the place I want to live doesn't provide much opportunity to make a living

[FavoriteAunty]

I had a big long post typed out and *poof* disappeared ... grrrr!

 

Anyhoo, here I go again (the Readers Digest version.)

 

A few years ago I moved back to the small city where I grew up thinking that I wanted to be closer to my family. That part has been great, I know my nephew and nieces very well, my Mom and her hubby are happy that I am round more, my sister and I get along very well, I am more involved with my extended family. The lifestyle choice was the right one.

 

BUT career-wise it has been a disaster. I have been in the Architectural consultancy business for +24 years, I lived/worked in the middle east for 2 years, I have a very robust portfolio with many large-scale projects, I was respected by my colleagues and the junior staff I managed/mentored and at one point I was making a 6-figure income (tax-free). I have never really had to look very hard for jobs in my field.

 

This small city where I now live has very little of the kind of work I specialize in and like to do. I worked for a local firm for about 1.5 years and came to realize that the "small town mentality" is very screwed up and didn't really have much respect for my experience (although that's precisely why they hired me)! The old boys club is intact. I have been doing small projects as an independent contractor but the only types of contracts I can get are soul-crushingly boring. I will be working for my brother-in-law this fall as a general labourer but even though they pay me way more than any other labourer makes, its not enough to live on and its not a career.

 

As I look through the listings for local jobs, I get very discouraged and depressed. I am either seriously over-qualified or not qualified at all. I've done some retraining and skills upgrading which might still come through with something satisfying and lucrative but at the moment I'm running low on savings and motivation.

 

The obvious choice would be to move away to a city where there are more opportunities. I recently inherited a piece of land in the country that has become my "happy place". It was my Dad's haven before he died so it has much sentimental value to me and my family. So I am very reluctant to leave it behind and would prefer to find a way that I can move out there. But I need to feed myself (and my dogs, cat, horses, etc)

 

So that's my dilemma: the place I want to live doesn't provide much opportunity to make a living. What to do? I don't know what posting this is really going to do for me, I guess I'm just throwing it out to the universe, see what comes back at me. Maybe someone out there will post a comment with that one nugget of advice that will make the light come on for me.

[annie24]

imho, go back to where you can make a good living, and then retire to this happy plot of land.

[DancingFool]

Quit bleeding away your savings, go back to where you actually belong career wise and focus on retiring early to your little plot of happy....in other words, what annie 24 said.

 

Also, be careful about jobs. You are reaching a point where companies will pass you up for someone younger, cheaper and less experienced that they prefer to train. In other words, don't loiter until you are obsolete and "my last job was laborer" isn't going to do much for your resume. The longer you are out of your field, the more unemployable you are getting to be. If you are completely bent on staying in a small town, then you are going to have to learn how to deal with small town politics and still have a job, aka curb your career expectations. Personally, I'd stay on the career path and set myself up to retire early.

[FavoriteAunty]

Quit bleeding away your savings, go back to where you actually belong career wise and focus on retiring early to your little plot of happy....in other words, what annie 24 said.

 

Also, be careful about jobs. You are reaching a point where companies will pass you up for someone younger, cheaper and less experienced that they prefer to train. In other words, don't loiter until you are obsolete and "my last job was laborer" isn't going to do much for your resume. The longer you are out of your field, the more unemployable you are getting to be. If you are completely bent on staying in a small town, then you are going to have to learn how to deal with small town politics and still have a job, aka curb your career expectations. Personally, I'd stay on the career path and set myself up to retire early.

 

I guess there are really only 2 choices: stay or move away. Either way I lose something I love. There's always a trade-off I guess.

 

Thanks for the reality check on the younger, cheaper, less experienced versions of myself. I haven't worried about that before and I don't *think* that will be an issue ... but I appreciate that you raised this because I had only given that a passing thought before; it could bite me in the butt. Food for thought. My 'resume' covers the gaps and I don't put the "general labourer/grunt" jobs on every job application I send out.

 

Savings and retirement are not my biggest worry actually (in the long run). I am in the enviable position that I know what I will inherit in the coming years and my parents have provided for us quite generously. If it was just about money, I'd be back overseas pulling in my big fat tax-free salary! This is more about self-fulfillment and lamenting the status I once had (that thought just came to me now). As well, I worry a little bit that my Mom will perceive my move back as a manipulative measure to "get my inheritance" which was NOT the case at all. I think she (and the rest of my family) sees me struggling so I believe she would understand my reasons if I were to relocate.

[DancingFool]

I guess there are really only 2 choices: stay or move away. Either way I lose something I love.

 

If you follow the career path, you are not losing, just temporarily postponing.

[t1lersm0m1]

What about finding the nearest big city with an abundance of job choices for you, and then come home on weekends? If you find a job with ample PTO, you can even take long weekends if/when your work is slower. Hopefully you aren't so far out in small town USA that you can find a big city within a few hours drive. It's not perfect but it's more than ideal I think.

[FavoriteAunty]

What about finding the nearest big city with an abundance of job choices for you, and then come home on weekends? If you find a job with ample PTO, you can even take long weekends if/when your work is slower. Hopefully you aren't so far out in small town USA that you can find a big city within a few hours drive. It's not perfect but it's more than ideal I think.

 

Thanks for this suggestion. I was contemplating this last night actually. The nearest big centre that has anything is 3 hours away, I used to live there and there are a lot of appealing aspects to going back (all my old friends.) The logistics of uprooting everything feels overwhelming and expensive, not sure I want to go through that just to do it all over again and move back in a few years.

[t1lersm0m1]

Yes, but I'm assuming you can double or triple your income. Wouldn't the short term expense be worth the long term gain? And I"m not sure of your age, but if you're talking about at least two years until retirement I think it's worth it.

 

The more money you make, the more you can sock away into a retirement account. Increase your 401K if you have one, put $5500 a year into a Roth IRA.

 

I know the 6 hour round trip drive weekly isn't appealing. But you don't have to necessarily do it weekly. You can plan for monthly or bi-weekly, and if that goes well you can increase it.

 

You previously made six figures and now barely make enough to pay your bills. While family should always be the most important thing in our lives (I prioritize it above all else) I think there is a compromise to be had.

[lavenderdove]

I know lots of people in your position who do a 2nd home kind of thing. That is, they get the high paying job in the city where they rent an apt. or share a house with someone, while owning a place in the country where they build a home they will eventually retire in (think small home, not palace) and spend as much time as they can in the country (holidays, long weekends, vacation).

 

So if you move to a near city (as in the one 3 hours away) you can still find a job and have an apt. in the city where you work and enjoy city life, while spending as much time as you can in the country with your family, eventually retiring there. Your dogs could go back and forth with you, and you could probably find a local kid to care for the horses when you're not in town (or wait to get the horses until you are full time there).

 

This is a very nice lifestyle that my own parents did, and I did as well. I now work 2 days in the city, and spend the other 5 days at what I consider my 'real' home in the boonies.

[FavoriteAunty]

Hmmm, thinking about the "second home" scenario. That might work. Thanks!

 

My dogs already go everywhere with me so they'd be fine to travel back and forth. Renting a place that takes 2 big dogs might be challenging. I already have the horses, I've invested a bit of time and money into them so don't want to sell them but they can be boarded. Not a deal breaker.

[lavenderdove]

>>Renting a place that takes 2 big dogs might be challenging.

 

You'd probably have to look a bit harder and lower your standard in terms of how 'nice' your city house would have to be since people who rent to dogs will have houses a little less pristine/new than those who don't... and they'll require a stiff pet cleaning security deposit.

 

but you could rent a TH maybe or even try to share a house with someone who is a pet owner themselves. But if you mainly work in the city and spend lots of time in your 'real' place in the country, you won't really care so much about your city place.

 

I also know people who buy a small condo or TH in the city that they know they'll sell when they retire, and build a small country house so that the two mortgages combined are equal to one larger mortgage.

[FavoriteAunty]

>>I also know people who buy a small condo or TH in the city that they know they'll sell when they retire, and build a small country house so that the two mortgages combined are equal to one larger mortgage.

 

I looked at this and it might be a good alternative too. Condos are sometimes funny about pets, especially large ones (I was in one for 8 years and was on the board of directors for much of that time because of the silly dog rules they were trying to impose.) House prices are very high these days so not sure I can get more financing (I already have one mortgage on the house I live in now) and I don't know how it works to hold mortgages on 2 different properties? To have a house (or something livable) on my property wouldn't add substantially to my debt load, I have been working on that for a few months already, I am hoping to pay cash for that but it would be a bit of a stretch. I own the land in the country free and clear and I have very good credit. A nice paying job can only help.

 

I get what you're saying about having to lower my expectations. Living in sub-standard housing might actually give me incentive to make my fortune and get outta there!!! hehe

 

You've given me some great ideas and a little glimmer of hope that can work out. Thank you for that.

[lavenderdove]

>> don't know how it works to hold mortgages on 2 different properties?

 

It is no different than one big mortgage, i.e., they check to see if your combined total mortgage payments/debt ratio for the two properties is under the limit for your income. For example, if the standard is your mortgage can't be more then 39% of your before tax income, they'd add up the two mortgage payments to make sure you are under 39% of your income. You can own as many properties as you want as long as you meet the debt/income ratios of whatever lender you are purchasing your latest house from (since they will the ones making the loan).

 

It is actually a very good way of managing your money because when it comes time to sell the city home, you can take all that equity and put it towards retirement. And mortgage payments are 100% deductible from your taxes (on both a primary and secondary mortgage), so you get a great tax break by doing that and will pay lower taxes.

 

I'm much rather have two smaller properties than one large one because of the investment potential, and if you lose your job, you can always sell one of the properties and still have a place to live. It is also a lot easier to sell less expensive property than it is big houses with big mortgages.

 

I've been living like that for the last 20 years. I also love the fact that when you're ready to sell a place, you just move out of the house and fully into your 2nd house and don't have to worry and hassle of showing it and keeping it pristine with dogs in the house and living there while you show it. You just move out, have it sparkling clean and looking LARGE because you don't have furniture in it, and it sells rather quickly as a rule because there are a lot of buyers who can be put off by people's furnishing, and a lot who want a house they can move into quickly since you can settle very quickly since you aren't living there. I move out, paint it nice neutral whites so it looks clean and large, and it sells within a month or two. Lots of first time buyers love those small houses.

 

Lots of people make the mistake of buying the hugest house they can which sticks them with a large mortgage, big heating bills, big taxes etc. Then they get in serious trouble if they lose a job or their income drops for some reason, and it is harder to sell an expensive house. If you split your income between two smaller houses, you can always 'cut back' to one if necessary and always have a place to live and avoid the pitfalls of trying to unload a big house in a bad market or if you have financial difficulty and need to sell quickly.

[FavoriteAunty]

And mortgage payments are 100% deductible from your taxes (on both a primary and secondary mortgage), so you get a great tax break by doing that and will pay lower taxes.

 

In Canada we don't get to write of mortgage payments ... but I'm following your line of thinking and it sounds reasonable. As well, if I'm not mistaken, proceeds from the sale of a property are not taxed (unless it was rented out at some point) so selling property to fund retirement is also better than our RRSP's (which are taxed pretty heftily, its a bit of a scam actually.) Depending on the "climate" when you are applying for financing, lenders can get fersnippity about mortgages on second properties that are not your primary residence. But it can be done. The housing market is quite inflated in Canada these days so even a "small" mortgage is rather sizable.

 

Since I've widened my geographic job search I've come accross a number of good job prospects and submitted 4 applications today.

[lavenderdove]

In the U.S. a 2nd home is really considered a home and not an investment property UNLESS you rent it out to others. So there are tax breaks for that.

 

I didn't realize you were from Canada, so you might want to check out the laws and just ask a mortgage broker. But you said you are high income and excellent credit (when you are working your high income job) so it probably won't be a big problem as long as the two combined are not pushing the limit of the debt/income ratios.

 

But you could always do the rental thing in the city if property is too expensive to buy. I know plenty of people who go that route if they only want or can only afford one mortgage.

[FavoriteAunty]

Thanks again for your comments, Lavendedove. I didn't have my profile filled out so no way you could have known where I am

 

I have very little other debt and if/when I find another 'real' job, I should be back on track. I'm in a real short-term bind (of my own making) and things were feeling very bleak and hopeless. I have been so focused on my immediate problems, I really needed a step back to look at the big picture again. Even while writing things out, I really realized how fortunate I am and there are always options. Helps to have honest opinions and suggestions.

[FavoriteAunty]

Well I was feeling optimistic about my prospects a few months ago but I've fallen into the depths of despair again. I have been sending out resumes and have not received a single response. I applied for another job yesterday and got my sister to review my resume and cover letter, I'm wondering if there is something on there that potential employers see that I don't; she made a few minor suggestions, I made some edits and sent it in ... but I feel very bleak about it and everything these days.

 

There are a few other things that I "should" be doing but they are things I find infinitely unpleasant and I cannot seem to find the motivation to break the habit of avoiding things I don't like. I paint myself into a corner. I also don't allow myself to do the things I enjoy because I have not yet done "first things first." So I waste time avoiding the crappy stuff, don't do the things I like to do and go to bed every night feeling guilty and ashamed that I have wasted yet another day of my life for no good reason.

 

I am getting depressed. Part of my downer is that I feel that my Mom (and possibly one of my sisters) is judging me negatively for my struggles in finding work. She frequently enquires as to what I am doing and makes condescending judgemental comments which only serve to fuel the deep down feelings of failure, of being an imposter, a loser and inferior. I'm too tired right now to write out all the ways she is pushing my buttons these days ... and it has occurred to me that the reason it bothers me so much is that she's not wrong.

[Catherine_3]

Is it possible that your mother realizes that you are banking on your inheritance and that's why she is not supportive of your choices?

 

I hope to leave my kids and grandkids a significant step up (I feel like I should knock on wood here) but I would be extremely deflated if I felt like they were using that as a crutch.

[Hell_On_Heels]

It's ok to do the things you enjoy, even if you haven't finished the yucky things on your to-do list. If denying yourself some joy was motivating you to do the hard things, I'd say stick with that plan. But it's not working, it's only depressing you further.

 

Would working from home be an option? I know some companies that have nearly all of their staff working remotely while covering specific territories. It involves some travel, but that should be doable from what you've said here.

 

Another thought is to open your own business.

[DancingFool]

If your resume is not getting so much as a thank you but we went with someone else, then your resume is a problem. Instead of your sister, go to someone in your industry - an old boss, a colleague, a recruiter who specializes in your field and find out what's not right. Basically, find someone in your industry who will be brutally honest with you why they'd overlook your particular resume, so that you can fix it. Also, maybe reach out to your old contacts in the industry and put the word out that you are looking. A referral is still a powerful way to get your foot in the door, especially when you are on the high end of the pay scale and experience level. Since you were well liked and respected, it might be a better way for you than cold calling on job ads so to speak.

[FavoriteAunty]

It's ok to do the things you enjoy, even if you haven't finished the yucky things on your to-do list. If denying yourself some joy was motivating you to do the hard things, I'd say stick with that plan. But it's not working, it's only depressing you further.

 

Would working from home be an option? I know some companies that have nearly all of their staff working remotely while covering specific territories. It involves some travel, but that should be doable from what you've said here.

 

Another thought is to open your own business.

 

I have my own business now and that is what's not working and thus the job search. My industry is heavily skewed towards the 'professionals' (even though I have been very professional my entire career and have done many if not all the same tasks as the "degree holders") so it is an up hill battle to be recognized. I am just not the type of person who can overcome those challenges.

 

Working from home is also a bad thing for a die-hard introvert. I know that I function better and am in a better head space when I am around people during the day. When I sit at home in front of my computer, I tend to stay there for far longer than I should and isolate myself even more. It would be nice to be able to work remotely given that this locale is ty, I get what you're saying.

[FavoriteAunty]

Is it possible that your mother realizes that you are banking on your inheritance and that's why she is not supportive of your choices?

 

I hope to leave my kids and grandkids a significant step up (I feel like I should knock on wood here) but I would be extremely deflated if I felt like they were using that as a crutch.

 

Yes, I do think that this is part of what she's thinking and I am not saying that she's wrong. She has her own things to deal with in that process (such as realizing her own mortality, giving up almost everything she owns, etc.) which she says doesn't bother her ... but it must on some level (it would bother me). I try to show how genuinely appreciative I am for all that she and my Dad have done for us. I treat her with respect and kindness (which is more than my other [employed] sister can say!), I do little unexpected gestures of kindness, I help out when she needs it, I go for visits fairly often. And I am plainly honest about what's going on with my job situation, I don't lie or sugar coat things. I haven't let on how much it is hurting me that she is passing judgement for fear of sounding like an ungrateful brat, I give her suggestions respectful consideration and try to respectfully explain how her suggestions are just not practical (she doesn't really understand what I do for a living so she's off the mark a lot of the time). She is and has always been a domineering "I know what's best" personality and it took me many years far far away from her to find my own voice and put to bed the demons from my childhood. I won't say that I don't still carry some of that baggage around but in recent years (even before the inheritance wheels were ever in motion) I have had a much healthier, happier relationship with her. BUT some of those childhood demons are creeping back in again and that is actually kind of scary for me.

[FavoriteAunty]

Thanks for this. This is probably the next step if I don't get results from this last application. My sister is a pretty harsh critic but she's in a different line of work so might not understand the intricacies of the construction biz (all industries have their nuances). My biggest client as a "self employed" technologist was my (now ex) boyfriend (yup, that was a mistake) so that reference may or may not be reliable. My most significant job from a couple of years ago was overseas and my supervisor passed away tragically this past spring so not the easiest to track down other people from that company ... but its doable. I'll have to start mining my network for other references.

[DancingFool]

It's not just understanding the nuances, it's really understanding the industry hiring attitudes. That's why I was suggesting digging up someone who actually does make hiring decisions. Regarding the ex, maybe ask him to give you a written reference. So you can see if it's good or not good enough to use. Also, takes out the unpredictability factor in terms of him saying something negative.

 

Reading up above, if you don't have a degree in an industry where it's standard to have one, that is a huge obstacle and likely the biggest reason you are not getting so much as a call from all your applications. Your resume probably doesn't even pass the basic computerized filters. It's not the end of the world and you were clearly hired before and worked just fine. However, that does create a situation for you where you really will have to lean hard on networking and referrals and any connection you can dig up to get that interview. Getting someone without a relevant degree hired nowadays is a really hard sell and they better be special in some way. So don't despair, but be prepared to shine a lot more than the average applicant and be sure you bring with you a can do anything any time attitude rather than a how much will you pay me attitude.

[Hell_On_Heels]

I didn't mean to start your own business in your current industry. I was thinking of something totally different - like riding lessons, or a small store, etc