somethngwrng Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 It doesn't matter whether you were not friends for the past few years - many people go from not knowing one another AT ALL, then a few months later they are in a relationship. Truth, the majority of relationships are formed rather quickly unless circumstances hold it back. Circumstance meaning that person is taken - unavailable. Without a spark of mutual attraction from the beginning, it is difficult to form a relationship with someone and takes a long time. I'm going with she's not interested - if she were, she would have taken you up on the date offer. She would have become excited at you asking her out, and if the time did not suit she would be in contact with you to suggest a better time. You can try again, but if nothing happens, let it go. People don't like to turn others down - it's not a nice situation to be in. If she is not interested she will most likely brush you off again - perhaps even pretend to seem interested but never set a date. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 The other way to look at things is to think nobody likes you really, delete everybody from your facebook and spend the rest of your life alone. Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 The other way to look at things is to think nobody likes you really, delete everybody from your facebook and spend the rest of your life alone. Or... you could move on from someone that is not into you, and instead work to make your life as enjoyable as possible and to meet new people, in general. Seems a bit dramatic and childish to throw your life away and to resign yourself to years of lonelyness because of one unrequited love. A lot of us have been there at some point. But the difference between the winners and losers, is that the winners quickly face the truth when someone isn't interested in the romantically, and accept that they may not be everyone's cup of tea, and move on. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 What I meant was you can pick holes in every friendship and relationship you have. You can develop an attitude where you question everything and even when people say nice things you wonder if they mean it. With that attitude you will be lonely for a very long time. I don't think the original poster should totally give up on his crush but like you say, he should go out and meet new people as much as possible. You can't have enough friends. Link to comment
bostonbruins44 Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 oh well I didn't agree with you before and I don't now. Never mind. Perhaps you are right ,putter but I think you must realize this time around you do have to take a different approach .The same approach will only bring you the same result .Make your romantic intentions clear ,early on and let the chips fall where they may. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 2, 2011 Share Posted June 2, 2011 Hey I'm glad your here. I'm hopefully getting some golf coaching going. With that woman I like. Her idea, she's becoming real keen about golf. Maybe others will be interested as well ! Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 No offense but I don't think I'm hanging around like a bad smell. About 10 days ago she came on facebook and chatted with me and asked me if I wanted to play golf one day next week. I suggested Friday. Anyway she was working Friday so she suggested Sunday and also wanted me to work with her as well. So I worked with her, enjoyed it but it was raining so we couldn't play golf, however she suggested playing this week some time. I said Thursday, she agreed. I sent her a text yesterday and asked her if she wanted to play on Wednesday instead. She replied saying 'yes'. So it's not me hanging around like a bad smell. It's more like she's enjoys my company and the start of a good friendship ! Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 No offense but I don't think I'm hanging around like a bad smell. About 10 days ago she came on facebook and chatted with me and asked me if I wanted to play golf one day next week. I suggested Friday. Anyway she was working Friday so she suggested Sunday and also wanted me to work with her as well. So I worked with her, enjoyed it but it was raining so we couldn't play golf, however she suggested playing this week some time. I said Thursday, she agreed. I sent her a text yesterday and asked her if she wanted to play on Wednesday instead. She replied saying 'yes'. So it's not me hanging around like a bad smell. It's more like she's enjoys my company and the start of a good friendship ! Ok, well, how many other women have you made an effort to meet in the past month? Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 14, 2011 Share Posted June 14, 2011 One other who is flirting with me at work. I asked her to the pictures, she didn't really answer. She is friends with the other woman so it makes things a little awkard. She did say they were both 'fighting over me' - those were her words. I play golf with the other woman so I asked her what she wanted to do. She is very flirty and loud and after weeks of flirting I thought I would call her bluff a bit and actually say something. She seemed surprized and went rather quiet. Nothing concrete was done and she didn't follow anything up. I wasn't kidding, I would spend time with her and go to the pictures although as friends only I suppose. I don't mean to have a go at you because I think you give good advice to people on here. It's just you gave me a little bit of stick a few months ago. I know it's hard for you to give advice sometimes because all your going on is what I write. I know half the time it's my fault because when I'm down in the dumps I come on here and vent my frustrations. But with the original woman it's all good and a nice friendship is developing. I never would have guessed she would take up golf but I think it's great ! Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 Ok, well, it's good that you have made friend from all this. However, take this as an indication that you ARE enjoyable to be around, and that you owe it to yourself to meet new people. Don't stop now. Don't stay stuck on this one girl. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 15, 2011 Share Posted June 15, 2011 My gut instinct is telling me that the golf woman likes me only as a friend but the other one likes me more. Yet the golf woman asks me to spend time with her and the other one doesn't. And I did suggest some things we could do together. She isn't shy either, she's the opposite. It's not like I've got a swarm of women wanting to be with me. It's only those two ! Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 Ok, well, if you feel that one of them only likes you as a friend (where you both reciprocate) then learn to be happy with that and stop expecting a romance. If it's only those two women that want to be with you, that's fine. But go out and socialise, join a hobby group and try to meet new PEOPLE, not just women. That's my whole point. Don't be happy with what you've got. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 16, 2011 Share Posted June 16, 2011 The golf woman cancelled our golf game at the last minute. Two days on the trot, said she was tired. I was a bit disapointed. I told this other woman at work and I knew she felt sorry for me. I asked her if she wanted to play instead. She said she couldn't. I seem to getting good at 'asking' these days. Not like it's doing me much good. The golf woman did send me a text saying she was 'sorry', she had been asleep and we'll play golf soon. So it's not all lost. Not sure about the flirty woman and the one today; I've always had a thing for her and she is single but we've never done anything together, even though I have suggested a few things over the years ! Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 17, 2011 Share Posted June 17, 2011 Ok, well, pick yourself up and broaden your horizons a bit. Sign up to a hobby group for something completely new and see what happens from there. Link to comment
sunnyhappydays Posted June 19, 2011 Share Posted June 19, 2011 Expression, I think you are being incredibly unfair to the woman whom you like. It's clear from your posts that she can't win. She is not interested in you. That is clear. However, if she is nice to you, you take it as hope of her liking you. You refuse to ask her out because you know she will say no. Instead you hang around trying to be her friend. Somehow you feel you have a right to be her friend and to be invited out to every event that she attends, even though she has had other friends for years, and there is no law which says every friend must hang out together every single time. It's not even that usual. She obviously knows this and is trying to gently let you down by ratcheting down communication so that you don't get the wrong idea. Now you are bitter that she is not being a good friend. She is not your friend and you are not hers. You don't want to be her friend, you want to spend time with her to show her that you love her. That is not friendship. Leave her alone and GAL. I'm not trying to be rude but you are what people call a Nice Guy. See these links link removed - this is what you are doing. You are trying to get close enough to manipulate her. Accept her decision and move on. link removed Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Great post, sunny. And great links too. Because this situation is really quite simple - if a guy likes a girl in a romantic way, ask her out. If she doesn't seem interested then do NOT make excuses for her or settle for being friends. MOVE ON - and find someone else. It's the same with women (I was in the same situation once). Life's too short to hang around like a bad smell around someone that is not interested in being with you. Plus you are not going to find someone that DOES want to be with you if you have your heart set on your unrequited love. You will be able to acknowledge them, but your heart will not see them, because on some level you will be comparing them to your UL. And your heart will never forget your UL until you cut ALL contact. Link to comment
galaxy71 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Why do people continue to berate "nice guys" like they are scheming, duplicitous doormats? There is nothing wrong with being a nice guy. The reason why nice guys fail with women has nothing to do with insecurity and not "loving" oneself. The reason why nice guys struggle in dating is because they don't know how to attract women. That's it. There are plenty of good, upstanding guys who are in relationships with quality, mature women. When a guy is terrible at attracting women, he will second guess himself, and he will become insecure because he associates failure with women. He will latch to a women who shows any signs of friendliness because he knows that it will be a long time before any woman throws him some crumbs. Movies like Forrest Gump and American Beauty brainwash guys into thinking that if they put women on pedestals and shower them with affection and attention that women will come to like them. Movies, family, and friends are some of the societal influences that socialize guys into thinking that being nice with women is a way of making them become attracted you. On some forum that is similar to Enotalone, the people on that forum kept on talking about "being friends first". They never talked about flirting or being aggressive. Instead, they talked about being a good friend, being a good listener, and asking a lot of questions. There are plenty of people in this forum who advised the same things too. When guys get bomborded with messages from the media about putting women on pedestals and other messages about how you attract women by being friends first, building rapport, and building trust, you create a lot of guys who try to attract women by hiding their interest under the guise of friendship. After all, women are more likely to meet her boyfriend through her social cirlce rather than a nightclub. A lot of nice guys never learned how to attract women in his social circle. There is so much advice on internet dating and bar/nightclub game, but there is very little advice on how to meet women through your social circle. I remember a thread last year where this women advised guys to be friends first. Some time later, she talked about how the women in her social circle didn't want to date this guy because he was not "cool" enough. I think most of the people in this thread are too focused on the symptom(i.e. being infatuated with a woman who can't reciprocate his feelings), instead of looking at the cause(i.e. not being able to attract women). Expression, I advise you to ignore sunny's advice. She doesn't know what shy guys like you go through. Her advice is judgemental and harsh. I also advise you to ignore her links because they blame the victim instead of realizing how nice guys are created. My advice to you is that you got to overcome your shyness and show more "expression" around women. Once you do that, women will step away from their friends to talk to you. Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I think there's something to be said for socialising and getting to know women in a friendly way and as friends - without any expectation of trying to date anyone of them just to get into any relationship with any woman - but then there's "nice guys" who either see every woman as potential, they will take anyone as long as they get rid of their virginity and get some experience on their belt. And then there's other nice guys that will latch onto one woman who really isn't displaying any interest, but instead of moving on, they put her up on a pedestal and will not budge. They'll be very accommodating and listen to her emotions and be there for her. And while this could always become a relationship, nice guys don't know when to move on, because whether you are male or female, if the spark isn't there, it just isn't. It's hard to know whether nice guys have low self esteem because they can't attract women so it makes them view themselves as unattractive, or whether they have always seen themselves that way and that is why women aren't attracted to them. So what came first, the chicken or the egg? Having female friends is fine, going out to bars is fine - attraction usually happens mutually in a natural way. Pining after a friend and hoping for more for an extended period of time without making a clear and definitive move that is not ambiguous at all, such as asking them out on a date a couple of different times, is not natural. The power is out of balance. It's one person idolising another and putting their own need above the woman's need to be left alone if she isn't interested. Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I really don't feel that sunny was trying to blame the victim. You call it "blame" I call it "owning the behaviour". If you aren't having much luck with women then YOU are the common denominator, and only you can change what you try or change, whether that is the way that you meet women, or your desperation, or standards. And if you think that is blaming the victim, then you've lost the battle before it's begun. Because Expression is in 100% control of whether he takes a chance and gives a clear signal to her that he is interested romantically one last time, or he can choose to stop obsessing over for months and years on end and choose to move on. If he isn't in control and isn't willing to take responsibility for this situation, then who should? Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I didn't grow up thinking women wouldn't like me. It was only when I started looking for a girlfriend / talking to women that I realized that they didn't like me. And this happened over a very long time as well, probably 5 years or so. It didn't put me off in those days either and it wasn't until I got to 30 that my self esteem crumbled and I stopped trying. Link to comment
sunnyhappydays Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 Galaxy, your post was long but not really responsive. Expression is clear on a few things 1. He knows she will say no if he asks her out. Thus he is refusing to ask her out and choosing to keep things ambiguous when they are not. This is not a situation where they are getting to know each other pre relationship. He KNOWS how she feels and is choosing to ignore it. 2. I'm trying to point out how this woman might feel. She doesn't want to lead him on and he is giving her no way to express that. Any niceness to him is considered a sign of hope for a relationship. He is not really letting her be a friend to him and he is not being a friend to her. He is trying to find a way to persuade her to date him. It won't work. This could go on for years! Why? Why not date someone you like? I know what it's like to like someone who doesn't like you. Most people do. But spending years investing time and energy into that non-relationship will lead to bitterness and loneliness. And that's when you turn into a Nice Guy, whining about how "all" women are this and "all" women are that. It's not true. This is one woman. And it's not going to work. Link to comment
putter65 Posted June 20, 2011 Share Posted June 20, 2011 I don't think it works like that. I don't think crushes last for years. The ones I've had lasted a year at most. What happens is you meet somebody else and the process starts again. Link to comment
dramallama Posted June 21, 2011 Share Posted June 21, 2011 It's ok to have crushes, but the failure and anxiety comes from not doing anything about it, reading into signals that are not there, settling for being friends when you want more (especially if it stops you from pursuing and seeing the potential in other women), letting the crush go on for months and months. I think it's a good idea when you have feelings for someone, if you're a guy, is to let her know ASAP - so that you have an answer, and then you and your crush can either move towards one another, or you can move on - within a matter of a couple of months, not years. Link to comment
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