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How to let go of the emotions when it comes to signing a *prenup*???

TooLost

By TooLost
in Relationship Advice

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TooLost Explorer

TooLost

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In my last post, I explained how my bf wants me to sign a cohabitation agreement(?) when I move in with him and how this made me feel. Pretty much all the replies I got confirmed that this is a good thing to do before moving in....

 

What I am now wondering is, how do I not feel hurt that he can't trust me / not feel dissapointed? How can I not feel that he think our relationship is doomed??

 

I can somewhat think rationally about this and know thaa how I feel isn't right, but I still can't help feeling that way!! ](*,)

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Hermes Collaborator

Hermes

Posted
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Hello Toolost:

 

Yes, I saw your other thread and I agree with all the replies. I think it is a most sensible course of action. It is not because he does not trust you, (or even thinks the relationship is doomed). It is just plain common sense. I think one poster mentioned: "just because you snap on your seat belt does not mean you don't trust the driver".

 

Emotions are fine and good, but must not govern everything in our existence. It is also important to think with the head LOL.

 

H

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lavenderdove Enthusiast

lavenderdove

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First, don't sign anything until you have a lawyer review it, or are really sure what it means.

 

For example, if it is his house, and you will be contributing to the mortgage (i.e., paying part of the mortgage) and it says you waive all rights to the property, then that is not fair to you since you have contributed to paying down the mortgage and should have some rights. But if he is paying all the mortgage and asks you to sign away rights to the house, then that would be OK since you are not paying down his mortgage.

 

Also, what does the agreement say about items you purchase jointly? Just make sure it doesn't basically turn you into a border who is living there, paying into the household, but has absolutely no rights should he toss you out.

 

Once you know you've got a fair agreement, then you don't need to resent it, since it protects both of you. But if you feel anything is unfair, don't sign it, and don't move in.

 

Most pre-nups have nothing to do with the relationship being 'doomed' they are a caution to protect financial assets in the event of a breakup. Since more than half of all marriages end in divorce (and even a higher percentage of live in relationships break up), it is only common sense to protect one's assets in such a situation. So don't resent it, just make sure it is fair to you, then forget about it.

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Hermes Collaborator

Hermes

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Agree fully with what LD says:

 

Most pre-nups have nothing to do with the relationship being 'doomed' they are a caution to protect financial assets in the event of a breakup. Since more than half of all marriages end in divorce (and even a higher percentage of live in relationships break up), it is only common sense to protect one's assets in such a situation. So don't resent it, just make sure it is fair to you, then forget about it.

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shes2smart Grand Master

shes2smart

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In a sense, this may speak to a bigger issue, though. That being the fact that there is a business aspect to relationships...especially when you start looking at merging your life with another person's (whether that includes marriage or not).

 

It's not something people really talk about when discussing relationships....other than the "who pays for dates" debate. But that business aspect is there...and the closer or more serious or longer the length of the relationship, the bigger that aspect becomes.

 

Perhaps you can start taking a more "whole picture" view of your relationship -- sure there's that fluffy, pink-cloud, I-will-love-you-forever, romance part...but there's also the sexual aspect, the friend/companion aspect, and, yes, the business aspect. A prenup clearly falls into the business aspect. Any aspect you don't acknowledge and deal with is pretty much trouble waiting to happen.

 

The fact that there IS a business aspect between you tells you that your relationship is transitioning into a more "serious" (for lack of a better word) phase.

 

If you want to be with this person for the long term, the fact that there is a growing (and openly acknowledged) business aspect is a good thing.

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Notreadyet87 Contributor

Notreadyet87

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I know that it's hurtful in a lot of ways, but honestly in today's day and age a prenup is VERY smart. Essentially he is protecting you just as much as you protect him. As one of the largest DISPUTES and issues in marriages and relationships is MONEY and ASSETS--at least you guys are protected in that sense. Say years from now you make more than he does and something happens you break up--don't you want to be protected?

I don't even see it as him not trusting you or not loving you. It's no different then when you sign a lease with a roommate, or when you sign a contract with a job. It doesn't mean that there isn't trust that you'll do right by the partnership, living experience, or job, but merely a way to ensure that you are protected both by the company/apartment/etc and by yourself.

The way I look at it, is that if you truly know that you are not that type of woman, then this should not effect you no more than it does when you are forced to a sign a contract at a job about "not stealing" or what not. I know it's more complex than that but again emotions aside, you must look at this from a practical standpoint "I'm not in it for the money. I know he loves me. This is simply him protecting US. This will only make it easier IF something goes wrong."

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TooLost Explorer

TooLost

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Is it bothering you that you think he's "planning on failure" or more that you feel somehow untrusted?

 

I think it's more that I feel untrusted, because I don't feel I deserve to feel like this...

 

Eventhough it feels like he is planning on the relationship failing, I know that in reality that's a possibility....

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Ms Darcy Mentor

Ms Darcy

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I think it's more that I feel untrusted, because I don't feel I deserve to feel like this...

 

Eventhough it feels like he is planning on the relationship failing, I know that in reality that's a possibility....

 

So I think you have a few options. You don't have to live with him. He simply stated that to live with you, he would need an agreement to do so. If you don't accept, then don't move in.

 

Of course, you can talk to him and tell him how it makes you feel. But as another poster noted, there is a business aspect to relationships that you are just now beginning to discover - so this is inevitable in the future in some way (whether through a marriage pre-nup or just when you do your taxes after marriage).

 

Another idea I wanted to bring up is .... and it's not a pleasant one to think about ... most relationships fail. If you think about a lifetime of dating, I'll take my friend T for example: she dated one guy in high school, two guys in college, two guys just after college, and one guy in grad school. She married the guy she dated in grad school. So out of six relationships, five "failed."

 

In all honesty, you are not moving in with him as a commitment. You are moving in as a trial. A commitment is a separate deal. It's saying that from what I have seen from you I want to be with you forever. He hasn't seen that yet. So, he's saying that if we move in together and find we cannot get along, here is how we should split our assets. It's business-like yes, but it is not UNFAIR to you. Of course, have a lawyer review the agreement.

 

As a sidenote, if you are moving into his place and paying on his mortgage, I do not think you should have any more rights than any other tenant would have. I know some people feel like moving in with a guy should afford them equal rights to the property after they leave, but I don't. And if this is his situation, he's well-wise to protect himself.

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Hermes Collaborator

Hermes

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Eventhough it feels like he is planning on the relationship failing, I know that in reality that's a possibility....

 

Come again, TooLost.

 

Do you mean you are not as sure yourself as you thought you were about this relationship?

 

H

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1guygirl Collaborator

1guygirl

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i would go talk to your own lawyer aswell, get some legal advice...maybe even draught up your own pre-nup...shoes fit on both feet remember

 

when all said and done, you will be helping him pay off HIS mortgage and you will be left to find a new house, from scratch whether you buy your own or rent. maybe i would feel more comfortable if he sold house, paid off his old mortgage and then you started off on a new house that you both had names on from the beginning and was split equally if you did split...that way your money wont be wasted investing entirely into his future well being

 

may not seem practical but then if this is the business side of relationships, lets get your business head on and start looking out for your own future like he clearly is for his

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nutz76 Newbie

nutz76

Posted
Posted
In my last post, I explained how my bf wants me to sign a cohabitation agreement(?) when I move in with him and how this made me feel. Pretty much all the replies I got confirmed that this is a good thing to do before moving in....

 

What I am now wondering is, how do I not feel hurt that he can't trust me / not feel dissapointed? How can I not feel that he think our relationship is doomed??

 

I can somewhat think rationally about this and know thaa how I feel isn't right, but I still can't help feeling that way!! ](*,)

 

Read these and you'll understand why a marriage is such a huge risk for men today and why prenups are essential:

 

link removed

 

link removed

 

The broad strokes is that Marriage 2.0 is not just a relationship between you and your bf, but between you, him, and the state. At its core modern marriage is a contractual agreement that traditionally obligates him to give you half of his stuff if you ever decide to leave no questions asked. How anyone would enter into such an untenable agreement without some assurances they'd be protected is beyond me.

 

Also, if you end up making more than he does the prenup protects you as well. They're not one-sided and are meant to protect the both of you from the state forcing itself into the separation should you split up in the future.

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Espi Newbie

Espi

Posted
Posted
In my last post, I explained how my bf wants me to sign a cohabitation agreement(?) when I move in with him and how this made me feel. Pretty much all the replies I got confirmed that this is a good thing to do before moving in....

 

What I am now wondering is, how do I not feel hurt that he can't trust me / not feel dissapointed? How can I not feel that he think our relationship is doomed??

 

I can somewhat think rationally about this and know thaa how I feel isn't right, but I still can't help feeling that way!! ](*,)

 

First off, a prenup is NOT the same as a cohabitation agreement. They are worlds apart...ask any lawyer.

 

Secondly, if I were a woman, I'd never sign a co-hab agreement because if/when the relationship ends, he takes what's his, and you take what's yours. No muss, no fuss, no lawyers, no alimony, etc. From a male perspective, he's being very smart because the co-hab agrement protects him from your trying to take half of his hard-earned money if/when the relationship ends (and statistics tell us that the relationship will likely end).

 

If I were you (a woman), I'd drop him ASAP and find a guy that you can marry. That way, if/when the marraige ends, you can keep earning the money from your job AND collect half of his money.

 

My advice to ALL women: get married...as many times as possible! Because a divorce is likely going to represent the single largest finanacial windfall of your life!

 

My advice to all men: Don't get married! Be honest with her and tell her that you're not getting married...not now, not ever...tell her everything that you're looking for in a relationship--especially pertaining to wanting access to other females. If she still wants to be with you, ask her to define the relationship on paper...i.e. sign a co-hab agreement (ESPECIALLY if you plan on living together more than 2 years...many states consider 2+year live-in relationships LEGALLY BINDING, which means that she can take 50% of your money!!!!)

 

Your BF, however, is a smart guy. He seems to uderstand the fact that only two type of people marry:

 

Dumb men

Smart women

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Ms Darcy Mentor

Ms Darcy

Posted
Posted
when all said and done, you will be helping him pay off HIS mortgage and you will be left to find a new house, from scratch whether you buy your own or rent. maybe i would feel more comfortable if he sold house, paid off his old mortgage and then you started off on a new house that you both had names on from the beginning and was split equally if you did split...that way your money wont be wasted investing entirely into his future well being

 

This is the trouble with playing house

 

If I got engaged to a man and he wanted me to sell my home so we could buy together, I would understand the proposition. If my bf asked me to live with him and he told me to sell my home so we could buy together, I would probably spit up my tea with laughter.

 

Living together is not a lifelong committment. It is living together. I would go to the ends of the earth to advise young people not to buy a home with someone they are not marrying ... because THAT gets ugly if/when there is a breakup. In someways, buying a home together is more of a commitment than marriage.

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Espi Newbie

Espi

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Posted

Also, what does the agreement say about items you purchase jointly? Just make sure it doesn't basically turn you into a border who is living there, paying into the household, but has absolutely no rights should he toss you out.

 

 

If he's smart, he'll stipulate that nothing will be purchased jointly...he should know nothing about her finances, and she should know nothing about about his...ie both parties are financially independent.

 

Also, he should not list her on his mortgage..he should assume respensiblity of the mortgage that HE secured BEFORE she met him, and, per the co-hab written agreement, he should stipulate that the mortgage is HIS responsibility...that she need only contribute a specific monthly rental amount.

 

In a relationship defined by a co-hab agreement, the only things that should be paid jointly are utility bills...and those should be defined in the co-hab agreement...but aside from those things, she should purchase whatever she desires using her own money, credit card, etc. Same goes for him...

 

If she's moving in with him, he needs to protect his assets that he's worked so hard for...to do that, he simply stipuates in writing that his property remains his if/when the relationship ends.

 

If he adds her to his mortgage, he now stands a 50% chance of losing his property. (50% of marraiges and long-term relationships end).

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TooLost Explorer

TooLost

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Do you mean you are not as sure yourself as you thought you were about this relationship?

 

H

 

Sorry, that was unclear...What I meant was that I know a lot of relationships fail and I can't predict the future, so I know it would be possible that something happen in the future and us not end up together( I'm just being realistic I guess)... But I don't doubt the relationship right now, no.

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Hermes Collaborator

Hermes

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Posted

TL:

 

I can't predict the future, so I know it would be possible that something happen in the future and us not end up together( I'm just being realistic I guess

 

Too right you can't predict the future, and it is good to be realistic. So if you do not doubt the relationship now then I think the advice you have got on here from others is good, particularly about seeing your own lawyer, ensuring the agreemen is properly drafted and so on.

 

Good luck

H

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