EXGF has coldfeet! The end of the road.

[DaisyB]

I disagree with GeeCee (much as I hate to do that ). I think that if you end up back together, your relationship will be much stronger. If, at the end of this, you find you don't trust each other as much anymore, I don't think you'll end up together -- I think you'll go your separate ways. Of course, I don't know if you'll end up together or apart, but I do think that if you end up together, your relationship will be better than it once was.

 

I don't think her indecision for three months has anything to do with the quality or quantity of her love for you. She could be very much in love with you, but simply confused and/or insecure. You've been together 7 years -- of course your love isn't going to feel as "pure" as it once did. I'm sure in those 7 years you've both gone through periods of "hating" each other, or not understanding each other, but I imagine that that has deepened your relationship, rather than corrupted it.

 

I base that only on experience and stories -- I've known many people who've broken up and gotten back together (and gotten married), and their love doesn't seem to be any less "real" than those couples who have never broken up. If anything, their love seems to be stronger, because the experience of loss made them value each other more.

[shockeddismayed]

Thank you both...

 

GeeCee: I know where you are coming from... I could get bitter and allow it to pass over into the relationship. However, at this point I am not there yet.... I am simply having a Sunday of second guessing.

 

I don't feel bitter yet.... I am just starting to try and feel as though I should be preparing to protect myself... I think that the storm is still to come. She has been building up toward trying again... and I am trying to make sure that all of my personal work doesn't get swept away in all of this.

 

If things work out... they WILL be stronger. I've spent too much time realizing how my inability to be open with my love has led to heart break. She won't have to wonder about my feelings anymore... I'm going to cast aside my IRISH-ENGLISH-REPRESSED background and learn to express my feelings publicly.

 

DAISYB: Thank you so much for your encouraging words. I really appreciate it.

 

I must say that I am a still a bit baffled as to how I got here.... I mean she never EVER said anything like "I hate you" or anything of that nature. I am still so surprised to have ended up here... how did this happen again?

 

I'm hoping that I've handled myself well with the flurry of contact in the last week. If anyone has any suggestions on how to handle the next few contacts... I am all ears.

 

She's now home from the cottage... no word from her yet.... it is past her bedtime Sunday, so I wont hear anything now. Her B-day is Tuesday, so I expect I won't hear from her until after then. I have a CD and a card that I will leave. My cards will be close to the vest, but I'll send the card and CD as a way to keep her thinking positively.

[kipster]

It is now sunday... she has been up at the cottage with her girlfriends all weekend. I'm sure I have come up as conversation a lot. She is still very confused.

 

I guess my question is: Can it still be real/true love if she is still having these doubts 2 months after the breakup, and nearly 3 months since she started seriously considering the breakup?

 

S&D, I'm in a similar situation in terms of years invested and I suspect that she is confused. After 7 years, that's not an easy decision I would imagine. I think the fact that she's having doubts this far afterwards should be viewed as a positive, especially since I've dated women who say its over and never call again or even venture to talk with you (some who even tell you directly, 'don't call me', 'lose my number', 'go to h__L', etc.). At some point she has to deal with the reality of it and can't keep putting it aside. Plus, you should be mindful that if it took 7 years to get to this point, 2-3 months is merely a fraction of the total time invested. So that would seem normal to me. Indeed, if she'd changed her mind in a week or two, that would probably be more abnormal if you ask me.

 

I know that we just managed to make a lot of progress on our issues... talking relationship on and off all of last week. I know that you aren't supposed to put a timeline on love...

 

But all the same, I can't help feeling like it makes our love illegimate that she still be confused. ?

 

I'd say you are indeed making progress, but stop pushing her with the 'relationship talk'. Leave those thoughts to her. I would only talk more generally to her about things and only talk about the relationship if she brought it up and even then I'd stay very 'surface' and let her do the divulging of information. I think its O.K. to be confused and I'd steer you away from feeling like your love is 'illegitimate' as well. If it was 'illegitimate' do you really think she'd still be talking to you at all or even pondering it? Again, look at the facts and stop letting emotions get the best of you.

 

Am I being rediculous? Has anyone else felt this way? Despite our "progress" recently, am I just deluding myself?

 

Or maybe this is something couples just go through after a time... and the fact that we were 7 years in and not yet married makes it easier to pull the chute... especially when the marriage issue was coming up during what for her was the darkest time in the relationship?

 

 

No your not being ridiculous and everything you've noted that you've felt, I and others have as well. But you have to give her her time to think things through, just as I imagine you'd want someone to grant you if you were in their shoes. Don't pressure her, let her come back because she wants to, not because she feels guilty or because she feels obligated. The latter two motives will make the re-union (if any) a short-lived one, no doubt. And don't worry about being 7 years in and not married, I know people in the same boat. That is water under the bridge at this point. And I know its natural for you to bring up marriage, as a guy, at the end of the relationship--since you interpet your GF as wanting it-- so in desperation you say I'll marry you tomorrow (been there, done that, and wrote the book). That doesn't work because I assume they say, 'Oh now you want to marry me' when I've decided to leave. Seems like a ploy and from others I've seen, it actually has the opposite effect. So don't bring up marriage or the relationship unless she pushes it there. And I'd stop the constant contact as well and answering her calls as often. Let her really think hard about it and don't push her.

 

Just my suggestion.

[shockeddismayed]

Kipster

 

Thank you for the help.

 

A few points I should clarify.

 

1) I don't feel I've been pressuring her about the relationship talk. It has come up very naturally (by her mostly) during the conversations... and she has been very receptive to the things I've said. Earlier on, this was NOT the case... I could see the "push" happening and her recoiling. She may still be recoiling after the conversations end, but she is definitely receptive during the chat.

 

I'm trying to cater to HER... I know normally that relationship chats are a no-no... but this girl is a few months from being a psychologist... so I feel like my talking to her (now that she's listening) is almost a form of seduction. I can hear it in her voice....

 

But that doesn't stop me from worrying what she thinks when I'm not talking to her... how her second thoughts factor in.

 

I know I am at risk here to keep contact up... I'm thinking I will let her lead entirely for a while.

 

2) Marriage Issue: I don't think this is the thing at all.... I mean she is still in school and we'd talked about getting married. My delay did not cause her to wonder about my intentions. I don't think she has ever doubted that I would ask.... I think the doubts she is having have to do with whether she thinks that we can last happily... whether we can conquer our differences and work on our faults.

 

Obviously a couple months ago her answer has "NO".... now she's agreed that she *might* be very wrong about that.... I'm hoping that thought is growing in her mind... and will allow/force her to give things another try. But I know she is afraid... afraid of hurting me again and afraid of being hurt. Any suggestions on this fear issue?

 

I'm still hoping this was just an exagerated "cold feet" type response... she felt the engagement coming (I mean we had a ring picked out), had some worries, and it taking the time to sort them out now.

 

3) I agree with you about pressuring her.... I need to back off, as even encouragement can be viewed as pressure. We talked about that together last thursday night... I tried to re-emphasize that I am not trying to pressure her, but that I am worried for her... for both of us... if she doesn't use her space wisely. She admitted that she could end up in trouble, and understands that I need to try and put her behind me for my own sanity.... but at the same time, she's told me that she needs to keep me in contact so that she doesn't lose me while she is sorting this out. She knows it isn't fair... but it sounded like she is going to try and do it anyway.

 

Cripes! Well at least she can admit that she is stringing me along.

 

Also... thanks so much for helping me put a few things in perspective... I know it took a long time to get here... that it may take a long time to get out. The two of us have two very recent examples of couples who ended up together after similar breaks. I've tried to remind her of that, and to see what positive is coming out of our space/personal growth. We've also talked about not getting trapped into her decision.... that getting back together DOESN'T need to mean that the breakup was the wrong thing to do... it could have been the right thing that we needed to get stronger together (I hear you Daisy and GeeCee).

 

I'm just so damn impatient!!!!!! This waiting is driving me bonkers!

[shockeddismayed]

Latest Update (if you can call it that).

 

Ok... so last week we looked on the road to recover... lots of pleasant relationship talk... her telling me that she needed to hear these things.

 

It was left that she was going to keep contacting me (cuz she was missing me and thinking about "us"). She joked that when I got sick of it I could call the cops. I joked and said i would. That was Thurday.

 

She goes away for the weekend for a girls only cottage weekend. She says she will be giving "us" some serious thought.

 

Tuesday was her Birthday. I left a card (no mush, just some humour and best wishes) and a CD (a new one from the "our" band). I left this in her mailbox at about 6:30pm. She may have already been home, but the mail didn't look like she'd checked it yet.

 

Today is wednesday... still no "thank-you" email. I'm thinking leave it be... there must be some sort of longer response coming... it doesnt take long to type "thank-you".

 

Thoughts? (or on any of the stuff last week (page 11).... wondering whether I should go back onto NC after this flurry?)

[strong1]

Ok...women..jump in here w/your own comments...but if a guy has been dating a woman over the age of say...25...for 3+ years..and you have NOT discussed marriage...she is wondering what the heck is up. And you should be too.

 

Any other women want to comment on that? I know it's 'uncool' for a woman to fess up that we really do want to get married IF/WHEN we find the 'right' guy. But, I'll open up that can o' worms anyway.

 

I can't for the life of me figure out why many men are so scared of marriage. Women too..but out of all my friends..it seems the men are the most scared of it. In two income families..it doesn't mean you need to support us financially. For women, I think marriage is a form of emotional security. Men want sexual intimacy...and most women want emotional intimacy/security in a relationship.

 

I can certainly take care of myself (own own home, car, great job, etc.) But a proposal says 'out of all the women in the world, I chose to spend my life w/you.' And that says a lot about a guy. If you can't decide after that amount of time ... discuss your fears with her (she may have the same fears...you never know), mull it over..and if you are still undecided...don't waste her time.

 

I think sometimes women just figure 'Game Over. If he doesn't think I'm good enough to discuss marriage at this point..he's not worth my time.

[shockeddismayed]

Strong1...

 

Thanks for the response... but you obviously haven't tread through the situation (I dont blame you... i've been writing alot ).

 

But this girl and I HAD talked about marriage.

 

We HAD a ring picked out... and she told her friends she was elated (but I could see it on her face anyway).

 

We HAD been very happy (at least I thought so).

 

We even HAD a guest list planned.

 

She knew I was saving for the ring.

 

She took a trip down south with her parents and then bolted on the return. (after picking a couple fights over nothing with me prior to her trip)

 

This is NOT a "guy has committment fear" issue... if anything it is the other way around.

[Mix Maxster]

Strong1,

 

What you said about guys and marriage is probably very true, however it's not how I feel about it. Personally I'm a guy that always grew up wanting to be with someone. To love and hold and to be close to. Someone I would be able to grow old with, one who I could love without fear of getting hurt. One I could share myself and never be cruel. There's so much hatred in this world, I just wanted to love and be loved. Is that so much to ask for?

 

I know this doesn't have much to do with the post, but really is being loved really so much to ask for?

[shockeddismayed]

Hi Gang...

 

I'd really appreciate a few thoughts about what I should or shouldn't be doing right now.

 

If you want to read about the latest contacts, they are on page 11 and 12. Here's the short version.

 

1) After about 8 weeks of the breakup (7 year comitted relationship) with minimal contact, we met by chance at a drug store.

2) That set off about 4 relationship chats last week (last week of April). The chats were generally VERY GOOD. Talked out a lot of our problems, talked about how things might be better if we tried again, but also her fears that things wouldnt have changed (essentially how we argue, and how it caused her to stop criticizing me for fear of losing me, which then led to resentment... which then led to arguments, etc).

3) She admitted that she'd been feeling "SD is the one" and that she missed me very much, but was still worried about whether things would work out... especially since she has done what she did (hurting me with the breakup). She also said that she still feels like she needs to "find her voice", which I interpret at girl-talk (kidding) for "I think I love you but I'm still not sure".

4) We left things with her realizing that she needs to try and focus on this, otherwise it might be too late. And I told her that I would be doing what it takes to move on. She threatened (half joking) that she would continue to contact me while she sorted things out... and said I might have to call the cops. I laughed and said I was a big boy, and could choose whether to pick up or not...

5) She went to the cottage last weekend with her girlfriends.

6) I dropped off a card and CD at her house on Tuesday for her B-Day.

7) No thank-you or anything about the card.

 

After all of that "progress" last week I am kinda surprised that I haven't heard a peep from her..... not even a "thanks for the card". Does anyone have any suggestions?

 

Should I be back on NC? If so, how long? It felt so good to be talking to her last week... I could hear that my voice was stirring up all sorts of feelings for her (tears, but also many soft "I'm melting" sighs, etc).... I'd like to keep this influence up, and create some more positive moments, but I'm unsure if I should be the one initiating contact, or just wait for her.... especially since I tried to instill a little fear in her.

 

Part of me says "you've always chased her, you had to chase at the beginning 7 years ago just so she'd get over her fears (of relationships) and give it a try... quit chasing... let her fear your loss and make her own decision... besides you said you'd move on... DO IT". But I'm also worried that (knowing her like I know her) a little fear might just make her start behaving like she's already lost me, and she'll grieve the loss instead of dealing with her confused heart. Obviously I can't know this for sure, but it is a risk.

 

Thoughts?

[Scout]

I can comment on one of these points...I think it's possible that what she actually meant by "finding her voice" means that she needs to have confidence in how she communicates in the relationship with you. That ties in with what she said about being afraid to criticize you for fear of losing you. (on a side note, I wish she had said being up-front about her views on some of your behaviors instead of the word criticize, but maybe that's what she meant).

 

Anyway, if that is the case than I would encourage a low-key, not to fast pace of open communication. Basically setting a whole new tone to your relationship. Listen carefully to her, and give her feedback at the same time to. My starting to become a favorite quote is: Don't give up, don't give in - just give.

 

Listening is giving. Offering feedback, and empathizing at the same time is giving. Learning to look at her good qualities with new appreciation is giving. Even maintaining just a friendship if that's what the situation calls for is giving. You get the idea...

[shockeddismayed]

Thank you Scout...

 

You are right... she did say being up front about my behaviour. One thing she also said was that she really regrets how it came to this... sees now that our bad habits just reinforced each other... ie her fear --> her not being open with her concerns --> passive-aggressive behaviour --> me being annoyed --> me feeling she didn't trust my love --> resentment --> me withholding affection --> her fear ... and it loops around. She sees that, but can't decide whether it is "a bad match" that made things worse (so maybe it would be easier with someone else), or simply bad patterns that we neglected working on (meaning I'm "the one" and we can work this out)... again she's confused

 

What really baffles me about all of this is that we NEVER disagreed on anything important (children, finances, life goals, etc)... even our fights were caused by personality characteristics that we don't like in ourselves... ie I don't like my short temper any more than her, and want to change it... she doesn't like her inability to trust and wants to change it... and neither of us like that we get so hurt when the other notices and comments on our faults (she is bit blunt, ). It seems so silly... I feel like we could be better people if we didn't run from this challenge.

 

Anyway... I appreciate what you are saying... but do you think then that I should initiate contact, or leave her for another week, 2 weeks, indefinitely?

 

When I think about our recent conversations, I feel like I should keep contact up.... that things are moving in the right direction.

 

but then I worry about "the other guy". She told me she is not going to see him b/c she is focussing on me... nevertheless I wonder if she will turn down his advances in her confused state... it's been over a month since she saw him (he lives 5 hours away by car), but I'm sure he'll put in another effort to see her as she said he has strong feelings for her. Anyway, when I get worrying about that I start to say "screw-it, let her put the effort in".

[ziggystar]

shocked&dismayed:

 

i just had a thought and it is in reference to my own situation, but may also apply to yours. it seems like the ex is afraid of commitment. let's look at why. she's afraid of getting hurt. how? that after commiting her heart even more in a marriage and have it not work out later on will be immensely painful. she's afraid of possible failure of the marriage and being abandoned. her fears are running rampant, she acts out of shear terror and confusion. she shows her extreme bad side. good or bad, it's a part of her, whether we like it or not. we react extremely against that. we say shape up or we're gone. WE JUST PROVED THEIR WORST NIGHTMARE, WE DON'T ACCEPT THEM WHOLE HEARTEDLY. why would she even begin to trust us when we threaten to leave at the first signs of trouble? instilling fear upon the fear she has already is not a good thing. yes, it isn't fair. yes, it's a little wacky. yes, it's a game. but it is a true test and if it's our goal to get them back, then time, patience and understanding is what we have to learn. i'm not saying you should accept anything less then what you feel you deserve. i'm just giving a different perspective.

 

yes, you chased her at the beginning, but what you got in return for 7 years was pretty good. if you want the next step in the evoution of this relationship, you'll have to chase her again, but in a different and smarter way. what will you gain from chasing her this time? possibly a life-long committed partner and mother to your children. hmmm...sounds pretty good for the investment of some time. it's less risk to move on personally. it's a lot of risk to stay the course and be strong enough for both perosnally, but less risk relationship wise. she may be testing you on how resilient you are. not necessarily consciously. in a way, it's asking how committed are we if we high tail it out of there when we're faced with their emotional extreme. and to an extent, it's true. we might just be as scared of commitment as they are.

 

i would say do tit for tat contact, and keep the conversation non relationship and just create positive moments and let her feel safe to return and open up. show her that you won't bail, but won't be taken for granted.

[shockeddismayed]

ziggy...

 

really glad you checked in.

 

I agree... your thoughts definitely do apply here. I'd noticed periodic committment/fear of future issues on her part for a long while... I think I got resentful about it. Then when I got in my own funk, I didn't want to listen to her (good) advice on how to get out of it... I was tired of her trying to "improve" me....... especially since I assumed her fears of the future had to do with how she thought of me (when I now feel it had very little to do with that)... so I got sick of feeling like she was never satisfied. Maybe I was ALSO testing HER by allowing my funk to drag out... maybe I wanted to feel that she'd just TAKE the worst of me. I dunno, it is complicated.

 

Anyway... I had an AWESOME "ME" day today. It was a real eye opener for me. I'd met a bunch of new people at a party last night (arrived knowing one person, left knowing way more)... even though I cried myself to sleep, and had to call my sister, I woke up feeling good. Went for a 1.5hr run... groceries (flirted with a pretty girl in line)... treated myself to a huge meal and watched a movie... all alone... all happy. I even sang outloud while walking and listening to my MP3 player (and I'd become a bit more reserved). It was REALLY cool.

 

As for the advice.... I agree. I feel strong enough to support her through this... but I assume when you say "tit for tat" you mean "don't call her until she calls"... am I correct?

 

If I don't hear in another week, would you call? Email? Or just leave it?

[ziggystar]

hey shocked&dismayed,

 

Maybe I was ALSO testing HER by allowing my funk to drag out... maybe I wanted to feel that she'd just TAKE the worst of me. I dunno, it is complicated.

 

absolutely true. i did exactly that myself. i might have even exaggerated my issues to see how much she can take. it is complicated. but we're both still in proximity. she hasn't cut out/off completely and i haven't either. that means there is a chance. it can be resolved. the same with you and your ex.

 

if she didn't call within another week, i'd call or email. the only thing getting in the way is our ego. call and say "i wanted to say hello and see how you were doing?" i did exactly that this past week. my ex went to visit her parents and said she would call me when she got back (sunday). i didn't hear from her so i emailed her on wednesday saying, "just checking to see if you got back safe and sound." she replied and talked about getting together over the weekend, but before the weekend got here, she called me (friday afternoon) unplanned to see if i was home. i was and we hung out a bit. it was nice. the chain of events probably wouldn't have happened if i didn't check in. you can't lose your self esteem if you don't have any expectations of the phone call. think of it as a strategic nudge.

[ziggystar]

tit for tat meaning call her, give her time to respond, when she responds, take some time to respond back. basically one for one, unless it goes too long, ergo the strategic nudge.

[DaisyB]

She sees that, but can't decide whether it is "a bad match" that made things worse (so maybe it would be easier with someone else), or simply bad patterns that we neglected working on (meaning I'm "the one" and we can work this out)... again she's confused

 

I think my ex feels the same way. . . he can't figure out if we're a "bad match" or if we just have problems that can be fixed.

 

I would try to maintain contact with her if you can handle it emotionally. With even minimal contact, maybe she'll feel like you're working things out together (thus proving that you two are not a bad match). If she doesn't call you in another week, try contacting her.

[ziggystar]

daisy b and shocked & dismayed:

 

the funny thing about the comment "bad match" is that it isn't a bad match but a good match if you look at it from a different perspective. i know, i'm kind of in the same position. it's a good match because if being together brings out the worst in each other, it allows the bad to come out so it can be fixed. with or without each other the worst does exist on their own within each person. those things need to be fixed/changed regardless. like it has been said, every person that enters our lives are for a reason. so if one can change their worst parts while being with someone, it will ensure the bond be that much stronger. and don't forget, we get the worst parts out of people, because we also get the best parts out people. they go hand in hand. and ultimately, if we can weather the storm, we'll all be better. win/win is what it's about.

 

and beside that, we're all human beings capable of the same things, so is it really possible to have a bad match? our exes are nitpicking over insecurities.

[Scout]

Truly thought-provoking posts on this thread...it all makes so much sense, I just wish my ex was reading this stuff. Ziggy, the sentence you wrote about "proving our worst nightmares" when our partners back off at the first sign of discord is so true. At least in my case. It's frustrating, sometimes it feels I'm doing all the work to figure out how to have a healthy relationship with each other, but if it doesn't work out with this guy, I've got plenty of new information to take with me into the next relationship.

 

Shocked, I also agree with Ziggy that it's perfectly fine to keep up with the "Strategic Nudges" (what a great expression!) However, keep them infrequent. You need to see for yourself if when you give a Nudge, if it initiates extra contact on her part. For example, last week I called the ex a week after we had a big blow-out (see Gee Cee's thread "A New Gal in Town"), just to sort of say hi, find out how things were going in his family (family members ill) and although he was short on that phone call, he actually called me back later that afternoon, and we saw each that evening. But if the Nudges never result in any kind of contact back from them, I guess you gotta do some thinking on that, and figure out if that means to press on, or not.

[shockeddismayed]

DaisyB...

 

Thank's so much for checking in. Really appreciate the support... I'm worried I'm wearing out my family/friends with this. (ha... not really, but I'm trying to spread it around).

 

Ziggy.... we are SO on the same page about bringing out the best and worst in each other. My EXGF and I have acknowledged that from the FIRST few weeks we met each other. In her post breakup letters to me she has expressed it in several ways: "we have a challenging relationship that at times has felt almost unbearable (arguments)... at the same time I acknowledge that you are my soulmate, I'm aware of the power we share... I just don't understand (how we got here)" and "you've challenged me on so many things, helped me grow as a person, yet even though these challenges were good for me, I resisted... what caused that? The match, or my pride/inability to let you in? "

 

The thing is I went into this with my eyes open... I knew the challenges we'd face and I was all for it. I think I started to get resentful and stubborn when I felt she had stopped accepting my challenge, yet still expected me to rise to hers.

 

The REALLY funny thing is that she was so insightful... 7 years ago she wrote (and later showed to me) that her biggest fear was that I would leave her when the challenge became unbearable. The irony is that it ended up being her who left...

 

I've often felt like what made us react to each other so strongly was that we almost melded. We were such close soulmates that I reacted to her faults as strongly as I'd react to my own. What I mean is that when you see your own faults, it can be a very powerful reaction. I think we had the same reaction to each other's faults... almost as if we saw each other's full potential, and were frustrated by how slow the process of self-actualization is. I wanted to "self"-actualize her and she me... how rediculous that now seems.

 

We talked about all of this... but some of it happened before she was ready to hear it.... she's said her biggest feeling that led to the breakup was fatigue (me, work, stress, school, etc) and I think at first the discussions were too much too soon. She sounded more receptive last week, but I'm imagining that this week's lack of contact may have something to do with absorbing some of last week's drama.

 

I think you are both right... another week, and then maybe just a short email to see how she's doing. I need to think on that though... my ego DOES want her to come to me.

[ziggystar]

shocked,

 

We talked about all of this... but some of it happened before she was ready to hear it.... she's said her biggest feeling that led to the breakup was fatigue (me, work, stress, school, etc) and I think at first the discussions were too much too soon.

 

it's funny that you used the phrase, "too much too soon." it's always too much too soon, meaning no one is ever prepared for stuff like that. in fact, we just avoid it for as long as we can as humans. i can bet these issues were always there in your entire 7 years together, they just had to finally come up, like the dustballs underneath your couch. i am exactly going through what you are going through. even with the getting into my own funk situation and being resentful of her advice. the only difference is that my relationship started only a several months ago. it just goes to show, that time is irrelevant when it comes to growing. we (my ex and i) went through the same set of emotions/issues (as you and your ex) in a matter of months. so that only means that those emotions and issues where there well before we met. and us meeting only precipitated the necessity of this upheaval to happen. and they needed to happen to get to the next level. just think, there are actually people out there who have been married for years and still haven't gone through this. BUT THEY WILL, so count your blessings.

 

"you've challenged me on so many things, helped me grow as a person, yet even though these challenges were good for me, I resisted... what caused that? The match, or my pride/inability to let you in? "

 

the real answer on both sides is not an incorrect match or pride/inability to let the other person in, it's actually the deep-rooted pain associated with having to face our emotional demons. it's easier to run away from that by running away from the people who trigger those demons. being that those demons are inside, it's not the other person you are running away from, it's yourself. and they will come up again until you face them, whether in this relationship or another. but people get confused and believe it's a bad match, because of this adversion to those painful demons.

[shockeddismayed]

Again...

 

I agree with all of that...

 

Now the worry: My EXGF has been wondering whether it would be "easier" with someone else. I can see all too clearly that she could fall into a relationship with a nice, kind, fun person who doesn't challenge any of those issues inside her.... such a relationship could last a while before boredom sets in.

 

She's a bright girl... I only hope her thought process will lead her to this conclusion (that the fact it was a GOOD match is what makes it so difficult at times) before she needs to learn by a bad experience.

 

Ughh... Can't let myself start thinking that way today. Positive flow.

[ziggystar]

i feel the same way. but you have to trust her process, just as much as you have to trust in our own process, trust in the fact that you have seen her worst and she knows that, and by continuing to be there, you prove that she can trust you in your process and thereby you can trust that she won't find anybody in anytime soon that will let her be that way.

 

yes, positive flow...

[shockeddismayed]

yeah...

 

she said something similar to me at the very beginning.... "I know you believe in this relationship, maybe you need to believe in it enough to know I need this time".

 

As for my worries... I flip-flop. I know this other guy is VERY interested in her. He tried to break us up before (4 years ago)... she told me then that is was just "the attention" while I was accross the continent. Now he comes back into the picture at just the moment where she is saying "oh my gosh, S&D is really going to propose to me". She sees him 3 weeks post breakup and then says she's put him out of the picture while she sorts out her feelings for me....

 

I just have such a hard time imagining that he isn't still pushing the buttons to try and get her interested in seeing him. It's kinda unfair that he has email access to her in this confused time, and I'm left in a place where I need to respect her space.

 

Ughh. Again Ughh.

 

It's beautiful out though... I better go for a walk.

[RandyB]

shocked&dismayed,

 

Mine is about no. 27 on your reply list, so I may repeat something already said before, but it sounds to me like your ex is playing you like a piano. As someone already advised you, take all your stuff, and I wouldn't leave a bittersweet gift behind. Gestures like that aren't always accepted in the spirit in which they are offered. Still, I am reluctant to believe anyone is simply insensitive or cold or that they enjoy torturing exes. I prefer believing everyone has feelings, even if, in the case of your ex, they are mixed feelings. Maybe I'm naive. If you still feel strongly about her, I would call her up in a week or two and test the waters. If she doesn't sound very friendly, or starts playing head games with you ("I love you, but...") just be civil and tell her you just wanted to know how she was doing, and give her a chance to make the next move. But don't ignore other opportunities. Doesn't sound like your ex is.

 

RandyB

[DragonGirl724]

i dont think youre being played really. i know my ex said he was gonna sell his car & put $ aside for us & make me a young bride we were exctatic!!!! we looked at rings in the past as well. buttt we faught the next 2 days afterwards & he broke up w/ me sayin he needs time alone & he had a gf since he was 16 and needs to be alone NO GIRLS, just him & his boys workin on cars & playin football...& we're on 'good terms' we talk now & then wen hes online. i dont call him anymore im lettin him do the chasing. he wanted to make sure i knew he still loved me but he needs this time to himself i kinda smothered him etc...i dunno maybe thats what ur ex is feeling. she felt kinda claustrophobic maybe and doesnt know how to handle it. and maybe theres sumthing out there she needs to see/experience for herself b4 settling down and becoming a mature adult & starting a life with someone....

 

-DG724