Need some advice GF hiding things, lieing.

[wanderz]

sorry it's so long... you can read the first paragraph and 6th (starts with so, this morning). for the important stuff.

 

(short version)

my GF recently started really hiding things from me, acting a bit odd and even out right lieing about at least one thing.. and i'm not sure what to do about it.

 

(details)

we've been dating for almost 4 and a half years, and living together for almost the same time..

the bad part is she was married for 9 years (from 18-27), had three kids already, but said it was a bad relationship, they slept in separate rooms for last two years of it.. and basically agreed to break up, but remain more or less friends for sake of kids.. she went from living with him to staying with me most of the time then completely moving in.

 

everything has been pretty much ok, we have the occasional argument but we always talk it out and usually end up in a better mood after.. we recently moved (in march) to a MUCH better location and state.. NC.

 

(the problem)

a couple weeks ago, at her new job she was upset because some guy kept making sexual comments and asking for her number, even joking that he was going to kidnap her... at my advice she talked to him calmly at work and told him to stop, he apologized and says he didn't mean anything..

now suddenly she's friends with him, talking about working for him IF he starts a business, maybe within a year.. (not the problem)

she had a business like that before we moved.. which i helped with.

also he wants to buy a computer.. which i've been building for over 20 years.. so of course i could help there..

she's called him a couple times.. not a problem (i think).

 

a few days ago, she suddenly decided she needed text messaging option on her phone.. despite 4 years of saying how stupid texting is when you can just talk quickly.. oh well.. it was supposedly to text me sometimes... (i received 1 test text so far)

 

yesterday he called her while i was in the room, she talked to him for a couple minutes about work.. then said "yeah he's hear.. 4 years" obviously the answer to "is he there" and "how long you been together" (i believe) then she left the room of our empty for the weekend, and extremely quiet room while talking to him... a couple minutes later she came back, i didn't even say anything, she sayed, "sorry hun, he was aking questions about you, i didn't want to answer in front of you" what? then she tried telling me he asked the question i KNEW she had already answered before leaving the room.. when i said that she just said oh it was nothing. and changed the subject..

she did say he wanted to meet somewhere and discuss what computer he should buy and talk about the business, IF he's going to start one...

 

so, this morning she mentioned going out to meet him... which based on everything in the past four years would mean WE would go meet him... especially when he wants my opinion on a computer... but she made a big argument that i can't go... with no particular reason.. 3 hours later, i pointed out repeatedly that this is the first weekend we have without kids since february, why would i want to sit home alone while she goes out to have coffee with someone she has known for about 2 weeks who used to sexually harass her? her only response was we could go eat something then come back home and she'd leave to go meet him.... still no reason why i can't go, besides "i didn't warn him you'd be coming" they also didn't even know where they were going so she could still easily "warn" him.

 

she was dressed up nicely with makeup and her fancy earrings and everything all day.. which i don't know when i've seen last.. waiting for him to call her.. he didn't, so she called him and woke him up, he works nights.. she apologized for waking him and basically said let me know if you still want to meet up somewhere.. she kept her phone with her the rest of the day (not normal) and dressed up sitting around the house (very not normal, especially when it's hot).

around 7pm she decided to go get her gps out of her car to sort out the music on it... took her phone and sat in the car for a little over 10 minutes talking on the phone... to cover for that she brought up a couple cds and asked if they were mine.

around 8pm her ex called to ask if he could drop the kids off..

and did around 8:30.. it wasn't until then that she finally changed into her shorts and staying home clothes..

i decided to think for a bit, so i just calmly said i was going shopping, talked to my mother by phone while shopping... about 2 hours later, as i'm heading home she calls half asleep to ask when i'll be home..

10 minutes later i got in, she's asleep.. she woke up for a minute and just said hi hun.. i just said hi sleepyhead, good nite hun.. which for four years has been accompanied by a kiss.. not today.

 

i remembered she works different hours the next three years, so i needed to reset her alarm on her phone (and mine) so we don't wake up at 5am for nothing.. so i checked the recent call list while i was there... she called him twice more while i was shopping...

i also needed to check to see if we got charged for the 1 text she sent me.. and make sure she wasn't either.. i was charged for 1 message she had used 29 of her 200 she has the plan for.. in 3 days.. i don't know who the other 28 were too.. i'm debating if i should check that on her phone. she also called his house 3 times on the 4th, during her breaks (when she can't call me because it's too loud there).. the list only goes to the 5th.. no saying how many times she called since.

 

and advice how i should approach her would be much appreciated.. at this point i'm mostly concerned about the lies, i don't think she's actually cheating on me.

[DN]

If she's not cheating on you it looks like she is planning to.

 

I would tell her what you know and see what she says. If she doesn't come up with convincing answers I would advise walking away from her.

[pinkrobot]

I'm with DN, if the cheating hasn't happened yet, it definitely sounds like it will.

 

The thing I find interesting is that her behavior makes it incredibly obvious she's being deceitful...she appears (from your story) to make no effort to be secretive about any of this.

 

What you need to do is basically take everything you've told us, and tell it to her. Pay attention to how she reacts, because that will tell you a lot. Watch for whether she appears genuinely hurt by your accusations, or whether she gets defensive (this may indicate she has something to hide).

[karvala]

Don't be a doormat is the first piece of advice, and I say that not because I think you have been, but because the desire to appear laidback, combined with sufficient self-control (which I think you have) to carry it out, can inadvertently result in that. Many people will tell you that making a fuss drives your loved one into the arms of another. I would tell you something different. Very few women cheat with someone they've just met or hardly know. It takes time for an emotional bond to form from the initial sexual chemistry, and most women will not cheat without it. I dated someone who had been a serial cheater before me (as I discovered partway into the relationship). She cheated again on her next bf after we'd broken up. She never cheated on me, however (which I know through several means, so I'm quite sure it's true). That wasn't because of any change of personality or extra commitment, but because I wouldn't allow it happen, I remained vigilant and at the first sign of danger, before things got out of hand, I would make a fuss and cut it off dead. It would take the fun out of it for her, and make it impossible for it to seem like a thrilling, romantic, emotional thing, instead becoming a sordid, traumatic and guilt-inducing thing.

 

My advice would be to do the same. What your gf is already doing is highly disrespectful, and I have little doubt that unless you nip it in the bud, it will develop into some form of cheating, even if her conscience at that point kicks in and she regrets it and ends it. You must have it out with her, calmly and rationally at first, explaining that you don't think it's appropriate for her to have this level of contact with him and insisting upon meeting him alone etc., and that if they're just friends and work colleagues then you would like to be introduced, and otherwise, you would like her to cut it out. Be prepared for a fight, because she will not gve in lightly, and she may not give in at all. If that doesn't happen, then it's time to escalate it, frustrate her into telling the truth about her feelings for the guy, and extract an emotional confession from her, followed by a reconciliation between the two of you and a resolve on her side to end things with him. Only then can you can let up and go back to being the good relaxed guy, which will finally make you seem the better option to her. Before then, you won't be the good relaxed guy, you'll be the pushover guy behind whose back she thinks she can get away with doing other things.

 

In other words, however tempting it is, don't leave it and don't play it down. Deal with it now, and be prepared to go in hard to do so.

[wanderz]

The thing I find interesting is that her behavior makes it incredibly obvious she's being deceitful...she appears (from your story) to make no effort to be secretive about any of this.

 

she has been trying to be a little secretive, at least at first.. i didn't really know about most of the calls until after the conversation in the morning.. and my further investigations since then.. which have actually revealed more..

 

she deleted all but four text messages from her phone.. the one she sent me, and two to her ex about kids (one from over a week ago that we're paying for because it was before she had the text plan) and one she sent in the evening to him just saying "do you still want to meet today" no replies either.. she did cover her tracks on that one.

she had a few calls on her contact list to him as well.. one i forget if it was friday or saturday for over 15 minutes.. at 9:30 at night.. which seems odd because we were together then (both nites).. the only possible thing i can think is maybe when she took a shower, which would actually bother me more then any other time.. or maybe the one she left the room at the end of but i didn't think it was that long of a call..

 

thanks for the advice so far.. i will probably go with your suggestions.. tho i do think at first i'm going to play dumb and see if she'll admit to more of the phone calls..

 

the big complications that'll come up in the very likely split.. we have an apartment in both our names for another 4 months.. 1.5 of which are already payed even.. two cars, both in my name, and 'her' car can't be transferred because i'm still paying on it.. altho i'd consider letting her have that one.. she can't have my grand cherokee..

we have a lot of furniture, to much to fit in this three bedroom apartment in fact... 4 computers, multiple video game systems and tvs.. most of which i payed for.. so i guess i'd take my share first

 

the sad thing is, at this point i'm a little upset and i think more just interested in investigating.. i wonder if the cheaters show would come to NC on a few hours notice.

 

I suppose i will miss the kids.. they have become more and more like me then anyone.

[wanderz]

Don't be a doormat

 

In other words, however tempting it is, don't leave it and don't play it down. Deal with it now, and be prepared to go in hard to do so.

 

yeah, i wasn't planning to be..

evidently i was typing my 2nd post while you were typing yours, so i didn't see it until after..

 

i seriously doubt there is much chance of working this out..

basically at this point i'm more questioning

 

just how should i end it? just abruptly tell her the plain truth that even if she is not, or in theory wasn't going to cheat on me, i will never be able to fully trust her again. generally i go by the theory that once someone starts to lie there is little chance they won't do it again.

 

or question her and give her a chance to explain what's been going on first..

 

also, should i bring it up before she goes to work or after? i'm seriously leaning towards giving her the chance to think i don't know anything and see if she a) meets him on her lunch break, unfortunately i don't know exactly when it is today, so it'd be a bit hard to catch her, unless i sit in the parking lot for a couple hours.. and i don't actually know what he looks like.

or i could give her the chance to meet him after work and catch her there.. i do know where she wanted to meet him today and could probably get the info out of her again...

then either way i'd confront her when she gets home.

 

my third thing i'm questioning is if maybe i should call him and ask a couple questions... and possibly her ex as well..

the reason for this is, during the months i worked with her before she left her ex husband.. we went out for lunch breaks together a few times, innocently, then after work a few times, then jokes of a relationship started.. then it built up from there into a real relationship, with her constantly telling me how badly her husband treated her for over 8 years..

i'm just curious if she's now telling this guy that i treat her badly...

i have his home phone from the online phone bill and can get his cell from hers.

i'm curious what she was telling her ex back when she was spending so much time with me, before she actually left him.

 

i'm also realizing i don't really have any way of moving out right now.. i don't have the money to put down the first and last on an apartment right now.. and also can't get out of the lease here.. which i already know places around here ask if you notified your current landlord you'd be moving soon..

which means unless she moves out, we're probably going to be stuck living together until september, and even if she does move out, it'll be a bit hard for me to pay the rent, all the utilities and other stuff on a 3 bedroom by myself while trying to save up to move out.. not to mention a huge waste of space.

[Applewhite]

Just curious if you've really decided you can no longer trust her, and you want to end the relationship, why do all these things matter? How you end it, catching her, seeing if she will lie to your face or admit the calls, talking to the ex, talking to the new guy... why does any of it matter IF you have made your decision?

[retired1]

Had something similar happen to me during my first marriage. I approached the guy and point blank told him that if he continued his behavior, they'd find little pieces of his sorry hind end scattered all over the place. Issue solved.

[offplanet]

She's obviously very interested in this guy from what you've said about her calls to him, supposedly re the computer, and naturally, not willing to admit that to you. It doesn't seem like he's too interested in her though, which is irrelevant, because she's willing to cheat on you and deceive you. I'm glad you see through her.

[wanderz]

Just curious if you've really decided you can no longer trust her, and you want to end the relationship, why do all these things matter? How you end it, catching her, seeing if she will lie to your face or admit the calls, talking to the ex, talking to the new guy... why does any of it matter IF you have made your decision?

 

well, i guess part of me does want there to be nothing really going on and maybe somehow it's a misunderstanding and she is just talking to him about work stuff.. the only way i can possibly be convinced completely either way is if i can catch them together without them knowing i'm there, or maybe talking to him to see what he says / how he reacts, once again without him being warned that i'll be talking to him.

 

of course at this point just the fact that she has been trying to hide most of it from me would leave me with distrust that would probably never be able to completely be fixed.

 

mostly i do like to investigate/ research things and figure them out.. i've even been known to point out evidence on things that made me look guilty when i didn't do it.

 

we didn't really talk yet, i kept it normal for now (wouldn't have had time anyway unless i woke her up early), talked about kids mostly.. just before she left i did ask if she ever got in touch with him so we can plan things on if she might get a job or not.. not that i'd let her work for him and stay with me at this point.

she said she only got thru that one time when he was half asleep and said he'd call back.. then she didn't hear anything, which she said she was upset about and if he wants her to help him build a business he better get in touch with her because she won't chase after him to help him out.... which is a typical thing for her to say (usually about her ex or brothers).. then she usually calls whoever again anyway.

unfortunately the phone call list is still only listing up to saturday, and it's sunday i need to see.

 

i did find the list of texts she sent, 9 of them were in deed to him.. and only one reply. the others were her ex and mostly receiving from him.. which she does mention to me, and joke about his spelling etc..

and i evidently accidentally resent her last text (to him) at around 3am..

[wanderz]

hmm.. here's an interesting twist..

 

i traced his phone number, and low and behold his wife that he supposedly divorced some time ago and left her the house is listed at the same address as him still..

now i could be really nice and call his house and talk to his wife

[Applewhite]

hmm.. here's an interesting twist..

 

i traced his phone number, and low and behold his wife that he supposedly divorced some time ago and left her the house is listed at the same address as him still..

now i could be really nice and call his house and talk to his wife

 

But why? What good will that do? I know how you feel and I have no intentions of undermining your feelings or curiosity (I have been in similar situations, and felt the same thins). However this kind of behavior, as well as being unproductive and a waste of time, will in the end hurt only YOU.

[wanderz]

But why? What good will that do? I know how you feel and I have no intentions of undermining your feelings or curiosity (I have been in similar situations, and felt the same thins). However this kind of behavior, as well as being unproductive and a waste of time, will in the end hurt only YOU.

 

how is it going to hurt me if i call and ask her if they are really divorced, and let her know that he's sneaking around with my fiance? supposedly he told my gf that he was talking about getting back together with his ex soon... shouldn't she know as well if this is all true..

it also explains why he doesn't talk or reply right away when she (my gf) calls or texts him.

[Applewhite]

how is it going to hurt me if i call and ask her if they are really divorced, and let her know that he's sneaking around with my fiance? supposedly he told my gf that he was talking about getting back together with his ex soon... shouldn't she know as well if this is all true..

it also explains why he doesn't talk or reply right away when she (my gf) calls or texts him.

 

Lets assume you did all this. How will it help you?

[pinkrobot]

how is it going to hurt me if i call and ask her if they are really divorced, and let her know that he's sneaking around with my fiance?

 

Have you proven they're actively sneaking around together yet? Sure, your gf is being deceitful, but you've said yourself all you have to go off of is their cell phone communication. So until you can prove something, keep this between you and your girlfriend.

 

Having said that, you mentioned hoping this would all turn out to be a misunderstanding and then it would be fine. But even if it was a "misunderstanding," the fact of the matter is that your wife has been secretly making phone calls and sending texts to a man other than you. And that's wrong. And if she's capable of it with one man, she's capable of it with others as well. A huge trust issue has been broken here. There's nothing to misunderstand about that. And it's an issue that, one way or another, needs to be seriously dealt with.

[wanderz]

Have you proven they're actively sneaking around together yet?

 

Having said that, you mentioned hoping this would all turn out to be a misunderstanding and then it would be fine. But even if it was a "misunderstanding," the fact of the matter is that your wife has been secretly making phone calls and sending texts to a man other than you. And that's wrong. And if she's capable of it with one man, she's capable of it with others as well. A huge trust issue has been broken here. There's nothing to misunderstand about that. And it's an issue that, one way or another, needs to be seriously dealt with.

 

no i haven't proved they are really doing anything yet that was why i said i would like to see them together somewhere... the main problem is that she lied to me... the only other issue is really that she refused to let me even meet this guy, with no explanation.

 

his story gets worse and worse.. (based on what she told me, repeatedly) he works two jobs, has a lot of money to open a business, and supposedly divorced his wife and left her the house some time ago.. but some research shows it's a rather cheap small house that they just bought less then two years ago... which he still lives in with her.. which actually has me a little concerned for her safety..

 

but no matter what i really doubt i'd ever totally forgive her for the lies and deceit.

[LostSpartan]

I'm coming in late on this one...

 

Let me tell you.. I have been in lots of relationships with women. Older, younger, different races, all kinds of jobs and careers. The fact remains all of the key elements are usually the same.

 

1. Getting defensive.

2. Always some event you can't go to for the most insane reasons.

3. Phone problems. Hiding their mobile phone, deleting numbers, weird calls, just about anything with it.

4. Making changes to make themselves look better.

 

You pretty much said all of those in your first post. I agree, there is some cheating afoot. Now.. has she done it yet? Who knows. Although, she has crossed the line so far as emotional cheating, disrespect, and trying you as a man.

 

Do yourself a hard favor. Tell her how you feel. Hit her with all of that in calm matter. Trust me yelling will NOT work. She's going to be defensive and may want to argue. Expect that, she sounds guilty so that is how she is going to act. Do you know why a person who is cheating acts guilty? It's because they are acting. They aren't upset or really offended. It's an act so she is going to overdue it and come off defensive. Basic human function like the heart picking up when someone is lying.

 

Now, I'm reading your posts about all of this detective work. I know it hurts and its very frustrating. You've spent years with her for it all to be tossed away. You owe it to yourself to cut ties. Three kids that are hers? Haha trust me man.. shes going to be the one hurting in the end. Not many men are willing to deal with women and those number of kids. You are a great man. Now show some integrity. Hold your ground, present your information, keep how you feel real with her, and state that you are done with her. She will get mad and maybe even just say fine. Expect that. Just expect your resolution is you have saved yourself from more hurt from this lying cheater.