The X is an X for a Reason

[John Bendix]

I keep reading this on posts here and I am trying to see the validity of this general statement. The connotation is that the X is out of your life for a good reason and that should be out of your life.

 

Well, all general statements contain some manner of falsehood, including the one I have just written. The part that troubles me is that the statement does not allow for change. It assumes that a person is who they were in the past, and that is their identity now.

 

Is this an extention of what we believe our own identites to be linked to, our past? I firmly believe this to be not so. The past is gone and only survives in images. To view ourselves as a past image of what we were or did, seems to be taking away from what we are right now, in this moment.

 

I believe that we do not have to try and make the person we used to be (only an image anyway) happy. It seems to be a waste of energy and a false action. That past persona is not who we are unless we insist on dragging it with us as if it is who we are.

 

Most of the best friends in the world that I share my life with, did not get along with me or I with them when we first met. Some of them I did not even want to speak with much. Sometime later, we got to apprecaite each other for what each other was at the time w/o dragging up our images of each other from the past.

 

Just a thought.

[waveseer]

I agree with this message.

[JadedStar]

Well, John, past behavior is a strong indicator of future behavior. "Strong indicator" does not mean an end all be all, but what comes to mind when a person tries to continue to get back wtih an EX he or she had nothing but problems with is the saying of "insanity is doing the same exact thing over and over and expecting a different result".

 

There is validity in looking at a person's past behavior when trying to decide propensity for future. Sure, people can change, but people rarely do extreme 180s ina short time. If a person TRULY has good reason to believe an X is working extremely hard on change, and they are OK with knowing that change is giong to take a good amount of time, no harm in trying again.

 

But most people who break up and get back together find themselves back in the same cycles as soon as status quo hits again. Note i say "most". I knwo there are exceptions so I don't really need examples cited from anyone unless they just want to do it, I am well aware that there are exceptions.

 

For me, I would prefer to be in a relationship with someone who shares my common goals and values from the onset and with whom i don't need to wait for a lot of change to take place, and if that means i have to find a new person because the old one was continuing to prove no good for me, then I'd do it.

I'm not here to change anybody and at my age if i am with someone who needs to make a lot of serious change to make a relationship work with me then they are likely not the right person for me. No slam to them personally, they just aren't likely the right match for myself.

[lady00]

I do think that breakups generally happen for good reasons. Exes are exes for a reason. That doesn't mean that people cannot get back together and have a great relationship though. If people really want to mature and change, they certainly can. I know people who have broken up, gotten back together and are now married, and I believe happily so. Two of the people I am thinking of specifically had a lot of time apart to explore their dreams, figure out what they wanted in life, and grow up and mature (so much can change during the late teens-mid twenties) and now they are happily together after realizing that they both needed to change their behaviors in order to work together as a couple.

[SighSob]

I wish I could be given a second chance, my ex told me I deserved it but it would just be too odd for me to turn back suddenly into the kind guy I was at the beginning of our relationship. I guess the problem is that once the dumper has grown out of love for you, it takes him/her some time to be prepared to eventually fall in love with you again, even if you change the very moment he calls the break...

[JadedStar]

I wish I could be given a second chance, my ex told me I deserved it but it would just be too odd for me to turn back suddenly into the kind guy I was at the beginning of our relationship. I guess the problem is that once the dumper has grown out of love for you, it takes him/her some time to be prepared to eventually fall in love with you again, even if you change the very moment he calls the break...

 

Outstanding point. Often times even if the ex changes a great deal the past took too much toll on the person and time also helped them move on and the love could have faded or they fall totally out of love...thus rendering a second chance very unlikely.

[SighSob]

Well if your partner has grown out of love with you, you just have to accept it (i still haven't), focus on yourself and become a better person. Unless your ex died, there's still hope that sooner or later you'll make him/her yours again...of course you don't want to lock up in a room waiting for your ex to change his/her mind...you go out, make new friends, date new girls, and live as if he's never coming back. There's nothing wrong in hope, as long as you don't STICK to it...

[John Bendix]

Jaded,

 

I knew this thread would open a can of worms! jk

 

I see your points but mine still remains that when someone goes into a mindset, based on a generalizied statement such as, the X is an X for a reason, and totally buys into it to avoid dealing with what is happening right now, they have limited themselves by seeking justifications for their actions.

 

To me, it assumes too much and is so general as to have a tiny bit of truth in it in any situation. This can be extrapoloated in believing that the statement, and its connotations, are absolutes.

 

As for this,

 

"insanity is doing the same exact thing over and over and expecting a different result".

 

I could not agree with professor Einstein more. But the main problem in doing this action lies in the expectation. Hopefully, the people in the relationship will not re-live the past mistakes.They may but to assume that they will, becasue of this statement of the thread, is not an assumption I am willing to make.

[pumpkinmoon]

I think this is a good post. Although some people don't get on at all, I think that most break ups are due to one or both parties not being prepared to work hard enough in the relationship. I read stories on here about dumpers who say, "I love you but we can't be together" and things to that effect and it really irritates me if I'm honest. If you love someone why leave? Surely it is worth the work and I know I could never leave someone I love. Sooner or later, the work has to be done otherwise everyone would end up alone.

[lostandhurt]

Hey John,

Honesty has to come first with all breakups. Not the truth but honesty. It may be true that he or she did terrible things and there was a breakup. The honesty comes from looking inside and admitting that they are not good/healty for you anymore. They may have been at one time like you and I know all to well but that is the past just as you say. Love goggles keep us from being honest with ourselves, perhaps to protect the memory of the relationship or to protect our pride and ego. These goggles blur the facts and our lack of honesty with ourselves leads us to think and feel things that aren't true whether good or bad. We choose to remember the bad so we can justify or we choose to remember the good so we don't feel like we wasted __ number of years.

Once the honesty comes then clarity can follow. Then we can truly see who we are and if we like the person we have become. If not we can admit our faults and work to change for the better. Our S.O. can do the same but not without honesty. Unfortunately bitterness, pride and ego all to often get in the way.

 

I am not the person I once was and and neither is anyone else on this site.......

 

lost

[John Bendix]

Lost,

 

But in many cases, honesty is the first thing to go. Way before the relationship is over. It is a contributating factor (to say the least) to the dissolution of the relationship.

 

You are right. There is that scoundrel the ego again.

[JadedStar]

John, you always bring forth compelling arguments but i guess i still have to stick strongly to my thoughts on this simply because of sheer facts. I have seen far more people who go thru the break up and back together thing that failed then likewise. This is probably because more people than not don't actually do any REAL changing. Change is very hard, and most people charge ahead into it with real good intentions, but once status quo hits the person reverts back to type. It takes a lot of tenacity and hard work to change, and let's face it, most are not willing to do the work and due diligence. That is sad, but it is a reality. Anyone on earth CAN change. You and i BOTH know that. But how many really DO real 180s in life? I am a not a gambler but i do look at propensity whenever i examine the odds about an outcome and in tihs case the odds are in favor that when most people break up, and get back together, nine times out of ten the old problems are still present. They can try to get thru them, or not. Most do not because many people do not possess the knowledge or love of self help to really make positive changes in their life.

 

And let's not discount the obvious. John, many people break up due to incompatibliity, and you can continue to put a square peg in a round hole all day long, but you are going to end up chafed! I mean "you" metaphorically speaking of course.

 

And as lostandhurt so poignantly pointed out, sometimes a dumpee realizes that person is simply NOT healthy for him or her anymore. This is usually a very big moment in a person's life when they realize this and it is a healthy step to realize that it is not always the best tihng to keep "working on something". Sometimes letting it go is the best thing a person can do for themselves.

[lady00]

Some things are more unlikely to change than others. For example, as Jaded said, incompatibility does not usually go away.

 

On the other hand, if the problems are due to immaturity, that often does change for many people, especially in the teens and twenties. It does not mean a relationship will work, but it can swing in favor of things working out the second time around.

 

Generally, from my observations of friends who have gotten back together with their SOs and made it work, the things that needed to change had to do with growing up, maturing and coming into their own as adults. This often involved a long period of separation and dating others. Also, in some cases, distance was a factor and then was no longer a factor and the couple decided to give it another shot.

[coldplay.]

I disagree with the statement.

 

If your 'x' is an 'x' for a reason. Then you HAVE to agree that people never change or grow and secondly that you are not healed.

 

If you say anything that would propel you away from that person then you are not in the neutral position of healed, you are against them, thereforee you are grudging, thereforee you are angry, thereforee you are hurt, thereforee you are not healed. Some people will never heal, they will reach a position where they are comfortable and stop there, never trying, always having this very deeply buried pain that may never surface again. When people say they 'learned' from the other its just a nice way of finding a clever term that has at least some validity, of why never to revisit them, but in reality it is a falsehood, its just buried.

 

 

Our present state is the adjunction of all of our past decisions and actions. We are no more or no less that what we have created for ourselves. Understanding the past, is the key to our present and future, but we must know the past for what it really is, the past. We cannot dwell in it, we must be an outside observer. We cant do this forever though, once weve come to terms with it all we need to exercise mindful living, really know what the heck is going on at this moment in time and not letting the veil of life stretch over our eyes as the proverbial train comes at us down the track.

 

About friends, i think our first mistake we make in a relationship is befriending someone we are in a relationship with. Love and friendship are close together but indefinitely divided. Sometimes i believe we confuse sexuality and friendship with love, and we give our unearned friendship very easily to the other, but once that happens our trust can be easily violated. Then we look back after its all done and are wondering how and why their friend would do this and why they wont talk to us, they are not our friends, they are lovers. Then even afterwords as mayday11 has said so many times before, you cannot be friends with an ex, but you can be friendly. Because most of the time we were not friends to begin with.

 

I believe a difference i can put forward, can you have sex with a friend? Before any different lifestyled people chime in 90% of the people here would not. Because after youve had relations with them, are they still friends? Id say NO, there is a certain trust friends give, and the only way they maintain is by not compromising their position on ability to hurt you. Keep in mind this is all talking about "true" friends not just acquaintances.

 

And also, i know many people date friends, well this isnt for you.

[John Bendix]

My point still remains the same:

 

Generalized statements should not be used as true justifications for our actions and reactions.

 

"The X is a X for a reason" thereforee, there is something intrinsically wrong with them or the relationship. Get out of it.

[coldplay.]

yes and i believe i helped shed some light on why its intrinsically wrong. But keep in mind, when they are our ex's we are already out of the relationship.

[JadedStar]

My point still remains the same:

 

Generalized statements should not be used as true justifications for our actions and reactions.

 

"The X is a X for a reason" thereforee, there is something intrinsically wrong with them or the relationship. Get out of it.

 

I am not really even referring to the statement the X is an X for a reason unless one is using it on a case by case basis to describe someone in particular that the statement applies to.

 

For example if i said my ex is my ex for a reason, it is not a generalized statement and is very true. I know about ten friends off the top of my head that i could say that same thing to and it would be accurate. In many cases it is accurate. But without knowing the person and their situation, no it can't be used as a can statement everytime. But if the ex is an ex for a reason that does not suggest there is smoething wrong with THEM it suggests that the two people in question either could not overcome the difficulty because either it was too great or they didn't care to work on it hard enough, or they were so incompatible it just wasn't going to make it. That doesn't mean there was something wrong wtih either person but YES it does mean something was wrong with the relationship. that is why they broke up.

 

But again, I like to go with odds and propensity much of the time when making assessments. that doesn't mean that it is an end all be all, just propensity and nothing more, nothing less.