what's so bad about narcissism?

[Johnny_has]

My step sister is dating a guy and she told my family that she can't stand him because he was diagnosed as having narcisstic personality disorder. Sounds like one mental illness that I wouldn't mind having, what's so bad about loving yourself? From what the little bits of info I've heard it sounds like these people are just very assertive, have high standards and love themselves just the way they are, and this guy isn't even that good looking and he has this disorder.

 

So what's so bad about narcissism???

[BlueEyedBoy]

I hate narcissistic people. I find no reason why I should make time for someone who thinks of nobody but themselves.

[SweetypieEnlightenedOne]

I sort of agree with you Johnny_has, if your not the best looking person in the world, what better disease to have then that? Hey, i'm not the worst looking person in the world and i wouldnt mind having a little bit of that. Ha ha. However it the diesease hurts those who you are close too because your being a bit vain, and selfish then that may be a man, she needs to just leave be. 8)

[OmegaMan]

The thing is, narcissim isn't only about loving yourself. If that would be the case, everyone would want to catch that disease. Narcissim is so.. extreme. The problem is not so much that they love themselves, it's that the universe turns around them so it becomes very hard for them to live in any sort of collectivity. I wouldn't want to be narcissist, it would be a nightmare. Oh yeah, narcissism isn't only about looks, or so I've heard, it's that the person is in love with everything that has to do with them.

 

Etienne

[SweetypieEnlightenedOne]

Yikes I have a confession, if what Omega man described is even just a few symptoms of narcissism then i have about five people i need to turn in to the Authoritys! One girl in particular is one I work with, If she is without a man for the rest of her life, i would not be surprised, she is all about herself, her looks, her money, her ways, her thisher that. I thought she was just looney, but now I know what she really is...*Eyebrows raised in an Austin powers kind of way*

[Poe]

actually, narcisstic individuals hate themselves. That they love themselves is an illusion. They are obsessed with their image. It's all a facade.

 

Basically, narcissistic individuals create this image that they project to circumvent dealing with who they really are. They typically have a conscience, but choose to ignore. They don't have the same bounds of conscience the rest of us do, and it's typically inflicted by extreme emotional trauma that the person was unable to cope with.

 

Read into it... it's not a character trait you would like to have, nor associate with.

[Leonhart]

The lack of empathy is the main problem.

 

They don't feel anything for others and will not hesitate to stomp all over anyone, even those they "claim" to love.

 

It's quite antisocial.

[someguy88]

The lack of empathy is the main problem.

 

They don't feel anything for others and will not hesitate to stomp all over anyone, even those they "claim" to love.

 

It's quite antisocial.

 

I kind of disagree, but it's kind of a 'which is first, the chicken or the egg' argument. I think the lack of empathy is an illusion, kind of like a bi-product of their deep seeded self-hate and yearning to be loved. I think assuming that they don't feel is anything for others is the most dangerous misconception.

 

Although narcissist's act cruel and vicious at times, they're just like everyone else in that they want to be loved, however, they can never really feel loved because they hate themselves. Nothing anyone does will ever be enough for them so being in a relationship with a narcissist is like taking one "prove you love me" test after another.

 

Personally, I think narcissism is one of the worst things a person can be affected with. It really does hurt a lot of people including the narcissist.

[Leonhart]

I kind of disagree, but it's kind of a 'which is first, the chicken or the egg' argument. I think the lack of empathy is an illusion, kind of like a bi-product of their deep seeded self-hate and yearning to be loved. I think assuming that they don't feel is anything for others is the most dangerous misconception.

 

Although narcissist's act cruel and vicious at times, they're just like everyone else in that they want to be loved, however, they can never really feel loved because they hate themselves. Nothing anyone does will ever be enough for them so being in a relationship with a narcissist is like taking one "prove you love me" test after another.

 

Personally, I think narcissism is one of the worst things a person can be affected with. It really does hurt a lot of people including the narcissist.

 

That's nice.

 

I am going by the Narcissistic PD in the DSM-IV. Not what layman's call "narcissism."

 

Look it up.

 

You'll find the lack of empathy a key trait in that PD.

[someguy88]

hahahaha I'm a narcissist. Beat that! LOL **kidding**

[just M.E.]

Someguy

I was married to one, it is very brutal living with this type of person, to say it is all about them is to say nuclear bomb is just a firecracker. These people can be devastating to others, they are seductive and then destroy, they need a continue cycling of partners in their life, this goes on and on.

 

They take on a variety of colors and flavors, but they can be extremely cruel and vicious and it is most done without an awareness on their part because it really is all about them. Go through it once and you will understand, but I hope you never do.

[Cimmie]

I was with someone who I suspect has NPD.

 

It's no joke. The lack of empathy is profound and very disturbing. It's like other people literally don't exist for them, or are tools put there solely for their use.

 

I was violently mugged while with my ex and he evinced no emotion, just said, hope you'll be ok, and walked off and left me standing there in shock.

 

That's what you call lack of empathy.

 

They can also snap and become violent if their narcissistic control or worldview is challenged. My ex told me I had no rights, and when I challenged that statement he became violent.

 

I would like to know the difference between a psychopath and someone with NPD, but I am not sure.

[cc2006]

We're all narcissistic. There is "healthy narcissism" and "unhealthy narcissism".

 

The kind you could see as "a good thing", is the 'healthy' kind. That consists of acting in your own best interests (usually sometimes or often - like .. making sure you take care of yourself emotionally) and seeming to really 'love' yourself and such. There is nothing wrong with, and actually very many things good with, healthy narcissism.

 

The unhealthy kind is quite frankly, scary. I'm not sure I'd say my ex was a full blown sufferer of NPD ... but she has some very poignant narcissistic characteristics.

 

In a very small nutshell ... take that healthy "I like me ... I'm a good person ... I'm confident" thing we all crave and warp it with some doses of "I don't like ____ about me" and "everyone needs to love me" and "me me me me me" attitude and you're on your way.

 

My ex was one of the classic self-hating narcissists. Her past has her self-esteem so riddled with holes that she seems to have no problem trying to use other people to make her feel better about herself. It seemed to me, through dealing with her, that she had a very "what can you do to make me feel happy" way of thinking ... and if you weren't making her happy, then all hell would break loose.

 

 

"I think I'm fat because you don't tell me I'm pretty" is not a healthy conversation starter. No .. you think you're fat because people made rude comments at you when you were younger, people you cared about, and you have developed an eating disorder. ... me telling you I think you look good in those pants will not cure an eating disorder. Oh .. now you're yelling at me and crying ... ok ... I forgot this is the script I get every weekend ... sorry ... sorry.

 

There was also a huge lack of empathy ... or consideration for my feelings. You shouldn't have to point at something completely obvious that it would upset you and say, "Didn't you realize I'd get upset when you said/did that?" A more healthy person with common sense and empathy for others would realize that saying certain things or doing certain things can and will hurt others ... and they would hopefully choose not to do those things for fear of hurting their partner. My ex, whom I loved and cherished, would berate me on the phone until I felt like I was nothing ... and by the end of the conversation she'd go from feeling down and depressive to healed and healthy .. happy .. and whistling like the world was wonderful. She'd feed off me ... making me feel horrible ... pointing out all the alleged ways in which I was 'lacking' and wasn't a perfect boyfriend ... she'd cry and throw fits and act childish until I was completely drained .... and by the end she'd feel great and go to bed and sleep soundly ... and I'd get an hour or two of sleep and not be able to eat for three days.

 

If she did in fact act concerned about my feelings ... it was nearly always the case that she just expected me to have the same feelings that she had, the only 'right' ones, the only 'real' ones.

 

 

 

Unhealthy narcissists will latch onto someone that makes them feel good about themselves and basically suck the strength out of that person. When that person is all used up, or wakes up and fights the abuse ... fights back against constantly being used as an emotional battery ... then the narcissist can be known to freak out ... and ultimately leave their partner to find someone "new" and "exciting" and "better" to feed their ego off of.

 

True narcissism is the epitome of selfishness, self-centered behaviors, and insecurity.

 

True narcissists will never get help ... because they feel they're right, the center of the universe almost ... and can't see how they hurt others. They respond, usually, to therapy with anger and confusion. How dare someone accuse them of not having everything together. How dare someone point at them and even hint at the fact that they need some counseling.

 

 

 

 

Now ... if you could see the look of utter sadness and pain on my face ... the posture I have, slumped and hurt ... hear the tone in my voice if I were to read this post aloud ... you'd understand, in no time at all, how totally devastated dealing with my ex has made me ... how much it hurt me ... and how much it pains me to think that she'll never change ... and she'll just plod through life in her damaged state and never seek true help over it.

 

Now .. if she were to walk into this room right now ... and observe the same things as you ... she'd probably just glaze over the fact that I'm upset. At best she'd ask why I was upset ... and if I showed her or read her this post she'd flip out ... acting like I just sank a knife in her heart ... how dare I claim she has 'issues' ... how dare I try and blame her for our relationship problems ... this must mean I hate her, and don't love her, and think she is fat and ugly and stupid. It would be a personal attack on her ... and not an expression of my feelings in a sincere and thoughtful way ... in which I'm pouring out my worry for her, my fear she'll be unhappy forever, my fear that she is 'broken' and needs to become healthier and learn to love herself in a healthy way so she can love in return.

 

This would be seen as a blatant attack on her as a person ... she'd flip out ... probably tell her friends later that I was a complete ______ and was insulting her ... and then they'd agree with her because she'd word it in such a way that makes her look like a victim.

 

Game .. set .. match. She gets to keep being "poor me" and act the victim ... and I look like a bad guy. ... and in the end she doesn't have to once consider that I'd have feelings that may in fact differ from hers. She got everyone (except me) to agree with her that she is right ... so obviously she is ... and then she can move on to another guy to fill the hole in her ego.

 

 

 

 

I'm done.

[Vanishing Girl]

I was actually going to post what a family member has posted about themselves on their myspace page to see what you guys think of it in terms of "can someone like this be healthy"? This post seems like a good place to put it:

 

 

egocentric, self absorbed, not loyal, not generous, only concerned about those close to them, prone to bitterness, can ignore the rights of others, narcissist, meglomaniac, competitive, controlling, needs to have the upper hand in relationships, vain, materialistic, values indivuality over loyalty, not afraid of conflict, would pursue a career that was harmful to others, believes the benefits of freedom outweigh the benefits of attachment, does not value organized religion, does not like to admit making mistakes, quick tempered, not traditional, tactless, blunt, suspicious, makes enemies, wants to be famous, prefers technical careers (law, engineering, medicine), prefers instant gratification, attracted to prestige, manipulative, influenced more by self than others, decisive

 

 

I noticed after hanging out with her that i always felt bad about myself and she would constantly point out faults within my family, which helped to make me dislike her.

 

Another bit of info: she has on their "more to love" when she's skinny as a rail. She seems to have no close friendships, however she is married and seems to have a "normal" (whatever that is) relationship within the marriage. Is this all possible to live normally and happily and still be the way she describes herself????

[Vanishing Girl]

Another bit of info: the person in my family whom she married was doing nothing so to speak with his life before meeting her, and since they've been married he's gone back to school, gained a career, and traveled more parts of the world than most would have the chance in their lifetime. So, to me it seems that maybe she is a healthy narcissist?

[just M.E.]

A person with true Narcissist Personality Disorder can't be "healthy", there can overlaps in a person's psychological make up and a positive narcissist can go very far in life but from what I am told by the "professionals", those also cannot form truly healthy personal relationships.

 

Maybe the two have interlocking personality disorders and it works for them...

I don't think the concept of narcissism as a healthy trait is realistic. We all have healthy self love and self esteem but that isn't narcissism.

 

If you really think it can be healthy, marry one, they can sustain for a number of years, behaving in a relatively "normal" manner but in the long run the damaging behavior patterns come out. They inevitably will damage their partner in some sense if that happens. Seems to be a accepted school of thought by those with much more experience than any of us.

[cc2006]

Another bit of info: the person in my family whom she married was doing nothing so to speak with his life before meeting her, and since they've been married he's gone back to school, gained a career, and traveled more parts of the world than most would have the chance in their lifetime. So, to me it seems that maybe she is a healthy narcissist?

 

Well ... to be honest, I'd hope her profile info was a complete joke. ... like she put all that stuff up there to make people shy away from talking to her.

 

If in fact that is an apt description of herself in perfect honesty then she sounds insane to me. lol

 

 

... and 'healthy narcissism' doesn't force others to do what they want. If that guy was perfectly fine doing "nothing" then there is nothing wrong with doing nothing. ... if that makes sense.

 

Life isn't about molding people into what you want them to be. If she basically held an emotional gun to his head and manipulated or flat out forced him to change his life against his will then that isn't healthy in the least.

 

 

Again though .. I hope all that stuff is a joke ... because if not, she totally is wacked out. lol

[Cimmie]

Sometimes I felt I was the narcissist. Is that normal when living with them?

 

I also think I may be a co-narcissist because my father has narcissist traits. I think that's why I went into a relationship with my ex and stuck it out for so long.

 

I should be in heavy duty therapy.

[Vanishing Girl]

Well ... to be honest, I'd hope her profile info was a complete joke. ... like she put all that stuff up there to make people shy away from talking to her.

 

If in fact that is an apt description of herself in perfect honesty then she sounds insane to me. lol

 

 

... and 'healthy narcissism' doesn't force others to do what they want. If that guy was perfectly fine doing "nothing" then there is nothing wrong with doing nothing. ... if that makes sense.

 

Life isn't about molding people into what you want them to be. If she basically held an emotional gun to his head and manipulated or flat out forced him to change his life against his will then that isn't healthy in the least.

 

 

Again though .. I hope all that stuff is a joke ... because if not, she totally is wacked out. lol

 

 

She does seem to appear to live up to that from what i can tell, but I also realize my own perception plays into that (and I'm finding my perception to be a little twisted lately), so i am trying to give her the benefit of the doubt and yet stay away......if that makes sense, LOL

[just M.E.]

Cimmie,

I know a couple of children of a narcissistic father and they aren't like their father. I think it is normal to doubt yourself after living with a narcissist, I am also told by those who have lived with someone who was Borderline Personality that they often felt they were the crazy one. Maybe it is all the projection stuff that happens, makes us absorb the guilt of there issues onto us, just a guess.

From what I have been told it would be difficult for two narcissistic people to be together, the need for 100% attention from their partner would force them apart.

The "it's all about me" concept doesn't make room for another narcissist.

[cc2006]

Sometimes I felt I was the narcissist. Is that normal when living with them?

 

I also think I may be a co-narcissist because my father has narcissist traits. I think that's why I went into a relationship with my ex and stuck it out for so long.

 

I should be in heavy duty therapy.

 

 

You know ... my ex used to make me feel like I was the one with the issue. She'd try to turn it right around on me.

 

She'd constantly point out how her needs weren't being met ... and how she was upset ... and how her feelings meant so much but I wasn't doing as she wanted.

 

.. then, I'd say "Why does everything always have to be about you and your feelings?"

 

.. and she'd flip out ... and be all "It isn't .. you aren't doing what I want .. so thereforeeee you're doing what YOU want ... it is all about YOU and what YOU want all the time because YOU get YOUR way!!!"

 

.. which .. I guess could make sense, and at times did to me, so I'd feel bad. Does that make sense now? ... or did I just lose everyone.

 

I wanted her to stop being depressive and making demands on me. She just kept making demands and saw my not catering to her as me always getting my way.

 

 

So ... she made me feel like I was the narcissist. Hey .. for all I know, maybe I am one ... but ... I seriously doubt it.