Son is ungrateful/doesn't listen/overly aggressive

Ok before I start i want to say that I am proud of my son as he has accomplished a lot in his life thus far.

He started attending medical school this fall after a 2 year period where he was working. I rented out my home, moved my things and moved down to his apartment just to help him out. As far as I know I am the only parent who is willing to do this for their son.

The problem is he doesn't listen to directions when I give them. He is often late getting to bed, goes out on weekends without asking, and generally disrespectful when I ask him to do something. He gets upset over the smallest things such as me not squeezing the toothpaste from the bottom, leaving coffee cups on the counter, or using the wrong garbage bags in the trash can. When I try to talk to him he just says that I need to leave him alone. For the record, I cosigned the lease because he said doesn't trust anyone else with his money.

He has also had a history of aggression and can be manipulative (though not towards me) of other people. There are tons of examples of this. He was always fighting in high school. When he was working, he was a supervisor and he fired someone because he didn't like their views on a certain subject. Now I didn't live with him during that time but I frequently visited his office. I still remember he had the poor guy's stuff all in a box, and said that he had 30 seconds to change his mind or "get the f--- out of his sight". I told him that he couldn't treat people like that. He got up and punched the guy he was firing in the stomach and said "You're right. Maybe *this* is better." He then phoned security and had me removed from the building for "telling him how to do his job".

Can you help a guy out? I don't know what to do. I would like a him to not be so uptight and ungrateful when all I'm trying to do is help him out and protect him from getting hurt.

As a loving mother with the best intentions for the both of you....

I'd follow your Irish proverb and move out and leave him to his own devices. He's a bully but he is also a man who needs to learn from his own mistakes.

I'd follow your Irish proverb and move out and leave him to his own devices. He's a bully but he is also a man who needs to learn from his own mistakes.

I had this discussion with him. I am just trying to help him out and teach him about the real world. I suppose his version of "hell" is a place where somebody can keep him in check and where he has to obey someone elses rules.

I cosigned his lease and technically have a right to remain there. I told him I'm not going anywhere. If I move out, he quits medical school and that's it. As soon as he learns how to be a proper son, by following instructions and rules in the house, and how to be a proper citizen, I will leave him on his own.

As a future doctor he should know to always keep calm. Aren't you supposed to have fitness of character to practice? That is what I'm most concerned about.

How old is your son ?

Don't help him anymore. He has a malicious uncaring streak by the sounds of things and does not deserve assistance.

I had this discussion with him. I am just trying to help him out and teach him about the real world. I suppose his version of "hell" is a place where somebody can keep him in check and where he has to obey someone elses rules.

 

I cosigned his lease and technically have a right to remain there. I told him I'm not going anywhere. If I move out, he quits medical school and that's it. As soon as he learns how to be a proper son, by following instructions and rules in the house, and how to be a proper citizen, I will leave him on his own.

 

 

As a future doctor he should know to always keep calm. Aren't you supposed to have fitness of character to practice? That is what I'm most concerned about.

Now that really bothers me. Aren't those the words of a controlling parent?

I get the feeling here that you will never leave him on his own because, in your eyes, he will never learn to be a proper son, never fully follow instructions and obey the rules of the house or ever become a proper citizen.

I stand by my first post, leave him alone to live his life.

How old is your son ?

He will be 25 next month.

Now that really bothers me. Aren't those the words of a controlling parent?

 

I get the feeling here that you will never leave him on his own because, in your eyes, he will never learn to be a proper son, never fully follow instructions and obey the rules of the house or ever become a proper citizen.

 

I stand by my first post, leave him alone to live his life.

I am NOT trying to control him. I mostly let him do what he wants but he has to know there are limits to what he can do.

He was such a great kid growing up. Listened to his parents, helped the younger kids and old folks in the neighborhood. He went to church every week, and was well-behaved which is more than I can say for 90% of kids. He is still very religious. Now he won't listen to a word I say. I tell him not to drink so much coffee and he just ignores me. I say it's 11pm and he should have been sleeping one hour ago, and he tells me to shut up. The list keeps going on. Respecting your parents is one of life's basic lessons. It's one of the ten commandments. Just my opinion here, but if he's acts like that in the home, he obviously needs to grow up a little before he can live on his own.

I think you would both be happier if you stopped living together. Someone who is old enough and smart enough to handle medical school is old enough and smart enough to handle living on his own without his parent around to "help" him.

The problem is ... HE GREW UP and you are still treating him like a child by telling what to do and when to do it. He is grown man and you are not allowing him to be a grown man, grown men drink coffee and go to bed when they feel like it, not because their father tells them to.

There comes a time to set your children free and let them live, supporting and advice when they ASK for it. You are treating him like a child, and as a man he must resent this.

It is as ridiculous for you to tell your son, a man, how to live his life and what to do as it would be for your own father to step in and tell you what to do and when to do it now that you are a man.

And you are holding him to ransom by threatening to pull the plug on his career and he must resent that very much. Also bringing up the ten commandments to back up your position to continue to treat him like a child isn't necessary.

And you might find this patronising, but find an outside interest of your own, join a class or something to fill up your time so you will not be so interested in his life.

If you don't back off here, there is a very real risk that he might drive off into the sunset and into his own life and you will never see him again.

MOVE OUT if you cannot stop treating him this way while you are living together. Let him live his own life, the sooner the better.

WoW!!!!!!!!!!

What Amipushy said; cuz what I want to say is a whole lot more harsh.

I agree with the others. Let him live his own life. Your son sounds strong in terms of personality, and sounds like he could manage just fine. He obviously was fine during four years of college and two years of work without having any sort of intervention.

He should always respect you. If he is still religious, then he probably still does, but I can agree that it would be frustrating when you are 25 and your father is ALWAYS telling you what to do.

About staying up late and drinking coffee, that is normal. Unless you are of the Mormon faith, I don't see why this would even be an issue. Medical school is very demanding and requires a great deal of studying after-hours. Even undergraduate college students may sometimes stay up all night to prepare for an exam. Instead of getting upset because he doesn't go to bed at his "bedtime", you should be happy that he is at least being enthusiastic and giving his studies his best shot.

The problem is ... HE GREW UP and you are still treating him like a child by telling what to do and when to do it. He is grown man and you are not allowing him to be a grown man, grown men drink coffee and go to bed when they feel like it, not because their father tells them to.

There comes a time to set your children free and let them live, supporting and advice when they ASK for it. You are treating him like a child, and as a man he must resent this.

The problem for me is that he does not ACT like a grown man. Grown men don't throw a tantrum and get upset just because someone moves their stuff to another place in the room. Children should know not to refuse to eat certain foods because they don't like the way they taste. A grown man would have the responsibility to go to sleep on time, without someone telling them. He's been more rebellious since I moved in, essentially behaving like a teenager, not like a grown man.

And you are holding him to ransom by threatening to pull the plug on his career and he must resent that very much.

Well, he did say he can do without me once. Of course -- he wants me to leave him alone but still wants me to foot his bills for his education. He can't have it both ways. As long as I'm paying for him and supporting him through medical school, he should at least follow the rules at home.

Nevertheless, I'll follow the advice most people have given and allow him some space to do his own thing. I talked to him about it and said I'm not moving out just yet, because his is not ready to live alone but that I will back up and try to respect "his space". He should know, though, that there are certain responsibilities that come with these priviliges.

Also bringing up the ten commandments to back up your position to continue to treat him like a child isn't necessary.

Sorry, I guess I got out of hand. The thing that bothers me is that he himself claims that he is "fairly religious", and he does pray at least three times a day and goes to Mass weekly. The thing is that he cherry-picks the Bible sometimes and he beats the Bible so much that he sounds like some kind of an extremist. For example, he claimed to me today when I asked who he was voting for, that "real" Christians wouldn't vote this year because both Obama and McCain are supposedly not in line with the Church. I guess I was a bit frustrated with his attitude over the few years and it came out sounding a bit bad.

I rented out my home, moved my things and moved down to his apartment just to help him out. As far as I know I am the only parent who is willing to do this for their son.

There are thousands of parents who help out their child in his position, myself included, but by moving in with your son you have become the classic "Critical parent".

If you think about it, it was a foreseeable disaster..Go home.

I don't think you are trying to control him so much as show him to right way to treat people and react to situations. But, he's 25. I act more mature than that and I'm 21. Just reading what you wrote at the very end of your inital post, he punched someone in the stomach? At 25? C'mon already! That's high school/ middle school garbage. He's going to have to learn on his own that he can't treat people that way. He'll end up in jail if he doesn't knock it off, and sometimes that was it takes for people like that sometimes But, I think you should go home... You were responsible for his actions 7 years ago. Don't be responsible anymore. It's not worth it. My mom doesn't protect me like you protect your son. I learned a lot of hard lessons on my own, with my mom as a reference, someone to cry too, not to solve it for me.

Hey Frank -

Sadly, you are NOT the only parent willing to do this.

As a parent, I can see completely where you're coming from and appreciate how difficult a position you find yourself.

On one hand, you are USED to sacrificing who and what you are to make your your child becomes who and what they are supposed to.

Yet on the other hand, sometimes who our child becomes isn't always likable, even to us ourselves.

There are many things you COULD do or try but NONE, I fear, will be as effective as taking this baby bird from the nest perched atop the tall, tall tree, holding him over the side and just letting him go.

He WILL fly. Its in his nature. He may struggle, open his wings too late, or shoot you a look of panic stricken shock at your audacity, but the whole while, he will be flapping his OWN wings and learning to fly his own way.

You have to do it man. You HAVE to let him figure this one out on his own. There are a MILLION other ways for you to assist in his flight instructions from the sidelines WITHOUT carrying him on your back whilst YOU fly him around.

Best of luck to you dude. AND your son......

That's exactly one of his problems. He never thinks he's wrong. Sure, he can go around and hate certain groups of people, but it's because they're screwed up, not him.

Of course on the outside, he can be really friendly and all smiles, when it matters. But once he is placed in a position of authority, he grasps onto it and won't let go. And he makes sure that nobody disagrees with him. I happened to be visiting him in his office when he was firing that guy for something trivial -- something the other guy supposedly said about the Virgin Mary. I told him that in America, people have the freedom of speech, the right to disagree, so he shouldn't fire a guy just for that. Nevertheless, he couldn't calm down and socked the guy in the stomach because I was supposedly "undermining his authority".

By the way, he was diagnosed with OCD and Intermittent Explosive Disorder when he was 17. Of course, now *he* claims that the psychiatrist was a quack, and that the "liberals" were persecuting him because he was religious.

At times, I think he can be pretty irresponsible, which is one reason why I am reluctant to leave him alone. For example, he did not tell me he wanted to apply to medical school. He just went ahead and did it without my permission and then one day told me that he was going to need the money for it. Luckily it was not a huge amount of money for us because he also applied for a scholarship (again, not telling me anything) but still more than he could pay.

I do wish I could go home at times. I will probably move out next semester, if I can see an improvement. I can see both sides of the argument where, sure, he might be a bit embarrassed at having me around at his age, but on the other hand where he is not really ready to do things on his own. I would like to have him listen to my directions more, like he used to do back in the good old days, but as some people here implied, it's probably useless. I can't move back just yet as my tenants have signed a lease which doesn't end until the first day of January, 2009.

I understand your position and why you fell as if you need to be there. But I agree with Awdree. You gotta let him figure it out on his own. He'll never learn otherwise. Sad, but true.

I happened to be visiting him in his office when he was firing that guy for something trivial....

Why were you visiting him in his office? I think many people would feel awkward if their parents came to their workplace.

Also, the fact that he applied to medical school on his own, and with success shows that he in fact CAN handle his own affairs.

You won't be there forever to help him out. Your son clearly has a very strong personality, and strong convictions even if it comes out the wrong way. Don't be overprotective; my OWN father is that way and it sometimes drives me crazy when he hassles me about trivial things. I can tell you that it CAN strain a father-son relationship.

You walk aound behind him thinking and probably saying repeatedly to your sone "YOU are wrong". Even without verbally saying it your non verbal communication e.g. shakeing head, tuts and sighs andbody language etc tell him that.

He's a bully at work, pure and simple, but while at work you shouldn't interfere which you did. It isn't up to you to butt in, it is his employees place to make a formal complaint and up to this employers to smack him down for what he did and the police to prosecute if necessary and if he was a decent organistation he would have been fired and marched off the premises for what he did.

We learn what we live and our environment shapes us and right now you are his environment and you are shaping your son.... move out.