I don't know what to do

[Batya33]

Just now, H o p e said:

At first we didn't use emoticons at all. He could have gone back to being serious if he wanted to create more distance. I don't overindulge in emoticons, I'm juts saying we're all smart enough to know the difference in tone they can make. 

 

And you are certainly smart enough to know when a man is interested in seeing you one on one because he will ask you out for a date he plans in advance.  Anything less is anyone's guess- at least, assuming that kept me grounded in reality without being negative in any way.  

[Tinydance]

24 minutes ago, H o p e said:

At first we didn't use emoticons at all. He could have gone back to being serious if he wanted to create more distance. I don't overindulge in emoticons, I'm juts saying we're all smart enough to know the difference in tone they can make. 

 

You read into everything quite a lot. These days people use emoticons all the time and it's no big deal. It's probably more the younger people but I'm 38 and even my friends and I use emojis a lot. The difference in tone is also made by the type of actual emoji used. I think there's a big difference between let's say: "Oh thanks 😍" and "Oh thanks 😊". Something like smiley face or sad face actually aren't perceived as romantic. Saying:  "Sorry we can't meet ☹️" Isn't the same as: "Sorry we can't meet 😘". You want to read into everything so badly that you think just the fact he used some emojis means he's into you. If people really wanted to they could read anything into anything.

[Jaunty]

44 minutes ago, H o p e said:

 he seemed genuinely interested. Mutual attraction was there. Immediately after launch, he wrote to me, and to me, his thank you was so eager it almost sounded as an excuse to ask me for that coffee. 😉

 

You have projected wildly. 

People are attracted to others all the time.  Married people find themselves professionally interacting with others and feeling chemistry.   It means zero, insofar as future potential for anything.   

Not saying this guy is married, and not saying that he didn't feel a spark. 

But obviously not to the necessary extent to try to get together with you ... not at all.    Because, clearly, he did NOTHING.

Meanwhile, you felt that you'd fallen in love, and you are continuing to spin yarns about the feelings and motives you are projecting upon him.

You're attributing deep emotional meanings to emoticons???

Honestly you seem obsessed.

 

[H o p e]

1 minute ago, Tinydance said:

You read into everything quite a lot. These days people use emotions all the time and it's no big deal. It's probably more the younger people but I'm 38 and even my friends and I use emojis a lot. The difference in tone is also made by the type of actual emoji used. I think there's a big difference between let's say: "Oh thanks 😍" and "Oh thanks 😊". Something like smiley face or sad face actually aren't perceived as romantic. Saying:  "Sorry we can't meet ☹️" Isn't the same as: "Sorry we can't meet 😘". You want to read into everything so badly that you think just the fact he used some emojis means he's into you. If people really wanted to they could read anything into anything.

No no no, if he chose 😘, I would find it really cheesy - cheesy on no basis whatsoever. Thank god he didn't use that. 😆

[Batya33]

2 minutes ago, H o p e said:

No no no, if he chose 😘, I would find it really cheesy - cheesy on no basis whatsoever. Thank god he didn't use that. 😆

The second you find yourself analyzing use of emoticons is when you know for sure the man is not "that" into you.  Maybe this is obvious or you're in the throes of this intensity and it bears repeating -with extremely rare exception a man who is interested in seeing you for a date would never risk a miscommunication and it's easy to do so because all it requires is asking the woman out for a time/place/activity. 

Like when my then really shy/future husband asked me to lunch.  He called me and said "would you like to have lunch next week?" Then we set a date and time. 

When many years later after we'd broken up, reconnected and he wanted to make sure he could see me when he would next be in town (unbeknownst to me, also to broach his desire that we get back together) - he called me and made a plan two weeks in advance because it was for a Saturday night.  It really is that simple and clear on both ends.  With rare exception.  Which this situation is not at all IMO.

[H o p e]

4 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

You have projected wildly. 

People are attracted to others all the time.  Married people find themselves professionally interacting with others and feeling chemistry.   It means zero, insofar as future potential for anything.   

Not saying this guy is married, and not saying that he didn't feel a spark. 

But obviously not to the necessary extent to try to get together with you ... not at all.    Because, clearly, he did NOTHING.

Meanwhile, you felt that you'd fallen in love, and you are continuing to spin yarns about the feelings and motives you are projecting upon him.

Honestly you seem obsessed.

 

No, I am not obsessed but I maybe sound obsessed because I'm trying to find logic in everything.
My assumption was: this guy is sincere. He says things and means them.
I would never assume he would be using phrases he didn't have to.
Maybe he was just just curious, you know, playing a little bit just to test the waters.
I don't know.
It was totally unnecessary for him to propose a coffee.
I would rather see no messages about the coffee from him, you know!
Just a 'thank you so much, beautiful, perfectly done' and 'until next time, have a nice time'.
I would be much more at peace.


 

[Batya33]

4 minutes ago, H o p e said:

No, I am not obsessed but I maybe sound obsessed because I'm trying to find logic in everything.
My assumption was: this guy is sincere. He says things and means them.
I would never assume he would be using phrases he didn't have to.
Maybe he was just just curious, you know, playing a little bit just to test the waters.
I don't know.
It was totally unnecessary for him to propose a coffee.
I would rather see no messages about the coffee from him, you know!
Just a 'thank you so much, beautiful, perfectly done' and 'until next time, have a nice time'.
I would be much more at peace.


 

So tell yourself that unless a man you are interested in asks you out on a date he plans in advance you can be at peace that he is not interested in dating you whether he proposes coffee sometime or not.  If he is interested in the future he will contact you and ask you out for a date he plans in advance and until that time whether or not it happens move on and be at peace. That's how I stayed at peace.

[H o p e]

12 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

The second you find yourself analyzing use of emoticons is when you know for sure the man is not "that" into you.  Maybe this is obvious or you're in the throes of this intensity and it bears repeating -with extremely rare exception a man who is interested in seeing you for a date would never risk a miscommunication and it's easy to do so because all it requires is asking the woman out for a time/place/activity. 

Like when my then really shy/future husband asked me to lunch.  He called me and said "would you like to have lunch next week?" Then we set a date and time. 

When many years later after we'd broken up, reconnected and he wanted to make sure he could see me when he would next be in town (unbeknownst to me, also to broach his desire that we get back together) - he called me and made a plan two weeks in advance because it was for a Saturday night.  It really is that simple and clear on both ends.  With rare exception.  Which this situation is not at all IMO.

What I meant is that I use the kissing emoticons only with several people in my life that are pretty close to me, not with strangers, so I would be bothered If he was fasttracking our communication that way. 🙂

I agree with what you're saying, of course it usually is that simple and you just know and don't have to ask yourself about interest. I also planned in advance, just to let him know I do have interest. So yes ... I understand everything. Just hard to accept it was obviously just another phrase. No one wants to hear phrases when hoping for something more ... If this wasn't a business situation at first, I wouldn't be so tip-toey about everything and I wouldn't be afraid to be more direct from the beginning, to just back off when needed, letting no space for any guessing.

 

[Tinydance]

17 minutes ago, H o p e said:

No, I am not obsessed but I maybe sound obsessed because I'm trying to find logic in everything.
My assumption was: this guy is sincere. He says things and means them.
I would never assume he would be using phrases he didn't have to.
Maybe he was just just curious, you know, playing a little bit just to test the waters.
I don't know.
It was totally unnecessary for him to propose a coffee.
I would rather see no messages about the coffee from him, you know!
Just a 'thank you so much, beautiful, perfectly done' and 'until next time, have a nice time'.
I would be much more at peace.


 

To be honest I actually don't think he misled you. Some people do touch someone's arm a bit here and there. My ex actually used to do that but didn't mean anything by it. I know he said about the coffee and it doesn't mean he was completely insincere but he may not have meant it romantically. Because you were attracted to him, you took everything as a sign. It's actually easy to do that if you're really looking for the "signs".

For example, if he was an older woman doing business with you and she touched your arm and said: "I'll take you for coffee to thank you", you'd think nothing of it, right? I know that men usually don't say they'd take a woman for coffee but this was actually in a work context. It would be different if say you were at a party and talking to a guy and he wanted to take you out for a coffee. Sometimes at work a male and female colleague actually might go to get a coffee if they're on the same break or they need to discuss something about work.

Also you said he messaged you something then said it was the wrong number. You said you thought he was using it as an excuse to talk to you. I think if he just wanted to talk to you he would actually message you normally. He could have just said: "Hey shall we go for that coffee Hope?" Why would he send some random fake message to you and then say "Sorry sent to the wrong person". That just makes no sense. He probably did actually send it to the wrong person.

 

[Batya33]

1 minute ago, H o p e said:

What I meant is that I use the kissing emoticons only with several people in my life that are pretty close to me, not with strangers, so I would be bothered If he was fasttracking our communication that way. 🙂

I agree with what you're saying, of course it usually is that simple and you just know and don't have to ask yourself about interest. I also planned in advance, just to let him know I do have interest. So yes ... I understand everything. Just hard to accept it was obviously just another phrase. No one wants to hear phrases when hoping for something more ... If this wasn't a business situation at first, I wouldn't be so tip-toey about everything and I wouldn't be afraid to be more direct from the beginning, to just back off, letting no space for any guessing.

 

No you didn't show genuine interest in meeting him for coffee.  You're a business person so you know that your timing showed none/lukewarm interest.  Whether that affected his decision later not to plan coffee is anyone's guess and irrelevant. The only relevant fact is he doesn't want to meet you for coffee and he has not asked you out on a date so assume it's because he doesn't want to have coffee with you at this time or date you at this time.

My point is stop the "hoping for something more" as anything more than a feeling.  Which you can choose the reaction to.  If a man is not asking you out on a date he plans in advance (or accepting with enthusiasm your invitation for a date you plan in advance) tell yourself the "hope" is unfounded.  Because the reality is at that time there is no interest in dating you in any way relevant to your life.  

[Tinydance]

9 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

So tell yourself that unless a man you are interested in asks you out on a date he plans in advance you can be at peace that he is not interested in dating you whether he proposes coffee sometime or not.  If he is interested in the future he will contact you and ask you out for a date he plans in advance and until that time whether or not it happens move on and be at peace. That's how I stayed at peace.

Yes and especially if she sent "Happy Birthday" and all he said was "thanks" and she asked him for coffee twice and he's not acting interested. Also sometimes someone might be hoping you read between the lines rather than just flat out saying "no". E.g. saying "I guess this coffee just isn't meant to be". Like that's a bit of a negative statement? If I was away but interested I'd never say that. I'd say something like: "Soon as I'm back we'll organise it!"

[H o p e]

9 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

Yes and especially if she sent "Happy Birthday" and all he said was "thanks" and she asked him for coffee twice and he's not acting interested. Also sometimes someone might be hoping you read between the lines rather than just flat out saying "no". E.g. saying "I guess this coffee just isn't meant to be". Like that's a bit of a negative statement? If I was away but interested I'd never say that. I'd say something like: "Soon as I'm back we'll organise it!"

Of course he would rather see me reading between lines, because saying 'no' would just flat out say his intention was not real, it would mean it was merely a phrase, it would say he's not sincere and he can not follow through an idea he set up in the first place.

Perhaps it's good to feel so much disappointment as I am right now, that way I will forget about it sooner, I guess.

[Tinydance]

5 minutes ago, H o p e said:

Of course he would rather see me reading between lines, because saying 'no' would just flat out say his intention was not real, it would mean it was merely a phrase, it would say he's not sincere and he can not follow through an idea he set up in the first place.

But he doesn't actually HAVE to take you for coffee. You're actually acting a bit entitled like he HAS to like you and HAS to go out with you. He actually doesn't. You're taking this extremely seriously. There was nothing going on between you and that guy. You were working together and he thanked you for your work. The message he sent you was about the work you did and to thank you he'd take you for coffee. Maybe he actually did mean it but as a colleague. So when you texted him "Happy Birthday" maybe it began to sound to him like you actually were into him but he wasn't interested. So that's why he didn't follow up on your coffee.

[Sindy_0311]

Hey, just to mention, your story reminds me of one guy I have been working with on a project one year ago, we had good chemistry, he always complimented my work and i think we were attracted to each other. Months later he contacted me through an online dating app, liked my page and asked for a drink together. I said, yea sure, with pleasure… I’m still waiting for the drink… it’s been six month now. 

Your guy is not ready to date you, neither was mine at that time, he even sent me the heart emoji… but I learnt to always keep my expectations low and not read into signs unless they take action on their interest. And even so, they might only be interested for a hock-up… so, welcome to the jungle 😂

[Sindy_0311]

Just now, Tinydance said:

So wnen you texted him "Happy Birthday" maybe it began to sound to him like you actually were into him but he wasn't interested. So that's why he didn't follow up on your coffee.

I completely agree🙏

[H o p e]

1 minute ago, Sindy_0311 said:

Hey, just to mention, your story reminds me of one guy I have been working with on a project one year ago, we had good chemistry, he always complimented my work and i think we were attracted to each other. Months later he contacted me through an online dating app, liked my page and asked for a drink together. I said, yea sure, with pleasure… I’m still waiting for the drink… it’s been six month now. 

Your guy is not ready to date you, neither was mine at that time, he even sent me the heart emoji… but I learnt to always keep my expectations low and not read into signs unless they take action on their interest. And even so, they might only be interested for a hock-up… so, welcome to the jungle 😂

My oh my, well yeah,

instead of Welcome to the jungle I was looking for some Patience, but I guess I was wrong 🙂
 

[Tinydance]

2 minutes ago, Sindy_0311 said:

Hey, just to mention, your story reminds me of one guy I have been working with on a project one year ago, we had good chemistry, he always complimented my work and i think we were attracted to each other. Months later he contacted me through an online dating app, liked my page and asked for a drink together. I said, yea sure, with pleasure… I’m still waiting for the drink… it’s been six month now. 

Your guy is not ready to date you, neither was mine at that time, he even sent me the heart emoji… but I learnt to always keep my expectations low and not read into signs unless they take action on their interest. And even so, they might only be interested for a hock-up… so, welcome to the jungle 😂

But in your case at least that guy actually contacted you much later on a dating app, asked you out and sent a heart emoji. In this case all the guy said was: "I loved your work and I'll take you for coffee to thank you." After that he never messaged and all the messages and invotations were only started by her.

[Sindy_0311]

1 minute ago, Tinydance said:

But in your case at least that guy actually contacted you much later on a dating app, asked you out and sent a heart emoji. In this case all the guy said was: "I loved your work and I'll take you for coffee to thank you." After that he never messaged and all the messages and invotations were only started by her.

I know it’s a different situation, but the point is, that even if my guy showed more signs of interest, I’m still waiting for that drink… so I suggest Hope you stop reading into signs, because they don’t mean anything… 

[H o p e]

I never thought a short, simple happy birthday wish would scare him off. 🙂 Of course I was aware I was showing interest, I could have forgotten/'forgotten' about it. That, he must have known. But thinking of the meeting, I think he mentioned it on purpose, I mean, it was totally irrelevant to our business, saying a deadline would be on his birthday. It was probably just him being spontaneous. I spontanously decided to wish him a happy one.

[Sindy_0311]

3 minutes ago, H o p e said:

I never thought a short, simple happy birthday wish would scare him off. 🙂 Of course I was aware I was showing interest, I could have forgotten/'forgotten' about it. That, he must have known. But thinking of the meeting, I think he mentioned it on purpose, I mean, it was totally irrelevant to our business, saying a deadline would be on his birthday. It was probably just him being spontaneous. I spontanously decided to wish him a happy one.

Think about what would have happened if you actually had that coffee with him… are you sure that it would have led to something? Maybe you would be at the exact same point, wondering about his interest towards you. As everyone says, when you have to wonder about it, it means there is no interest. That simple. But I know it’s not easy because people sometimes send mixed messages without real intentions. 

[Batya33]

17 minutes ago, Sindy_0311 said:

Your guy is not ready to date you,

There's no indication he ever wanted to take her out on a date. He never asked her out on a date.  I don't think it's that he's not "ready" -in this situation there's no assumption that he wanted to date her in the first place.  He was flirty with her - from her perspective.  He mentioned potential coffee and she provided her belated response. 

I wouldn't elevate this to a situation where a man says "I really would love to take you out on a date sometime.  I have some personal stuff going on and I just cannot date right now.  I will call you in __ months when I have things more together".  Yes this happened to a friend who met her future husband at a bar.  He called when he said he would -a few months later.  They married a bit over a year later. He turned out to be a jerk but he actually did follow through.  That's not this.

  I don't like the suggestions on this thread that he was interested in dating her -men who are interested in dating -especially business men who are not shy - will make that clear by asking the woman out on a date he plans in advance (or accepting her asking him out with enthusiasm).  The OP is imagining and has these notions that he was interested in dating her -but the proof is in the pudding. No pudding to see here.

[Batya33]

4 minutes ago, Sindy_0311 said:

Think about what would have happened if you actually had that coffee with him… are you sure that it would have led to something? Maybe you would be at the exact same point, wondering about his interest towards you. As everyone says, when you have to wonder about it, it means there is no interest. That simple. But I know it’s not easy because people sometimes send mixed messages without real intentions. 

I don't think he sent mixed signals.  Like so many do (in my life too -happened a few day ago) he suggested coffee.  Like so many the recipient didn't respond in a timely way.  If they'd met no need for mixed signals because if he wanted to see her again he'd have asked or accepted her invitation with enthusiasm.  No need to read signals, emoticons, etc.

[Sindy_0311]

I think mixed signals are very subjective. It depends on how much you like someone, you start to read everything like a signal, that’s what OP is confused about. The hand, the compliments, and the coffee suggestion can easily be interpreted as signals from his part. That is what I was referring to. 

5 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

I don't think he sent mixed signals.  Like so many do (in my life too -happened a few day ago) he suggested coffee.  Like so many the recipient didn't respond in a timely way.  If they'd met no need for mixed signals because if he wanted to see her again he'd have asked or accepted her invitation with enthusiasm.  No need to read signals, emoticons, etc.

 

[H o p e]

51 minutes ago, Tinydance said:

To be honest I actually don't think he misled you. Some people do touch someone's arm a bit here and there. My ex actually used to do that but didn't mean anything by it. I know he said about the coffee and it doesn't mean he was completely insincere but he may not have meant it romantically. Because you were attracted to him, you took everything as a sign. It's actually easy to do that if you're really looking for the "signs".

For example, if he was an older woman doing business with you and she touched your arm and said: "I'll take you for coffee to thank you", you'd think nothing of it, right? I know that men usually don't say they'd take a woman for coffee but this was actually in a work context. It would be different if say you were at a party and talking to a guy and he wanted to take you out for a coffee. Sometimes at work a male and female colleague actually might go to get a coffee if they're on the same break or they need to discuss something about work.

Also you said he messaged you something then said it was the wrong number. You said you thought he was using it as an excuse to talk to you. I think if he just wanted to talk to you he would actually message you normally. He could have just said: "Hey shall we go for that coffee Hope?" Why would he send some random fake message to you and then say "Sorry sent to the wrong person". That just makes no sense. He probably did actually send it to the wrong person.

 

The mistake message was only few hours after our meeting took place.
Next day, I wrote him message I need some additional info about the project. He called me, I missed the call, I called back and we talked.

So all these events occured prior to the launch of our project 5-6 days later and prior to him thanking me for the work done and just after thanking me, proposing a coffee.

I understand what you're saying. He had my number all the time.

But you know what's the strangest thing?
That I so much liked the fact that he did not anxiously ask about the coffee all that time when I was busy and overworked. He was not pushy. He was waiting. And I think I wasn't pushy neither, I mean, almost a month of silence was in between, I think I did fine, and I hope he won't resent me trying one more time, I had to do it to move on.

[Sindy_0311]

3 minutes ago, H o p e said:

The mistake message was only few hours after our meeting took place.
Next day, I wrote him message I need some additional info about priject. He called me, I missed the call. I called back and we talked.

So these all occured prior to the launch of project 6 days later and prior to him thanking me for the work and proposing coffee.

And yes, I understand what you're saying. He had my number all the time.
But you know what's the strangest thing?
That I so much liked the fact that he did not anxiously ask about the coffee all that time when I was busy and overworked. He was not pushy. He was waiting. And I think I wasn't pushy neither, I mean, almost a month of silence was in between, I think I did fine, and I hope he won't resent me trying one more time, I had to do it.

A month of silence is way to much if you have some interest. He could have reached out just to check on you from times to times until you would be able to go for the coffee… he was not pushy at all, I was just off. IMHO