To Ticklish to Touch?

[RayKay]

I don't think true love means destroying who we are in the process. Yes there is some aspect that when you truly love someone you will work through things with them, but when they are unwilling to (and since we don't know there is a history of abuse on her side or not, I am sticking to she is just not sexually compatible) is it fair to keep giving and giving and sacrificing ourselves? In my experience, and from what I have seen on others, that takes a toll on people and does destroy them and the relationship.

 

You cannot give your all to someone who no longer wants your all, nor is willing to share the responsibility or reciprocate. I don't think it is proving his love would be more shallow. For example, when we are madly in love with someone, and they leave us, and we try for a while to work things through, but they are not willing, is it really saying we never truly loved them if we finally accept that things are not going to work as one partner does not want them too? Does it diminish the love we have/had for them? I don't think so, not at all. True love is not all about sacrifice, yes there are compromises, but once we start sacrificing ourselves repeatedly, we are sacrificing who we are too, and not standing up for ourselves. Over time, if we get no reciprocation, it eats away at who we are. T

 

True love should have compromise, partnership, communication and mutual understanding...but I don't think "continous self sacrifice" is part of true MUTUAL love. No love is not selfish, and I am all for selfless love, and unconditional love, but it is not living for our partner and ignoring our needs....because you should be able to share MUTUAL needs and satisfy them together.

[Amethyst]

I don't think true love means destroying who we are in the process.

 

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I honestly don't see how going without sex (or having limited sex) for any length of time is going to "destroy" who a person is.

 

Yes, true love is give and take. But, "either you work through your problems so we can have sex or I'm going to leave" doesn't sound like give and take. That sounds incredibly selfish to me.

 

Bringing up a couple who has split and the one tries to get back with the other is hardly the same thing. Giving up in that case is simply accepting reality -- the reality that there is no longer a relationship. The reality here is NOT that there is no relationship -- the reality here is that there IS a relationship but it has a PROBLEM. Love desires to work through problems.

 

Again, that goes for both of them. If they can't overcome this, then the relationship is not made of true love.

 

Edit: One more thing (and it's a genuine question) -- how can you say it's "sexual incompatibility" when their sex life was fine for a year? I mean, they only just started having problems a few months ago, and I would've thought incompatibility should've shown from the get-go.

[OceanEyes]

Are you still with us Slippery?

 

Sometimes things just fade out, and there isn't any real explanation or reasoning behind it, it's just something that happens that nobody can explain or give solutions for. Sometimes it's just basical human chemistry, not something than can be forced, or solved with the help of paid therapists.

 

I've noticed that a lot of modern-thinking people will look for the "hidden meanings" behind sexual situations like this. Of course there very well may be something deeper than a 'fade out' of sexual attraction, but by the sounds of it, I doubt that's the case. Of course, we are all welcome to provide our opinions as we see fit. I'm not saying that she doesn't have some kinds of issues to deal with, but there's absolutely nothing that you can do about it if she's not ready to deal with them. If I were you, I would start asking myself whether or not I could handle sticking around and waiting for that.

 

I don't think that you are being selfish at all. I think that sexual intimacy is absolutely crucial to any relationship. Some may disagree with that and be able to carry on very meaningful unions without sex, but to me, that is not the way I want to live my life. I believe that having a good sex life is a physical expression of how I feel about my man. In other words, if the sex starts going downhill, I know that things are starting to go downhill PERIOD.

 

Sammy -- her asexual behaviour can be stemming from so many different things. It's impossible for us (and by the sounds of it, even for you) to know what's really going on in her head. It must be unbelievably frustrating for you, since by how you've described your situation, you have basically tried everything. You seem genuinely concerned and that you really want to help, and that's neither selfish or demanding of you.

 

A lot of women won't admit this, but some of us (without even realizing it) will control our men with displays of emotion (crying). I'm not saying that this is something that every woman does, but it does sound to me as if your girlfriend might be doing it. It can't be easy to see her crying, and it must make you feel like crap, and like it's YOUR FAULT, but it's not. I think the time is coming for you to try and look past the tears, to say, "I love you, but sexual intimacy is something that I can't live without when I am in a relationship", and give her reasons as to why you feel this way. Explain that it's not just because you "need to get off", but because it makes you two an intimate and sexual couple. Be as honest with her as you can be, even if she gets upset and can't seem to handle it. You are not doing yourself (or her) any favours by sticking around and putting up with it for another 6 months. She either takes some action, is honest with you about the real reason that she isn't interested in sex anymore, or you simply can't go on. Sometimes tough love lets other people know that you love them, but that you have boundaries that cannot be crossed.

[DN]

RayKay put it so well I am going to leave it there.

 

I will say that I think Amethyst must be a really cool person for her ideas about love and loyalty. Whoever manages/has managed to marry her will be/is a lucky guy.

 

I just don't agree that her concept of love is going to work for most people - I kinda wish it would though!!

[Amethyst]

I will say that I think Amethyst must be a really cool person for her ideas about love and loyalty. Whoever manages/has managed to marry her will be/is a lucky guy.

 

Thank you. That's very sweet of you to say.

 

I just don't agree that her concept of love is going to work for most people - I kinda wish it would though!!

 

Maybe I *am* being idealistic; after all, I live in a society where half of all marriages end in divorce. But, I don't think that changes the fact that true love really is forever -- more likely I think it proves that people often settle for less.

[Beec]

Oceaneyes said that well.

 

In theory, I'd agree with Amethyst, except for one thing. Relationships are two way streets (few rare exceptions) in which both people need their needs to be met. This includes their sexual needs. One might suppress those needs under certain circumstances, such as when your longterm partner becomes disabled and you know the issue. One mgiht also if there were something like a rape or a man who become impotent because of prostrate surgery. But it is tough to accept an unidentified problem and wait for someone to decide if will ever be addressed.

 

Also, if SlipperySammy's girlfriend had a problem she was willing to work through, he might consider working with her. But for him to sit and wait for her to decide if and when she wants to work on this problem. If she refuses to even address it, I don't see that she is acting out of her love for Sammy.

[Amethyst]

In theory, I'd agree with Amethyst, except for one thing. Relationships are two way streets (few rare exceptions) in which both people need their needs to be met....If she refuses to even address it, I don't see that she is acting out of her love for Sammy.

 

This is so frustrating to me because people keep saying they agree with me except for such-and-such when I *never said* such-and-such. I feel like I must be speaking Greek!

 

I've expressed the EXACT sentiment a few times already:

 

It does work both ways. If she loves him enough, she'll want to work through this. But, at the same time, that doesn't mean anyone should expect her to rush into it. It will *still* take time, and I can't really say that a year is enough or too much -- that's between the two of them.

 

Again, [the fact that true love desires to work through problems] goes for both of them. If they can't overcome this, then the relationship is not made of true love.

 

No offense to anyone, but this is my final post in this thread. I'm really getting tired of defending myself against statements I never made.

 

Sammy, I truly hope things work out for you and your girlfriend. You seem like a really nice and understanding guy, and you deserve to be happy.

[Beec]

Sorry if I forgot some things in your post, Amythest. My fault.

[SlipperySammy]

First off thanks for all the awsome responses! I have absolutly no one to talk to about this so it helps big time! I have to go but I'll be back later.

 

 

Amethyst--

"I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I honestly don't see how going without sex (or having limited sex) for any length of time is going to "destroy" who a person is. "

 

I am not proud of this... but as a man I have a biological demand for sex. I hate reducing sex to that, because I think it is so much more. But as a 22 active and very fit man I have a decent libedo. Isn't asking man to go with out sex alomost equevilent to asking him to ignore other biological functions...ask him to breath less air a month, or go to the bathroom less. I don't think I am asking for alot, I am not into any thing kinky, just sex 1-2 times a week and some initiation would satisfy me...but she needs to want to and find enjoyment from it also.

 

Any way I'll be back later I am sure this duscussion is getting for more of you I know it is for me.

 

Cya

 

and thanks.

[RayKay]

I don't think true love means destroying who we are in the process.

 

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I honestly don't see how going without sex (or having limited sex) for any length of time is going to "destroy" who a person is.

 

Yes, true love is give and take. But, "either you work through your problems so we can have sex or I'm going to leave" doesn't sound like give and take. That sounds incredibly selfish to me.

 

Bringing up a couple who has split and the one tries to get back with the other is hardly the same thing. Giving up in that case is simply accepting reality -- the reality that there is no longer a relationship. The reality here is NOT that there is no relationship -- the reality here is that there IS a relationship but it has a PROBLEM. Love desires to work through problems.

 

Again, that goes for both of them. If they can't overcome this, then the relationship is not made of true love.

 

Edit: One more thing (and it's a genuine question) -- how can you say it's "sexual incompatibility" when their sex life was fine for a year? I mean, they only just started having problems a few months ago, and I would've thought incompatibility should've shown from the get-go.

 

For the last part..the genuine question, I will answer that first. Because we don't know whether she TRULY was into it then or not. I know of women who "fake" their enjoyment of sex to make their man love them/to keep them. They don't like it, are not sexually turned on, but instead of saying something or seeking help, they fake it...they initiate even if they really don't want to, pretend to love it when they don't. Some did this from the very start.

 

Maybe once she moved in with him, she felt she no longer had to try? This is just a guess, but is very possible...so it IS possible they were not sexually compatible before the signs even showed.

 

Now I will address the rest, hopefully in order!

 

Going without sex does not destroy who we are, but not being able to form that intimate bond, make love to a partner we love, and have them make love with us, DOES affect us personally...it does eat away at your self esteem, make you doubt their feelings for you. It is not about "just getting off" as if it were, we could take care of it on our own, but it is about that intimate bond that is created between two loving partners. Sex is not everything, but believe it or not sometimes it is a strengthener, and a healer, a way of showing our love, expressing how close we want to be to our partner.

 

And next, I really don't think this is a matter of "either you work through your problems so we can have sex or I'm going to leave". I think it is a matter of as partners you need to have an equal commitment to working through problems. What if instead of sex, she was just terrible with money, spending it and they were finding themselves in severe bankruptcy. We would advise they work through it right? Of course. BUT, what if one partner continued to ignore it was a problem, it was adding stress to the partnership, destroying what they had built, their savings, everything? Would we insisit the other one stay through it all for years and years until they had nothing...not because he had not tried for a long time, but because the other partner had NO desire to change things.

 

Don't get me wrong, I am ALL for working things through. I never want to get divorced, I am not one to just leave when there is a problem...but I don't think it is fair that Sammy stay in a sexless lifetime commitment when there ARE solutions and she does not seem to feel a need to do anything..which is why showing maybe she does might do something. He has stuck around, brought up counselling, asked her, tried different things..nothing.

 

As for the couples splitting up...but there IS still a relationship. It is not a committed on both sides one, but it IS one, and in some relationships where the people ARE together, there is lacking a commitment on both sides as well. I think if one partner is failing to follow through their commitment to the relationship by not working through problems they are destroying the relationship....how long are we supposed to allow them to do that, when they won't work on it on their side?

 

I am a romantic too, but also a realist. I think commitment is about more than true love. Because there are times where even with true love, we don't always feel it - maybe due to other stress, who knows....so it is then where we make a choice to stay on path to true love or not. It is when we can commit to the relationship when we don't feel it, or when it is to help our partner that true love grows. Sammy is putting effort into improving their sexual relationship to this point...but where is HER effort? Even in true love, it takes two.

[SlipperySammy]

Hi,

 

I hope in my last response I didn't come off as all sex is to me is 'getting off'

 

I find my girlfriend VERY attractive, and in all honesty don't find any one else sexaully appealing but her. I love her very much and can't even imagine a life with out her...on the same token, I can't imagine a life were I sleep in the same bed as some one who I find so attractive but continue with the intamacy problems...(And don't know why...always second guessing her feelings.)

 

I think that is why I keep posting here because I can't see any answers, and a solution seems so far off.

 

 

Amethyst seems hung up on 'true love.' maybe I don't know what true love is...maybe this isn't true love...I don't know all I know is I love her VERY VERY mutch in love with her, to the point I can't imagine a life with out her. Again there is a 'but' .... but as this problem continues and she refuses to 'come clean' or 'open up' or atleast try...I begin to resent her. Instead of looking at her and seeing the girl I madly love I tend to think to myself, "there is a girl who has no sexual interest in me." These thoughts then make me feel either depressesed, angery, or frustrated depending on the moments.

 

I think RayKay money analogy was pretty good. I also thought her point about my girl friend never really enjoying sex, and then after I moved in just not trying any more is an interesting possibility. (also very sad.)

 

I am surprised no one has really been on me about that issue yet? A devils advocate would tell me I am not good enough in bed for her to enjoy, or that I am a selfish lover.

 

After all this I can't imagine I am the best lover...if I was wouldn't she actually want sex? Ofcourse these are the questions I am left with.

 

All I can say is I am not a selfish lover. My pleasure and excitement come from pleasuring her. I love giving oral, and love to just take time to make her feel good. I always ask what can I do better, and really want to be the best lover to her possible. I'll be honest I am not bringing my 'A' game after a three week lapse in sexual activity...I am sure that my eagerness and stamina could be better...but what man isn't the same way after a three week lapse?

 

I could focus on pleasuring her for hours (what ever she wants) and be very giving...but I don't think that even sounds good to her...that can't be normal...Is it?

 

^^^I actually tried this^^^ I lit candles one night and was very sweet, she opted out of any sexuall acts and wanted a back rub (fair enough, but I figured it might escalate further.) What happened? I gave her a back rub and she told me "See I like this better then messing around," and we went to sleep.

[DN]

Sammy,

 

You have now received seven pages of fairly consistent advice with the possible exception of Amethyst, who is actually saying much the same as everyone else except we are all not getting where she is coming from. (Perhaps Voltaire should have said "I disagree with what you say but I will fight to the death for your right to miscommunicate it)

 

I digress.

 

No one is suggesting you stay in the relationship if she will not seek help for the problem.

 

At some point you are going to have to digest all this advice and think long and hard about what you have to do to achieve some sort of resolution.

 

In the final analysis, and perhaps after more attempts at solving the problem by talking to her about it, you will have to decide to a) stay and live with the problem hoping she may change at some point, or b) leave on the best possible terms.

 

In either case, you may need some fresh advice about how to proceed. But sooner or later, you should make a decision, and IMO, it is in both your interest to make that soon.

[OceanEyes]

How you are in bed never really crossed my mind. Because if that was the issue, it would mean that your woman was actually interested in a sexual relationship with you, but just not getting what she wanted/ needed. I can almost guarantee you right now, that your abilities as a lover are completely impertinent here.

 

How long have your sexual problems been going on for? What was it like in the beginning? Do you often try talking to her about her day, anything that is totally non-sexual, asking her how she feels about this/ that? And, don't take this one the wrong way, but are you always trying to get down her pants? The reason for asking the last question, is because with past relationships I found that things started to get stale when ex-boyfriends would only ever touch me in sexual ways (this includes grabbing her butt, boobs, etc.).

[SlipperySammy]

I actually spend alot of time talking to her about non-sexual things...I am not that big of a horn dog.