Shy guys.... feeling intimidated and subtle hints being lost on you not helping?

[Solo Pilot]

What's with the actual?!

I assume you are happy for us!!??

 

Yah I'm happy for anyone who breaks the shyness barrier. It's only fear.

 

Fear will stop us (sometimes) from achieving or getting what we want or deserve. So are you (anyone shy reading this fortune cookie-like msg) going to OWN fear or let it OWN you

[FrogIsFree]

Yah I'm happy for anyone who breaks the shyness barrier. It's only fear.

 

Fear will stop us (sometimes) from achieving or getting what we want or deserve. So are you (anyone shy reading this fortune cookie-like msg) going to OWN fear or let it OWN you

 

- well we all know fear is a big component and that is why this thread has been so productive!!

 

As for dealing with fear.. we can all say we know what to do, but doing it is another matter all together, hence the in-depth discussions plus dealing with fear means dealing with many complex issues and factors that underline that or those fears!

That is not an overnight process..!!

I have lots of wise sayings too, but by sharing my experiences with others with similar experiences we understand our experiences better, so all those sayings mean something, rather than just being words that I can say, ask, and if I dare be so forward - advise, to anyone at any time!

[FrogIsFree]

Yah I'm happy for anyone who breaks the shyness barrier. It's only fear.

 

Fear will stop us (sometimes) from achieving or getting what we want or deserve. So are you (anyone shy reading this fortune cookie-like msg) going to OWN fear or let it OWN you

 

ps - what are your dating experiences in terms of breaking your shyness barrier, as you are clearly so successful at it we already know true growth and wisdom come through our experiences and personal growth, it would be good to hear how you have struggled with the subject of this thread: ie the GREEN LIGHTs subject we are all discussing.

[Jake]

thank you for your post /Jake/.

 

Well I read it, thought about it, had to think about it some more and guess what? Not for the reasons you might think..

You see I had a revelation last night: it seems that apart from me and this guy being very much the same, there is another dimension to this situation that I had on it's head! While it is good that I realised it, it has been a painful reawakening.

 

Yeah I had a similar revelation as well about 2 months ago...wasn't pretty I can assure you that.

 

It seems that while I only thought of him being this way.., it seems that `the same' has so much more to it ie

I have equally as much going on, not less, as I had unintentionally assumed because he seemed to so hard to talk to.

You see the thing is I realised that I: pushed him away - never intentionally - but, I did. I was running away..

I may not have meant this next bit either, but I am reviewing everything and remembering more and more times when I did exactly as he did - what you described and in my heart of hearts I have known all along - I gave him the impression I wasn't interested.. I realise this last few days that my upset, frustration and avoidance (yes, me too! has equated to me shutting down. I made a gigantic leap to initiate a conversation with him, only to realise I had pushed myself so hard and so far out that it nearly killed me emotionally.. I can honestly admit - I fell to pieces.

 

You should really look into Avoidant Personality disorder and see if it applies to you FrogIsFree. It might help you understand yourself a little better.

 

- I couldn't hold myself together last night realising all of this & suddenly - your post arrives in my in-box + then I really didn't get much sleep..!

 

My apologizes, that wasn't exactly my intention.... I guess I had the information or knowledge and conveyed it to you without really comprehending the effect it could have.

 

- I feel unable to break this pattern.. I have watched myself since I intiated conversation and realised I am shutting back down again + the pain of opening back up to move it forward is so overwhelming, I am typing this whilst trying to stare at the screen through a pool of tears!

..ridiculous! All I have to do is do the same again, but I felt so exposed I haven't been able to do it!

The thing is: I went too fast for what I could emotionally handle because I pushed myself over the line so hard that I was a complete wreck afterwards and had burn out.. that's how traumatic it was for me: not many - clearly yourself and a few others on this forum - could comprehend the level of agony experienced just to start that conversation and while it was a major breakthrough, I felt crippled after it.. it actually made me retreat further in to my shell, despite all the great, positive words I offered to others who had done the same. This is not to take away from what I achieved, hell it genuinely was incredible and a massive achievment but I felt so exposed I was ready to go right back to the beginning and do something vile to put him off me! Fathom that! But knowing you, well at least by this post alone, you will have this last bit all figured out..

 

Yeah I can pretty much relate to everything you're saying. All I can say is all the words I put in bold are something someone with AVPD would say. I must say FrogIsFree you're really coming accross as displaying symptoms of Avoidant Personality Disorder. I can't tell you that you have it (for obvious reasons) but I highly reccomend looking into it yourself to see if it rings a bell or not (for me it was like a burglar alarm).

 

link removed

 

I personally believe I have have it because it matches me almost to a T.

 

- dito!!

 

- what is interesting & is something I knew in my heart but my head hadn't caught up yet til I read your post was: he knows this - there is something in the look in his eyes and the way he is around me, if you turn this on it's head the right way up in the way that I had missed, that made me see something I had missed all along: he has been waiting until I am ready too. He can see what that I am struggling. He can see the inner battle & this is part of the vulnerability - knowing he can see this. That's why I pulled the shutters down and ran away.

 

Well... I have to say your thread is turning out to be more about you then him! That's a good thing though! After all, you can only help yourself by improving your own position with what you learn. It will only help the overall situation really.

 

- did this for a while + in the last 2 months I noticed how dependent I had become on that `innocent' bottle of wine.. & that extra one a couple of days later in the week - then that extra one on the weekend, til my kidneys ached!

 

I crossed the line but at tremendous expense (I know that sounds negative, but you can see from what I have written earlier what I mean by this, contrary to the outward observation by some that it was no big deal and perhaps that it didn't add up to be in such a state about it, but you and I know better).

So yes! We definitely are not `describing general shyness now, more like a horrible by-product'.. accurate to a T.

 

I never drank alcohol in my life, even on my 21st birthday (legal age to drink here). I resisted even when I went out with my buddies to a restaurant. How you've described your experience with wine is what I'm afraid of. I don't want or need a crutch in life.

 

I really feel for you, I really do because I know that urge / pain of wanting to drown it out.

 

- after seeing him going through this and not realising the same was true for myself, I realised recently it was for me too.

How odd to realise we are like mirrors reflecting each other! It should make us easier to understand to each other but the problem is we are both so terrified, perhaps myself even more now I review things, that we are both very backwards in coming forward..!

 

Yeah, I'm the same....very backwards no interest shown where interest should be shown! Makes me want to pull my hair out when I do that.

 

- Indeed.. which one dictates what we both say or do around each other?!

I seem to have this unusual hope, despite all these odds on both sides, that somehow it will work itself out..

if only we can sit down and have that coffee together & just relax.. - always sounds so simple.. I watched him a few days ago watching me - of course I was also, out of the corner of my eye, watching him. He has been doing interesting things like rather than finding a table behind a pillar to hide behind, he will find a table closer to me. Rather than choosing a work station on the opposite side of the room where he can watch me from a safe distance, he will park himself right next to me.. I daredn't look him in the eyes properly until recently, so equally, unintentionally gave confused signals but since then I can feel his eyes on me continually, no wavering, as I stare straight ahead fully aware of this and him aware I am aware..

The truth that seems to have emerged from all of this is.. he is actually braver and stronger than me, and is already intiating things.. I just didn't see it. He has been busy getting closer and closer to me / in to my personal space and it honestly feels like he is saying in his head: little steps closer each time + she will see she doesn't have to be afraid of me. Figure that! Completely a case of the opposite of what I had hung on to in terms of my thinking and assessments, slightly seemingly in my arrogance but purely to do with defensiveness, all this time.

 

Maybe he will be the one to ask you out on a date after all.

 

- neither of us have done this.. thank God.. but time and his constant moving me forward, will only tell.

I am trying to keep having faith, that is all I can do at this point..

But what helps right now, is knowing how I left myself out of this equation.

I had become so outwardly toughened to the world, I did not see my own part in the equation and much, + more, of this applied to me!

 

I have to admit that I kind of lied. You really can't throw your heart away. Or at least I couldn't.... I said that partially out of frustration in my own situation.

 

To give up ones true heart's desire would only be devastatingly hurtful to ones self.

[Solo Pilot]

ps - what are your dating experiences in terms of breaking your shyness barrier, as you are clearly so successful at it we already know true growth and wisdom come through our experiences and personal growth, it would be good to hear how you have struggled with the subject of this thread: ie the GREEN LIGHTs subject we are all discussing.

 

My success just came from my experience of getting older and realizing that if I didn't change my ways I wouldn't ever get anywhere in life whether it was work related or relationship related.

 

You have to get yourself in the mindset that opportunity doesn't knock twice. What the hell do i mean you ask? lol. Using you personally as an example, you need to tell yourself that this guy that you like, may be the last good guy out there that you will ever meet. Now it may seem strange to think like this, but all it is doing is giving you proper motivation to go out and find out for yourself if this guy truly IS the last good guy you will ever meet. I mean you wouldn't know until you gave it a shot right?

 

Chances are even if you never get the nerve to ask him out and you move on, you will (probably) eventually find another guy who you will fall for again and think is the good guy for you.

 

But what happens when your still too scared to act and let the 2nd guy get away. Wait for the next one to come along? Is that going to happen? When? What if the next one doesn't come along and you just figured out that you should have said something when you had the chance. Ain't no guruantees in life(I gave up can't spell this stupid word )

 

So yah I realized all that up above. It helped me get past the sting of rejections. As another poster here said, Rejection is temporary, Regret is not.

 

Don't get my wrong, I'm just trying to get you 2 properly motivated. I guess you guys are in your 20's. At least you have plenty of time.

 

Oh and about the green light thing. Its hard to tell when a shy person likes you for obvious reasons. They don't give out those tell-tale signs of being interested in you. I think some good things have already been said in this thread and others about how to pick up on some of those various signals that we give off sometimes. I can't say i'm an expert regarding this subject. All I know is that when someone likes you, they will make excuses to be near you and\or try to make good eye-contact with you.

[Lonewing]

I have been wrong so many times. Women I thought liked me didn't. And when that happened I felt stupid.

 

If a woman literally said, ' I like you, I want to date you' - only then would I believe she actually liked me.

 

Awfull attitude to have but when your 42 and only been on a few dates in your life, it's hard to have a different one.

 

No mixed messages there. Clear as water, no mud, we know EXACTLY what you mean.

 

Though then we meet the girls who say they want to date, and after a couple dates completely disappear...leaving us even more confused than before.

 

Froggie, you have so totally broken the sound barrier on this topic - I hope you have the best!!!

[FrogIsFree]

No mixed messages there. Clear as water, no mud, we know EXACTLY what you mean.

 

Though then we meet the girls who say they want to date, and after a couple dates completely disappear...leaving us even more confused than before.

 

Froggie, you have so totally broken the sound barrier on this topic - I hope you have the best!!!

 

Thank you Lonewing! ..that's very kind of you!

[FrogIsFree]

The problem with self-diagnosis (I am a member of several psychological topic forums) is that it can be dangerously wrong or at the least: wildly innaccurate..

I don't have AVPD - I can confirm that.. what I do have, that I didn't want to go in to on here, is another disorder.

Basically, I don't avoid any more than the average person (people I've known and know now) and while it presents with seemingly similar symptoms - it is extremely different. I will explain.. I avoid for a period - but only a short period (part of the coping strategy of my real disorder) until I have the necessary skill(s) to manage the situation better.

In a nutshell: I had disassociative tenders as part of the disorder I don't wish to discuss and this meant that rather than what it appears: avoiding, I didn't know how to emotionally respond to situations alongside being a shy personality. Being shy is not a disorder in itself and even where disorders exist, the aim is to gradually replace negative coping mechanisms with positive management strategies that put the person back in charge.. we cannot control others, of course, but we can manage ourselves and make appropriate situational choices! One of those choices that causes confusion in the world of psychological `disorders' is that a shy person doesn't have a choice to reduce their psychological and physical stress and step away from a situation that is creating physically damaging symptoms e.g. we have all heard of the expression: "time out" - we all need it. What many shy people tend to do, I used to do it, was insist on putting myself through an unnatural test of exposure therapy ie I am bad - I am avoiding this or I am a failure I am avoiding this - whereas in a fact, these were wrong assumptions: what I was was: poorly equipped to deal with it. Once you turn it round and equip yourself, you no longer have any fear or the need to avoid - these are social issues to do with, in many cases, social rights such as: right to maintain your personal space without it being encroached on; the ability to understand one's own emotions in order to be able to decide what is right for you/me what is not.. this is a major issue that shy people struggle with and the right to decide something is not right for us, rather than based on other people's ideals, which it is all too easy to carry round and believe are our own.

 

Conditioning is a very powerful thing and some people may think they have AVPD when in fact they have been subjected to other people's belief systems, like a psychological and emotional prisoner, so that they think: they have a disorder, when in fact they were not allowed the ability to exercise their right to choose right from childhood.

 

There are many people who think they are psychologically balanced and healthy, while pointing they point the finger (or we internalise their issues and tell ourselves we have a disorder) because they had issues with us and with us being shy.

Shyness is not, I repeat, is not an illness.

Granted there are people with disorders, but we have to be very careful not to get sucked in to thinking that just because we find something difficult and a challenge that we have some sort of deficit.

I always end up doing what I fear doing - that's the difference.. I gain the skills to handle it better, I change the way I perceive the situation and do not take unnecessary onus or blame on to myself that the situation was difficult to manage - I recognise other people's responsibility.

So much of what I read in forums from shy people is that: they take on the responsibility emotionally for other people, like a sponge, and excuse their controlling, domineering, selfish, manipulative - or whatever it might be - negative behaviour and take it on themselves as if they have the issue and need to get help.. which is wrong.

 

As shy people - we are subjected to psychological evalutions such as these because we are like mirrors up to those who want to keep the status quo. `If we tell the shy people they have a disorder', we get to operate the status quo. The status quo isn't right just because it's the status quo + accepted norms are just trends or social patterns that many adhere to to feel normal.. anything else is scary and dangerous - in this respect: shy people are incredibly adept at seeing situations for what they really are - that can be very scary to wider society because it is not the norm & most shy people I know are incredibly gifted + this causes terrible turmoil in their lives through the jealousy they suffer - but I will go far too off point if I go in to that.. but I hope you understand this better through all this.

 

Regards Green Lights: the guy is not stupid - we have both made progress and our own personal development and growth has created clearer green lights on BOTH sides.

It is not a black + white issue, as you and I well know, it is a meeting of minds, a compromise of actual actions ultimately: `what's the bloody rush?!!!'

[putter65]

Yah this was an interesting thread. I wonder which one of you 2 will be the first to go out on a real actual date with your partners.

 

I think Frog will eventually go out with the guy. I don't think I will get anywhere. Text friends is about it I reckon.

[FrogIsFree]

I think Frog will eventually go out with the guy. I don't think I will get anywhere. Text friends is about it I reckon.

 

putter..!? Stay positive! ..it can feel like an unsurmountable mountain, but it will happen.

Don't give up - especially with believing.. It'll be worth it!

[putter65]

putter..!? Stay positive! ..it can feel like an unsurmountable mountain, but it will happen.

Don't give up - especially with believing.. It'll be worth it!

 

Thanks. I'm only been honest. I'm text friends with her, she has mentioned possible meetings in the future. It's better than nothing I suppose.

[celsiana]

This thread has been quite helpful for me, too! I also realized recently that I've run away from a guy I've liked. For the longest time I thought he was the one who was putting up walls, but lo and behold, it was me. And now, of course, I don't know how to fix it. He still talks to me, when I happen to see him. *sigh*

 

Anyway,thank you for this thread, Frog.

[FrogIsFree]

I've run away from a guy I've liked. For the longest time I thought he was the one who was putting up walls, but lo and behold, it was me. And now, of course, I don't know how to fix it. He still talks to me, when I happen to see him. *sigh*

 

Anyway,thank you for this thread, Frog.

 

You're welcome!!

 

I am glad about that for you & I am glad, slightly selfishly, that someone can relate to my experience because I am never looking for advice but hear and share other people's experiences, because things then get clearer like that and I can work them out for myself!!

 

Well, this last couple of days I have been coming to the conclusion that I can't "fix it", thought I have been thinking exactly this same way about it as you have.

 

I put this guy of royally.., and have also been very tearful thinking: how on earth did I not see that I was doing that - I have always been so self-aware! - even keep a journal! But what has become apparent and partly answers this question is: when I am afraid I am good at burying emotionally the thing I am afraid + it was him seeing the whole me, for who I really am, and this fear that his feelings are so intense for me but what if he finds out about the rest of me and doesn't like me? I know in my head this is not true, but my emotions are betraying any sensible logic and jumping in with reasons to keep him at arm's length.

He has actually gently, but surely got closer to me, and only just (doh) realising that over these last few days has really freaked me out! ie he has approached me without me being aware.. I was so focused on what I needed to do to get him to do x, y and z, as if he had the problems and I was just frustrated with and for him trying to help, but missed the glaringly obvious about myself - my own body language. This is not to say: I haven't consciously made an effort to show him I like him and make eye-contact, but because he is aware of how afraid and shy I am, I can feel he is working out the `perfect' way to catch me without scaring me off.. I just have to allow him to and pray to God (every day!! !) that I do not freeze up, because I can't dictate (not that I want to - just an explanation of the feelings the fear causes) when, where and how he will do this.

I did make a giant leap (after which I was very poorly and exhausted) in which I psyched myself up to `go out of my way' to initiate a conversation with him.. he was visibly very shocked. That actually fits and makes a lot more sense now because he had confirmation I do like him, contrary to my - probably - not very certain signals (though I had convinced myself otherwise) that I was.. He has absolute proof now - that's why I have been falling to pieces - because I feel so exposed and vulnerable now - that's the long and short of it now.

I always get the impression he is trying to make sure I am comfortable by not staring too hard etc.. as if he already knows I might get freaked out. He knows I am shy but he also knows I am struggling with letting him in.

Perhaps all we can do now is trust? I think I've done what I can - if I spontaneously think I can speak to him again.., I know it will help, but I think he is determined enough on his own (it seems that way too with your guy going out of his way to intiate conversations with you), so either way it will work out.

[shygal2008]

Originally Posted by putter65

 

 

If a woman literally said, ' I like you, I want to date you' - only then would I believe she actually liked me.

 

 

 

PUTTER....

 

WHAT IF SHE CAME UP TO YOU AND ASKED YOUUUU FOR YOUR CELL PHONE NUMBER..AND SHE WAS SOMEONE YOU WERE ATTRACTED TO? OR WHAT IF ONE DAY SHE JUST OFFERED YOU HER WORK AND HOME EMAIL ADDRESSES ON A POST IT NOTE..WHAT WOULD YOU THINK..SAY OR DO?????

 

 

SINCE HOME MADE COOKIES & SWEET CARDS DON'T SEEM TO DO IT

[FrogIsFree]

It's really nice to hear a woman talk about the things that matter in a man. Not just looks or status.

 

Well if you're following the thread on beauty, you will see I have reinforced this point because some men seem to think they are `lower status' looks-wise.., but to me, that's incorrect. I find this guy attractive for who he is + the attraction grew and means so much more than just the visual and/or lust thing!

It's a meaningful connection that makes me love him + find him physically more deeply attractive more and more each day..

[putter65]

Originally Posted by putter65

 

 

If a woman literally said, ' I like you, I want to date you' - only then would I believe she actually liked me.

 

 

 

PUTTER....

 

WHAT IF SHE CAME UP TO YOU AND ASKED YOUUUU FOR YOUR CELL PHONE NUMBER..AND SHE WAS SOMEONE YOU WERE ATTRACTED TO? OR WHAT IF ONE DAY SHE JUST OFFERED YOU HER WORK AND HOME EMAIL ADDRESSES ON A POST IT NOTE..WHAT WOULD YOU THINK..SAY OR DO?????

 

SINCE HOME MADE COOKIES & SWEET CARDS DON'T SEEM TO DO IT

 

I would be surprized and shocked. I would give my number though. I would probably also send them an email saying 'hi'. I would not think they wanted to date me or anything. I remember this woman once gave me a list of computer games. Also there was her mobile number on the paper. I asked why it was on there and she went crazy. Didn't talk to me for months.

[shygal2008]

You're lucky you are not afraid of the phone or email..some people who have extreme Anxiety and are Avoident Personalities can't do either

[putter65]

You're lucky you are not afraid of the phone or email..some people who have extreme Anxiety and are Avoident Personalities can't do either

 

Oh I'm not as bad as that. It's not like women have been showing interest and I haven't been acting on it. Women haven't been showing interest. Well not much anyway !

[FrogIsFree]

I would give my number though.

 

- what was the green light that made you do this?

 

I would probably also send them an email saying 'hi'. I would not think they wanted to date me or anything.

 

Now there it is again - no risk! - so really, it's not about dating it's about friendship and perhaps something romantic occurring but perhaps not planning to get an end result of a date in the purpose behind sending an email..!?? Hence anxiety and AVPD not being relevant, until some non-platonic apparent interest is shown in return that takes it to a whole other level when those might well set in..

 

I remember this woman once gave me a list of computer games. Also there was her mobile number on the paper. I asked why it was on there and she went crazy. Didn't talk to me for months.

 

Oh Putter, she probably couldn't understand why you missed the meaning of something that was, in her eyes, so obvious!

You're so sweet!!

[putter65]

She's the woman from the '12 years ago incident' which I could write a book about. lol !

[FrogIsFree]

She's the woman from the '12 years ago incident' which I could write a book about. lol !

 

Yes, I thought she was her but didn't want to assume

 

Perhaps, like me, those opportunities to offer your number have been slim for a whole myriad of reasons?

I have given my number out on very few occasions, I took a risk only recently with someone new, but it confirmed I am better keepin it to myself because I dont feel comfortable giving it out - it's a privacy thing and when I do, I usually give out an alternative number (not my main number) until if I have made my mind up about the person on a trust level.

[celsiana]

I would be surprized and shocked. I would give my number though. I would probably also send them an email saying 'hi'. I would not think they wanted to date me or anything. I remember this woman once gave me a list of computer games. Also there was her mobile number on the paper. I asked why it was on there and she went crazy. Didn't talk to me for months.

 

Hmm. So this fellow that I fancy, I've known him for several years now, we used to talk a lot a few years ago. After having a pleasant conversation a few weeks ago, I sent him a message on FB saying that he should text me sometime, I miss talking with him like we used to. I gave him my number. Of course he didn't write back to that message or text me. I can't sort out if he thinks I was just being friendly, or if he just isn't that into me. Long backstory to this, and I'm pretty sure that he had asked me out last year... but now I am forever getting mixed messages from him. Sigh. I must move on. Just rambling, I guess. Sorry! lol

[putter65]

Hmm. So this fellow that I fancy, I've known him for several years now, we used to talk a lot a few years ago. After having a pleasant conversation a few weeks ago, I sent him a message on FB saying that he should text me sometime, I miss talking with him like we used to. I gave him my number. Of course he didn't write back to that message or text me. I can't sort out if he thinks I was just being friendly, or if he just isn't that into me. Long backstory to this, and I'm pretty sure that he had asked me out last year... but now I am forever getting mixed messages from him. Sigh. I must move on. Just rambling, I guess. Sorry! lol

 

I am so different because I would reply to every message I got. Out of politeness.

 

I would move on I'm afraid.

[FrogIsFree]

Hmm. So this fellow that I fancy, I've known him for several years now, we used to talk a lot a few years ago. After having a pleasant conversation a few weeks ago, I sent him a message on FB saying that he should text me sometime, I miss talking with him like we used to. I gave him my number. Of course he didn't write back to that message or text me. I can't sort out if he thinks I was just being friendly, or if he just isn't that into me. Long backstory to this, and I'm pretty sure that he had asked me out last year... but now I am forever getting mixed messages from him. Sigh. I must move on. Just rambling, I guess. Sorry! lol

 

It's very possible he's puzzled and maybe felt rejected as you didn't go out with him when he asked you out..!?? So your sudden interest again may have left him confused and wondering if you are even serious about him.. I don't know all the details but if he perhaps felt he put his heart on the line.., & you didn't respond or respond much.. so unless you've given him sure fire signs he can't mistake for just friendliness, he might be a case of once bitten (in his mind) twice shy.

It may well be worth investigating some more, also has he - having perhaps given up thinking you weren't that bothered about him - given up? That doesn't mean for good, necessarily but he perhaps stopped hoping.., as it was some time ago!??

This part struck a chord with me, as my guy watched from afar and waited, meanwhile he dated a girl.. was very unhappy, broke up with her and now he's free he felt able to `show' me interest - if he currently has a gf but in his heart of hearts he tried to `move on' while still interested in you (tried to put you out of mind by finding another girl, maybe all the while telling himself `get real') and now he can't respond because he is `with' somebody technically, rather than in it with his heart, so now it is inappropriate to respond knowing he has feelings for you.

Life can be more complicated that at first appears and without all these other facts plus probably a whole string of events leading up to these last few weeks that you've touched on, it's not a certainty he's not interested.

 

I am sure I will get slated for this but, it's the gut feeling after you said you suggested that perhaps you unwittingly gave him `not interested' signs by screening him off or running away!!

[celsiana]

Ack. It's a very long story. It was two years ago that we talked a lot at work, alone. I was off the clock, I would stay late by an hour or so, and he works nights. (We work in different buildings, he delivers stuff to my office. If I don't want to run into him, it's easy to avoid him since he shows up only once a day during my hours now.)

 

In the summer of '09, I think he tried to ask me out, but I wasn't sure if he was just trying to clear the air between us? Much like Putter's situation, women at work were ALWAYS teasing us. (They still do it...) One woman tried hard to get him to ask me out, so one night he said to me, "M. says I should ask you out!" I wanted to agree with him but I got scared/embarrassed/confused because I wasn't sure if he wanted me to stop liking him. So I didn't give an answer, instead I joked that I was going to hurt M.

 

Well, after that he and I still talked for about a week, but he discussed much more this other gal he liked. I did e-mail him that week to say that I do like him and that I would go out with him, but I know he likes Other Gal. Well of course he probably took that the wrong way, thinking I was letting him down easy. He didn't write back to me and I stopped staying late to talk to him. He started dating Other Gal, so I heard through the grapevine.

 

I didn't see him much for over a year. Then this past September I started running into him a bit more - meaning he'd show up when I was leaving for the day, and sometimes I'd wonder if he did that on purpose to talk to me. Who knows. But he started being flirty again, he'd ask about various fellows I've (sort-of) dated recently, he would do things to make me laugh, and so on, but since my hours had changed by that point, I only see him for a few minutes a few times a week.

 

In November he told me that the Other Gal he was trying to date for 16 months had started seeing someone else and he found out on FB that morning! He was upset! But ummm I guess they weren't that close? He did say that his interest in her waxed and waned over the year. Why was he telling me all that?

 

Since then, I'm not sure if he has asked me out or not. Several times he's mentioned places where he'll be, such as the exact fair where he was giving massages one Saturday, and another event where he was playing Santa. Last month he went on about dvd's of his and let me know I can borrow them if I wish. Once in a while I do start a chat with him on FB, but it's much more fun to chat with him in person.

 

One random thing: we both love the TV show Castle, and our friendship is similar to Beckett and Castle - bickering and flirty. A few weeks ago those two characters finally kissed. When I saw him that week, I said, "How'd you like that episode!" He said, "Meh, they can drag that on forever..." But he was looking right at me as he said it, and I must have turned 50 shades of red...

 

I suppose I ought to point out that this has been going on - off and on, in various forms - since December of '07...

 

I think the only way I will know for sure is if I ask him out. Then when he says no, I'll be able to move on! I've liked other fellows over the years, but he's - he's special.