Why does this woman avoid me at all costs?

[Lucy__lou]

I believe your perception is flawed for women in general but if it were true, I think it would set women back decades. I have a wife, a sister, two adult daughters and a large acquaintance of females and I know of none of them that would react in the way you have suggested and they all would resent the implication that they might.

 

I would think this reaction was immature and over the top and drama queenish too if I hadn't found myself behaving in a similarly over the top way a few times myself. And it's not the most mature looking behaviour, but if you don't know how to handle a situation and draw a boundary in a calm way, it might be better for your own wellbeing than doing nothing.

 

I've had guys show interest in me before, and I've dealt with it in a normal, polite way. These other times when I've not handled it well, it's been something about the guy, something about his vibe which has put me on edge. I have learned through past experience that listening to my guts, even if other people don't understand why I might feel a certain way, is a good thing. So condemning a woman for listening to her instincts and protecting her self, even if no one can see the reason for it, isn't a good thing. Women need to be on guard in a lot of places in this world. The minute we stop listening to our guts and ignoring our instincts is the moment we start putting ourselves in situations where we might get abused. Drawing boundaries in a society that wants us to retract them and be more available to men for their use is an ongoing challenge for women.

 

I would also like to point out to you DN that you are in Canada, and the OP is in Sacramento. As far as I'm aware, Canadian women aren't sexualised as much as those in the US, so your wife, sister and daughters are probably less traumatised from sexual harassment or fear of it than the average girl in Sacramento. These things build up.

[Cognitive_Canine]

I was never raped nor was I ever sexually abused. I only just get sexually harassed and such. You're right, it is not the OP's fault that he attracted to her, but if she heard it from word to word, who knows what has been told. What if someone twisted the OP's words and she heard that he talked about her body, how much he wants to shag her, etc? Adults can still have the mentality of that of a high school teenager. Why do you think my father tells me there are still "cliches and groups" at his work place? They are adults in their 20's-70's, and they still feel the need to cling onto certain people and shun other types away.

 

That's a good point too.

 

Maybe some competing guy told the girl some nasty things about the OP so he won't have to worry about him.

[servedcold]

There is not even the slightest whiff of sexual harassment by OP anywhere in this thread, so why is it being brought up? Sure there are lots of possible explanations for the woman in question's behavior, and OP probably just wanted to vent some anyway, yet we are being asked to try to see this woman's side of the situation why exactly?

 

This situation gets me a little riled because I've seen the scenario played out in the workplace many times, the woman dresses or acts provocatively to get the attention of the big stud in the corner office, but if some lesser plebe has the outrageous gall to find her attractive, Call the sensitivity corp! "I feel so -uncomfortable- in this environment! How DARE the wrong guy respond to my obviously slatternly demeanor and appearance? Lock... him... away with all the other pervs... but not the stud in the corner, he banged me in the bathroom last week and hasn't called, guess it's time to bring out the pushup bra and FMPs."

 

Anyone in the modern workplace who says they don't see this on a regular basis needs to open their eyes.

[servedcold]

There is not even the slightest whiff of sexual harassment by OP anywhere in this thread, so why is it being brought up? Sure there are lots of possible explanations for the woman in question's behavior, and OP probably just wanted to vent some anyway, yet we are being asked to try to see this woman's side of the situation why exactly?

 

This situation gets me a little riled because I've seen the scenario played out in the workplace many times, the woman dresses or acts provocatively to get the attention of the big stud in the corner office, but if some lesser plebe has the outrageous gall to find her attractive, Call the sensitivity corp! "I feel so -uncomfortable- in this environment! How DARE the wrong guy respond to my obviously slatternly demeanor and appearance? Lock... him... away with all the other pervs... but not the stud in the corner, he banged me in the bathroom last week and hasn't called, guess it's time to bring out the pushup bra and FMPs."

 

Anyone in the modern workplace who says they don't see this on a regular basis needs to open their eyes.

[DN]

My daughters are sexually harassed on a daily basis at work by men in explicit terms that would make a sailor blush.

[DN]

My daughters are sexually harassed on a daily basis at work by men in explicit terms that would make a sailor blush.

[vertigoxo]

That's a good point too.

 

Maybe some competing guy told the girl some nasty things about the OP so he won't have to worry about him.

 

Who knows. Some men never grow up. It could also be a group of co-workers who are catty enough to spill the beans on the woman as a "Heads up, that guy has the hots for you and wants to know if you're interested in a sexy one night stand with him."

[vertigoxo]

That's a good point too.

 

Maybe some competing guy told the girl some nasty things about the OP so he won't have to worry about him.

 

Who knows. Some men never grow up. It could also be a group of co-workers who are catty enough to spill the beans on the woman as a "Heads up, that guy has the hots for you and wants to know if you're interested in a sexy one night stand with him."

[vertigoxo]

We are using the sexual harassment point because the woman may have been harassed in the past and the fact that she may have heard about the OP having a crush on her may have made her thought, "GREAT! Another pervert to keep away from!"

 

Yes, there are office harlots that are like what you describe, but a normal working woman who wants to arrive to work, do what she has to do, and come back home in one piece wouldn't think that way.

[vertigoxo]

We are using the sexual harassment point because the woman may have been harassed in the past and the fact that she may have heard about the OP having a crush on her may have made her thought, "GREAT! Another pervert to keep away from!"

 

Yes, there are office harlots that are like what you describe, but a normal working woman who wants to arrive to work, do what she has to do, and come back home in one piece wouldn't think that way.

[DN]

The fact that someone has been sexually harassed by a man does not mean that they get to treat all men as the enemy. It's like saying that because you were mugged by a member of a particular race that you get to treat all members of that race as potential muggers. Or if a man has been the target of a golddigger that he should assume all women are like that. It's called 'profiling' and it does no one any good, not least the person doing it.

[DN]

The fact that someone has been sexually harassed by a man does not mean that they get to treat all men as the enemy. It's like saying that because you were mugged by a member of a particular race that you get to treat all members of that race as potential muggers. Or if a man has been the target of a golddigger that he should assume all women are like that. It's called 'profiling' and it does no one any good, not least the person doing it.

[servedcold]

We are using the sexual harassment point because the woman may have been harassed in the past and the fact that she may have heard about the OP having a crush on her may have made her thought, "GREAT! Another pervert to keep away from!"

 

If the woman had been burned in a fire before, and ran away screaming whenever she saw someone light a match, would that be entirely her problem to deal with, and not at all the responsibility of the person with the match? Or would the person with the match be expected to worry about her past history?

[servedcold]

We are using the sexual harassment point because the woman may have been harassed in the past and the fact that she may have heard about the OP having a crush on her may have made her thought, "GREAT! Another pervert to keep away from!"

 

If the woman had been burned in a fire before, and ran away screaming whenever she saw someone light a match, would that be entirely her problem to deal with, and not at all the responsibility of the person with the match? Or would the person with the match be expected to worry about her past history?

[vertigoxo]

The fact that someone has been sexually harassed by a man does not mean that they get to treat all men as the enemy. It's like saying that because you were mugged by a member of a particular race that you get to treat all members of that race as potential muggers. Or if a man has been the target of a golddigger that he should assume all women are like that. It's called 'profiling' and it does no one any good, not least the person doing it.

 

Trauma is the word here, though. I caught this episode of Dr. Phil (Yes, shoot me.) about a woman who is completely severely traumatized because she was raped by a black man, and now assumes all black men will do the same to her. She profusely swears up and down that she is not a racist, she has "black girl friends" who knows the situation and understands it.

 

It isn't her fault that the rape happened. You don't have to look like a complete prostitute to "ask" for a raping. If anything, I think rapists are more turned on by a woman who dresses modestly because of the possible virginity that woman may possess. It's not an image thing... It's just how it is. Anybody, even men, can be targets for rape and sexual abuse/harassment.

 

 

If the woman had been burned in a fire before, and ran away screaming whenever she saw someone light a match, would that be entirely her problem to deal with, and not at all the responsibility of the person with the match? Or would the person with the match be expected to worry about her past history?

 

Again, the key word here is "trauma". It's nobody's fault. What do you expect that person to do... Sit there in squeaming anguish as she watches the other person play with fire?

[vertigoxo]

The fact that someone has been sexually harassed by a man does not mean that they get to treat all men as the enemy. It's like saying that because you were mugged by a member of a particular race that you get to treat all members of that race as potential muggers. Or if a man has been the target of a golddigger that he should assume all women are like that. It's called 'profiling' and it does no one any good, not least the person doing it.

 

Trauma is the word here, though. I caught this episode of Dr. Phil (Yes, shoot me.) about a woman who is completely severely traumatized because she was raped by a black man, and now assumes all black men will do the same to her. She profusely swears up and down that she is not a racist, she has "black girl friends" who knows the situation and understands it.

 

It isn't her fault that the rape happened. You don't have to look like a complete prostitute to "ask" for a raping. If anything, I think rapists are more turned on by a woman who dresses modestly because of the possible virginity that woman may possess. It's not an image thing... It's just how it is. Anybody, even men, can be targets for rape and sexual abuse/harassment.

 

 

If the woman had been burned in a fire before, and ran away screaming whenever she saw someone light a match, would that be entirely her problem to deal with, and not at all the responsibility of the person with the match? Or would the person with the match be expected to worry about her past history?

 

Again, the key word here is "trauma". It's nobody's fault. What do you expect that person to do... Sit there in squeaming anguish as she watches the other person play with fire?

[Cognitive_Canine]

But, the thing we're getting it at.

 

Is it the black mens' fault for scaring her? Or is this something she has to deal with on her own?

 

It's not the OP's fault if this woman assumes he's a hounddog creeper due to her own issues.

[Cognitive_Canine]

But, the thing we're getting it at.

 

Is it the black mens' fault for scaring her? Or is this something she has to deal with on her own?

 

It's not the OP's fault if this woman assumes he's a hounddog creeper due to her own issues.

[DN]

Trauma is the word here, though. I caught this episode of Dr. Phil (Yes, shoot me.) about a woman who is completely severely traumatized because she was raped by a black man, and now assumes all black men will do the same to her. She profusely swears up and down that she is not a racist, she has "black girl friends" who knows the situation and understands it.

 

It isn't her fault that the rape happened. You don't have to look like a complete prostitute to "ask" for a raping. If anything, I think rapists are more turned on by a woman who dresses modestly because of the possible virginity that woman may possess. It's not an image thing... It's just how it is. Anybody, even men, can be targets for rape and sexual abuse/harassment.

But it also isn't the fault of every other black man either. And you can't really expect that if she sees a black man in the street and treats him in a very negative way that he is going to think to himself "she must have been raped by someone with the same skin colour as me and therefore I will go away so she isn't further traumatised."

 

Similarly, it is not reasonable for a man not to confess that he has a crush on someone to a co-worker for fear she will find out about it, has been sexually harassed in the past and will react in the way described in the original post.

[DN]

Trauma is the word here, though. I caught this episode of Dr. Phil (Yes, shoot me.) about a woman who is completely severely traumatized because she was raped by a black man, and now assumes all black men will do the same to her. She profusely swears up and down that she is not a racist, she has "black girl friends" who knows the situation and understands it.

 

It isn't her fault that the rape happened. You don't have to look like a complete prostitute to "ask" for a raping. If anything, I think rapists are more turned on by a woman who dresses modestly because of the possible virginity that woman may possess. It's not an image thing... It's just how it is. Anybody, even men, can be targets for rape and sexual abuse/harassment.

But it also isn't the fault of every other black man either. And you can't really expect that if she sees a black man in the street and treats him in a very negative way that he is going to think to himself "she must have been raped by someone with the same skin colour as me and therefore I will go away so she isn't further traumatised."

 

Similarly, it is not reasonable for a man not to confess that he has a crush on someone to a co-worker for fear she will find out about it, has been sexually harassed in the past and will react in the way described in the original post.

[galaxy71]

But the OP did not grab her. He didn't make any sexual comments. I get the feeling that the woman in the original post would not have tried avoiding him if she was interested in him. There are a lot of threads where men and women talk about dating coworkers. People date their coworkers all the time. I have seen women encourage guys to pursue their female coworkers.

 

It's sexual harassment if the guy is unattractive. Yet, if the guy looks like Brad Pitt, he is admired for his confidence I really find it bizarre to apologize for having a crush on someone when men and women hook up with their coworkers all the time. What should he write in the apology letter??? I'm sorry that I don't look like Brad Pitt or George Clooney. Or maybe he should write "I'm sorry that I've haven't studied the effects of patriachy in the workplace"

 

Lucy Lou, I really do not know why you brought sexual harassment and the oppression of women in this thread. Straight guys are attracted to women all the time. It should not be something to be ashamed of. It is nothing to apologize about in a letter. Writting a letter will unneccesarily escalate things. People have crushes all the time. It's complete natural. An unintended side effect is that the object of the crush will feel uncomfortable if he or she cannot reciprocate the feeling. That's life. If you are always trying not to make people feel uncomfortable, you will end up writing countless threads in the shyness folder about how you are unable to show interest in people you like. It reminds me of that thread where some guy wrote that he thought it was wrong to show interest in a women. I refuse to pay for the sins of my grandfathers and my fathers. I want to be judged for what I do. I should not be ashamed for finding a women attractive, even if she cannot reciprocate my feelings. Most straight women actually like it when men competently show interest in them, because they want to date men.

[galaxy71]

But the OP did not grab her. He didn't make any sexual comments. I get the feeling that the woman in the original post would not have tried avoiding him if she was interested in him. There are a lot of threads where men and women talk about dating coworkers. People date their coworkers all the time. I have seen women encourage guys to pursue their female coworkers.

 

It's sexual harassment if the guy is unattractive. Yet, if the guy looks like Brad Pitt, he is admired for his confidence I really find it bizarre to apologize for having a crush on someone when men and women hook up with their coworkers all the time. What should he write in the apology letter??? I'm sorry that I don't look like Brad Pitt or George Clooney. Or maybe he should write "I'm sorry that I've haven't studied the effects of patriachy in the workplace"

 

Lucy Lou, I really do not know why you brought sexual harassment and the oppression of women in this thread. Straight guys are attracted to women all the time. It should not be something to be ashamed of. It is nothing to apologize about in a letter. Writting a letter will unneccesarily escalate things. People have crushes all the time. It's complete natural. An unintended side effect is that the object of the crush will feel uncomfortable if he or she cannot reciprocate the feeling. That's life. If you are always trying not to make people feel uncomfortable, you will end up writing countless threads in the shyness folder about how you are unable to show interest in people you like. It reminds me of that thread where some guy wrote that he thought it was wrong to show interest in a women. I refuse to pay for the sins of my grandfathers and my fathers. I want to be judged for what I do. I should not be ashamed for finding a women attractive, even if she cannot reciprocate my feelings. Most straight women actually like it when men competently show interest in them, because they want to date men.

[browneyedgirl36]

This is not an issue of sexual harassment at all. Sorry but I have to stand up for myself a little bit here. Lets not make this into a bigger deal than it is. She was not sexually harassed. Just because something happened to some of you doesn't mean it's the same situation I'm in with this girl. Try to have an objective opinion here.

 

Besides, what actually happened at work? I barely even see her at work to begin with! I'm on the 1st floor, she's on the 3rd, we don't cross paths often in the first place, and the situation I described here didn't even happen at work! It happened in traffic after work! So lets not blow it up into some big "women in the workplace" issue. I didn't DO anything, and I don't feel like I have anything to apologize to her for.

 

Apollo -- Please don't feel like you have to defend yourself. You have done nothing wrong here. The only thing you maybe did *wrong* (and I hate to even call it wrong) is revealing to a co-worker that you had a crush on this girl because, as we all know, office gossip runs rampant, and there's always a good chance stuff like that will get around.

 

That said, I am a college professor, and I have experienced my fair share of creepy stalker-like behavior (including an incident last spring that led me to consult with the campus police) AND overt sexual harassment; I have also been the object of a few crushes in my time, and while I can't speak for all women, of course, I can tell you that for me, there is a HUGE difference between a guy having a crush on me and a guy stalking me or sexually harassing me. For me, there is a very clear-cut distinction. Harassment/stalking would be getting a bunch of notes under my door, for weeks on end, from a guy commenting on what I was wearing, my various body parts, etc. -- THAT was creepy, because it was clear that he was watching me, and I had no idea who he was. And, it was followed up with e-mails asking me to PLEASE respond to him. I finally did, telling him to leave me alone (I had never met the guy, as far as I know). He left me alone, but while it was going on, I was a bit freaked out.

 

If, however, a student has expressed that he has a crush on me (which several have done, after the semester was over, usually) or if I sense he does, it doesn't bother me at all. It would only bother me if I had some reason to think he might be unstable or dangerous, but that has never been the case for me.

 

If this girl is indeed freaked out, well, that's her prerogative, I guess, but I don't think you have done anything wrong, and it's her issue if she feels she has to go out of her way to avoid you.

 

I agree with the posters who said DON'T write a letter. I know you know that already, though. That could be taken the wrong way, first of all, and secondly, you don't have anything to apologize for.

 

Just avoid her as best you can. Don't engage her in any conversation unless you absolutely have to and it is work-related. And, don't mention her to any of your other co-workers. Just let it go.

[browneyedgirl36]

This is not an issue of sexual harassment at all. Sorry but I have to stand up for myself a little bit here. Lets not make this into a bigger deal than it is. She was not sexually harassed. Just because something happened to some of you doesn't mean it's the same situation I'm in with this girl. Try to have an objective opinion here.

 

Besides, what actually happened at work? I barely even see her at work to begin with! I'm on the 1st floor, she's on the 3rd, we don't cross paths often in the first place, and the situation I described here didn't even happen at work! It happened in traffic after work! So lets not blow it up into some big "women in the workplace" issue. I didn't DO anything, and I don't feel like I have anything to apologize to her for.

 

Apollo -- Please don't feel like you have to defend yourself. You have done nothing wrong here. The only thing you maybe did *wrong* (and I hate to even call it wrong) is revealing to a co-worker that you had a crush on this girl because, as we all know, office gossip runs rampant, and there's always a good chance stuff like that will get around.

 

That said, I am a college professor, and I have experienced my fair share of creepy stalker-like behavior (including an incident last spring that led me to consult with the campus police) AND overt sexual harassment; I have also been the object of a few crushes in my time, and while I can't speak for all women, of course, I can tell you that for me, there is a HUGE difference between a guy having a crush on me and a guy stalking me or sexually harassing me. For me, there is a very clear-cut distinction. Harassment/stalking would be getting a bunch of notes under my door, for weeks on end, from a guy commenting on what I was wearing, my various body parts, etc. -- THAT was creepy, because it was clear that he was watching me, and I had no idea who he was. And, it was followed up with e-mails asking me to PLEASE respond to him. I finally did, telling him to leave me alone (I had never met the guy, as far as I know). He left me alone, but while it was going on, I was a bit freaked out.

 

If, however, a student has expressed that he has a crush on me (which several have done, after the semester was over, usually) or if I sense he does, it doesn't bother me at all. It would only bother me if I had some reason to think he might be unstable or dangerous, but that has never been the case for me.

 

If this girl is indeed freaked out, well, that's her prerogative, I guess, but I don't think you have done anything wrong, and it's her issue if she feels she has to go out of her way to avoid you.

 

I agree with the posters who said DON'T write a letter. I know you know that already, though. That could be taken the wrong way, first of all, and secondly, you don't have anything to apologize for.

 

Just avoid her as best you can. Don't engage her in any conversation unless you absolutely have to and it is work-related. And, don't mention her to any of your other co-workers. Just let it go.

[vertigoxo]

But, the thing we're getting it at.

 

Is it the black mens' fault for scaring her? Or is this something she has to deal with on her own?

 

It's not the OP's fault if this woman assumes he's a hounddog creeper due to her own issues.

 

It's nobody's fault is where I'm getting at. It's not the OP's fault the woman has issues, just like it's not the woman's fault for getting inappropriate attention.

 

But it also isn't the fault of every other black man either. And you can't really expect that if she sees a black man in the street and treats him in a very negative way that he is going to think to himself "she must have been raped by someone with the same skin colour as me and therefore I will go away so she isn't further traumatised."

 

The lady on the show doesn't treat black men negatively, though. She just starts crying and run away. And while that may look odd to outsiders, we have to remember that it's not her fault she gets like that. It is burned to her psychological hard drive that as of now, any black man can be a potential threat to her.

 

Thankfully, she is getting help.