I Wish I Knew His Orientation

[theoneandonly0708]

I met this guy who currently is now one of my closest friends who just makes me always think he may be gay. He has a girlfriend, but she lives out of state, and other than that he has had few girlfriends. Hence, he is a nice-looking guy. It seems like everytime I talk to him or hang out with him, I get this feeling that when we look into each others eyes we were "meant for each other". Now, I know that's a little to emotional but when were talking or he's talking to me, he always looks at me straight in the eyes and I can see his eyes look down to my mouth every so often. After he says something, for example a joke, he'll laugh and then still stare me in the eyes and theres this awkward silence as we look at each other, eventually one of us breaks it by him then suddenly looking at the television or talk about something else. Just when he looks at me it's almost like that "make-out" feeling. But, I don't wanna risk anything if it turns out he's straight. We see each other every day, he has made a nickname for me, is always telling me he loves me, which I assume in the friendly way. He has grabbed my cheeks before and told me he loves me. I'm dieing to know if he's at least bi-sexual, but I'm still not sure, and don't want to like go in for a kiss when it turns out he freaks out and everybody knows. Any ideas?

[Jinx]

He has a girlfriend, but she lives out of state, and other than that he has had few girlfriends.

Well, that I have to say is something that has to be considered. Cheating is cheating, whether he is gay, bisexual or straight. Even if you found out he was gay or bisexual, I think in ethics terms, it would be best for him to break up with her before pursuing anything.

 

We see each other every day, he has made a nickname for me, is always telling me he loves me, which I assume in the friendly way. He has grabbed my cheeks before and told me he loves me.

Maybe I'm in the boondocks side of the world in a way, but honestly I've never heard two men say they loved each other that weren't either (A) family in a family manner or (B) a gay couple. Hear women all the time, but men, nope. Reason I'm saying this is that depending on the mentality of the region which you reside, may also help in your assumption.

 

Anyhow, there is potential of him being gay but I suppose the best course of action would be to talk about his feelings related to gays and what not to start out with. That seems to be one of the best icebreakers, and given it is currently a major political topic it isn't like pulling a topic such as, "Are you romantically inclined towards dating a man anytime in the near future?" that would be awkward and possibly line yourself up with a false answer, and from my experiences at the moment it seems like a popular thing when someone is under pressure about their orientation. Needs to be gradual conversation wise I presume.

 

It truly depends how open he is on the topic, and how far you want to discuss. If he is extremely open and open minded it isn't so much a task, now if he has reservations it will be similar to getting blood from a stone, so to speak.

[theoneandonly0708]

There was also a time when we were talking with a bunch of people and someone brought up this kid in our school that was gay, and then I heard (the one I like) say "So what?". Every so often I see him with this one kid who is bisexual or gay in our school who currently has a boyfriend himself. Now of course he may just not have a problem with people being gay but I'm not sure. He even made me a valentine card he made in one of his classes, he said he didn't make it just for me. He just gave it to me and said take it. So, I did. It was a project they had to do in their foreign language class. Sometimes when he's over my house he'll just stare at me every once in a while, right in the eyes and mouth like I said before.

 

Now a good amount people I know are very open and don't have any problem talking about anything sexual. And we are either serious or joking around. So, I had thought to joke around with him saying something stupid like "I have a boner" or something like that and he would be like "that's gross". Where as other people I know would either laugh and say something sarcastically back, that may just be personality-wise however, I'm still not sure. Yet, at the same time I am trying my best to look for signs that could be giveaways.

 

I heard that people's eyes dilate when they like someone, but his eyes are dark and were never usually in like a bright area, ususally normal lighting but I still can't tell.

[theoneandonly0708]

I was talking to him the other day and somehow he brought up the topic of how gross a gay kid is in our school. So, I of course agreed in a straight manner. Then I brought up another kid who was and he told me to stop and asked why we were talking about this.

 

I am beginning to have some doubts.

 

Yet, when we walk in the hall afterschool leaving, he is usually like very close to me like side by side.

 

I need help...

During the conversation, should I have said something like "Well, sometimes you just have to accept the fact that people are gay." Or would that be pushing it?

[Prufrock06]

During the conversation, should I have said something like "Well, sometimes you just have to accept the fact that people are gay." Or would that be pushing it?

 

No, I don't think that would have been pushing it. I think it would have been an example of telling him where you stand on this particular issue without necessarily drawing attention to yourself or your sexuality (if that's what you're trying to avoid). In fact, I say next time that topic comes up, you should go right ahead and say just that. Might help give you more insight onto where he "stands"...

[Jinx]

I was talking to him the other day and somehow he brought up the topic of how gross a gay kid is in our school. So, I of course agreed in a straight manner. Then I brought up another kid who was and he told me to stop and asked why we were talking about this.

I'm wondering here with the wording, was this conversation in the way of individualized gross, or in the way of overall * * * * * is disturbing type? Could make a difference and I wasn't quite sure. Just assumed the latter given your comment about a straight answer.

 

For him to ask why you were talking about this, seems like he was being defensive attitude wise, such as though it were a threat to even be bringing up the topic at hand.

 

Depending on how you answer in a straight manner, when he brings it up again, I suppose instead of trying to force acceptance on, say something nonchalant that "Love happens, and not much we can do about it." Or to that effect. Then again it really depends on what you too are comfortable with and how he will react. If he is hung up on acting homophobic, well, I think no matter what you say he will act offended if it has anything to do with thats life and learning to "cope".

[theoneandonly0708]

Well, it was an online conversation, so as unfortunate as it sounds, I wasn't able to see his reaction in person.

 

I'm not sure what we were talking about before, but randomly online he may say "I Love You" or "I Heart You" or something along those lines. I usually say the same in the return. And then he brought up the kid who was gay in our school and he was just saying he is so gross. Then I agreed saying other things, then I brought up another kid, and he said nasty or something and then told me to stop and why we were talking about this.

 

Another Thing:

 

I know plenty of straight guys who would just, out of the blue, say something sexually-related in a humorous way. For example, "I have a massive erection..." of course they laugh and it's a joking situation. So, I attempted to joke around, just to see how he would react (yet it was an online conversation again). I told him that I had a boner (which I didn't) and he said that was gross. And I told him I was kidding and he still said that was like gross. Then I went a little further saying, like, don't you hate it when you get it during school. And then he was like "Why are we talking about this?!".

 

So, I told him again, I was joking around. I mean I joke around like that all the time, and even my lunch table with like all straight guys, we would be open and talk serious about it sometimes. Mostly in a laughing manner, but yet we were still making a point.

 

Anyways, I am still confused, and if he seems this "defensive" if you will on simple topics that most people don't really care about, then I'm not sure how to approach him.

 

I'm like afraid to approach him in coversation like that if he's that way about topics like that, yet I haven't seen his reaction in person still... More tips would really be appreciated, thanks...

[theoneandonly0708]

And ideas? Any and all tips are greatly appreciated. But I really want to know how I should approach it.

[Jinx]

And I told him I was kidding and he still said that was like gross. Then I went a little further saying, like, don't you hate it when you get it during school. And then he was like "Why are we talking about this?!".

 

Why are we talking about this, as you too have pretty much assumed, seems to be his scapegoat sentence. He vaguely reminds me of a friend who I speak to here and there (distance element and phone bills, ouch) but this friend of mine is open about things such as attraction and crushes, but just will not touch any sexuality issue, humor or not.

 

She is much like that, when a topic comes up whether serious or joke that has an outright or possible sexual basis she just won't touch it, much like a hot potatoe. We can converse for a few moments, then it is just like that, "Why and how are we talking about things like this. Moving on to something else..." These are heterosexual comments too mind you (I'd probably hear a body falling out of a chair if I even tried Homosexual), still it has the common sexual base and thus, treated equally.

 

It may just be he is either unknowledgable and need not feel embarrassed, doesn't want to give his opinion or is bothered by any sexual subjects for one reason or another. You say he is open about most other things (ie 'I love you') but this is hitting a different nerve.

 

If he is like my friend, you have to allow the other person to lead the conversation and when all is peaceful somehow add in where appropriate (before any of these sort of conversations start though, so the message has time to absorb) that you'll listen to anything he ever has to say, and don't judge (and take that sincerely and seriously about not judging or else it just isn't going to work and make people clam up more). For people who are uncomfortable of making a fool infront of a good friend or even an acquaintance, this line delivered sincerely makes a world of difference.

 

For me, I can get results because seriously, I don't make an issue if they are unknowing or foolish. I have no judgement, unless of course they're becoming extremely irritating or insulting intentionally directly towards me. Even then I have patience, or try really hard. I think that maybe what he needs is just to know that if he isn't sure of himself or makes a mistake, you won't laugh. Or if there is, it will be his laughing at himself and you're laughing with him. Also helps to know how his self esteem goes too. Nonetheless, things like that help people open themselves up when they can trust you to take them gently and seriously all at once except when it is humor.

 

As for the "I love you" you could always could question that but it may be iffy. If it were me (of course female to female and male to male in our society has major differences, so take this with a grain of salt) I'd reply with something questioning such as, "You love me, hm? When did this development occur?" or "Promises, promises" if he "threatens" to do something in a playful manner. Non-openly-intrusive types which are taken in a playing context can often be the best keys to communication, or even if fluid enough and done right can lead to most interesting conversations.

 

Of course, depending on the person I can get away with these things cut and clear because it is humor. I just know who I can get away with this and who I can't. It really depends on him as an individual when using humor which is like that, if he isn't used to it, then it may be taken literally. Good friends I have that I do this with understand my dry or sarcastic humor, that is the difference.

 

It could very well be that he has been raised in an environment where sexual topics are looked down on. My female friend was, thus it makes it extremely uncomfortable and in not wanting to look like an "idiot" as these individuals often view after a couple people have laughed at them, they just avoid it in any form serious or otherwise. They want to talk about it but they've lost their stability in this kind of conversations through prior experiences in opening up to others. This is just one possibility too, there are hundreds of others.

 

Nonetheless, I think the key is to put these conversations into motion when he is there. You can say a lot of things over the internet you wouldn't in reality. On another note having such conversations in person allows you the benefit of seeing his reactions. I think you just need to approach the conversation topics as you would elsewhere, but make sure he is in person.

[theoneandonly0708]

It's been a while since I updated this whole ordeal...

 

Well, "almost" every weekend we hang out either he sleeps over here or I sleep at his house...

 

Not to draw off on a tangent, but today he told me "online" of course he wanted to have my children, he always starts a conversation by IMing me with the word "love" or "I LOVE YOU" in capital letters. When he walks with me in the hall he almost always is arm to arm with me. I wish I had the guts to ask him if he was himself, but he's so conservative and brought up so religious that I have the feeling he would just be offended or something. My crush on him has really grown for him, but I don't want to keep my hopes up for nothing, even though so many signs are there. He still has a GF, in a different state mind you, he may come over again this weekend, and I'm just so attracted to him right now, but I control it of course. And he does still look me right in the eyes once in a while, at least when me and him are alone, in the school - he still does but not as often as if it were just me and him. I'm so confused right now...

[lazy_day_blues]

Im having the same problem with a guy at my school; like the exact same problem. If he is as close a friend to you as you say, and if he does accept homosexuality like you say, then you should ask him. In private.

[daytimetvsucks]

I too have the same problem with a guy and i still dont know exactly what to do

but I don't want to keep my hopes up for nothing, even though so many signs are there.

i know exactly the what you mean(really and im not just saying that like some people do)

what I would/what im doing is just not thinking about it as much kinda being open to what happens (in my situation i dont think he is gay/bi now which is dissaponting) so you know how everyone tells you if you losse something then to find it, stop looking for it (I dont know but it works for me) so thats what im doing but it is really up to you and what you think is best

[theoneandonly0708]

Thanks For Following Up Guys...

 

UPDATE --

 

He came over today after school, he pretty much wanted to come over, I of course had no problem with that. He always asks if we will be home alone at all. Well anyways, sorry if I'm skipping around here for what happened today, but there's just so much.

 

Say, your sitting at a desk in a chair and he has no chair and he leans in to type, well let me tell you how close our faces were to each other, I mean literally touching, and he didn't really care, which surprised me. Usually he doesn't seem like that touchy-feely kinda guy. Yet, when we walk in the hall his right arm is always touching my left arm when we walk together. Almost as if we were going to hold hands. Also, my hand was so close to his pants pretty much touching that area (not intentionally, although I was shocked he didn't care) and I was surprised. We must have stared at each other for the most LONGEST durations ever, like thats all, there was like no conversation we just stared. But, I'm so afraid to approach bringing up a topic like relating to us. When our faces were pretty much in "kissing" distance, I know for a fact no straight guy would ever get that close not caring. But, he still has a girlfriend in a different state who he hasn't seen for five months or so now, I don't know. I was dieing to just go in for a kiss, but then your mind starts to think of the consequences. "Will he back away and be like * * *?" "Will he kiss back?" "How awkward will our friendship be after that?" "Will he tell anyone?"...

 

He's also very religious and I am as well, but I don't know. There are just soooo many signs, I want to find out soooo bad, but I'm afraid of what might happen. But, if he was getting THAT close to me today, not caring and staring at me way longer without ANY conversation, I don't know. He seemed to open up a little more after we arrived at my house. At first I grabbed his arm when I was trying to get a pillow and stuff (attempting to get into situations on how he would react to touching, although it wasn't like softy touching, I was grabbing his arm to get the pillow kinda thing) and he asked "Why are you touching me?"...

 

Also, he IMd his GF on my screen name to find out stuff, and he had typed this thing (which he didn't send) like "Yeah, he's pretty hot..." (me being his friend saying that about him to his girlfriend) and he was laughed and then said "Moving On..."

 

I have that feeling when we both look each other in the eyes that we both know it, but are afraid, I don't know... Hopefully these latest details help give some clues... Please help...

[theoneandonly0708]

I hope this information helps, how should I approach it, without something bad happening? He seems to be more comfortable with me in private...

[theoneandonly0708]

Based what I've been telling everybody, does anybody think he may be bisexual or gay?

 

Why sometimes he has no problem when we are touching each other and other times he questions me about it is beyond me... Maybe it's his "homophobia" stage, or at least I hope. But, seriously, I have never had this feeling or connection with any other guy I know, no straight guy would stare in my eyes just for the heck of it and for the longest duration. I don't know, I'm dieing to just do something but I'm so afraid of what the outcome could be...

 

What was also interesting is that when we went to go play PS2, which is at the foot of my bed with the TV (I have a bunkbed)... We were undecided what to play and everything was off and we were just kinda laying there. Suddenly he says "Okay, well let's play something otherwise your mom may come in here and think this is strange..." I can't remember what exact words were used, but it was very close to that... Please help...

[theoneandonly0708]

It's been quite a while, and he just came home from being out of state to see his GF. And she does in fact exist, I've seen her MySpace, talked to her on AIM once in great while, who would go out with someone who lives in a completely different state and only sees each other every 3-4 months or so? Is he really that devoted to a relationship like that? Lately, I've been "easing off" from him, I used to have to IM him every time when I'm online to start a conversation. You'd think if he was interested in me he would IM me? But the day he arrived home he was online and he actually IM'd me not with Hey, Hello, Hi like anybody else would say, but - "Where have you been my whole life?!" he always says these things during an IM Conversation. Then we had a somewhat normal conversation and when he had to leave he said "I love you so much *nickname*!", he says this very often. I've confronted my parents about most of these signs in a "straight" manner. I tell ya, everybody in my immediate family thinks he's definitely GAY, if not BI. I'm not going to repeat myself but all the other posts I've made show most of the signs I've noticed. This crush is starting to slowly fade away, as I don't think he feels the same as I do to him anymore...

[Lmitt54]

Just simply ask the guy some night after a few drinks. If hes straight and you dont want the "whole world" knowing you're not then simply say you wanted to make it clear you are straight as well and it seemed hes was coming on to you. If hes straight he'll never give you those signals again! BUT!.... it sounds like hes just as unsure of you as you are of him.

I had very same situation several years ago with one of my best friends.

Whenever we'd had a few drinks and we got our nerves loosened up some he would do the same, touching me physically somwewhere on me.

Then one winter we were stranded out of town and forced to get a room at a motel. After a considerably large amount of alcohol I risked asking him how he felt about bi-guys after a conversation on gay marriage before it was such a hot topic as now. Well long story short it turned out he was just as interested in me as I was him! The next thing I know we were groping each others erections through our Levis and ended up "getting to know" each other much more intamately the rest of the night and morning!

So give it a try talk to the guy, you'll never know until one of you breaks the ice.

[theoneandonly0708]

The only problem is that niether of us drink so that would be impossible and he's strictly a non-party person, which I am about the same.

 

Another thing I forgot to mention, the second to last day of school was picture day for ID's (we're going to be seniors next years), and he is always dressed very nicely and looking sharp, I remember him telling me he loves to dress up and he once went shopping with my mom and sister while I was at some event for about and hour and wanted to help my sister pick out her earrings?

 

Back to the picture day, afterschool that day I asked him if he wanted to go to my sister's soccer game that night. He said okay and he came with his same dress clothes on! He had told me he wanted me to see him dressed me earlier that day since I barely saw him anyways.

 

I'd be more that willing to talk with him in private but I need to know how to approach it still because he's very "Why are we talking about this?" sometimes and I want him to be honest and open with me. The problem is he has a GF in a different state...

[Rizby]

He's probably gay...and madly in love with you. He's trying to come out somehow and letting you know it subtly. He's waiting for you to make the first move.

 

Let him decide whether he wants to pursue the alternate lifestyle or remain "straight". His call first, then yours.

[theoneandonly0708]

It's very possible, if you read my other threads I have about "So Confused...", and "Coming Out, So Unbelievably Nervous..." I've tried to come out to him, but I'm just to nervous, but I really do think he may be gay but hiding it very well. We have so much in common and he always sit next to me and close to me...