Getting over someone with rage issues (possible BPD?)

[ChrisKelms]

So a few months ago I posted this thread because I was worried about my girlfriend's rage issues and how I was always worried about something setting her off.

 

 

 

Well, about six weeks ago I realised she had been going through my laptop when I was still at work, logging in sometimes 2-3x a day for weeks, reading all my documents, viewing all my photos which are sync'd to my phone.

 

I said right there and then, that's it, it's over. And I was hugely relieved to have the decision done and the thought of freedom from yelling and accusing.

 

The next ten days was hugely awkward as she was living in my room and I was on the couch in the living room, and every day when I came home she'd have been drinking and when she drinks she always gets angry and insulting.

 

I transferred her enough money to cover two months of rent, told her it wasn't a loan but to make the move easier, and finally her things were packed and the movers had taken them and it was goodbye.

 

And I lost my f'ing s***. We were both crying and saying we didn't want this. I really DO love the hell out of her, but life with her is just so, so hard. In addition to her rage issues, she also makes my life hell as she has no friends, doesn't seem to care for friends, and gets upset when I want to be around my friends, and I love my friends so that's a huge problem.

 

But we agreed to talk more.

 

A few days later we met, and before we did I wrote a seven-page letter beforehand of what I need in a relationship, detailing what we would have to make work, and to my surprise, she agreed with all of it and said we could work through the issues. I was extremely cautious but optimistic, and while a huge voice in my head was screaming RUN, another part of me said maybe with counseling we might get past the issues.

 

Only problem was that the following week I had plans to go to my grad school's 5-year class reunion in Spain, so either she would come with me -- which I wasn't ready for -- or we'd talk more when I returned, which we agreed to do.

 

Unsure that I was doing the right thing but hopeful, we hugged goodbye.

 

That night at 2:35am I received a very long text from her saying that she couldn't do this anymore, that I didn't really seem to want her, that my friends are clearly more important than her, that she hopes I have a "fabulous" time and find the perfect girl and to never contact her again. Basically the exact opposite of everything I'd just told her I needed from her and that she agreed to work on.

 

So that was that. Three weeks have passed, the reunion was nice -- great to see everyone -- but over, and now I'm single and feeling terrible.

 

If the rational part of me says I did the right thing to move on, why do I still feel so awful? Why do I keep going over and over whether I did do the right thing? Did I?

 

Most of all, I'm just not looking forward to the future, and hate the idea of dating and going out with someone new who knows me so little. Despite all our fights, I know the girl loved me and I loved her and I just feel so damn terrible that we never managed to make it work after trying so damn hard.

 

How do I get past this sick feeling and just feel good about life again?

 

God I'd appeciate any advice here.

[Mavrik]

Sadly dating someone with BPD isn't easy, as I sadly had to walk away from an intense relationship that I had with someone I loved and cared about a lot.

 

And yes I would get the text messages at 3am sometimes telling me how great I was and other times them telling me how much they hated me and never wanted to see me again.

 

I couldn't understand what was going on so I read up as much as possible online as to people with BPD and the symptoms and how people can react.

 

Sadly when they suffer from BPD and are having an episode, they can turn on you very badly, yet not even have any feelings as to what they are doing.

 

After 12 months of mood swings and put downs and crazy arguments that stemmed from nothing, she said she wanted to end it. I'll be honest with you, I'd been the best person in her life ever, supportive, loving, caring etc etc. Yet she couldn't handle it and ended it.

 

I felt so bad and sick to the stomach and thought I missed her a lot, but looking back, what I did miss her being in my life and the constant daily battles she had with me and the endless texting and calls, that's what I appear to miss, the gap that this has left. But realistically it's a good gap and a lot better than the filling thaf the gap had in thaf it was nothing but abuse.

 

I got on with my life and it's been a few weeks only and I'm waaaayyyyy over it.

 

Think of what the relationship actually provided that was positive and I'm sure you'll realise it was nothing good

[ThatwasThen]

How do I get past this sick feeling and just feel good about life again?

YOU need to get yourself into therapy so that you figure out why you would even give someone like her the time of day again. You are codependent and you need to work on that about yourself so that you don't pick someone like her again or, worse, let her hoover you back in for more of the same dysfunctional, toxic quagmire of an existence with her.

 

She will contact you again when she gets over the feeling that you abandoned her and she will act like you don't exist once she feels engulfed by you when things are going smoothly and you show her love. YOU CANNOT WIN with someone like her.

 

Go to counselling

Google White Knight Syndrom

Read everything you can on codependency and the importance of personal boundaries...

 

... and for goodness sakes, block her from every possible means of contacting you again.

 

Forget about having to meet new women at this point, you're grieving and it's perfectly normal to not be able to picture yourself going through the motions of meeting someone new. In time, that will change. Work on yourself and why you would choose to have a relationship with someone who clearly showed you that she was in deep psychological trouble. Once you figure that out you'll be able to pick a good partner that will show you what TRUE love is instead of this codependent addiction that you thought was love.

 

Good luck and feel better soon... waste no more time in getting yourself a therapist proficient in codependency issues. You will be glad you did.

[Wiseman2]

Agree you did the right thing getting her out. It's understandable you miss a relationship. There was a lot of intensity and drama which causes more of a trauma-bond (google it) than intimacy. Which you two never really had given the trust issues and arguments.

 

Do some self reflection and consider that getting her out is a sign that you are getting healthier and getting ready for a much better relationship in the future. Use this time for a self improvement plan and reconnecting to friends, family, your interests, hobbies, etc and enjoy your freedom!

I transferred her enough money to cover two months of rent, told her it wasn't a loan but to make the move easier, and finally her things were packed and the movers had taken them and it was goodbye.

[SadSadgirl]

BPD + alcohol + no medicine = huge disaster. you seem extremely codependent, which is why it was so hard for you to leave someone who's so bad for you. cut of all contact. go out with friends, job, gym, etc. you'll thank yourself later

[Ms Darcy]

We don't know if she has BPD. What we do know is that with all that chaos you keep trying to go back.

 

I would strongly advise therapy for you as your own personal mental health has suffered.

[ChrisKelms]

Guys, I've already signed up for a shrink. You don't have to keep telling me to go - I'm going. Yes, I need to find out why I kept going back and resolve it. I get it.

 

Was just looking for a little support to feel a little less like complete crap in the meantime.

 

Thanks Mavrik & Wiseman2, that helped.

[Mavrik]

What helped for me was writing down the issues of this relationship, and once I saw all the negatives written down in front of me, I realised how damaging the relationship was, and made me think and realise 'what the hell was I doing in this relationship'.

 

I also realised that it was an abusive ralationship, in that she was constantly putting me down and making me feel like crap, but for some mad reason I would go back again and again thinking I could change her.

 

I was angry at our mutual friends who didn't want to see her dark side and blamed me.

 

It takes time but you do get over it. I got busy at work and when I go to the gym I tire myself out a lot more than I used to. And I'll

Be honest with you, within 2 weeks I was WAAAAYYYY over it.

 

I do lapse sometimes into thinking about her, but I very soon get over it

 

Message me if you need any support or anything, but I would advise the following.

 

1.dont cyber stalk her Facebook page as to what she's been upto

 

2. Don't think you can change her, because you can't

 

3. Try not to fall for contacting her if you can

 

all the best, but 3 weeks ago I wax exactly where you were

 

It's the gap of the communication and the part of your life she was, thats the gap that needs filling

 

All the best with it

[Mavrik]

after a lot of thinking I came to the realisation that I loved her, but i

Wasn't in love with her

 

Think about that, yourself

[ChrisKelms]

Yes, that also helps - thanks Mavrik.

 

So many times I realised I was sitting there wanting her to be happy and yet not having that "we are one person" mutual understanding that to me is love, of the kind I felt in a prior relationship. While that prior relationship didn't work out for complex reasons, I remember my last girlfriend truly just "getting" me -- she would immediately understand and love everything I said -- while this one would misconstrue the most meaningless sentence as an insult and no matter how much I explained and re-explained she'd remain upset, which meant I'd always just sit there feeling baffled and alone.

 

And yeah, I'm not stalking her in the least, and the gym and getting back to my peak self is definitely part of the roadmap for the rest of the year. My problem in the past was going back to her after a few months of improvement when I was feeling good again, thinking "Okay, THIS time I've got the strength, patience and courage to help us overcome the bad s*** so we can focus on the good". And then we'd get back together and there'd be a lot of good times but also a lot of draining bad times until finally... nope, I can't take it anymore.

 

How long did yours go on for?

 

To those who are calling me "codependent", I don't know if that's fair. Maybe it is, but having read up a lot about codependents it feels like a label that fits poorly. I'm pretty successful professionally, do well taking criticism and accepting it (other than broad labels ), have a good group of friends that I get along with well, and other than our fights I really did care for this girl and wanted it to work out. I actually have a tremendous amount of self-esteem and love for myself, it's only just with this one girl that I kept trying and failing and trying again and again to resolve the problems.

 

But if she's unstable and always finding something surprising to yell at me about and fault me for every few days, does it make me "codependent" to stubbornly continue to look for new avenues for working through our issues rather than immediately running away at the first sign of an argument? If you really, deeply care for 80% of a person does it make you somehow sick if you don't stick around through their crazy to try to support them through it?

 

Maybe it does.

 

Either way I'm starting to see a counselor this week to talk through why I keep going back to this one unhappy problem when everything else is going so well in my life. I need to understand why I hate normal dating so much that the idea of a brand new, truly happy mutually loving relationship seems so distant to me these days when five years ago I had such confidence in it happening soon.

[Mavrik]

Mine lasted 12 months, and wow what an intense 12 months that was

 

The usual honeymoon period for quite some time, but the thing I also had a challenge with is that when I'm in a relationship I give it my all, love letter, flowers, little gifts, sending her video montages, taking days off to look after her when she was ill and going that extra mile and so so many other things. Which I know she had never experienced from previous partners. And she always felt I was putting this on and it would one day end so she would try to sabotage the relationship to stay in control 'all my partners have left me, This one will as well so let me take control and end the relationship myself'. So it was always off and on. And when it was off for a few weeks she'd go out and have reckless sex and then tell me about it to make me jelous. It was so painful to hear but it was like she didn't care and just wanted to hurt me, for something I didn't know what.

 

So it went on for 12 months and I came to realise she was unable to hold down many friendships, she fell out with everyone all the time and her partners would leave within a few weeks, lodgers left, friends left, colleagues turned on her, yet she'd paint the picture that she was the victim and everyone was wrong and treated her badly. Yet I knew the dark side to her thaf no one else saw and I became the bad guy.

 

Like yours, she used to fall into this mood for the smallest reason and no way could I get her out of If and it was soooooo draining.

 

I think I stayed as I thought I could change her and knew she was in a bad place and wanted to be there for her when so many walked away, why? Because I'm different and wanted to be there. How stupid am I to even think that

 

So after her last blow out she told me never to contact her again, last week after several weeks she asked me to go round, which I did and she cried and cried and cried (she was in a low mood) and I sat and spoke to her and held her while she cried...... and then she turned on me.

 

I must be absolutely crazy to think she'll ever change

 

She denies there's anything wrong and so can't be helped

[ChrisKelms]

Damn man, that's really tough. Especially the part about her going out to have sex with other guys - that's just insane.

 

I think my ex was BPD for sure but a little less severe. She'd have all the sudden rages, and the constant accusations, and so much suspicion of my phone and Facebook, and the same issues always losing friends and jobs and not really seeming to care.

 

And yet when it came to me I know she really did love me, and was trustworthy and not a cheater. And that meant something. I don't know what but it did. She'd worked hard to get enrolled in weekend classes toward a degree and managed to stay at her latest job for over a year and that stability really seemed to improve things... yet the problems were still very much there.

 

In the end the chaos was just too much. It's so, so draining to always be thinking "Damn, we haven't spoken in three hours, I better text her some little message or else she's going to be upset". Or that I'd be at work and she'd be at work and she'd get upset about something and I'd have to excuse myself from what I was doing to go have an argument in the hallway so she'd calm down. SO many times I had to leave people I was with to go stand on the street for 20-30 minutes trying to reason with her. Just so much emotion there.

 

It really sucks. I loved so much of her but that core of anger and insecurity was just impossible to get past. If there had been a surgical way to get it out of her and replace it with the same amount of emotion but instead self-awareness and kindness it would have been amazing, but that's wasn't the reality and we're now where we are.

 

Seems now like the only option I have is to work on myself. Physically yes -- I can't wait to get back in great shape and feel full of physical energy again.

 

But like Mrs. Darcy said, I think this relationship has probably damaged me more than I realised. I'm not the same brighteyed super positive guy I was five years ago, sure that with enough hope that anything can work out. I'm kind of jaded, worried that any other relationship will go as bad like this one. Or on the other hand I'm also worried also that I somehow changed to grow addicted to the constant chaos and will now find any truly wonderful relationship boring and too calm. I don't want that to be true and hope it's just anxiety but I have to speak my fears out loud in order to face them, which I guess is why I came here and wrote this, if that makes sense.

 

Right now I find myself living in this fairly dark cloud where the future looks difficult and dark and hard to see. I'm looking forward to seeing what the counselor suggests but let me know if anyone has any other advice on how to start finding a brighter outlook again during what almost feels like recovery from addiction.

[Mavrik]

A normal break up is like a recovery from addiction, so one with someone with BPD is a harder addiction.

 

Reading you last post and this new one, you certainly can't say you didn't try. And you certainly put up with this for a long time. Hoping she would change and you could be there for her. But we get drawn into this and can't seem to find a way out.

 

We get used to the tantrums and constant dramas. And when it ends we find it hard to get over this addiction we've made for ourselves.

 

I think your too close to see it, but someone looking in can see that this should have ended a long time ago and you did your best to make it work but it was all one way. I had the tantrums and the abuse and negative comments, even the racism (she's white im from an Asian background) and she'd make some cutting remarks.

 

I missed her loads and when I saw her the other week and it began to spiral out of control and she began to have a go at me, I pleaded with her not to do this and for it not to end it on a negative, and I apologised for whatever it is that she thought I'd done wrong yet she continued on at me and I felt like a broken man.

 

You need to work it out yourself what you personally got from this all.

 

Share your thoughts and feelings with others.

 

Make yourself a better person

 

Re-engage with yourself and others

 

Go to the gym or get involved in things you like (I watch a lot of comedy as this brings up my mood)

 

Think of the time before this all happened and take yourself back to that place.

 

You will come out of the darkness and you will move on. When I read up on BPD and the various forms, I worked out what was going on for her and the impact on me. Understanding it was a great way for me to move forward as I realised whatever I did would never have changed things.

 

I know she will always struggle with relationships and will always be alone. Do we need to be part of this journey? No

 

Reinvent yourself and become a person that's much better than how you were. And you'll come to realise how much others begin to like you

 

When you are ready to go back on the dating scene you will have more knowledge and insight as to who and what your looking for and the signs and symptoms to look out for.

 

Understanding the impact it's had on you will make you realise that you don't need this in future relationships and you will find the 'one'

[Ms Darcy]

In my opinion, co-dependence is not necessarily about self esteem. It's moreso about acting in ways that are inconsistent with having a healthy interdependent relationship.

 

And yes, you are 100% responsibile for your part in that.

 

You are trying very hard to have it both ways. You want to (inappropriately) diagnose her with an illness and really painting her as the root of all your relationship problems. (That's like me saying my cousin has Parkinson's. Maybe he does but only a doctor would know.)

 

On the other hand, you are trying to paint yourself as a good guy because you wouldn't "leave her at the first sign of trouble."

 

So, either the relationship is a toxic mess based on her reactions or the relationship hit some minor bumps that you were courageously willing to work through. But it can't be both.

 

I myself was in a toxic relationship for two years many years ago. I worked with a therapist. And she helped me realize three things.

 

1. It takes 2 to make any relationship, including a toxic one.

 

2. You are getting SOMETHING out of the drama (like its addictive or at least the highs are).

 

3. There is no honor or nobility in staying in an unhealthy relationship. A ton of people list reasons for staying that try to boil it down to that but it's not going to work.

 

A good therapist will help you work on yourself. Because you run the risk of choosing this type of relationship over and over.

 

You did leave and that's a good thing. That's the beginning of recovery.

 

If you want to move on emotionally now, I don't know if you truly do yet, then get some help to turn the mirror inward.

[ThatwasThen]

Guys, I've already signed up for a shrink. You don't have to keep telling me to go - I'm going. Yes, I need to find out why I kept going back and resolve it. I get it.

 

Was just looking for a little support to feel a little less like complete crap in the meantime.

 

Thanks Mavrik & Wiseman2, that helped.

 

Now is the time to stop focusing on her and to concentrate on you and getting yourself to the point that you are the best you that you can be. As Ms Darcy points out:

A good therapist will help you work on yourself. Because you run the risk of choosing this type of relationship over and over.

 

When do you start your therapy?

Have you googled codependency and white knight syndrome?

Do you know how important personal boundaries are to your own emotional well being?

Do you even know what a personal boundary is?

 

I can give you many samples to start reading. Let me know if you're interested in getting over the way you're feeling through self-help rather then seeking out validation that won't do anything to help you change yourself for he better.

 

P.S. Codependency is nothing like you describe it to be. It has nothing to do with being able to support yourself or be a good professional or even okay when you are single. Learn about what it actually is through reading anything by Melody Beattie or through google even.

 

If you were not codependent then even though you though you loved her, you certainly would not return to her particular brand of crazy. You need to learn to love yourself enough to know that you can do better then what she dished out to you.

[ThatwasThen]

You might benefit from a site called BPD Family. Even if she's not BPD you can read about people in their forum that, like you, have suffered by returning to or having the misfortune to be a child of someone with BPD or have shown to have the symptoms of those who have it.

[ChrisKelms]

Thanks Mavrik & Ms Darcy. I don't think anywhere here am I pinning all the blame on her, rather just trying to use this forum as a place to reason out loud. I'm certainly responsible for all my own actions that led up to where I am now, and am seeing a counselor starting this week to begin discussing how I can see these things more clearly before making further mistakes, react differently to them and create a far more stable future for myself with a calm, loving partner.

 

ThatWasThen, I don't know why you keep hammering me on this stuff but I've already said I'm going to a counselor, and I've googled codependency and white knight syndrome extensively. If you have more links to share then by all means share them, but I was responding based on this and other links like this one:

 

 

 

"Co-dependents have low self-esteem and look for anything outside of themselves to make them feel better. They find it hard to “be themselves.” Some try to feel better through alcohol, drugs or nicotine - and become addicted. Others may develop compulsive behaviors like workaholism, gambling, or indiscriminate sexual activity.

 

They have good intentions. They try to take care of a person who is experiencing difficulty, but the caretaking becomes compulsive and defeating. Co-dependents often take on a martyr’s role and become “benefactors” to an individual in need. A wife may cover for her alcoholic husband; a mother may make excuses for a truant child; or a father may “pull some strings” to keep his child from suffering the consequences of delinquent behavior.

 

The problem is that these repeated rescue attempts allow the needy individual to continue on a destructive course and to become even more dependent on the unhealthy caretaking of the “benefactor.” As this reliance increases, the co-dependent develops a sense of reward and satisfaction from “being needed.” When the caretaking becomes compulsive, the co-dependent feels choiceless and helpless in the relationship, but is unable to break away from the cycle of behavior that causes it. Co-dependents view themselves as victims and are attracted to that same weakness in the love and friendship relationships."

 

Now maybe that's not how you're defining it but you asked me to do some googling and that's what I keep finding. If you have other versions of it that you think are more helpful than please do provide and I'll be delighted to study them. Based on this I think the label is fair but not perfect since I don't generally have low self-esteem and don't find it difficult to "be myself". But okay, if you must put a label on me I'll take that one. I googled White Knight Syndrome and as the first result is Urban Dictionary I'll pass on discussing that one for now though I get your point. I'm still trying to understand if "overly tolerating someone who has many qualities you love yet you can't deal with their anger" is the same as "needing to be a white knight to save a damsel in distress" but haven't reached a conclusion there yet.

 

"Let me know if you're interested in getting over the way you're feeling through self-help rather then seeking out validation that won't do anything to help you change yourself for he better."

 

You may not realise but "advice" like this comes off as sarcastic to the point of causing more problems than it solves. Of course I'm interested in getting over the way I'm feeling through self-help - I'm only writing in this forum to try to help myself. Isn't the point of a site called "e Not Alone" to express your issues and miseries and have others provide suggestions and guidance? I'm more than happy to hear any and all advice but maybe just berating me isn't the best way to go either.

 

I get that I'm the problem here. I've been looking inward to see what the problem is for some time now. I broke up with her because I knew I needed to get out of it and change the way I've been approaching relationships but now that I've been able to extricate myself from it I need to do the work to be sure I don't get back into anything similar ever again. If anyone has suggestions or guidance there's nothing I won't be happy to review.

[ThatwasThen]

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Adding:

 

[ChrisKelms]

Thanks for all your links, ThatWasThen. Some good reading there.

 

I'm sorry, I want to say that I really appreciate your effort to help here, but I still just don't think it applies to my situation. Different people react differently to different things, and what looks to one person as one thing may look very different to someone else, right?

 

For example, the first link about "boundaries", it lists:

 

Signs of Unhealthy Boundaries

Going against personal values or rights in order to please others

Giving as much as you can for the sake of giving

Taking as much as you can for the sake of taking

Letting others define you

Expecting others to fill your needs automatically

Feeling bad or guilty when you say no

Not speaking up when you are treated poorly

Falling apart so someone can take care of you

Falling "in love" with someone you barely know or who reaches out to you

Accepting advances, touching and sex that you don't want

Touching a person without asking

 

Of these really none apply to my last situation. Every time she got angry about something minor and tore into me, I let her know she was out of control and needed to calm down and was angry and firm back, which only ever made things worse. I never "went against personal values to please" her, I only treated her the way I thought I should treat a girlfriend. The only thing I think you can say I did wrong -- and I did it again, and again, and again -- was forgive her, and take her back, and dismiss the anger issues rather than say an unforgivable line had been crossed, then walk away. Except that then I did walk away.

 

I have never, ever had a problem where I say "yes" when I want to say "no". If anything, everywhere in life I'm too assertive, and have always received that feedback, even from my ex.

 

I truly get that you're trying to help, but I really don't think my problem is an extreme need to take care of people where I lose my identity in it. I think you'd find if you met me that my identity's pretty solid, and my friends and exes and the five people who work for me would support that.

 

I saw the counselor for the first time last Tuesday and she was actually really great -- very helpful and understanding, immediately made me see a few patterns I've always gotten myself into that I hadn't noticed before.

 

One thing the counselor helped me realise is that when I was a boy, my father was in the US Navy, and I ended up attending 13 schools in 12 years. Every time I started to become attached to a place or make friends, I'd lose them and have to start again. And again. And again. And as a kid who's never known another way of life you accept that, but looking back it really sucked, and as a result I think I developed some serious attachment issues.

 

As a result, I get really attached way too easily because I think everything in my life I'm going to lose quickly. When I rent a rental car for a week, I hate giving it back because I miss it. I almost feel like it's a person that I have a connection with. If I rent an Airbnb for a weekend, when I leave I say goodbye. When I moved out of my last apartment I'd been in for three years I filmed a little movie so I wouldn't forget all the good times I had there.

 

I really think my issue with my ex wasn't so much around a White Knight Syndrome where I needed to save her, especially because she was doing well and didn't need much saving, but just that I was so attached to all the memories we had together -- and yes, there were a ton of great ones that still make me smile -- that I couldn't bear to move on and never see her face and laugh at those silly in-jokes again, even though I knew perfectly well that I was in a bad relationship and needed to get out. After so much time it feels a little like someone close to me has died. I was just too attached.

 

Now, clearly that's an incredibly unhealthy way to go through life and it does have some similarities to codependency but maybe it's not quite the same thing, I don't know.

 

I do know that the counselor's suggestions and probing immediately took a lot of weight off and made me feel a ton better and a lot more optimistic about the future and the idea of a healthier relationship being possible, though. I need to understand why I keep fighting to keep these extreme attachments even when they're unhealthy. Much looking forward to the next sessions and understanding all of this even better.

 

Thanks for all your effort here though. The reading still always helps.