Will they ever get married?

[Lonewing]

We are in a new era. With all the single households operating without someone staying home watching the kids and maintaining the household, it's a questionable route for anyone to pursue it. If anything, what I see is not one spouse askign the other spouse to be a stay at home parent, but rather, one spouse voluntarily opting to be a stay at home parent, or being a stay at home parent by default because it's too hard to go do anything else. Those who I have respect for are in school, and they will not be stay at home once they finish their degrees, but rahter, they will have their own income and their own individual security.

 

Anyone who puts their financial secutiry will fare worse than those who are their own financial security. There is nothing Fair or generous any more, we ALL have to manage for the rest of our life what we are given - so why someone should have to pay for another person to live who is not their child and is not their employee is beyond me.

 

Parents careers are affected by having chilren, but it's often due to voluntary choices made by the parent. The single biggest reason for that wage disparity is not becasue she is a woman or a parent but because the non-parent/primary bread winner spends 40-60 hours a week at that job. If you put in more time at work, You Will Be Paid More. And the extra hours compnound, which basically means, the more you work, the more likely you are to receive bonuses and make those big plays that make the company more money. Parenting is a full time job, obviously, which means it's near impossible for a single parent to put in those same hours, and if anything, the numbers are closer to 35-40 a week for parents. Sure, they'd love to put in more hours, but they have to take care fo their kids.

 

People with children ARE less committed to their work - if the kid comes up sick, will the parent stay at work or will they drop everything for their kid? If the kid get's out of school early, is the parent going to go get the kid or stay at work? If there's a holiday, will the parent stay at work and pull the project through, or will they go home to be with their family? If they want someone to come in on a weekend, who will be more likely to say yes, the parent or the single/childfree person? Power positions are not just handed out, they are awarded to those who merit the position, often at the expense of everything else in their life. You only have 120 hours in a work week, there's no more finagling time...

 

Your given purpose for marraige, "as marriage is to protect women and to provide a safe haven for them to have children in," is a purpose that only has merit under a patriachial society. Too many single moms and dads have proven that a marriage is not necessary to provide that safe haven. Yes, your career will be set back for a couple of years, but in that time he's covering your bills. Furthermore, just because you can't work full time, this does not mean you can't still be working on yourself professionally.

 

In this day and age you may want to take a closer look at prenups, whereas they will protect your interests just as much as they protect the man's. What's mine is mine and what's yours is yours is a matter of respecting each other's property, and it might not matter to you now, but should you ever be the person going into a marriage with more assets than your future spouse, I dare say your opinion may change. This further extends to my debts, which belong to me and are not a family obligation.

 

I have to be realistic. I have raised myself up from below the poverty line, but a slip up like a divorce and I will be back below it again. In my family, between my mother and father and their combined 6 brothers, there has been 7 divorces on my dad's side and 7.5 on my mom's side - one uncle separated but never divorced, which was detrimental for her becasue she ended up with his debts when he died. Had she divorced him, she would have been free and clear of his medical bills, they would have died with him - the things you never think about.

 

My mother fared poorly with the first divorce but she did much better with the second, she basically got everythign though he didn't have to pay child support - not that he could, seeing how it's based upon how much he makes and he makes nearly nothing. My dad has languished because he expected to be taken care fo by taking custody of the five kids and that simply never happened. My mom is a single parent with two high school aged kids, and while all three of my parents/ex-step parent are on the poverty line, it is my mom who has attained a higher position.

 

Why? Because she woke up one day and realized she didn't want her life to be determined by a bozo man. She has taken repsonsibility for her own life, pursing work and school until she got to where she is now. She got there working long hours, and yes, her home life has perhaps suffered, but she has her independence and she's not wallowing in self pity. Any person who skips a decade of professional development without planning for the decade that comes next shouldn't be surprised when they get there and suddenly realize they have no plan for what comes next.

 

Perhaps you were raised on the notion that marriage is a love union; I've come to understand more and more that it is a business contract between two people. This being said whereas there are plenty of people who are very much in love who go decades without a marriage, while there are many more who are married solely for the financial benefits [tax benefits - I get about $1500 back on my tax retrun, my married with children friends get back closer to $5,000-7,000; heatlhcare benefits - my employer provides my family with a health PLAN; pay benefits - yes, if I got married, my housing allowance would automatically go up about $300 a month.]

 

 

I am single because I chose to stand off from relationships until I was in a position where I had financial stability under my own two feet - I believe a strong relationship is founded by two people who are each tendering a strong foundation under their own feet. I did not find this place until I was nearly 25. This being said, my "negative" attitude has saved me from the perils and pains I see in those around me. I desire a woman who sees me as her equal as I se her as my equal, and I have never yet had enough money in my life where I can ignore it and live in bliss. I do fear what might happen if I stay single for another 5 years, because by then I will have my own house and then the questions of property become even further compounded. naturally, if I do marry a woman who already owns a house [and this is becoming very common in my age group!], that is HER house, not my house, as it should be.

 

Getting married nowadays is like reaching into a box of snakes and pulling one out. You may pull a Garter Snake, or a California King Snake, but then again, you may pull a Rattlesnake or a Cottonmouth - this goes for both men and women. Unfortunately, you truly won't know what you've pulled until that dark hour when it's all been said and done.

[Reflective82]

Sorry, but I think your view points are wrong and the courts agree. You basically would have a woman limit her career to look after children whilst yours doesn't suffer, and then have her not be given half on divorce, which is wrong. You admit that these power positions and high pay aren't given out to people who have commitments eg children- and you're right. They aren't given out to WOMEN with children. The majority of men in these positions DO have children and they have a wife at home (or working but not full time) supporting them and doing the lion's share of the chores. So then if they divorce it's suddenly all HIS money- and not hers? Sorry, doesn't work that way. Money is not the only factor in marriage- the woman is enabling the man to get where he is and just because he may earn more of the income that doesn't mean she isn't entitled to half on divorce. Even half she still loses out, as he continues to make money whilst that half she is given is it- unless she gets another job but depending on whether she continued to work, that will not be as high a salary as it would have been.

 

If a woman's career suffers because of having children, which it does, then that needs to be taken into account on divorcing and she should be reimbursed for that- because they married on a premise that she would be supported in the marriage and if it breaks down, why should she have a way lower standard of living and struggle? Also, the woman most of the time gets the kids so if they are young, even if she does go back to work this will mean she can't pursue a full time career.

 

As a woman, I find these views extremley irritating. I have worked hard in my career and it will suffer when I have kids- a sacrifice I am willing to make. But I'm not going to be screwed over by some guy who doesn't think I deserve half if we divorce- I will definitely pursue this and it doesn't make me a "snake"- it would make the man a snake if he had your views.