Are You Sure NC is the Best Choice if You Neglected?

[eastonweston]

Let's say it's been 3 months since the girlfriend broke up with you. Not for another man, but solely because she got tired of your anger, controlling, need to always be right, and unwillingness to compromise. With a dash of neediness by way of sucking up all of her time and getting jealous and angry if she wanted to go out with friends.

 

Let's say she stated at the breakup that: "you need to fix you for you, not for me." And then said "it'll be a while before I can consider us getting back together; 6-8 months probably."

 

And then let's say about 1.5 months into the breakup, she says "you never chased me, you never woo'd me, you never came to me after fights to make up -- i had to do it all. i just wanted to feel chased and pursued for once, but you never would and never did -- even in the beginning, and that got our relationship off on the wrong foot."

 

Now let's say after 3 months of being broken up, but NEVER going NC for more than 10 days (one of us initiates, texts, etc), you would like a chance to show her:

 

1. How geniunely sorry you are for mistreating her.
   
2. How sorry you are for being rude and mean while she cried.
   
3. How much you want to "chase" her and romance her.
   
4. How much 14 sessions of counseling has created an awakening in you.
   

 

In this situation, is NC really the best move? Let's say she's kept lines of communication open, even initiates. Let's say she says things like: "I'm so very proud of the changes you're making."

 

If you were to go into NC, would she not think: "Great, that's him. I break up with him because he hurt me, and now he's just going to run away and be angry and not chase me or woo me. He'll never change."

 

The woman wants me to change, and show it. She wants to feel loved and cared for, not yelled at and belittled. She wants to be feel chased and romanced. Me walking away and going NC seems ... wrong.

 

Thoughts?

 

E.

[loveology]

As many have pointed out in this forum, NC is not a method for getting your ex back - it's a method of allowing yourself to heal and grow. If you really were angry, controlling, and needy in your relationship, I highly doubt that you've sorted all of those issues out in 3 short months. I think you should worry less about getting her back at this point and worry more about becoming a better man, so that if you ever DO get back together your relationship will have a chance at being successful.

[Jake_hope]

Go NC man, you need the time to actually change and in the future you are showing your change naturally. What you want to do now is "forced" change, the lost of her is making you want to change, not YOU wanting to change yourself.

 

Once you are able to let go, heal and change, then you can really "show it".

[eastonweston]

And so it's true that time and space away will make them begin to miss you? And not "well, he won't contact me, so I guess that's over. On to the next man." ?

 

She is a very sweet and reserved girl, so if she senses that I'm hurt and not contacting her, she'll never contact me out of fear of my being mean or bitter about the pain she caused me. She'd be more inclined to convince herself that I am moving on and that she might as well do the same -- if we take the view that she'd WANT to reconcile after observing changes. She won't dip into potentially treacherous waters like that, she wouldn't take the chance of conflict.

 

E.

[markie6]

NC runs the risk ... of doing both

And so it's true that time and space away will make them begin to miss you? And not "well, he won't contact me, so I guess that's over. On to the next man." ?

 

It does depend on how much you need to change... NC isn't a cure-all ... far from it. If I had recently been a dumper and my ex was to totally ignore me , it would play right into my hands, if I wanted nothing to do with them. It's often the best chance for everybody....for damage control.

 

If she wants you to be serious about addressing your shortcomings ( if indeed they are the only things you need to work on ) you will need the opportunity to show her, or at least let her see... who ever instigates is neither here nor there as long as it's not rushed. If you cannot keep your head, or any arguments occur when you speak to each other or meet up .... well NC would seem to be the best course of action. NIC probably better as you do seem to be on ok terms. If she wonders why you aren't contacting her , she might ask... at which point you can let her know you are trying to sort yourself out.

 

You should always be aware , you're heading into limbo if you are totaly set on changing yourself and getting her back. You won't know how long it will take, or even whether it will work... those are the risks.

 

NIC seems best given your circumstances imho

[PaintWithLight]

And so it's true that time and space away will make them begin to miss you? And not "well, he won't contact me, so I guess that's over. On to the next man." ?

 

She is a very sweet and reserved girl, so if she senses that I'm hurt and not contacting her, she'll never contact me out of fear of my being mean or bitter about the pain she caused me. She'd be more inclined to convince herself that I am moving on and that she might as well do the same -- if we take the view that she'd WANT to reconcile after observing changes. She won't dip into potentially treacherous waters like that, she wouldn't take the chance of conflict.

 

E.

 

You are over-handling and over-analyzing this whole thing. You need to leave her alone. Use this time to work on yourself without her floating in the back of your mind. Part of this process with allow you to truly evaluate the relationship. Right now, you are too wrapped up into it to even see clearly. Everything is run through the filter of having to be some kind of process which will bring her back into your life. NC means finding yourself, not running games to bring her back or guessing what her response will be to your NC.

 

What you are engaging in is just another form of your controlling behavior. You may have gained some insight but you need to dig deeper. There is still some obsessive and needy quality to your posting. You are not out of the woods yet. Please continue with your process and leave her alone. Really leave her alone. NC all the way.

[eastonweston]

Thanks very much Markie6. And I also really appreciate your advice on my previous thread.

 

As you know from my previous thread, my biggest enemy right now is my emotions, STILL, because when we do hang out, I still get either mopey or angry because of the sadness. For this reason, I completely agree with NC until my emotions settle down.

 

The bigger question is: how to handle a situation where the ex specifically said "you've never chased me." That makes NC tricky, in my opinion. It could be the final straw, of me being "in control" for the final time by "not coming to her after a fight."

 

I feel in my heart that either LC or NIC is the best choice right now. I want so badly to listen to thread after thread suggesting NC, and I get it. But we also need to make decisions for ourselves given our particular situation. Her and I had a 5 year relationship, we each have unique personalities that only we know (vs. strangers on a forum), and people need to keep this in mind. NC is a GREAT catch-all if you're completely lost, or the breakup happened a week ago. But I do think tailoring the advice to best suit your specific situation is smarter. It's the MINDSET behind the advice, not just the specific tactics.

 

Anyway, thanks again Markie. My situation is tricky because while she's told me she broke up with me because of my anger and need to control, and neglecting her the things she wanted to do, she's also told me that I became obsessed with her and needy (smothered her). It's kind of ironic, and contradictory. NC would improve the neediness and smothering part, but it could also mess up the "chasing after me" and "showing you care" part.

 

Hmm..

 

 

E.

[dasilver]

Personally (and this is just my opinion) NC is not every situation or every relationship.

 

If an ex has informed me that he does not wish to be in contact with me after the relationship is over and I still have strong feelings for him. I will implement NC.

 

I’ve only ever used NC as a tool to get over an ex who has made it perfectly clear that he does not want me in his life anymore.

 

If there are still some unresolved feelings between myself and my ex, or we both would like to reconcile, or my ex is genuinely sorry and has apologized for bad behavior. If the relationship was very good but ended due to uncontrollable circumstances. I will not go NC.

 

When a relationship has ended a period of space is always good for both parties (for reflection purposes and not as a form of punishment). However at some point, whether there is intent to reconcile or not... one must forgive, forget, let go and learn from the experience.

 

NC is not for EVERY relationship and doesn't have to be for the reminder of your life.

 

This is just my humble opinion.

[PaintWithLight]

Yes but not every relationship ends with such a clear cut sense of ending. Some relationships are toxic and the two individuals are wrapped up in a dance of leaving - pursuing - reconciliation which just goes on and on. These are the kind of relationships when they finally explode from negative energy, both parties realize that it was over a very long time ago and neither had the clarity or backbone to break things off permanently.

 

The OP has issues with anger, controlling behavior and neediness. He is a classic at risk for this type of separation dance. His ex has asked for time away and he is spending this time away from her continuing to fill his mind with scenarios involving reconciliation. NC would hopefully allow some clarity to this situation. With clarity might come the clear cut ending that you describe.

[becomingkate]

In your case, I don't think it would be wrong to call her up and explain that you're working on yourself, and you'd like to contact her again in a few months, if that's alright with her.

 

Take the time to go back to earlier relationships and see if you've been exhibiting the same behaviours as before.

 

During the two years following my husband's death I reflected on the past 15 years and realized that I had a major control issue due to my parent's alcoholism and the chaotic nature of my childhood. It impacted my marriage to my late husband, and I was afraid it would ruin a future marriage! My therpist helped me channel my control issue into more constructive persuits like organizing the home or office, although I still struggle to find a balance. It's helped to have a spouse that doesn't mind my bossiness and has enough guts to call me on something if I'm out of line.

 

Just the fact that your GF was honest about everything makes me believe you have a chance. I think that you can show her that she's appreciated (and wanted) and not just because you're lonely or afraid of being on your own. You'll want her because you're willing to work on the things that make a relationship good.

 

Taking a few months off from seeing or contacting her can be good for you both. If you happen to get back together, you can start with a clean slate and fresh boundaries.

[eastonweston]

Thanks, becomingkate . What I'm hearing from several of you is that NC is required right now, regardless of the "signs" I'm being shown. I do agree. Again, the trick is somehow showing her that I care and appreciate her, by "chasing her" and "wooing her" and not neglecting her, but at the same time I don't want this to show neediness or clinginess by smothering her again (I went through the begging and pleading thing for the first two or three weeks). So as you can see, there needs to be some type of fine balance to this.

 

My GF was VERY honest with why she decided to end it. She laid out everything, in a calm. mature, and productive way. There was no ambiguity or vagueness. I agree, becomingkate, that this seems like a positive sign that she is laying out the framework for what I need to work on before we're married.

 

Thanks for your thoughts, everyone. It's true that I haven't completely changed yet, but I've been in consistent counseling for three months and clearly see the problems and have extreme guilt for my actions. I only want to be able to work on these things while around her so that she can both SEE the changes and also not give up and move on to someone else.

 

This isn't about me wanting to CONTROL the situation -- although I can see how that can be construed. This is me saying "Listen, I made horrible mistakes, I was a terrible man, you shocked me into change, I've gotten help, and I want to be able to share the new 'me' with you, to treat you the way you deserve." It's only controlling the situation to the extent that I want to persuade her delicately to give me a chance to show her these changes.

 

E.

[PaintWithLight]

You seem to be running your recovery and time apart by constructing marching orders from HER, not you. You are mixed apples and oranges freely here. Statements made during the relationship after a fight or during a discussion may not apply during this separation period. You are giving each statement equal weight: "You never pursued me..." and "we need time apart". No wonder you are confused. The pursuing part does not apply now. The time apart applies now.

 

You are rewinding your shared history with her to find selective quotes or comments which will allow you to continue your needy behavior. The thing you should be focusing on now is to discover the root of your anger issues, your controlling behavior and your neediness. All these are from the same basic set of insecurities. You do not think you are good enough for her. And this might be true. You pull out the 5 years together as some kind of proof of validity but 5 years of controlling behavior and anger is not a successful track record. You were afraid the whole time of losing her, right? We might be strangers on a forum but there is nothing new under the sun when it comes to relationship cycles. Hundreds of people have gone through a similar situation. We are only trying to encourage self discovery and personal growth. We have no personal stake in whether you reconcile or not.

 

This cannot take place when you are mired down in continued mental review of your ex. This is your time. Get to know yourself so you can be a better Bf even if it is with a new woman.

[eastonweston]

PaintWithLight, I do understand what you're saying, and I do agree. But here are a few additional tidbits:

 

• I originally said after the breakup: "I'm trying to do what you asked and give you space." She said, "I didn't say I needed space, I said I wanted to be friends for now."
  
• She actually said to me AFTER the breakup, and yes, unfortunately during a fight after the breakup: "you'll never chase me, will you?" (after she started walking the opposite direction on the sidewalk and I walked the other way).
  
• She continues to say "I need us to be friends." I say, "I can't be friends with you." She says, "for now. I need us to be friends, for now."
  
• After the breakup, she said: "I just don't know how to do this, Easton! If I'm too close, you'll get comfortable and not complete your changes. If I'm too cold and distant, you'll give up and not complete your changes."
  

 

Do these things change anything?

 

E.

[PaintWithLight]

Follow the advice of Becoming Kate. You can let her know that you are working on stuff and agree to check back within a few months. Be confident and clear with her. Remember, she still has the echoes of the begging and pleading in her ears... You want to show that you are on your way to becoming a new man. Good luck!

[eastonweston]

I'd also like to add, both good things and bad:

 

• She has kept all pictures of us up on her apartment wall (saw this 12 days ago [3 months since breakup].
  
• Also 12 days ago, we had a good dinner and conversation after meeting by happenstance, and at the end she said "I'm scared." I asked, "scared of what?" She responded: "I just can't do this yet." This was clearly reflecting the fun night we had together, and a brief calm chat about our past issues and what went wrong.
  
• She did admit after the breakup that her emotional attraction to me is gone, that there is no spark right now. "I know you're physically attractive, but I just don't feel attracted to you in the romantic way now." She says it was because of my anger, stressing her out, controlling, being needy and clingy, and generally not being the 'man' I was when we first met.
  

 

E.

[Cope and Hope]

Over-analysing again sir. Just my humble opinion though. But it's your life so in the end you need to be the one who is okay with the decisions you end up making.

[HeatherB]

The problems your ex has with you would take you a very long time to change. Way longer than a month and a half. It's difficult to make over the basics of your personality and replace all your old automatic stress responses with new, healthy ones.

 

So there is a chance you could manage this. But it's not likely to be worth your time.

 

If you were to take a year away from her and really really work on yourself, leaving her alone the whole time, and then get back to her after you've proven to yourself that you have replaced all your old habits with new ones...she might have good reason to believe you and consider getting back together with you.

 

However, she doesn't want to be with you as you are today. Just realizing that some of your past actions were mistakes is not enough to prevent yourself from repeating them. That takes a LOT of work.

 

Your ex is actually being reasonable about this. She isn't expecting you to change yourself at all. She just doesn't want to be with you. If you undertake the quest to become someone else, there is still no guarantee she will want the new you. And there is no guarantee you'd enjoy being that new guy either.

 

Better to learn and move on. Only change the parts of yourself, if there are any, that you think need changing for your own happiness.

[AutumnBorn]

No, no, no. NC would be the worst thing you could do. She told you exactly what you need to do to win her back. Fail now and you'll lose her forever. If you've done the work you need to do, if you can be less controlling and more thoughtful, you need to pursue her with everything you've got without suffocating her and taking up all the oxygen in the room. Learn how to be romantic, too, but not canned romance (no candles, no poetry, nothing forced). It has to be spontaneous and genuine.

[eastonweston]

No, no, no. NC would be the worst thing you could do. She told you exactly what you need to do to win her back. Fail now and you'll lose her forever. If you've done the work you need to do, if you can be less controlling and more thoughtful, you need to pursue her with everything you've got without suffocating her and taking up all the oxygen in the room. Learn how to be romantic, too, but not canned romance (no candles, no poetry, nothing forced). It has to be spontaneous and genuine.

 

Wow, is this the first time that NC has actually NOT been recommended on eNA? AutumnBorn, these were my thoughts exactly, but everyone here seems to be in the mindset of NC, and I do understand why. But in this situation, she told me to my face exactly what I did wrong, why it bothers her, and she asked me to work on fixing it. Now I completely understand the other posters who say that I need MORE time AWAY from her in order to TRULY fix these issues, and THEN I can contact her. I fully, truly understand that logic.

 

However, do you think there's a chance that going NC -- even telling her why -- will make her begin to lose interest, if she was anticipating me to make these changes while we remain friends and stay in touch casually?

 

E.

[eastonweston]

AutumnBorn -- what would you define as pursuing without suffocation? Reach out to her once a week via phone? What are your thoughts on that?

 

E.

[BigSyke]

No, no, no. NC would be the worst thing you could do. She told you exactly what you need to do to win her back. Fail now and you'll lose her forever. If you've done the work you need to do, if you can be less controlling and more thoughtful, you need to pursue her with everything you've got without suffocating her and taking up all the oxygen in the room. Learn how to be romantic, too, but not canned romance (no candles, no poetry, nothing forced). It has to be spontaneous and genuine.

 

I agree, a perfect example on when you shouldn't go NC. If I were in the scenario, I would let her do the contacting, and I would certainly be on the defensive -do not talk about the relationship. You will tell her the most via your attitude change.

 

I'm 100% in the same situation. Neglected her, treated her like s***t. Once you get over that panic and emotional stage its easier to figure out the steps to grab their attention.

[AutumnBorn]

AutumnBorn -- what would you define as pursuing without suffocation? Reach out to her once a week via phone? What are your thoughts on that?

 

E.

 

 

NC is not a panacea. It's not even a tool for winning someone else back - it's about winning you back, giving yourself time to heal. You're on the fast track since you've been in counseling. That's a huge plus.

 

I recommend you make contact 2-3 times a week in short, simple ways that are all about her. Say, two texts, one call.

 

The first text should be something very short [like "Happy Monday, (insert her name here)"]. See if she responds. If she does, but doesn't respond in any significant way, tell her you hope she has a great day. If she doesn't, let it go for a few days. Then, you can send her a text that you saw something or did something that reminded you of her or something you did together that was fun. It's got to be all about her and good times, don't say you're sorry - show her by concentrating on her.

 

You can actually (I know this is way too radical - steel yourself) send her a funny card by regular postal service. That takes effort and it's something she can keep forever. Sign it in a witty way, maybe with a nickname or referencing an inside joke.

 

If she's receptive to the texts and responds, feel free to call her a day or two afterward and ask her if you can take her out for dessert (not dinner, too much of a chance to get back into old patterns or say something you'll regret) or coffee. If you have a dog, tell her you're going to be taking your dog for a walk in a park near her place and ask her if she'd like to join you. All talk should be positive and redirected toward her to show her you're interested in her, not yourself.

 

Truly read and absorb the Law of Attraction. (Did I post the link to how to attract your ex back? I can't remember.)

 

As you go about your life, start to learn something new, something that will expand her (and your) idea of who you are and make you more interesting - start to play a new instrument, get into digital photography (if you already are, it could be a great way to entice her to spend time with you - ask her to be a subject/model for you), or start taking language lessons. You can do all of these things for little to no cost with online tutorials, but it should be something you really would enjoy doing. Don't talk about it at first, just start doing it.

 

You really want to show her you're not as self-centered as you had been? Volunteer somewhere in a helping way - at an animal shelter, Habitat for Humanity, or some other worthy cause. You'll become a more well-rounded person and learn more compassion and empathy. That's actually very sexy.

 

When you do see her, make sure there's something a little different about you so she has a visual that you've changed a little. Nothing overly obvious, just something that will register subliminally. Maybe have your hair cut a little different or part it a little differently (or don't part it at all). It could be anything from how you dress to how you smell (wearing fragrance catches a girl's attention, believe me).

 

Also, you have to be positive and talk of the future, not the past. The relationship you had with her is over and you need to let it go completely. You want a better relationship, right? One that fulfills you both? If she brings up the past, tell her you're sorry you hurt her, but you want to concentrate on the future and how good it can be, not how bad it was.

 

It will take time and she may not trust that your efforts are sincere, but if you persevere, I think you can win her back since there was no betrayal in the traditional sense.

[BigSyke]

Most importantly figure out ways to plant seeds. Think shock and awe. Maybe contact her a few times a week and then stop, then contact her a week or two later and tell her your sorry for not answering, because you have been going through counseling or something. Think of seeds to keep her interested. Figuring out which seeds to plant is the fun part. After planted its all up to you how you want to put them into play.

[sharky988]

Wow, is this the first time that NC has actually NOT been recommended on eNA? AutumnBorn, these were my thoughts exactly, but everyone here seems to be in the mindset of NC, and I do understand why. But in this situation, she told me to my face exactly what I did wrong, why it bothers her, and she asked me to work on fixing it. Now I completely understand the other posters who say that I need MORE time AWAY from her in order to TRULY fix these issues, and THEN I can contact her. I fully, truly understand that logic.

 

However, do you think there's a chance that going NC -- even telling her why -- will make her begin to lose interest, if she was anticipating me to make these changes while we remain friends and stay in touch casually?

 

E.

 

NC has been recommended to you over and over. I think you're hearing what you want to hear at this point.

 

Best of luck with it, though -- I really do hope it works out for you!

[eastonweston]

NC has been recommended to you over and over. I think you're hearing what you want to hear at this point.

 

Best of luck with it, though -- I really do hope it works out for you!

 

Hey Sharky988 -- no no, I am just more confused than ever now, actually. I'm just glad to finally see someone else lay out a rational option for NOT doing NC, and someone else also agreeing. No Contact is the sole advice for every situation, and I don't believe things are that black-and-white. Again, I'm just interested in finally hearing an opposing view to the insistent NC advice that is almost copy/pasted for every single situation. I understand that NC is for healing. But then what? That's not the complete strategy for trying to rekindle a relationship. That maybe is the first step, used for both parties to cool down and get over the emotional high. It's been 3 months since our break up, and she has actually stated "I don't need space, I want to be friends, for now." Could she be using me to cushion her own fall, and I'm simply helping her to taper off of our relationship? Possibly, but these are the situations where we must use our best judgement.

 

Do I want to hear the advice be: "Yes, go talk to her"? Of course, but I am a lot more measured and disciplined than that. I understand my own bias. But it does help me see the other possible side of this.

 

Bottom line: I am still a little confused on which direction to go in.