Should I quit this relationship?

[LMJ]

I am seeking some help on a relationship that is exhausting me. I am currently in a long distance relationship with where my work is flexible enough that I am visiting a GF (known each other about 6 months/she is divorced) and this time around my visit is coming on 3 months in her town. Everything else seems great. She talks about the future as I do. I know her family well and spend a weekend night usually having dinner with her entire family – its fun. We are in touch (phone and text) daily as she travels a lot for her job and comes back to town for the weekend. Our relationship is very intimate, have been on a long vacation together and her family treats me well. What is bugging me more and more is she spends a lot of her time on weekends with her friends clubbing on Saturday night when we basically only have two days per weekend to see each other. Over the past three months, essentially the whole time I have been in town we have only gone out once on a Saturday night and that was with another couple. The other was a celebration event out of town that I planned for her. On several occasions I am made to feel like I am an option for her on Saturday night depending on her friends’ (all but one of whom are single) clubbing plans. One several occasions she says we can catch up later for a drink as she needs to do girl talk with her GFs but Im not contacted and end up going out on my own. On another occasion, she said she had to meet an out of town client (on a Saturday night) who needed some help and that we would met up for a drink later. That night I waited six hours and lost my patience after not being able to contact her at 2AM. We had a talk about this and though I trust she did not cheat on me I think it shows lack of respect for the relationship. Subsequent to that I received a “courtesy call” on a different Saturday night to join her and her friends for a drink but seems to me they were going to leave. Naturally I declined. We had another discussion about these Saturday nights to which the husband of the married friend said he agreed with me that she shouldn’t be abandoning me on Saturday nights. Yet she planned an outing again. Granted each time she makes amends to see me at other times like late Friday nights and on Sundays. Why is it that on what is “prime time” we are not spending any time together. One of her explanations is that she cherishes her GFs and they are the one who helped her though her divorce. I am an attractive and well to do guy who can get any woman. Yet I am also an incredible gentleman – maybe too much. Should I call it quits? Lately I have been feeling things have run their course. Want to hear from men and woman on this topic.

[mhowe]

I think she is taking you for granted. You are making the entire "effort" in this relationship. If she is treating you this way 6 months into it, imagine what the future holds. As you have spoken to her regarding this on numerous occassions, it comes down to this:

 

you teach people how to treat you.

 

You are "accepting" this behavior --- because you are still there. Tell her that if she cannot spend 3/4 of her Saturdays w/ you, especially if you are in town, then you are done. No one is asking her to give up her friends -- but to prioritize her weekends. And clubbing, for a woman in a relationship, seems inappropriate. How much "catching" up are the ladies doing in a club when you can't talk over the music?

[LMJ]

Thanks its nice to hear this from a femaie. Your thoughts have a lot of credibility IMO. Ive already told her what do you think a guy is to do if this happens every Sat night? That was weeks ago. I think this is running its course. Just that I want to make it work as their are sweet moments. I feel that post divorce somehow I am a rebound and a default guy while she hunts for more. At the same time she is not confident that I would stick with her as her husband cheated on her. We both come from relationships where our partners cheated on us. When I heard her story I made every effort to have full confidence in me but I dont feel the same with her actions. After the big first talk she said that I did not trust her. I feel its doesnt have much to do with trust or infidelity but more with making the other a priority on a night were we are both free and have little professional responsibility the next day. A consulation date on a late Friday or Sunday is just not the same. Also, Im the type of guy who thinks intimacy is important but just because are intimate doenst mean we are happy. Maybe its a different level of maturity on how a successful relationship should work. Want to hear more thoughts from guys and gals!

[luminousone]

I totally agree with mhowe but also wanted to add that I am wondering if she is an alcoholic. Alcoholics will put alcohol, alcohol related gatherings and alcohol buddies above any other relationship.

 

Regardless of whether or not she is an alcoholic, she clearly is not making your relationship a priority so I would walk away.

[Brian Floyd]

I agree with mhowe with regards to her taking you for granted; however, I do not believe it to be a malicious act stemming from a character flaw or anything like that. I think she just is not ready to fully commit to another relationship. She is enjoying the "single" life too much to settle down right now. But, when she divorced, she was lonely before she started being able to have fun, and that is where you came in. You eased her feelings of loneliness and enabled her to bounce back from the failed marriage. Unfortunately, being a "rebound" sucks.

 

Also, I highly doubt she is an alcoholic. I just think she needs to let loose for a while and have fun. An ultimatum, like the one mhowe suggested, is more likely to create animosity than solve the problem. She will settle when she is ready to settle. In the mean time, move on and take care of yourself. Maybe in the future when she has "grown up" you will be able to rekindle the old flame and develop a mature, balanced relationship.

[LMJ]

Brian you may be right. We have had discussions where she has said maybe I am on a different timetable. But I am not in a rush either as I want to be with the right woman. I think she waffles between committment and then on Sat nights presents herself to the world as a single woman. I mean from my perspective how many girls night out can there be. And Ive met her GFs so what is the big deal if I join at some point in the evening to have a drink too either by myself of with buddies of mine. Yet its too often an exclusive event. Im not exaggerating that I have not had a date on a Sat nught with her but once yet I am referred to as her BF. It's just illogical. Shes made comments like its nice to have intimacy again so maybe you are right that she is slowing rebounding off me. Shes also said that she doesnt know how to balance her GFs and being in a relationship. Just the other week she was excited to pinpoint the anniversay of or meeting date. The later she is talking about clubbing and how she wont be able to see me. Its baffling and frustrating. I took time off for a long time to rebound myself and certainly am not stringing her along. I dont want to push her and lose her yet at the same time how long can I go on like this? That's the deliema I deal with. Im certainly not needy but maybe the ultimatum and walking away is the solution or we should tone it down and just both date others. Want to hear more thoughts for you folks. This is really helpful to me in how to present this to her ultimately no matter what I decide to do!

[Brian Floyd]

I went through a very similar experience with one of my ex-girlfriends. I lived in Southern California and she lived in Northern California. She would point out special dates, called my folks "Mom" and "Dad", etc. etc. Yet, she was still going out and partying when I wasn't around. She doesn't want to lose you because she is afraid of feeling alone again so she points out important dates and does other girlfriend-type stuff to make you happy. And it does also make her happy. But then she places the relationship immediately on the backburner once Saturday night comes. She is manipulating you just enough to keep you around so she doesn't feel lonely (and because she cares about you). However, I maintain that this is not a character flaw, it is just a phase, and she will grow out of it and settle down. Until then, skip the ultimatum because they don't work, and move on.

[LMJ]

Brain Im glad you posted. In between my stays in town all this gal did was party. I used to get text messages from her. She always commented that she could be trusted. I do trust her and dont want to hold her back from fun but there is a point where one asks even when Im in town this cant be real. I do feel she cares about me. But at the end of the weekend I feel like I am just an option or saftey net for her. When something goes wrong in her life I get first call for support but when Saturday night comes around I'm manipulated. How do you suggest presenting to her a decision to move on if I decide to do so? I want another heart to heart talk with her. I need to find the right time to do so when there is a quiet moment between the two of us. Funny, Im a guy and Im not interested in being a booty call friend as I need to develop. All too frustrating to say the least.

[abitbroken]

If you are in her town three whole months, you can't expect her to spend 24/7 with you. If she has had a standing girl's night with friends for the past 7 year, lets say, and you come along, but she sees you all the other days, I wouldn't think it should be a problem. she shouldn't change it especially since you are in town for a few months and then leave. Maybe, however, spending time with her you are finding out you guys aren't so compatible. If she had a standing date for tea at the tea house with the girl's every week - would it be a problem also? Or is it just because its clubbing. I would just tell her that because you are in town, you are hoping that you could go out on a date saturday nights instead or be included with her friends when they go. But maybe you are not right for eachother.

 

btw - do you only see her friday, saturday, sunday when you are in town or do you see eachother frequently through the week? If you see her the 6 days and are upset you are not seeing her the 7th, then you need to loosen up, but if you can only see her 2 days, I can see what you mean. But maybe the point is because she is clubbing and you have moved beyond that is the point of incompatibility.

[Brian Floyd]

It's unfair to her to say this but yes, you are basically serving a purpose for her. When specific instances arise, she goes to you. But when she wants to go out and truly enjoy herself, it doesn't involve you.

 

If you decide to move on, which I think is the absolute, if not inevitable, conclusion to all this, then just be honest with her. Tell her that you are on two different timetables and that you are looking for something more than what is currently being exchanged. Just make sure you do not condescend her lifestyle or anything like that; do not give in and do not offer an ultimatum, trust me on this one.

 

Most importantly, end it on a good note and walk away. Stay in touch and let life do what it does best, go on.

[abitbroken]

It's unfair to her to say this but yes, you are basically serving a purpose for her. When specific instances arise, she goes to you. But when she wants to go out and truly enjoy herself, it doesn't involve you.

 

If you decide to move on, which I think is the absolute, if not inevitable, conclusion to all this, then just be honest with her. Tell her that you are on two different timetables and that you are looking for something more than what is currently being exchanged. Just make sure you do not condescend her lifestyle or anything like that; do not give in and do not offer an ultimatum, trust me on this one.

 

Most importantly, end it on a good note and walk away. Stay in touch and let life do what it does best, go on.

 

This is good advice - but when its over, I wouldn't stay in touch as she would just lean on you without seeing you. But I do think that the other part of this is is to not talk to the married friend to resolve conflicts with her or to gain an ally. It is between the two of you. I would tell her when it is NOT saturday night about how you feel in case she doesn't know and if she doesn't make some changes, then this is not the relationship you want.

[Brian Floyd]

This is good advice - but when its over, I wouldn't stay in touch as she would just lean on you without seeing you. But I do think that the other part of this is is to not talk to the married friend to resolve conflicts with her or to gain an ally. It is between the two of you. I would tell her when it is NOT saturday night about how you feel in case she doesn't know and if she doesn't make some changes, then this is not the relationship you want.

 

I completely agree. I should have said "later on in life, hopefully you can reconnect and see what happens".

That definitely brings up a dangerous, and common, situation: If the creator of this thread decides to break up with her and walk away, and it ends on a good note, then there is a definite possibility that he remains her go-to guy for life's problems. She will still call him because that is what she is used to. And often times, us dumb guys answer the phone calls from our exes haha.

 

As far as talking to the married friend, we don't know the context of the conversation to know how personal it was. I am sure that our thread creator keeps delicate issues in-house and maybe just grabbed a broad opinion from the only other person they know that is in a relationship. Then again, maybe he DOES need an ally lol

[LMJ]

I spoke to her. Im not good at holding back on what’s in my heart. I presented it as a positive thing to move the relationship along as I love her and I truly do. The reception wasn’t all that good. It was a range of things. She said I knew her lifestyle from the beginning and that it involved clubbing. She thought I would accept it and that Im completely different now. I said well I have nothing against it but would expect once a relationship develops that the importance of it would change. She added that she didn’t want to assume too much risk and that’s what her friends did and she didn’t want to lose them. I told her I knew they were important to her and even more so. My response was I want to be viewed as less of a risk. Then she said her efforts to see me were underappreciated. I told her they were very appreciated and even more so now in that I understand her better. I kept the tone as positive that the intent of the conversation was so that we communicate our respective needs better. She said she was not sure she wanted the pressure of another relationship but she wanted to try and I didnt understand her effort in balancing everything. The gal was in tears and I turned apologetic that that had happened emphasizing the positive intent of the purpose of the conversation. She said she didn’t want to see me at all this weekend and did not want to talk. Nothing made her change her stance and the conversation ended with her in tears. I feel very bad as it was just a heart to heart to get her to respect the relationship more. I do appreciate her efforts and more so than before. Anyway Im not sure where this goes. I really don’t understand how something like this moves the needle so far to the left rather than positively to the right. Im dumbfounded and very sad now.

[mhowe]

Sadly, because what you want is not what she wants.

 

And so, she would rather not have you than give up her lifestyle. You are rebound guy....and she wants to be divorced chick who hangs out in clubs.

[Brian Floyd]

Okay, just to clarify: You did not call to break up with her, you called to further define the relationship and to make sure she understood the seriousness that you are striving for, right?

[LMJ]

No I wouldnt do that over the phone. Would be classless. Purpose and repeated many time with examples was communication of thoughts would improve the success of a long term relationship. Emphasis was that it was presented with love. Hoever she didnt want to see me this weekend. Wasnt stated by her but I said I hoped to see her. Also she said she didnt want to talk but was in tears and thats how it ended. In some ways she said she felt a lot of pressure and didnt know how to deal with a relationship since it had been so long. I think shes confused and feels pressured. But thats not my intent. I wish I had this conversation in person. It would have been better. I just got carried away as it had bugged me. But I bugged me because I love her. Now I cant even work. Hard to concentrate. Why cant we just have a good understanding?

[Brian Floyd]

Oh didn't realize this was over the phone. Good, yes that would have been a horrible thing to do.

 

It is hard to give advice from here on out because I don't know her side of the story, know what I mean? It was definitely a tough conversation to have because you are trying to sugarcoat your accusations so that they sound less negative. But it usually doesn't work. What I do find interesting, is that you basically just told her that you feel that she isn't taking the relationship seriously because she goes out clubbing more often than hang out with you. She countered by accusing you of under-appreciating her attempts to hang out. So now, in response to all, she says leave me alone for the whole weekend, I don't wanna see you, I don't wanna talk to you.

 

When you guys first started dating, did she go out clubbing with her girls as often as she does now? More/Less?

[LMJ]

More but look Im forced to spend just a few hours when we are both exhausted on one of those nights. It jsut hard for me to understand why on a night when she is truly free I am discounted. In all honesty if I were an observer of this situation rather than one of the main actors I would say this isnt right. At least that is the instinctive inclination. But your point on it being a phase I do understand and perhaps discounted too much. Your responses are dead on though in terms of what you ask and your feel of the situation even if you were not around. I geuss its so similar to what you experienced. So should I bug off? There is a family event this weekend and my abscene would be noted by everyone. I dont want that as I feel its detrimental. I dont want her to think Im not interested. But Im not desperate enough to be in a situation where the gal clubs forever. IF the response is not one where we are going to work on our problems and I have emphasized that then that means there is no effort or willingness to understand on her part. Then Im left with no choice.

[abitbroken]

I think that she is not invested in this relationship. if she is consciously attempting not to get too involved, she is not. I understand not wanting to lose yourself and wanting to spend time with friends and that's fine, but to be obvious about it - taking "date night" and boozing it up with the girls is thumbing one's nose at you. Also, I would think after a certain age, one would mature beyond 'going clubbing'. You haven't said how old she is. But if she is over 22 or even maybe over 25 at the max - then really, its sort of time to grow up, or it is a sign of limited scope. its one thing to go out clubbing once in awhile, but if its your life, then one is not ready to have a serious relationship. I mean, if she really was just wanting to see her friends, the activity would rotate. To me, going to bars and clubbing every week is about keeping your options open. Its not like one night they do a movie, one night they go to a club, one night they go to a charity run, etc...

 

Now she knows how you feel - now you will see if she is willing to be invested or is holding part of herself back. if she still consciously decides to listen to her friends and not get too invested in you - move on. its okay that she sees them sometimes, but no game playing

[LMJ]

So things are at a standstill. Shes not receptive to communication. No one is asking her to give up her friends. I know she feels like it must be some sort of trade in that she has to give them up. She acknowledges she doesnt know how to balance it all. And the other main point is she said maybe she is not ready to shoulder the pressure of a relationship. After the remphasis on this I really believe her. But I have to say there are times where I say this is all crazy. All I am asking is that she move the needle forward. It seems to me her divorce devasted her and I am paying the price because I do love her.

[Brian Floyd]

Like I said before, it is hard to pinpoint what is going on in her head without actually talking to her. There is a decent sized chance that she is actually TRYING to get you to break up with her because she doesn't have the balls to do it herself. It is just a theory, but this seems to be a growing trend, these days.

 

Your situation is very similar to mine except she did end up cheating on me with one of my best friends (former best friend, I should say). She wasn't TRYING to get me to break up with her, she was just extremely self-absorbed, immature, and a hardcore alcoholic. And, oddly enough, she is now one of my best friends -- but we had zero contact for over a year before she finally got in touch with me and apologized, answered all my unanswered questions, and owned up to everything. So it is possible! lol

 

But yes, my advice is get out of there before you lose your mind. When she shows up at the club, it makes you look like a chump. And I'm not saying she is cheating, but going to happy hour or having a wine-and-movie night with the girlfriends is a LOT different than throwing on a mini-dress and hitting a club with all the single ladies.

 

Also, I probably would avoid the family event. She said she doesn't want to see you so I would honor that. Besides, if you DID show up, * * * * would just get awkward and put her family in a bad position because they would inevitably take sides with you or her. And that is not fair to her since it is her family.

[Ms Darcy]

I think you entered into this knowing who she is and now you are hoping she will change. People don't really change.

 

For your next relationship, seek someone with similar values.

[Brian Floyd]

I think you entered into this knowing who she is and now you are hoping she will change. People don't really change.

 

For your next relationship, seek someone with similar values.

 

I could not disagree more. People DO change. But change CANNOT be forced, nor should it be able to be forced. The person has to WANT to change, which is usually preceded by a NEED to change.

 

And if a person only seeks someone with the same values as themselves, then how can a couple learn from each other and grow together to become a stronger cohesive unit?

 

Seek whoever you find an attraction to and don't drag it out if it isn't working out.

 

AND NO ULTIMATUMS!!!!

[LMJ]

Bryan in reflection after the conversation, I can see her point of view. Also, in retrospect she does try hard to nurture the relationship. Other signals and actions also tell me I'm the guy she wants. The main issue is she doesnt want to lose her friends as they are the ones who suported her post divorce and before she met me. Im actually very different from the men he has met in the past per her and thats why the relationship developed. The issure here I believe is she still sees men as a risk. Kind of a lingering trauma from her divorce so she doesnt want to risk losing her friendships. Im patient because I do love her. The problem is she has shut me out now and I cant discuss things with her at the moment.

[LMJ]

I think she wants out. No response to me so far only something neutral as to being too busy.