EXGF has coldfeet! The end of the road.

[DaisyB]

I'm glad you're sending the letter, shocked&dismayed, if only because you said that you would. Even though she's your ex, keeping your word is still important (especially if you want her back). But it was a good decision to wait a week before sending it. Try to keep it as short and calm as you can.

 

After sending this letter, though, I still think you should try to go at least a month with no contact. (I'm sort of amending my past advice to you.) If she contacts you and you want to reply, I think you still can, but keep it very short and light. No relationship talks. After a month -- maybe -- you might want to initiate some light contact, depending on how you feel and how the month goes. . .

[shockeddismayed]

Good points Daisy...

 

Especially agree about resuming NC after some type of response to her.

 

Keep you posted.

[myJoy]

s&d,

 

i wish i read your post earlier so i can provide my 2 cents. i've been absent for a while trying to "keep busy" w/ my life. part of my process.

 

anyway, i said i wish i read it sooner because i would have advised against you sending the letter. you said you thought by doing so she would be able to focus on herself. the truth is she would only begin to figure herself out at her own time - when she is ready. it wouldn't matter that she is constantly worried about you. you also mentioned you want her to know you moved on. one of the classic mistakes we make is that we like to tell our ex how we've changed, or will change, or how we're moving on. these are versions of manipulation. the best method is to move on ourselves & let them see it through our actions.

 

however, following your thread, it looks like it went ok. on any letters you plan to write, i would suggest sending a card instead on occasion. keep it really simple. i do believe you've handled your situation well, & have kept a good presense of mind on your goal & not allow your emotions to take over. keep up the contact - so you can establish these positive moments w/ her. however, try not to be too available. you want to strike a fine balance. i'm pretty confident you're going to come out of this fine.

[shockeddismayed]

Updates:

 

1) Sent my response... it was treading the "fine line"... had it proofread by a few friends to make sure it wasn't too much (in their opinion). It basically said that "yes, while I miss you, I am doing things for myself... your letter seems to be asking me to wait indefinitely, can't promise that I will... I'm focussing on my own happiness".

 

2) 2 days later (today) I got a 7am phonecall... she was crying. She had a nightmare that I was upset... crying... had to call to see if I was ok. Despite being woken up by the call, I kept my game on... said I was doing well... told her work was great. Asked about her school... she said she was distracted.... not much else said, she apologized for calling, I said "no prob" and then said I had to go get ready for work.

 

3) 7:45 she emailed this: "As you can see that nightmare has to due with guilt and loneliness... so likely more about me than you. However, thank you for indulging that phone call for me. I won't put you in that position again... at the very least I'll "check in" by email, allowing you the option to respond (if) how you want to."

 

Advice... strategies? I'm thinking "leave it be".... but I don't want her to feel like she can't try to contact me... I want her to try... and then not be able to reach me. Isn't that what I need to happen?

 

PS: In my summary of her last email, I forgot to mention a paragraph where she starts off with "if we do get back together, it has to be on equal footing... etc... etc. " Not sure if that changes the gist of the message, or gives more insight into where she is?

[Ambiguous]

Hey S&D,

 

That is a very good sign that she called you after having a nightmare. The way I see it, she is now realizing that you are not readily available to her anymore, that her actions have consequences... and that she needs to think long and hard about her relationship with you. (whether it be friends or more)

 

At this point, she is testing the waters by saying she is not going to call and she'll give you the chance to decide whether or not you are going to respond back. I guarantee that she knows you will respond, and that you do want to talk to her... you do want to be with her, etc. But it's almost like a power struggle. She wants to hear it from you, so that she can get the comfort of knowing you are still there for her, that she still has you to fall back on. The fact that you are telling her things are good, you're really busy, etc etc.. is scaring the hell out of her. Trust me, I've been in her position. She feels like she is losing you, and in a sense she has lost you at this point in time. In your heart you know you are still here, and that you still love her, but she does not need to know that right now.

 

My advice is to keep doing what you're doing. Don't cut off all contact with her, just carry on with your life, and when you do talk to her, keep it positive and let her know you are OK. The worst thing you can do is show you are weak and lonely and unable to live without her. Because then, she will take you and everything you guys had for granted.

 

Take Care, talk soon.

[Ambiguous]

One more thing... I read a lot of what myjoy went through, your situation is somewhat similiar. He has posted some really good ways to get through a break up and possibly get back together...You may have already read this, if not check it out:

 

link removed

Strategy for Getting Back Together w/ Your Ex

[shockeddismayed]

Thanks Ambiguous...

 

I appreciate your advice.

 

I have read MyJoy's strategy... I agree... it is really good advice.

 

I have now been out of the house for 7 weeks, and haven't seen her in person for 4-5 weeks. I know that she is still thinking about me, but I am anxious to get to the point where she'd accept at least seeing me for a coffee, or something fun. I haven't asked of course.

 

My biggest worry is that even though she admits that she might want to try again, she hasn't said "now", so I am left wondering "when". Was I meant to take the initiative on this? I'm thinking not, but I worry that she'll wait until she has miraculously fallen back in love and gotten "sure" about being married before she'd even call and ask for a date.... how can that happen if she doesn't even see me?

 

I'd rather we start things slow and try and work from there... I'm not hoping for "forever" right now... just a chance to be on equal ground and be willing to try.

 

Do you mean that I should be calling to see her? Or where you just saying "respond to her contact... but remain aloof". All of this reminds me of the "security tennis" thread. I have the ball today, but no clue how to respond.

 

At the moment, I feel like emailing:

"Don't worry about it... it was no big deal" hoping that would let her know that I am open to hearing from her, but that I'm not killing for it.

 

What do you think?

[Ambiguous]

Maybe you should just email or ask her if she wants to out for coffee.. keep it simple.. and don't get too serious in conversation unless it feels right. I think you have a point.. if she is the type of person that is waiting for that moment when she falls back in love with you to react, and you're point is that if you guys never see each other, how is that going to happen? True.

 

That's why I don't think you should cut off all contact. Maybe suggest going to a public place, just to hang out for a while, with out getting overly serious. Let her know that you care, and let her open up to you, without spilling out your guts to her. Try and keep it positive on your part.. but start slow. (you had also mentioned earlier that your optimism is what she really liked about you, be as optimistic as possible without overdoing it ) It really does sound like you both care deeply for one another. Don't sever all ties. Keep the lines of communication open.

[shockeddismayed]

Ambiguous thanks again for your thoughts... I agree. Some small contact would be nice (for me) and would be a way to get her to see where she is at when faced with me.

 

This is a question for anyone else out there who'd like to chime in.

 

Putting aside me (and my self actualization, etc).

 

When is it OK to re-initiate contact?

 

Are the signs she's been giving me recently enough? Or are they just signs that NC is working?

 

Quick Recap:

1) First discussion Feb 20.

2) Moved out Feb 29

3) Last tearful hug and last time saw each other March 13

4) Last "Us" discussion on phone April 2

5) Moved out final things April 4 --> Led to her feeling very down/panic

6) Shared writing with her April 5

7) April 8: Received reply which included "if we do get back together..." , "If I still feel this way in a while, I'll want to try again, but I need to give this time...", "I did push through this quickly and am now feeling its impact" and "I really miss you" statements (see page 3)

8 ) I sent reply late night on April 14 which said "I'm recovering for ME... no promises to anyone else"

9) Receive crying phonecall morning of April 16. She was crying about her dream... very apologetic for calling. I calmed her down and stayed positive.. cut it short. She later emailed again apologizing... blaming it on her "guilt and feelings of loneliness". I emailed back a very short "don't worry about it".

 

That's basically it.... so while the contact by email/phone has been kept up, neither of us have seen each other in some time. This modified NC appears to be working... but I need advice on when I can safely try and re-establish some "positive moments together".

 

If I'm confident in myself, is it still too early? My big worry is that she is so worried/guilty about hurting me, that she won't initiate things until something unrealistic happens (she gets SURE about our future). I feel the only way for her to be sure is for us to reconnect.... its a vicious circle.

[shockeddismayed]

Anyone?????

 

Today would have been our 7 year aniversary.... man this feels SOOOOO wrong.

 

I haven't contacted her since her tearful phonecall to me last Friday (5 days)... except to email "don't worry about it".

 

I feel like I might be letting a window of opportunity pass me by. Her heartfelt but confused email (where she is considering trying again) was two weeks ago, but I didn't push on that... if anything I may have made her think that I'm not ready, or that I'm angry. Then when she called crying, I kept things so abrupt that she might have thought I was angry... when in truth I was just groggy.

 

In my dream world, I want to call her to do something fun (a hike in the (finally) spring weather).... then wait a bit and ask to take her to dinner for her birthday (two weeks from today) where I could re-create our first really romantic date from seven years ago. But I'd need to contact her about the first "ice-breaker" soon.

 

Anyone? Feris Bueller? Anyone?

[DaisyB]

Hey, S&D. . .

 

Here's what I might try. . . lay low for a little while longer, then when it gets closer to her birthday, tell her you'd like to do something with her for her birthday and suggest hiking. That shows you still care about her enough to want to do something for her b-day, but you're still "aloof" in that you aren't suggesting anything overtly romantic.

 

Judging from her phone calls and emails, it sounds like she loves you and misses you, but she's still not sure what she wants. I think she might be scared off by anything TOO date-like, but a nonthreatening meeting -- especially if you say you want to do it for her birthday -- might be casual enough for her to accept.

[MC]

Shocked&dismayed,

 

Here's my take.

Why should you be the one asking her out? Is it because you're the guy? If she really wants to meet you wouldn't she request it? She left you, buddy. If she wants to get you back she'll have to make some effort.

 

You need to ensure that you're in the driver's seat. Give her some attention only to hint that you still care and then leave things hanging. Make her think.

 

Asking her out is very risky. If she turns you down you're back at square one. Do a little no contact to make her miss you a little more.

 

Think of yourself highly. Put yourself before her. She threw away a good thing and she is the one who has to make most of the effort now. Don't be totally distant to make her think that there is no chance of you guys getting back together, but at the same time, don't be too available.

[shockeddismayed]

MC,

 

I know what you are saying... but here is the problem.

 

There is NO WAY for me to be ¨available¨ and give any sort of indication of how I'm doing... I live in a city with a million people, and we have no common connections. She's in school, I work. I now live on the opposite side of the city, etc.

 

It's not like I'm going to bump into her. I either initiate contact, or wait indefinitely for her to figure out whether she's ready to be married to me.... that is how all this started. Our 7 year relationship went (COMPLETELY WITHOUT WARNING) to heck when she panicked about my impending proposal. And we'd both been planning/talking marriage for a long time. We'd even made a wedding list!

 

Do you think I should just sit and wait when she's said that she is having second thoughts? Ugghh. That's no fun.

 

I want her to get off this committment fear and just hang out with me... no pressure. I DON'T want her to be thinking long term about our future right now... there is no way she can decide that by sitting on the sidelines.

[MC]

I see what you mean. But you've got to take things very slow and see what happens. I wish you all the best buddy.

[shockeddismayed]

Oh dear...

 

I had the most terrible down day yesterday (Friday).....

 

I had decided to delay (at least) sending an invitation to do something light... not that I'm convinced it was a bad idea, but I thought about how much better I would feel if SHE made the effort to ask, and that I might not have given her enough time to do that yet. I also just didn't feel I've been in the right headspace to make it happen. I've been down/anxious all week as I wait to hear from her (last contact was still her tearful phonecall about the nightmare, now 8 days ago)... all of her talk about "I'll want to try again if I still feel this way in a while" has had me on the edge of my seat wondering how long a "while" is. I've been so wanting to do something to stimulate some sort of response... to see how she is feeling. Ughhh.

 

Anyway, so yesterday I was feeling down and impatient. Then I happened to drive by our place on my way home from a worksite... I noticed her/our car was not in the driveway. It was 6:45 and she finishes class on Fridays at 2pm. Immediately I wondered "where is she". My mind was racing... oh my gosh I thought... she's gone away for the weekend to see him again... he probably isn't out of the picture! (Even though I have no basis for this one way or the other).

 

I was feeling so terrible... but managed to say ok when a friend asked me out for a beer... I tried to put her out of my mind as we went to a cool pub for some live music and Guiness... but obviously she was still stuck in my head. It was nice to be out though, and I tried to say to myself "Self, you need to make some friends in this city and go out more... you enjoy this... and you need to make the most of this time... remember, you were having wander-lust too, so why not have some wild times while you can... if you get back together with her, you'll regret not having some fun... and you'll resent her more b/c of it."

 

I really tried to stay up and on that train of thought, but it was no use. I even did a stupid/borderline psycho (and I am normally well adjusted) and realized that I'd bumped my phone in my pocket and it was set to call "Home" (our house) by speed dial... I was drunk and said what the heck and let it ring... didn't say anything on the voicemail, just let it seem as though I'd accidentally called so I let the bustle and music of the bar be recorded before hanging up. What a dummy...

 

By the time I got home and checked my email (empty). I just lost it... cried so hard I'm sure I dehydrated myself (even more than the beer already had)... I was crying so hard that I stopped making noise (I'm sure some of you know what I'm talking about). It was so terrible.

 

Today I've felt down most of the day too... although a call from my sister helped... she said "why would you assume that this guy is more than just something she needed to try on as part of the process? I mean you'd have heard if she were dating him... and the fact that she sent you that letter about possibly getting back together implies that she has put him out of her mind and is focussing on deciding between you and being single, not you and him. And besides, you've been away almost every weekend spending time with friends/family. I'm sure that is what she is doing.... in fact the information you have is that she is trying to make a difficult decision about whether to try again or not. Where would she go to make that decision?"

 

I told my sis I knew exactly where... home to her parents house... to her childhood room. I also realized that her brother has just finished school and was probably moving home this weekend (he goes to the same school), she probably took her car too to help him carry things.

 

It seems reasonable? What do you guys think (other than I shouldn't waste mental energy on him EVEN IF he is still in the picture)?

 

Also... can I simply sit here in limbo? Should I try and re-initiate contact even if it means rejection... . If she accepts, I won't bring up the relationship... but if she doesn't.... even that would be some closure

[shockeddismayed]

I'm trying to write the short version... it is difficult. Here is my third attempt.

 

1) 6:00pm Met at the drug-store by chance. I was aloof at first, wished her well and went about my business, but she waited for me outside.

 

We started light, but then she tried to talk about our relationship.... EVERYTHING came out (including the other guy... who as it turns out, is interested in her, but she is waiting to figure things out about me first... and said she new it might be a rebound.. that maybe he just represented "other options" in general in case she needed to feel that she wouldn't be alone forever... of course, she could just be saying that b/c she doesn't want me to give up on her).

 

It was good... we were both calm (she cried, but I did not). The impression I left her was that I would be moving on... and she left me with "I'm trying to figure things out". We left things open to talk more, as the conversation wasn't finished, and I had to run to "go out". To which she said "with who" and I chuckled and said "does it really matter". She was stumped. She mentioned that I looked good... that I looked confident.

 

2) I called at 10:30 (I know, bad move... ). We talk again until 12:30. Hit some common ground on what went wrong with "us".. part of which we both agreed, was her worrying that I didn't love her enough, so she got silent and would say/do passive-aggressive things to make me angry... that got me resentful... which circled back as her feeling I didn't love her enough, and so on.... all of this led to fights, in which she says she felt like she lost her voice. She's not quite ready to try again b/c she hasn't had time to see what her heart feels now, and doesn't feel she's totally regained her voice... I say I'm pretty close to giving up, that I don't know how much more patience I have.

 

I challenge her ability to learn anything more than she already does from dissecting the past... and tell her that she has to get over her fears of the future, ... no one can predict it. We talk about it being a leap of faith... and that if she can't follow her heart, it won't make a difference whether it is me or anyone else. She agrees, but says she doesn't know yet how to make sense of this and that she is trying to sort through things. I tell her it sounds like she is trying to analyze things now, where she refused to before. I say "when all of this started... you wanted to follow your heart, which was saying you needed a break. All attempts for me to rationalize things were rejected by you... you said "you can't try and explain this away". Now you are telling me that your heart misses me and you still love me but you are trying to rationalize the relationship by saying you don't know about the future... you need to choose a strategy... if relationships are about the heart, then you made the right decision at that time... but now your heart is saying something else... you need to find out what it is saying soon, or it will be too late." This impacts her.

 

We leave the conversation with me telling her she'd better start making her own space a priority... she's had plenty of time, and she stands to lose at least as much or more than I do. She asks how, and I say "cuz I've used my time wisely to get to the point where I could close the door on you if I needed to... and from what you've told me, you aren't close to that... if anything, the direction you are moving slowly toward is opening the door... I could be long gone and happy by the time you get there." She says I know... but I'm not at a decision point yet... I challenge her and say "maybe you aren't going to get the epiphany you think you will... maybe you are just going to miss me as you are now, and need to take the risk to try and work it out... maybe you should stop trying analyze and revive our old relationship... it is dead, I won't go back to it, and neither should you... you need to focus now on what your heart wants... not what happened... and not what might happen."

 

3) She called this morning, and I didn't pick up... she called ten minutes later, and I did. We had another long conversation, which was left with her saying "S&D you are so good to me". We left things at her needing to figure out her heart and do it quick. She said "so I need to figure out my heart, and then ask you to do something fun". And I replied "yes, or you need to ask me to do something fun, and figure out your heart"... "there is no recipe... you could wait for that moment of clarity in your heart, and by the time you see it, you've skipped on past it like a stone on flat water and you are left with nothing". She said she really heard me, and said that I've given her a lot to help her make a decision.

 

I don't feel hope.... but I feel good. I got some things off my chest... I got her wondering.

 

I know that this BROKE ALL THE RULES.... but I couldn't help it. I felt strong... I felt comfortable and strong this morning... I almost believed all of the stuff I said about losing my patience with her, and that I do deserve better. It isnt' that I don't believe it... it's just that I know how confused she is... I know I had a good handle on putting her there, and that if we'd both been more self-aware, we'd not have come to this place. So I believe I will have better.. that we both deserve better... I haven't ruled out that it could happen together.

 

Any advice... I don't feel I've fallen off the wagon, but you may think so. It's now 8 weeks since we broke up... and I handled myself cooly in the conversation. She was the one who was crying, while I kept a level head, and a kind... yet removed.. demeanour.

[SincerlyHurt]

You must know that you did not break all the rules, there are no rules. When we can get our ex expressing their thoughts the way you have that is always progress and always makes you feel stronger. Your situation is similiar to mine a couple of weeks ago when my ex broke down on me and cried for hours. And I do believe it was you that said your relationship is about two weeks behind mine, if that is the case you may not want to read my thread anymore.

 

What has happened to you is good, you are getting somewhere at least. That is always better than sitting still administering no contact. The more I think about it no contact is only for us, it really is pretty useless as a getting back together strategy, unless you are using it in the beginning to gain back your dignity.

 

Know that you will come off this high and will crash, I did, so you must be ready for it. Right now you feel like you have made leaps and bounds but don't get overconfident, she may recoil like mine did. You must have learned alot from my thread, use my examples as what to do, or not to do.

 

This is good news, I am happy for you. Keep us posted.

[shockeddismayed]

Thanks Sincerely,

 

I did say I was about 2 weeks back of you.... and thanks for injecting the humour. I appreciate that.

 

But in your case, I have to admit (and I've still been following), that I DO think you are better off without her. I really believe that. I think you are ready for the excitement of something new..... and as we agreed. She doesn't drink beer.

 

In my case, the truth is that I feel I am much more attached than I let on to her yesterday and this morning... I mean we mountainbike, snowboard, listen to music, walk, hike, DID EVERYTHING together... and not just by force of habit. We were best friends before it turned romantic.

 

Anyway,... I know that I will crash. I'm trying to prepare/postpone for it.

 

I also know that she may recoil... infact we had a frank talk about it. I told her that I was breaking all the rules of "getting your ex back", and that I didn't care... I'd much rather just be honest with her (and truthfully, I wasn't completely honest... I gave her time impression I could walk away easily... but I haven't built up the external support mechanism for that yet... at least not locally).

 

I guess I chose that strategy cuz I don't think I can out-game her. So I might as well say... "all the experts say you'll recoil now that we've spoken" and have her say "screw the experts, I'm my own person" in the competitive way that I know she will.... besides, she's training to be a psychologist, already with a course in relationships, so she has more access to things than I do.

 

One other thing we discussed, but I didn't mention, was that her biggest fear is that we fall back into our old patterns... her biggest worry was our fights. I made some really good headway by saying "how are we doing". She said "huh"? And I said "we're in what is the BIGGEST fight a couple can have... we've been at it for 8 weeks... we've done plenty to piss each other off... yet we are still here... we are still talking... we haven't raised our voices at each other since the first 2 days of the breakup... we're listening to each other.... how are we doing?".... big silence... then a soft sigh and she says "I see your point".

 

I guess I'll have to start really living my lie. See what comes from this and go from there.

[DaisyB]

Oh S&D, I think you've done well. Very well.

 

I absolutely would not worry about "breaking the rules" (after all, she's a psych major!) and instead concentrate on what YOU need to do. You laid out your feelings, but did it with dignity. I don't think there's anything wrong with letting her know you want her back, but also letting her know that you won't wait around forever. Pointing out the "fight" was an especially nice move.

 

I have no idea what she'll do now, but I think you need to keep doing what you're doing. It sounds like she's truly committed to making a decision (one way or another), I just don't know how long she'll need to do it. If she's anything like my ex, it could be months. . . the good news is that she is thinking, hard, about what she wants to do next. You also both seem to be listening to each other very well, which is crucial.

 

What did you decide to do about her birthday?

[shockeddismayed]

Daisy, S.H.,

 

Thank you both for responding. It helps.

 

S.H. : The crash came today (wed)... manifested as complete mental confusion... couldn't do crap at work. I couldn't wait to get out for a run.... that helped. I needed to sweat those toxic feelings out.

 

Daisy... no plan yet for the bday, I mentioned I might be willing to accept a hike with no relationship talk if she was interested... I will get a card... and a CD of an artist that she's been quoting. One line she quoted was "we could end up broken hearted, if we don't remember how all this started. Cupid only misses sometimes"

 

So the update from Tuesday morning's conversation is only this:

 

1) We had spoken about a card she sent for my birthday a year or two ago that called me "the one" by comparing me to a choice coffee bean... and her to a coffee maker. She asked me to scan and send it. So I sent on Tues evening... along with a short two liner about "it seems like we're starting to get our voices back (she'd said she's not quite there yet), as evidenced by the fact that we were able to listen to each other. Told her it was nice to HEAR her again. Closed with "take care of yourself"

 

2) Tonight her response: "Thanks for the card, it made me smile. I'm starting to take care of myself, a beer with (her bro) helped"

When I got the email, she was on msn... she'd have seen me sign in. I didn't respond yet... or msn her. She was on for about 30 mins before signing out.

 

Not sure how/when I should respond. There may be some merit to not responding, but it could backfire too... especially since we are communicating again. She is off to the cottage with girlfriends this weekend... has agreed she needs to get some time away in a canoe so she can sort through her tangled heart. I know that her email also made a point to say "i'm working on it", which you could *almost* say is her trying to buy herself some time... but more to alert me that she heard my suggestion that she figure things out before it is too late. I had a friend (female) suggest that maybe it is time to send some indication that I still love her... that it might have been lost in the drama.

 

My current evil plan is to not respond to her email until Friday afternoon... likely she won't get it, but it isn't so late that if she is expecting a response, she'll be mad. She will leave for the cottage, worried about whether I'm "gone"... I'll be on her mind... she'll maybe even cry with her girlfriends (most/all of whom really like me... she told me they all squealed when she told them we'd been ring shopping), so that could work in my favour. Then when she gets back Sunday she'll get this little boost:

 

"EX. I'm glad I put a smile on your face.... you have a beautiful smile. I'm also happy your getting the time to take care of yourself. Enjoy your downtime at the cottage. Me"

 

Whatdya think? Timing? Content? I'm trying to tread both sides of the fence here.

[Sli]

Hi S&D - finally had a chance to read your thread.

 

It's great that you 2 are communicating again. It would be nice to be in your shoes, I've still been in 2 minds about what to do since your kind response to my post.

Anyway looks like things are going quite well for you, you have really made her stop and think about the situation, flipping negatives into positives, like when she brought up the arguments, etc (a psych student too! much Kudos to you). . You have also instilled a sense of urgency, it seems she feels as though she is working to some sort of time frame, but bear in mind if she keeps 'buying time' she may eventually have to have proof that you mean what you say before she feels any real sense of urgency/loss.

 

For now I like the response to her email… smooth! I think you are playing this well, but always keep a safety valve in place, a tool to remain aloof, everything happens for a reason so tell yourself you are ready to let go at anytime, are you still working on yourself? What about the Ex Ex? Are you keeping all options open?

 

Sli

[shockeddismayed]

Sli,

 

Yeah... thanks so much for the response. Don't worry about not having communication. I had to wait a long time for mine to happen. I mean we were in contact earlier... but she was not listening much at all. Probably neither was I... it seems now that there is some hope... but it is JUST as difficult to deal with it.

 

I agree with your point... I need to keep my hand on the eject button. I'm trying to do that... but it is ever so tempting to rush back whole heartedly and say "Oh dammit... I was just kidding about moving on... I love you and want you back". But... I am trying to exercise retraint.... trying to guess at the right amount of encouragement and the right amount of pressure/urgency to instill. Obviously I don't want her to rush a decision... I just don't want her to delay thinking about it... or to just say "oh damn, he's gone, I better wallow in self pity and grieve his loss... or just get so busy that I don't have time to think". Knowing her like I do, she is just as likely to do either of those things.

 

Yeah... the psych phd thing is a bit daunting. All of the girls she is going to the cottage with are psych phd's too... and they are all already at the point where they've been seeing REAL patients, so I'm sure they will be all too ready to give her 5 different opinions on things.

 

I met my girl when we were both studying as psych majors, but I made the switch to business... so I only have my basic knowledge, some negotiating skills (which have done more HARM than good), and my intimate knowledge of her to arm me.

 

Oh and my friends on Enotalone! This place is amazing!

 

I hope that is enough.

[shockeddismayed]

Sli... by the way... no word from the EX-EX in a week.... she had an exam coming up, so I've left her be.

 

Latest updates:

1) I didn't get a chance to send my response, as when I got home tonight (thurs) there was already another... longer... email. basically: i) she wanted to agree that our conversations were "owed to each other" ii) wanted to say it was a big shock to see me... got her realizing she needs to make her thoughts a priority, iii) her friend got her thinking that no-one can hold a clock over her head. iv) mentioned focussing on sorting out the moments when she is feeling of "S&H is the one" but is also tempering it with her thoughts that she's worried she can't accept my faults, and that I deserve someone who can. v) wants me to explore whether I can deal with her faults. vi) closes with "I know you may not want me to email you.. feel free not to respond, to delete it, to tell me to F-off."

 

2) she's going away with those psych girls tomorrow, so I couldn't let her go away with that negative headspace... 4 girls, all of whom are "over-analyzers" all sitting alone in a cottage..... could be disaster! So I called... we had a nice chat... I started by letting her lead... said I wasn't sure what she was getting at with some statements, so i let her explain. we talked more about our issues... I agreed wth them... told her it was the right decision to "stop the snowball". She said that relieved her to hear that... I said that I knew the next snowball would be better whether with her or with someone else... that this downtime was about "catching up" on our personal growth... assimilating our experience over the last 7 years from 22-29. She also finally acknowledged that our impatience with each others faults could have more to do with the resentment caused by our fears... and less to do with "us being a poor/doomed match". I'd been hoping to get her to HEAR this part for a while.

 

Followed that up with "our patterns were set at age 22, and in my next relationship, whether it is with you or someone else, the patterns will be set at 29..." She ate this part up. I could feel the ice melting. We talked more about how she truly realized that "If it is meant to be, it will work out, but ONLY if you use your time wisely". She said she realized she needed to do that.

 

I said cool.... suggested again that I've been happy to have this time to sort myself out. Asked her not to get trapped into her decision... realize it was what needed to happen in February... that May brings other decisions based on what she knows and feels... she agreed and said she's trying to do that.

 

She said she's been feeling as though I'd been "willing her" to hear certain lyrics in songs. I told her I had actually prayed for her to listen to that Jack Johnson song that she quoted "we could end up broken hearted, if we don't remember why all this started".

 

The conversation turned lighter then, I joked about being stiff from a run... we laughed about something in her day that happened.... and she admitted that she's been so stressed about us that she's replaced yoga with cigarettes (and she doesn't smoke). She gave the impression she is having a really tough time... and I gave the impression that I am focussing on being healthy.

 

I closed it positively (tender good-nights), but not before she said "so I'm going to keep contacting you when I feel like it... even if you don't return my contact... even if you tell me to F-off... and until you call the cops". ANd I said that's fine... I'll answer if I feel like it... and if I don't, it isnt beneath me to call the cops and have you charged."

 

All in all... pleased with the chat.

 

Now to shake it up and be "too busy" next time she calls.... that's even better than an F-you.

[shockeddismayed]

Hey Again,

 

For those who have been following my little drama here (and anyone else for that matter), I wanted to throw something out there for your thoughts.

 

It is now sunday... she has been up at the cottage with her girlfriends all weekend. I'm sure I have come up as conversation a lot. She is still very confused.

 

I guess my question is: Can it still be real/true love if she is still having these doubts 2 months after the breakup, and nearly 3 months since she started seriously considering the breakup?

 

I know that we just managed to make a lot of progress on our issues... talking relationship on and off all of last week. I know that you aren't supposed to put a timeline on love...

 

But all the same, I can't help feeling like it makes our love illegimate that she still be confused.

 

Am I being rediculous? Has anyone else felt this way? Despite our "progress" recently, am I just deluding myself?

 

Or maybe this is something couples just go through after a time... and the fact that we were 7 years in and not yet married makes it easier to pull the chute... especially when the marriage issue was coming up during what for her was the darkest time in the relationship?

 

 

[GeeCee]

Hmmmm ... good question ShockedandDismayed, but not one that any of us can really answer.

 

I think that this can go one of two ways if you get back together, it will make your love stronger - you have overcome so much and are determined to stay together, or it will make your love more fragile - you will trust her less and be more cautious.

 

G xx