Older female,younger male + cultural & religious differences

[amber81]

This seems long, but its very interesting....We are a very interesting couple...

 

We met at a dating website.... I'm Mexican, He's Egyptian. I'm 26, he's 21. I speak Spanish,he's speaks Arabic. I'm catholic (by birth, not really devoted, I consider myself more spiritual, I believe in god) he's Muslim (kind of conservative, but still open)

 

ok, here it goes!

 

The situation

I'm 26, about to be 27 in 2 weeks, he is 21!!! 5-6 years doesn't sound a lot to me... and in fact it isn't! BUT! society punishes women a lot to be dating younger guys... I feel the gap is enormous! some people (including my parents) make me feel like I'm dating a teenager... which makes me feel bad...very bad, insecure and i don't feel their real support, although they accept it and try to adapt to it... at the beginning I had no trouble with it... but then when I saw people's reaction... It hit me! and It really hurts me and now I feel bad... I try not to think about it, but it does affect me, not directly not because of him, because of the other people, I live around people, I cant be isolated and people's opinions about our relationship are not positive.

 

Besides, it's well known that man tend to seek for younger women when they become older, so they already sentence me saying he's gonna dump me at some point.... If they do it when they are with no age gap, they certainly will do it with the gap difference.... Of course, not all man do it...but i kind of feel more vulnerable. I don't know... people make me feel and now i also believe it too, that the age gap is so big... I don't know why....

 

The core

With time I have realized that the gap difference, per say, It's not the real problem, the problem are the different stages we are in our lives... that's gonna be always the problem between people of different ages, you can be alike, you can enjoy the same activities, be compatible... but there is a sensitive age range (20s-40s) where your career and goals are different.

For example: I'm graduate with a bachelor degree. He is still studying and struggling to finance his school... I wanna have children soon in 2 or 3 years, I don't wanna be an "old" mom, Women have biological clocks... He is not concern about this, or even thinking about babies.. obviously... at his age all I cared about was the college!! and he is right! I cant force him to be thinking about other things when priority number one for him is finish the school,and solve the financial hardship he is in because of the college....

So, at this point, 5 years seem like a big difference...I think that if I had a boyfriend my age or older, he would be economically stable, and we could get married soon, and start planning our family together.... but with my boyfriend this is now "impossible", because he is not economically stable... and right now I am unemployed, looking for a job....

However, I always had in mind that my husband, should be the provider of the family, and if I worked, it would be just to help, not the main source of income. I would not feel comfortable being the main provider for many reasons..... of course I can be temporary, while he is able to do it... but not forever....

 

The conclusion

 

So this is the main concern I have right now, but adding to all these, we have some cultural-religious troubles now and then... but when they come, we had sometimes very ugly fights.... we are still adapting and knowing each other...It is not easy at all.... but we love each other so much... I could say it was love at first sight... or second sight h aha .... very pure and nice...

So we have many positive things, but some little details that at first sight don't seem like much, but then you start to realize how different we really are, and think, and how different backgrounds we have.... However I don't think this has to be necessarily bad, since I'm not looking for my "clone"... I'm just looking for someone nice, genuine and with aspirations in life, that loves me as much as I love him. that's it!

 

Besides, we like each other a lot, physically too, we are attracted to each other... we are good looking people, not models or anything alike, but we're in the same level, I would say... and we have great sex!! I love having sex with him! and he loves having sex with me too, although I'm the only one he's been with... he was a virgin.... for religious matters....

 

so thats pretty much the situation. What do you people think! please, I wanna hear different comments, points of view, advices.. anything, I would appreciate it! thank you for taking your time to read this... I needed to say it!

 

Amber

[kevinm]

Don't place expectations on others. Sometimes wanting something so badly can cloud what is really important. As long as you both love and support each other all the external "stuff" can be tackled. If you place a time line on your life as to when certain goals are to be accomplished you will most likely be disappointed. Take a career for example. If you do something you love, work towards something you care about, not only will you be happy, but the money will follow. The same concept is valid for relationships. If you are in a healthy and loving relationship then the rest will follow.

 

-Kevin

[annie24]

hi amber - why did he give up his virginity to you? if was saving it for religious reasons, why did he give it up now? it sounds like there are a lot, too many, cultural issues going on here, and the big fights are not a good sign. that plus the fact that you want to settle down soon, have kids, etc.... it doesn't sound like he is good long-term partner material at all. he's good for the meantime, but it sounds like you don't think he is "the one" for you. what do you think?

[amber81]

hi amber - why did he give up his virginity to you? if was saving it for religious reasons, why did he give it up now? it sounds like there are a lot, too many, cultural issues going on here, and the big fights are not a good sign. that plus the fact that you want to settle down soon, have kids, etc.... it doesn't sound like he is good long-term partner material at all. he's good for the meantime, but it sounds like you don't think he is "the one" for you. what do you think?

 

He actually gave up his virginity cause he loves me... he wanted to do it with his wife for the first time. But, as I told you, he/we are not economically stable right now to get married. But we would if we had the money.... He wants to do things "right" have a formal weeding, his parents are very sensitive about it, his culture would not allow something else..... right now we live together, but we are struggling to survive.... His parents don't know that we live together, they would die! they are so conservative. He says he wants to give me everything, this is why he needs to solve the college issue, so in a near future we can have a better live. He says we are now suffering a little bit but everything is an effort for a better future. and he would love have babies with me as soon as possible.

Maybe you got the wrong impression of him... he is a man of his word. And he is not the typical "kid" his age just trying to have sex with somebody.... he is very committed and very serious, very respectful, that's what I like about him..... so he just tells me, please wait, everything will be alright...just trust me.... And I dot trust him. But sometimes I feel my patience is running out...

My friends tell me that I want things "easy"... that I don't to wait, that I don't to fight for what I want... that I don't wanna build this together... and they are right... somehow I don't.... but I love him, and I want to be with him....so I know I have to wait.....

[Excalibur]

On one end - you're dead on. It's not an age gap - it's an experience gap. Experience determines your priorities, values, standards, goals, and pursuits.

 

he's in transition between being someone's son - to being his own educated, optioned, opportunitied, and able person to choose his path, to determine his fate, to define his own values and standards.

 

You're not in transition - you're wanting to move forward.

 

So the experience gap - not age, is causing one issue.

 

You say you have nasty arguments about cultural/religious differences. Statistically speaking, those two types of differences are intensified and are deal breakers once children become involved.

 

At the point you're a parent, you realze how much what you were taught about God, about the universe, etc. determines how you view your place in the bigger picture, how much self-responsibliity you take, etc. At that point, many new parents innsist on returning to the religious and cultural teachings and traditions that they left behind defiantly in younger, less responsiiblity oriented times of their lives.

 

If you two are clashing now about these things, children would intensify it to the destruction of all.

[hear_her_roar]

Personally, I can't speak for any of the cultural or religious differences, as I haven't experienced those to a notable extent... however, I can speak from experience when I say that letting other people's opinions about your relationship influence you can sometimes cause a lot of trouble and heartache. Any form of relationship that does not fit into society's idea of a cookie cutter couple is going to be judged, especially one where there is a significant age gap. I don't personally see five years as much of a difference, but some people do. You know what? It's their problem. People are going to judge you no matter what; whether you date an older guy, a younger guy, a guy of different race, a girl, whatever. What really matters is how YOU feel, because ultimately, people will judge for the time being, but in the long run it really will make no difference to them.

Now, as for your being at different stages of your lives... I understand how difficult that can be. I'm dating an older guy and I know that the different outlooks on life that accompany age and experience can be daunting. However, these may not change when he ages; they could just be part of your respective personalities, and this is something you guys will work through with time. You just have to evaluate your priorities; are kids right at this moment your top goal, or are kids in the future with your boyfriend more important? Would you be willing to wait for him to finish school in order to pursue a more serious relationship? It's completely your call, but keep in mind that different goals and outlooks on life are normal for any relationship, no matter how big an age gap.

Ultimately, it's your choice. I just wish you the best of luck with whatever you choose.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

I think that 5 years is really no big deal when it comes to age gaps. So that part i'd ignore.

 

But you do have some significant challenges on the culture and religion front. I hate to say this, but in many cultures, men will play around a lot when they are unmarried, but when it comes to marriage, they will look for a younger, traditional, and virginal bride of their own religion and culture. They may want a woman to play with before marriage, but when marriage is seriously being considered, they will look for bride their family will accept.

 

So you may already be disqualified on the marriage front due to the cultural, religious, and virginal bride factors. They can stay in relationships while in school, but when it comes time to marry, they go back to their original culture and religion to look for a bride. I have known several women who have dated men from Arab or East Asian cultures and even lived with them, who were shocked when they got dumped on no notice and their boyfriend went back to their own country and showed up a month later with a bride from an arranged marriage. So who they will 'play' with is very different than what they want to marry.

 

So i think if you are having fun, enjoy yourself, but don't be planning a wedding in your head just yet. Have you even talked to him about expectations for marriage? There is no guarantee he will tell you the truth, but please don't get too far ahead of yourself here or you may get really hurt. Perhaps he will break with tradition and religion, but more likely not.

 

There are many good books about Western women who have married into Arab culture, and you might be in for a really bad shock. If he does want to marry you, he could want you to return to his native country, and expect you to live as an Arab women with all the cultural traditions which will feel very repressive to a Western woman. You might want to read some of these books before considering getting serious so you understand what it may mean to live in that culture. Here's one famous book on the subject:

 

link removed

 

There is a chance he will be willing to leave his culture and religion behind for you, but a greater chance that he will expect you to run your house and raise your children in a Muslim cultural environment. Make sure you understand what that means before you agree to marry him.

[amber81]

Hi Be happy,

 

What you say, many people have told me before... And at the beginning I was very doubtful about how serious he could be, not because he is bad man, but because of the religion and culture, basically because of what you said...

 

I have talked to him about this, what people think of them (muslim/arab people) and that is very well known that they tend to do this, and that I don't feel comfortable about it, it's scary....

 

And he really seems to be different. He has no intention of going back to his country to establish there. He wants to live here in the USA or Europe, not in the Arab countries. He personally says that I would go crazy there. We have talked about marriage a lot, and at the beginning, he wanted to get married, cause in his religion is not right to live with me, if we aren't. but It was too soon and too crazy, so we just decided to wait and see. Besides his family is very important to him, and he's parents would go mad if he suddenly gets married like this, considering that they are away in Egypt, not here.

 

Now let me clarify that he has told me that Egypt, specifically, is a more "open" Muslim country. there's a lot of very conservative people,but there is also people that are more in the middle, and there is people that don't really follow the religion. Which was kind of surprising to me. So he is really a more open person. I have asked many questions you point me, like why does he accepts to be with me if i was not virgin? and he says because I was raced in a different way. We don't share the same beliefs.

Besides, Muslims (males) can marry Jewish or Christian girls, but the children they have should be Muslims too.

 

So that is also another issue, basically I don't have a problem with my children being Muslims because I know him, and I like how he is, he was raced a Muslim and he turned out well. So I don't see it as a negative thing. But I do know that at some point this will be a problem.

 

 

I don't personally think that he is lying and not serious about this relationship, about the marriage. He's values are very high and very important. He respects me a lot. And he knows that I am not a Muslim girl, so he shouldn't expect any of that from me, and sometimes he does forget, but I remind him.

 

So I'm not really worried about that. He has egyptian family here in the states, and they married americans, non muslims... like they are a little bit more open. One married a girl from Brazil, another married one from Argentina, they are not muslims.... so that inspired me to trust him on that issue. and the family accepts them well, so...

 

But yeah, there are a lot of differences. :S Anyway, the possibility does exist, maybe he is lying after all, but i have no way to know it.... unfortunately... So I just trust him, if he does it, this will be his mistake, not mine.... I cant do anything.

However at the beginning, and still now I tell him that I want a serious relationship, a commitment, a marriage, that i had bad experiences in the past and that im tired of it... I just wanna have a happy life!

 

so that's basically it....

[annie24]

i think egypt has actually gotten a lot more socially conservative in the last 20 years, not less. i agree a lot with what bsbh said, those are some concerns i had too, but didn't know how to articulate them as well as bsbh said. the age isn't so bad as the cultural/religious things, especially if you say you two have been fighting on these issues! the one movie that immediately pops into my mind is "The Namesake" (great movie!) in which an american born indian guy has this wonderful blonde american girlfriend for years, but then decides he cannot marry her, and winds up marrying an indian woman, friend of the family (and she incidentally winds up cheating on him later). i agree with what bsbh said, when they are finally ready to marry, they may choose someone of their own heritage, even if they seem americanized and open to other cultures. but, only you know your bf well enough to answer this question.

 

ps - i don't think muslim guys are bad at all. one of the sweetest bfs i ever had was a practicing muslim, we are still good friends to this day. but keep in mind if you want to raise your kids in the muslim religion. how to raise the children is an area in which many couples i know have troubles, if they are from different religions.

[BeStrongBeHappy]

You really do need to think about and research what it really means for your children to be raised Muslim. Are you prepared to go without Christmas the rest of your life? And to have your children raised Muslim?

 

Before you make this big decision, you need to study the religion and culture very closely to make sure you understand what this really means.

 

Also, marriage has a way of bringing out the conservative in people. They may not practice religion much when single, but as soon as marriage enters the picture, they want all the marital traditions, home, decisions to be rooted in their own culture. And you're already basically agreeing to raise your children as Muslims and not Christians. That means all the traditions you hold dear will no longer exist in your home.

 

And your daughter will be raised in a much more conservative approach than applies to you. I am not sure you are getting what your boyfriend is saying to you. He is saying it is OK for you to behave a certain way, but your daughter will be told that is bad and not acceptable. So YOU will be an outsider in your own home. That is a very common complaint from women who try to assimilate into a different culture. There will be many normal things about you that will be viewed as unacceptable in your children, and the pressure will be for you to stop being who you are in order to be the role model your husband's culture wants you to be for your children.

 

You haven't encountered some of the more stressful aspects, such as it is OK for a man to strike his wife to discipline her if she 'disobeys' him. You are his girlfriend now, not his wife, so he may not be disciplining you yet becuase you don't have the status of wife. There are MANY things like this that you need to investigate before you take the step to marriage.

 

The most important thing not to miss here is that he is living according to the rules of YOUR culture now, but the marriage will shift the balance, especially if you have kids whom he expects to raise as Muslim. Your home and family life will become a Muslim home and family. VERY different rules there.

 

You might want to spend time with his sister-in-law who are Brazilian/Argentian to see how they keep their homes and what will be expected of you. If his family is very liberal and westernized you may fit in OK, but maybe not. Best to really investigate this sooner rather than later.