What I have learned about Commitment phobics

[DieTeufelKatze]

I'm not so sure I agree with the "they're just not with the right person" statement. I am a passive (sometimes active) CP, my recent bf/now ex is obviously a serious CP that swings between active and passive roles. He has had one girlfriend in his life so far, a girl he dated long distance when he was in his late teens/early twenties. He then proceeded to sleep with 20+ girls over the years after they broke up, never getting into a relationship or calling them his girlfriend. (He and I are both 27). We were seeing each other for 3 months non-exclusively, then exclusively (he gave me the "girlfriend" title) for another 3 months, until he started backing off. I freaked out and ran. We're back to talking again, but not back in a relationship.

 

Having commitment issues myself, I can tell you that the anxiety that it brings up is REAL and very all-consuming. It doesn't matter who I've been with, and the same goes for him... we are VERY good together, but it doesn't matter because the anxiety the relationship brings up is too strong to be able to ignore. I think he's perfect for me, but the commitment anxiety is too great for either of us. Whether or not we can overcome it remains to be seen, but I don't believe in the "Oh, if only I were with the right person, I would be able to commit" excuse. It's hard to understand unless you've been there.

[lady00]

I think there are very few actual commitment phobes out there. You may be one of them. But I truly believe it's rare.

 

I've seen tons and tons of examples in real life and on these boards where someone appears to be a commitment phobe, says they are one, and it leads to a breakup, then the person goes on to marry someone else. So, that is why I think most people who say they are commitment phobes really aren't.

 

The anxiety you speak of sounds like a diagnosable, and probably treatable, condition, though I'm certainly no expert. Wheras I think a lot of people claim to be commitment phobic when they're really not.

[bulletproof]

Having spent my late teens/early twenties as the person who did the leaving in relationships, I can safely say it's because the guys I dated were not the right ones for me. It may have appeared to the outside world that I was "commitment-phobic", but when I finally met someone who I wanted to be with, there wasn't a doubt in my mind. It sounds like this just isn't the right guy for you, OR you are rejecting him before he can reject you (hence you backing off when he started to back off).

[JStar73]

usual story...met a girl 6 months ago, whirlwind romance, told each other everything about ourselves, lots of love, sex, intimacy and then BAM! freakout.

For the last 2 months I have been living in what now appears to be false hope that I could "love" her back to me.

We have repeated cycles of her thawing towards me, coming back only to freakout again 3 or 4 days later, pull the shutters down and say that she just doesn't feel the way she needs to.

I know everything about her past, her upbringing, her past relationships and she has more of less all of the traits in her background that will produce a fully functioning emotionally unhealthy CP - messy parental divorce, elements of abuse and so on and so on.

She has refused to take any responsibility for the hurt she has caused me through her behaviour, saying its my fault for believing her when I clearly know what she is like. All of her demands for space to "be who she is" but not allowing me to expect anything in return - it all just goes on and on.

I still find myself in love with this woman - objectively she does have many good qualities, but now she has decided that we can only be friends as she does not want to keep repeating the cycles - come close, pull away, freakout I freakout (which she then uses as justification for keeping me away).

Until next time that is. She will always say "we can't have a relationship. Right now" It's the "right now" added on the end that is the killer.

I don't know what I am doing. Why am I still clinging onto this? I am starting to question my own sanity.

[Hollyj]

If there is no legitimacy to CP, then why do they keep repeating the pattern? In my particular situation he says he still loves me but can't be in a relationship due to external reasons-I went NC. There seems to be be a repeating theme with this individual, he gets close and then pulls away when emotions start running on high. If they're not interested why not leave the situation all together? By the way, we have not been sexually involved since our initial breakup.

 

Lastly, this is my first experience with a CP, so I am not using this as an excuse for the ending of the relationship.

[Excalibur]

Compartmentalized, insecure or other dysfunctional people see relationships as a one sided, self-benefitting situation.

 

They want to play with you as they would a toy - when they want to play with the toy. They want you to be on the shelf, or in the toy box ready for them to play with again - whenever the mood strikes.

 

They don't get attached to the toy, or involve with the toy to meet its needs or consider it important. they involve with the toy when it benefits, gratifies and satisfies them.....period.

 

It's not that they're commitment phobic - it's that they see no value in commitment or involvement, and only interact when it benefits, gratifies, and satisfies them.

 

In reading into theri actions, decisions and words that they'll want what they want now - in two weeks - that's the problem. You can't predict two hours from now - much less two weeks.

 

They want what they want, when they want it....and that's it.

[JStar73]

I take your point, but in my case I think it is as clear as she has made out - she has explicitly told me that she is afraid of making a mistake, of there being someone "better" who might take her fancy at some point in the future, of feeling trapped.

Her father was a repeat adulterer who used to come and go endlessly with her mother, displaying endless CP traits and she is now playing this out herself.

She either gets involved with men who treat her the same way, or if they don't she makes them come and go by engaging her push/pull dynamic herself.

She has however recently come to the conclusion that there is nothing wrong with her, just that she hasn't met Mr Right yet and that it will all be fine in future.

Knowing this person as well as I do (I sometimes think I know her better than she knows herself) I know that whoever it is will either be in some way unavailable for her, or she will just repeat the same pattern of taking some minor flaw, magnifying it to such proportions that she will deem the relationship unworkable, and engage in the same can't live with/ can't live without you dynamic.

I am meeting her tomorrow. I am going to very calmly lay out to her that it really is now time to say goodbye. She wants to remain "friends" but I know only too well that going from lovers to friends never works, and only leads to more hurt for one or both parties in the end.

If she calls me up at some point in the future saying she has had some moment of revelation that it is me she wants, she is sure, double, triple, quadruple sure and provide me with guarantees, not promises, that she has got to the bottom of whatever it was that was governing her behaviour, I will of course listen to her. But I won't hold my breath, nor will I make the mistake of leaping into bed with her the next time she tells me she loves me and flutters her eyelids at me. Down that road much pain lies, as I know only too well.

[Excalibur]

Basically - you're 3rd or lower on the list of options - and she's searching for a better option.

 

It's like jobs - no matter which one you're in that is paying you a salary - you're always looking for a better position, with more money and benefits.

[JStar73]

well you know it's funny...since I wrote that, I have gone over and over the whole thing in mind. I keep a journal and read back the last couple of months entries...it's funny what selective memory can do, how you only remember the good stuff you want to remember. Going back through the last couple of months and re-reading the amount of pain, and basically how traumatic the whole thing has been for me it's quite an easy conclusion to come to that I need to bail out and also open my eyes to the possibility that maybe I don't really love this woman at all, or at least not like I think I do. What self respecting person would after all this? It's amazing how we can deceive ourselves...

Neither she nor I deserve any more of the unhappiness we seem to bring each other so basically, I am out of there. A valuable lesson I think, and I would advise anyone else in my position to keep a journal of thoughts etc so you can read it back to see what the TRUTH of the experience has been, not just what you want to remember in order to keep your fantasy going.

[bulletproof]

If there is no legitimacy to CP, then why do they keep repeating the pattern?

 

Because they can. Because someone (or many) allow them to. Because maybe some people are just inconsiderate, and selfish, and not very nice. But it doesn't mean that they have a mythical disorder.

 

I can speak for myself when I say that I would back off from people when I feared that they would become too attached and I knew I wasn't interested in them for the long haul. It was because I wasn't interested in that specific person. I wanted a serious relationship. Just not with him.

[bulletproof]

Thing is, "legitimate" or not, it's interesting to hear and discuss various theories of human behavior and/or dysfunction, because it's not like every person has to fit cleanly within a DSM-IV category... but much like other philosophical discussions, it's more about understanding different points of view and then deciding whether to integrate those views and values into your own life, or whether to reject them, or whether to assimilate those views and values that are most relevant to you.

 

My issue with it is defining it as some sort of legitimate disorder, when nine times out of ten the person just didn't want to date the other person. There are loads of personalities out there that are not going to mesh with ours long-term for whatever reason. Deciding that the other person has something 'wrong' with him or her is a great way to soften the blow to our ego.

[Hollyj]

Bulletproof,

I'm curious, do you happen to fall into the CP profile????????

[Excalibur]

It's imperative not to throw a label on someone because they don't value waht you value, or define it as you do.

 

Everybody that doesn't want a committed relationship romantically is not commitment phobic.

 

Commitment phobic personalities are perpetually switching jobs, interests, friends, locations, and have no long term associations of any sort that they carry forward into the next phase of their lives.

[jane820]

I feel like the active CP sounds alot like me. As soon as everything's ok, it's time to move on. However, I think I have reason to be this way in my situation. I'm 20, have been with my boyfriend for 3 years now, and what's keeping me from feeling fully committed is that if we stay together, I'm convinced we will either just get married, or my feelings will fester and ultimately lead to a very painful and embarrassing end to our relationship. Before I get married, I need to explore the single life and gain some experience so I know myself and what I want. I feel relatively sound in this anysis of my situation and my feelings. Does my situation seem to imply that I need "help"?

[JStar73]

Jane820- I would say not - you are only 20 yo, and I think what would define CP is if it is a pattern that recurs time after time after time, pulling way from relationships for no "real" reason, and living out a fantasy in your head.

Commitment is a big thing, and it is normal to feel anxiety attached to it. It is however the proportionality of the response that would indicate dysfunctional behaviour

[Hollyj]

Excaliber,

 

I'm sorry I don't agree. I certainly fit the profile for the first 40 yrs of my life. Some of the symptoms you mentioned certainly fit the criteria for a CP, but in the most extreme cases. The CP will not always fulfill "all" of those conditions to be consider CP, I didn't. I decided to make a conscious change in my life b/c I recognized I had a problem and was repeating bad and hurtful behaviors.

 

Just sharing my personal experience.

 

One last question. Are you saying that if an individual is not able to sustain any sort of loving committed relationship they are not CP?

[Excalibur]

My point is well made, but easily missed that once you determined you were missing out on something - you changed your patterns and associations in action - so that you became someone who "could commit".

 

But until you wanted people there for you and realized the reason they never stick around, is because I never stick around......there was no change to be made.

 

In that period of your life you wouldn't have said you were a commitment phobe - you'd have said I'm living my life on my terms,and it meets my needs.

 

Today - in retrospect, you think you were a commitment phobe because you didn't want committment and ran from it when imminenent. It's just that in reality - when you didn't want commitment and what it required of you - you didn't think you were missing out on anything.

 

Most commitment phobic types do have a change of agenda and heart in their 40's and 50's....they've been everywhere, done everything ,they have stories and have had experiences that most people can't imagine - much less personally involve in...tat's becuase there has been nobody else to consider along with themselves when deciding what to do and how to od it.

 

When the "been there, done that" perspective sets in - you realize the myriad of experiences can't be duplicated in other areas...and so now making a commmitment to someone else and considering them equally with yourself isn't an overmuch sacrifice.

 

I've been there - and done it........and till I was 44.....I didn't want commitment either.

 

Are you saying that if an individual is not able to sustain any sort of loving committed relationship they are not CP?

That is what I am saying. commitmentphobe is a self-proclaimed title and usually only held once change is desired on the individuals. part. It's not a diagnosis that can be rendered by the others who might desire commitment with the person who refuses to see the value and benefit of association with them.

 

I had to know someone extremely unique to see it - he committed himself in every way 200% to what he believed in, espoused, and found exciting, thrilling, and empowering and fulfilling. In no way, shape or form did he ever not commit to whatever it takes....in those situations and realtionships.

 

But what he did NOT want.......was marriage and kids. And unfrotunately, he was built like a body builder, with athletic speed, and California good looks...and everywhere he went women wanted desperately to date him - he has no problemw ith it - they desired ardously to sleep with him - again no problem there....but anything that went into her going "so where are we headed" meant he was headed out the door.

 

He was not willing to take on the responsiblity an obligation of commmitment to another person's wnats, needs, goals, agenda, and feelings equally with his own - he firmly believed that is what a committed relationship demanded, and he wanted no part of violating his own code of ethics.

 

And it's actually a wonderful thing that he held that view....he was 55 when he passed away in a freakish manner with a disease his lifestyle rarely encounters at all. If he'd have given any portion of his short 37 years from 18 to 55 to prioritizing other people's needs and wants, goals, and feeings - he'd have never accomplished all that he did, seen all that he saw. He'd have shortchanged himself...it was kind of like he knew all along he wouldn't make it to 60. He kept saying 'if I hit 60, I'll settle down". Hed' been saying that since he was 30.

[Hollyj]

Actually, at the time I knew there was a problem and couldn't understand why I put up those walls, I wanted to be in a loving, fulfilling and committed relationship. I wasn't happy with the way things were and decided to make the change.

[Excalibur]

Actually, at the time I knew there was a problem and couldn't understand why I put up those walls, I wanted to be in a loving, fulfilling and committed relationship. I wasn't happy with the way things were and decided to make the change.

 

Sounds like a classic case of "recovery" to me....I don'tknow why I drank so much for so long - but I didn't want the results I was living with becuase of it - so I stopped drinking and dealt with the issues that I used to believe "justified the drinking".

 

Same with repeat marriages, and anything else anybody has.

 

The day they're sick and tired of living with the results their actions create - they change their actions...not until.

[Hollyj]

It doesn't explain why I was fearful of letting someone into my heart for so many years. I always chose relationships that would not result in anything long-term, so when things got close I found fault with my partner and ended the relationship. In my eyes this is not normal or fulfilling considering my parents have been married almost 60 years. I've always wanted the romance and the fairytale but was afraid to let it happen.

 

I guess we can agree to disagree on this issue.

[Excalibur]

Maybe you saw what they sacrificed or opted out of to be in marriage and have children -and you wanted no part of those types of sacrifices.

 

If you wanted "solo wins" to so speak and you saw your parents constantly sacrificing, compromising and having to do what was best for the "community good" of the family instead of for themselves you said subliminall - to commit means to sacrifice and concede your individuality, no way for me.

 

I know a great many people with parents who loved being married - who personally want no part of marriage or kids themselves. They were parented in a way to think for themselves, shoot for the stars, to be self-accountable and self-responssible from an early age.....and they saw that to take on the obligation to someoen else's needs, goals and priorities was compromising thier own potential - so they wanted no part of it.

[Hollyj]

My parents have an amazing marriage. I can truly say they are best friends and have a great deal of love and respect for one another, I could only wish to find what they share. Not only do they enjoy their time with one another but also have outside interests which keeps the relationship healthy. I believe this is the best combination.

[Excalibur]

Ah, well, maybe you saw what they "built" - and it took years of building that prior to you being in the world, observant to create, and it took a great deal of effort to maintain thru careers, and losses, children and parental duties.

 

Maybe you thought 'until it looks like that for me, I won't commit" - not realizing that if you never committed first - it could never look like that.

[Hollyj]

No, not all. We were very financially secure and really didn't have any worries. I never heard any arguments, it was pretty Beaver Cleaver. My brother has been very successful in his personal life and has never had this issue. So, I don't know how to explain it, b/c like I said earlier I wanted to have someone special in my life.

 

All in all, it looks to me like phobic behavior, most especially with the reasoning you provided.

[Excalibur]

I found one of my issues was for a very long time - I wanted someone's attention to "make me feel special" - and then I fluctuated with it "I want my attention to them to make me feel positively about me".

 

When it was always about "I feel special because you are prostrate at my feet, or I feel special becuase I am so generous and giving to you" - I had issues keeping a commitment. The people that wanted me to serve them - were so not into serving anybody....and vice versa.

 

When I realized the desire ot give - needed to be because I wanted them to have what I was offering, because of how I regarded them in existential character.....and my view of me was based on how I regarded me based on how I conducted my life on life's terms...then I could make a commitment and keep it and not surprisingly, I was then attracted to and attractive to balanced, secure, mature, healthy individuals.