It's all crap, all of it...

[Grosse vache]

That's clever isn't it? Treat someone else badly because someone treated you badly....just perpetuate the negative cycle of scorn and hatred then. Whatever happened to staying true to your morals?

[Shajenko]

The victim of your behavior will only be you in reinforcing your negativity and ultimately driving other people away, not the women you lie to

 

Pffft.

 

most people have good instincts for liars

 

No, they really don't. They usually have to hear the liar tell a lie that directly contradicts something they know to be a fact to catch all but the most obvious of liars. They've done studies on this kind of thing, and most people fail miserably.

[Shajenko]

That's clever isn't it? Treat someone else badly because someone treated you badly....just perpetuate the negative cycle of scorn and hatred then. Whatever happened to staying true to your morals?

 

My morals say that justice should be served - people who deserve to be punished should be punished. And you can usually tell within a short amount of time if a woman is the type of woman who deserves that punishment. Sometimes they'll even tell stories about some loser they blew off with the techniques that have been previously discussed here.

[Batya33]

Hey - whatever works for you and makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside. All the best and good luck.

[Shajenko]

Hey - whatever works for you and makes you feel all warm and fuzzy inside. All the best and good luck.

 

You don't really believe any of that.

[Batya33]

Actually, I think you don't really believe that your approach works for you. I actually do believe all of what I wrote - you are determined to believe what you believe and determined to believe that it works for you - you are not open to "hearing" what anyone else has to say; rather you twist words or misleadingly/selectively respond so you can stay in your comfortable box of negativity - and those boxes can be warm and fuzzy because they feel safe and familiar to the negative person. There is no point in a dialogue because it takes two and you have chosen not to interact in any type of productive way.

[Shajenko]

Actually, I think you don't really believe that your approach works for you.

 

Gets me what I want.

 

I actually do believe all of what I wrote - you are determined to believe what you believe and determined to believe that it works for you - you are not open to "hearing" what anyone else has to say;

 

Not when I'm convinced they're lying.

 

rather you twist words

 

"Gentle brush off" is a euphamism you used a few times. I called it what it really was - a lie. I'm not surprised you didn't like that.

 

or misleadingly/selectively respond

 

I find it funny when people think that I'm somehow "hiding" their words when I use the quote function - your reply is right up above mine! How am I misleading anybody about what you said?

[Grosse vache]

What is it, exactly, that you do want?

[Shajenko]

What is it, exactly, that you do want?

 

Women to have sex with, for one.

[Grosse vache]

I thought as much.

[Leonhart]

My morals say that justice should be served - people who deserve to be punished should be punished.

 

That is a very male answer.

 

I'm not criticizing it, though. Just saying.

[Batya33]

That is a very male answer.

 

I'm not criticizing it, though. Just saying.

 

I am a female and I totally agree with that - but it is circular because it presumes that there is one way to figure out who deserves to be punished (and implies that the poster is correct in determining that "all women" deserve to be punished) and presumes a definition of "justice" (none is supplied). That is the interesting question - how to figure out who deserves to be punished and what is the appropriate type of punishment if indeed it is determined that there has been a violation of a law, code, moral ethics, etc.

 

Interestingly, the poster is punishing himself, ultimately, by creating emotional distance between him and others who might indeed be a positive force in his life.

[Leonhart]

Men focus mostly on justice while women tend to focus on justice AND mercy. I just found it interesting, is all. Nothing more.

[Batya33]

Men focus mostly on justice while women tend to focus on justice AND mercy. I just found it interesting, is all. Nothing more.

 

Not true at all from what I have seen and that generalization would be particularly offensive to the numerous female judges and female criminal attorneys in my country.

[Shajenko]

I thought as much.

 

A man who wants sex! Horrors!

 

 

[Shajenko]

I am a female and I totally agree with that - but it is circular because it presumes that there is one way to figure out who deserves to be punished

 

Hey, I didn't say I was perfect. It's just that some women make it so easy to tell that they deserve it.

 

(and implies that the poster is correct in determining that "all women" deserve to be punished)

 

Never once did I say "all women". Now who's the one putting words in whose mouth?

 

and presumes a definition of "justice" (none is supplied).

 

That's because it's an abstract concept. And I DID supply a definition - punishing the guilty.

 

That is the interesting question - how to figure out who deserves to be punished and what is the appropriate type of punishment if indeed it is determined that there has been a violation of a law, code, moral ethics, etc.

 

This has nothing to do with the law - laws aren't for enforcing justice, they're for enforcing order. You'd do well to know the difference.

 

Interestingly, the poster is punishing himself, ultimately, by creating emotional distance between him and others who might indeed be a positive force in his life.

 

Trust me, I used to be like the original poster. I never got any of that "positve force" from women when I was like him. I wised up.

[lifestream]

A man who wants sex! Horrors!

 

 

 

You're treating women as a means to an end, which I believe is particularly sad. They've become objects for sex rather than humans beings you want to share your life with.

 

I don't mean to come off as a jerk here, but some classic stoic and empirical philosophy would do you a lot of good.

 

Enchiridion - Epictetus

Meditations - Marcus Aurelius

 

Good starting points for stoic philosophy.

The first way you can influence the people around you comes with the changes you give to yourself and your perceptions.

 

And for the record, I've flaked out on people before, and I've told girls "I'll see you around" if the date went in a bad direction. I'm not fond of it because it's not explicit, but I'm afraid of adverse reactions to bluntness...

[SexySadie7]

I've often find Batya's posts to me to be insulting and demeaning also, original poster!

I'm sorry she hurt your feelings. I feel very hurt also many times after

reading her responses.

You AREN'T a loser.... You are just not as lucky in love as some people... that's NOT a failure on your part. Not everyone is lucky in love, I can assure you...just look at some really attractive Hollywood types...Halle Berry, for one. She's a gorgeous girl but look at her track record. She's gotten with some not so great guys.

Anyway.. as far as your response goes.... girls like it if YOU do the pursuing...

Trust me.. nothing aggravates me more than letting the guy know I'm interested and then HIM expecting ME to do all the legwork.

I know it's hard, cuz it risks rejection, but if a girl you like says she wants to get together... then i really think it should be YOU to do the asking out.

Cuz girls want to be pursued...that's the traditional way things go. I know, it's 2007, but no one's revised the rules yet where it's acceptable in society that women ask guys out for dates.

If you meet a girl who shows interest, suggest you do something, then you need to get some courage and try ask her out. If she turns you down, then you know..... she's just flirting... or is just a tease and you NOW know where you stand with her. Then don't ask her out again. She's not worth your time.

There are lots of guys, believe me, that lead a girl on too. I've met quite a few in my day. They act like you are the greatest thing since sliced bread, act like they are really interested, take your number, tell you to call THEM (something I hate, btw) and then after a couple of dates or maybe no dates at all, you couldn't get them to call you or pay you any attention to save their life!

Believe me... plenty of male players out there.. so it's not just a female thing. And NOT all females are like that. I really don't see the point in flirting with a guy I'm not attracted to. I may be friendly, but that's all.

I don't see the point in encouraging guys i'm not attracted to, but then, not all girls are like this....Some women, like some guys, just don't care about someone else's feelings. You don't want to waste much time with these types as it will bring you down. You don't need that. You need someone who's genuinely interested in you... but you gotta be pulling your weight too.

So...is there someone you really like in one of your classes that's showed interest but you've not gotten the courage to call her up?

I know it's tough... I've been trying to get the courage to call this guy I really like whom I dated....I know how hard rejection is.. but you know what.. I've not called him.. so he's really got no idea i want to see him...

You can pm me if you want, original poster.

[SexySadie7]

I also agree with galaxy.. Silence is NOT a successful way to save face for the person being rejected. It's hurtful, total disrespectful, confusing and just leaves the person wondering for a long time sometimes, what did I do wrong? Course, he or she, cannot ask the person rejecting them, cuz they have choosen to have NO CONTACT with them whatsoever. How could anything be more hurtful? At least if you had an argument with that person, you could find out what you did wrong, if any, what were the issues, so you could use that info in your next relationship. Instead you are just left in limbo.....

I find that the most insulting and cowardly way to treat a person, especially one, you have established you are comfortable with...

So I have to agree with you galaxy when you say,

 

It's one thing to blow off some random stranger who sent you an email, it's another to not even acknowledge someone you spent some time with to know that you feel safe around him.

 

There is no dignity in silence that you speak of. I have read nice guys, nerds, confident guys, and casanovas complaining about how disappointed they were when someone who seemed to enjoy their time and presense cut off all contact for no explicable reason. Most of these guys hate the indirect rejection because it gives false hope. Instead of moving on to the next girl, these guys have false hope thinking that the girl is busy and she will call him when she has the time. While these guys have false hope, girls like you are hoping that he gets the hint that she is not interested. We feel like crap when the person we like so much won't even acknowledge us as a person with a simple "No, thanks". It's a nice feeling when you see someone you thought was a friend talking to her friends after she has blown off a couple of mesages.

 

Very well put, galaxy... Whatever happened to our original poster? His feelings were probably hurt by what you wrote Batya.

[Batya33]

Thanks for your comments and your speculation about the original poster . . . . (your speculation is ironic and amusing given your personal attack of me )

 

If I have gone out with someone less than four times - and depending on the circumstances, I find silence - in either way - an effective and fair way to communicate lack of interest in going forward - particularly if there is nothing to talk about other than "you just don't do it for me" or if there is an issue of safety.

 

There are exceptions of course - that's a rule of thumb. I have found it quite arrogant to get a lengthy email or message from someone after one or two dates explaining why we are not a match -- presuming that I at that point was that attached and would want to know the minutae of his reasoning. If a man asks me to explain if he did anything wrong on the date and he did, I might, if I feel safe doing so. One man thanked me over a year later for pointing out how inappropriately he behaved on our date. Much of the time, such pointing out of mistakes can only lead to defensiveness - and I understand why - who am I to judge someone else's behavior when I don't know him well?

 

Exceptions are where I promise to call or make another date - then I call as promised or call to cancel the date - and where we were close friends before we dated. That is how it has always worked reasonably well among the people I know - perhaps it has worked differently among the people you know.

 

If you think it's unfair then obviously act accordingly - I don't think your approach is wrong - just different.

[BellaDonna]

This thread has run it's course.