If you're not born gay...........

[Majoraslayer]

I'm in the closet, so I'm coming out now.

 

I prefer WOMEN! *Is stoned to death by feminists*

[brando]

Well can we take this a step further??

 

What about a male prison population.?? Is homosexual activity found there based out of anger, predisposed conditioning, or a want of intimacy??

[annie24]

I'm in the closet, so I'm coming out now.

 

I prefer WOMEN! *Is stoned to death by feminists*

 

I don't get it.

[FoxLocke]

Well can we take this a step further??

 

What about a male prison population.?? Is homosexual activity found there based out of anger, predisposed conditioning, or a want of intimacy??

 

I think, like in the animal kingdom, prison rape is about domination...Basically, they use sex as a weapon to humiliate someone they deem weaker than themselves.

[rose2summer]

What about a male prison population.?? Is homosexual activity found there based out of anger, predisposed conditioning, or a want of intimacy??

 

I think it's based out of a desire to get your sexual/physical needs met.

 

Lack of sex seems to create a stronger desire for it,

 

So if a man/woman is available, then they will take whichever route is available,

 

I don't think it's really a thought of preference now.

[Boughtandpaidfor]

Prison sex- I have NO idea about at all!!!! Could be a TV myth for all I know. Anyone actually know it happens?

[Majoraslayer]

My parents work at a prison. Trust me; it happens A LOT. Think of it as a welcome party.

[AwdreeHpburn]

well....as odd as it sounds, I know people who've been to prison and they say it exists...and like Majoraslayer said, in abundance.

[nottoogreen]

Well can we take this a step further??

 

What about a male prison population.?? Is homosexual activity found there based out of anger, predisposed conditioning, or a want of intimacy??

Rapist according to rapists behavioral patterns including power, anger and otherwise want of intimacy.

 

Some will be predisposed and give in easier, others hold out of course.

[FoxLocke]

Prison rape is a problem and, unfortunately, they will never address it. It is a cultural punchline...Which is sickening.

[Boughtandpaidfor]

People who are psychopathic enough to rape people view sex in a completely different way to non psychopaths-- so it doesnt seem to me that you can in anyway equate that with homosexual behavior in society.

 

Power and narcissistic supply is reason enough.

[BellaDonna]

People who are psychopathic enough to rape people view sex in a completely different way to non psychopaths-- so it doesnt seem to me that you can in anyway equate that with homosexual behavior in society.

 

I think you made a very good point there.

 

I believe that the majority of gay individuals (and all sexual orientations for that matter) are influenced by something biological and out of their control.

 

then what would lead you to become gay?

 

Although in the complex world we live in, I also believe there are some people ( a very, very small minority) that have "chosen" or forced themselves to live with a certain sexual orientation based on extreme past experiences. For example, someone who has been raped or traumatized (by the opposite sex) may banish the opposite sex out of fear or post traumatic stress disorder.

 

There is a group of radical, extreme (and in my opinion, WACKY) feminists that believe that they should separate from men completely, and as a result they live in lesbian communities, even though they were "straight" otherwise. link removed

 

So I think extreme circumstances can cause people to "choose" a sexuality- based on environmental experience and not biological factors- however even in those circumstances, their behavior/lifestyle may not be in sync with their actual biological drives, but they force it.

 

BellaDonna

[nottoogreen]

Rape has practically nothing todo with sexual satisfaction: link removed

[Boughtandpaidfor]

What a strange place for this thread to end up!!!!!!

[nottoogreen]

Evolution of the prison related question, sorry.

[brando]

sorry happytown...i just took it in a different direction.. i am done though.

 

Interesting responses to the original question.

[Cadence308]

just for argument's sake, let's accept people aren't predisposed to do anything.

 

 

For argument's sake, why would you even ask this question? Have you ever taken a biology course, maybe genetics?

 

Everything about each of us is coded in our genes and there are different factors that turn on those genes and some factors are environmental. However, there has to be the gene and thereforeeee the predisposition for being gay or getting cancer or osteoporosis, etc. So, we are predisposed to everything that make us who we are.

[Boughtandpaidfor]

For argument's sake, why would you even ask this question? Have you ever taken a biology course, maybe genetics?

 

Everything about each of us is coded in our genes and there are different factors that turn on those genes and some factors are environmental. However, there has to be the gene and thereforeeee the predisposition for being gay or getting cancer or osteoporosis, etc. So, we are predisposed to everything that make us who we are.

 

Nope - did biology at school but don't remember a great deal. I remember from my history course though- that lots of people have lots of different opinions and nobody can say for sure who's right.

 

Who says everything is coded in our genes?

[FoxLocke]

It may not be genetic...But there is a high possibility of it being hormonal...Onething is for certain.

It is just as natural as heterosexuality to people who ARE gay.

[BrokenWingedFaery]

I think that people are born with a certain orientation, which is then molded by experiences.

 

Like this: I believe I was born bisexual. But my preferences for what I want physically in either gender was molded by experiences.

 

I think that people who aren't straight are the default form of birthcontrol. Seeing as gay/lesbian people (without cultural pressure) would choose to have sex with people of the same gender, bisexuals wouldn't have as much chance of getting pregnant because they'd probably be having sex with both genders (again, without cultural pressure to marry, or to be monogamous).

 

Just for the heck of it, link removed.

[Cadence308]

Who says everything is coded in our genes?

 

There are certain environmental factors which can turn on and off certain genes. Everything from the way we develop, the way we look, the way we learn, and much of our personality is coded in our genes. Sure, there are nurturing factors that play a part in who we are, but it all starts with the genes.

 

Certain genes can be knocked out of an animal's genome and the responses studied. Genes can also be inserted and the effects observed.

[Cadence308]

But there is a high possibility of it being hormonal

 

Genes control all hormones!!! Genetic regulation controls EVERYTHING THAT IS PHYSIOLOGICAL! That is a fact. All one has to do is go to pubmed to see the effects genes have on physiological function.

[Daddy Bear]

interesting topic. i knew a set of male identical twins, one of whom was straight while the other found the prospect of sex with a woman revolting. i knew a man who turned gay in his forties. straight people turn gay, gay people turn straight (i'm sorry, but it's true), and some folks of either tendency become celibate monks. nothing is written in stone. there is no gene which can be identified as causing homosexuality, period.

 

sexuality is a continuum, a sliding scale. some folks have one gay experience, some a handful, and some make it a lifelong choice. i personally believe Freud and others who have asserted that all human beings are born bisexual, and from there we are colored by our environment.

[UT]

[Just want to apologise for the length of my reply and I'm replying to the entire thread.]

 

Well according to the behaviouristic (behaviourism) perspective we are all born like an empty book ready to be written. All we are, is simply a product of what we've leant in life, our experiences.

 

" so, logically, there would be nothing that could make you want to be with the same sex."

 

I don't really agree here. There are a lot of things that could make us want with the same sex. There is only one combination that can lead to offspring, which is the biological meaning of life (according to some) but that reason isn't the only thing controlling us. We must also remember that in the animal kingdom the most common sexual preference is bisexuality (some claims that to be due to trail and error, mistakes are made (there's also some theories about homosexuality being the norm)).

 

It is mostly in human nature that the heterosexual preference is dominant. Almost everything we do, is due to our culture, due to the way we think. Like the ancient Greeks, pederasty was quite common, almost mandatory. The women existed to make babies while men had sex. Sex was between man and man. Now why? partly because it was part of that culture, but I also believe that the fact that humans, lke very few other animals, have sex for pleasure. This takes us back to our time. Why would one man have sex with another man? They find it more stimulating.

 

That they do find it more stimulating doesn't have to be that it is something in their genes. This can be (as behaviourism argues) one act that we associate with something good. For example, stimulation of the penis is for a man quite pleasing and feels very good. So does stimulation of the rectum. Men are the only one's who can provide both. However we can't forget that there are straight men who like stimulation of the rectum as well and there are gay men who don't enjoy anal sex at all. (I'm not saying things are this was or that way, I'm just presenting a possible explanation.)

 

" There was a researcher who showed that the brains of those who were gay versus those who were straight,

 

Were actually different,"

 

Yes, this was a part of the hypothalamus which controls our sexual desire. It's was shoed that this par was bigger in some men and smaller in others. Gay men tend to have that part more similar in size to the same part in a straight female and vies versa.

 

Although this doesn't mean that sexuality is predetermined. Hypothalamus controls our sexuality in a way and is not active until we reach puberty and how it evolves, if it grows or not, can be determined by other factors such as hormones.

 

"But if no one is gay, based upon your hypothetical, why would they get into same sex behavior?"

 

Individual preference due to previous experience.

 

"you see this in the animal kingdom. No one teaches the spider, but they are born knowing how to weave webs."

 

Humans, like animals including spiders have to learn to control their body and all its functions. That's why be have diapers on babies, we follow them as they evolve. That is why we can find baby birds who have fallen out of their nest and instead of flying up, they call for help. The have not learned it yet.

 

Same goes for all knowledge. We don't need teachers to learn anything it only goes much faster than if you do it on your own. All our knowledge, everything must have come from somewhere and in the beginning we didn't have teachers. We had to learn to make our own clothes, get food and build shelter. But it took time. We had time. Evolution doesn't happen under an autumn. We didn't just think "oh, we need something on us or we'll freeze to death" for every new generation our fur got thinner and thinner and we had to keep ourselves warm. Point being, We don't need teacher, we can teach ourselves, but it takes time..

 

Reading a bit more of your inputs I can't agree with, well nor can I dent that homosexuality is the norm. It can seem like it because of the trail and error part. (Oh oh, dangerous territory, going against what a scientist thinks) Whether to not homo, Bi or heterosexuality is the norm we can't prove to 100%. We can however say that in this are this is the most common sexual preference in this group of animals or in this particular pack. We can't say that, beyond reasonable doubt that this is so in the entire animal kingdom. We have identified only a fraction of all animals and life on earth. With our technology we can only go so far. The experiments are taken on a very small scale in relation to all the animals on earth.

 

"Well can we take this a step further??

 

What about a male prison population.?? Is homosexual activity found there based out of anger, predisposed conditioning, or a want of intimacy??"

 

First of all, Sex between men in prisons is not always about rape, it can also be as tender as any other type of sex. Even love can be involved. Although as we all know rape in prison does occur, but rape is not sex. Is an act of violence to control, to feels as if you're in control. But why do some straight people turn to gay sex in prisons (how ironic that you can go to prison for sodomy in some states)? Well, first we might want to think about why these men need sex instead of the old hand. Sex gives closeness and it's also used to build a relationship (almost makes you wonder why business men don't have sex with each other more often ). And sex feels good.

 

Once you've tried something, you can long for it, if you haven't you can long for it the same way. For example, after you've eaten your first hamburger, you can feel a need to eat it again. Before you tasted it, you can't long to eat it. You can however feel a curiosity, but that's not a need in the same way. When you've had sex, you can long for it again and sex is also needed for us to feel good and also, in prisons to make time go faster hehe.

 

Some could say that we need it to survive, it's almost like a drug. And in prisons there are no women so you might take the next best thing. A lot of guys do go to prison, do what they have to in there and then when they get out, they return to women again. So it's simply away to survive and to… "Vent" some sexual frustration so to speak.

 

(you people are focusing too much on the moral aspect of it. I don't think a lot of it is rape, but actual sex, just that imprisons, perhaps it isn't as sacred as we find it. Sex could be used to get protection and other things. See it as merchandise. )

 

As for genetics involvement in who we are. Genetics mostly dictate physical attributes but can also dictate a big portion of how we act, but not even 50% of out behavioural pattern.

[Boughtandpaidfor]

That's a great post UT!!!

 

Just a point on genes- is there a gene which means I have to compulsively masturbate? Or is it just a gene to make me act compulsively? If it is genes I'm wondering just how specific can a gene be?

 

So there could be gene that when switched on, causes someone to like men? Or just generally love everyone? Or is it a gene which causes someone to not want sex with women,,,, and then another gene causing someone to need sex, so they have sex with men? And then another one which causes me to not like spicy food? Or is there a special gene for me not liking chillies?

 

It just strikes me that genetics could explain away just about anything..... a bit like god.