Issues with his family

[lorac69]

My fiance and I have been together for just over 4 years. We are both divorced and both have 2 children from our first marriages. My oldest is married with a child and my youngest is a teenager who lives with us fulltime. His oldest is a Junior in College and his youngest is a teenager. They both live with us 50% of the time.

 

When we were first together his family was very receptive of me. Although we did not spend a lot of time with them, we did see them on occassions such as holidays and birthdays. He also exchanged birthday cards with them.

 

About a year into our relationship, shortly after we bough a home together, I found out that he had been untruthful with me regarding a relationship that he had with another woman, who he had dated prior to us getting together. Shortly after him and I got together, he started talking\txting and seeing her again for a few months. I found out about it then and told him that it was her or me. He told me it was all me. I believed him. And although it nagged at me, I still went ahead and bought a house with him, investing all my savings so we could make the down payment. 2 months later, I had a gut feeling that something wasn't right. I demanded his phone records from the prior year (a phone he had a rider on his sisters account) and when I got them, I discovered that he had continued the relationship with her for another couple months after telling me he was ending it.

 

I nearly lost my mind. I felt so betrayed and cheated and used. He claims that he did not have sex with her while he was with me, but did prior to us getting together. He claims that he loved me and was confused and the attention made him feel good. During the time of discovery, I contacted the other woman and through discussion I learned that his sister had contacted her (the other woman) and asked the other woman to call my fiance at work. When she did this, he asked her to lie to me about the number of times they had seen each other. When I heard this, I called his sister and asked her why she was involved, to which she gave no answer and then told her to stay out of my business. I then sent her an email that said "lying to cover lies is like adding fuel to a fire". After a few weeks I cooled down and regained some sanity. I emailed her and explained briefly what had happened and that he had lied to me. My email wasn't pleasant but it was not rude. At that time she ceased all contact with me. A few months later at Christmas time she came to our house to see him while I was at work. Slowly the relationship with his mother has become next to nothing. His other sister was married the following summer and I was invited but this sister (that I told off) ignored us and on a couple occassions I saw her pointing our way and talking about us. At that point I sent an email to her and apologized for being rude to her during that time I was so hurt and told her that she should have a relationship with her brother and not me if necessary. We are no longer invited to family functions at his moms, although his kids are. At one point his daughter came home and told us that his sister was telling herter bad things about me and I told him he had to take care of it. He talked to his sister and she just went on about how it was my fault and I been mean to her. So this last Christmas I sent everyone in the family cards. The other day in the mail an envelope came addressed to him and his kids but not me or my daugher. Also, his mother and grandmnother sent his kids cards at their mother's house, rather than to our house.

 

My fiance and i have gone through counseling to deal with the betrayal of his emotional affair and still struggle with that situation on many levels. I've come to the conclusion that although I love him, I will probably never marry him and at this point I'm not sure that we will be together forever. I do love him and he has done all the right things as far as transparency in the relationship and working to make it better. No secrets, all time accounted for, openness with all online accounts, phones, ect. But there is still doubt on my part. I also can't help but blame the situation with his family on him because it all came out of his dishonesty.

 

I'm extremely hurt by this situation. Obviously by the fact that he had an emotional affair but also that the relationships with his family suffered because of it. I'm hurt to the point of ending the relationship because the family connection is very important to me, but more so, I feel like I'm the one that is blamed for ending his relationships with his family. I feel like I was the victim of his deciet and lies and now it just keeps happening over and over because his sister\family can't let it go and it prolongs the pain I feel over the whole situation. I feel like by sending the cards to his ex-wifes house, his mother and grandmother passive aggressively showed disdain and disrespect for not only me but for him. His sister's act of sending the envelope addressed to just him, was less passive and more aggressive and was meant to send a clear message that I am not recognized.

 

I'm not sure how to deal with this. In my family, when one makes a mistake or gets angry and voices their opinion, it may take a while but apologizes are accepted and approached with communication, love and understanding. That does not exist in his family. On one hand I want him to stand up to her and tell her that if she can not recognize me, then don't bother sending anything because I am the person he loves and wants to be with and to hurt and disrespect me is to do the same to him. However, I don't him to do this because I tell him too. I also want him to ask his mother and grand mother why they don't send the kids mail to the house that we provide for them? On the otherhand I would like to just walk away from all of this because of the baggage that our relationship carries around and because I went through a lot of the same issues with my ex and I just don't want to deal with this. Then there is the option of just ignoring the envelope and to keep living life and pretend they don't exist.

 

I would very much like to have a relationship with his Mother and sisters, but the sister is not receptive to the apologizes that I have offered and has gone out of her way to keep the situation bad. I also ethat the relationship with his mother had suffered at the hands of the sister who very much controls his mother. I don't necessary want to be her best friend or even get together all the time or talk all the time but some kind of civility in the relationships would be much healthier.

 

I know this is a long and boring subject and I thank you profusely if you've hung in there this far. I would like to hear other's opinions of my situation and I thank you in advance for your time!

[DN]

I've come to the conclusion that although I love him, I will probably never marry him and at this point I'm not sure that we will be together forever.

This seems to me to be the issue that you need to deal with before you start worrying about the non-existent relationship with his family. It seems you want him to force his family to have a relationship with you when you aren't even sure you want a relationship with him.

[lorac69]

I agree. There are other issues with the relationship. I've taken this into deep consideration also and I understand what you are saying about making him force his family to like me. I know that my lack of confidence in this relationship stems from his betrayal and I believe that, although he does do the right things "text-book" wise to prove himself and get through the distrust, that somewhere deep inside he isn't as happy as he claims to be. When I think of what I would, if the tables were turned and it was family being disrespectful of our relationship, I would talk to the person and ask why it's still and issue and what needs to be done to make it right or civil and if that person still chose to ignore him, I would most likely tell that person - like I said in the OP - that to ignore him is to ignore me.

 

Maybe my expectations are too much. And I've also considered that maybe this is a test of his committment to me. Is he willing to actually stand up for me and our relationship? And if he does, does it really mean anything given the fact that he has said he doesn't care if he has a relationship with his sister or not?

 

I know, it's messed up.

[DN]

I think that to use this as a test would be most unfair, not to say manipulative.

 

Look, his family owe you nothing. They are his family not yours. He may have treated you badly but their job is to be on his side not on yours. As a result of what has happened, your actions as well as his, it is clear they don't like you. It doesn't matter whether that dislike is justified or not - they just don't.

 

So what you are trying to do is to force him to force them to like you or at least accept you. How likely is that? How can he force them to do that short of threatening to cut them out of his life altogether and hoping they will cave in to that blackmail?

 

So what happens if he does pass your test and estrange himself from his family - and then you decide that still isn't enough and dump him. Now he has no one - and let's face it that scenario is quite likely given the way you have talked about him.

 

You need to decide whether you love him enough to stay in the relationship and make a commitment to him. If you do and can, then you can work on re-establishing a better relationship with his family. But you won't do that if you try to be a victim who gets to forgive them if they ask nicely - that won't work.

[lorac69]

You said: I think that to use this as a test would be most unfair, not to say manipulative.

 

I say: Good point, although I think manipulative is a bit over the top.

 

You said: Look, his family owe you nothing. They are his family not yours. He may have treated you badly but their job is to be on his side not on yours. As a result of what has happened, your actions as well as his, it is clear they don't like you. It doesn't matter whether that dislike is justified or not - they just don't.

 

I say: So to say they owe me nothing, means I owe them nothing as well as they are HIS family NOT mine, including any attempt to recognize them as his family? Is it ok to say what's good for the goose is good for the gander in this case? Are you willing to include his kids in that? I disagree, I feel that when someone makes a declaration of their love, devotion and commitment to another person, a family does owe that person at the very least acknowledgement and civility or they are making the family member chose between them and the one they love. Is it ok for the family to do this but not the other person? And if this is the case, what about the feelings this causes for the him? Is it ok for his family to deny the existence of our relationship that we have both worked very hard to overcome the issues in? Is it ok for them to pretend the home that he has created and worked very hard to maintain for his children does not exist? As far as being on his side...I don’t' agree...I have 5 brothers and 2 sisters and while we have each other’s back, we are also not afraid to tell one another when we believe they are out of line or making a mistake and agree to disagree but we also treat all in-laws with acceptance because they are whom our siblings have chosen to love and be with. To deny them is to deny what means the most in my siblings’ lives, deny the children that have come from that relationship and deny that my siblings are capable of loving someone worthy of them. Yes, of course there are extreme circumstances that this might be waived, such and domestic abuse or such, but still there would be support for the in-law to get help and do what's best under the circumstances. And in the end if my sibling chose to stay, I would encourage him\her to get the help\therapy\whatever to make it better for them both.

 

You said: So what you are trying to do is to force him to force them to like you or at least accept you. How likely is that? How can he force them to do that short of threatening to cut them out of his life altogether and hoping they will cave in to that blackmail?

 

I say: Blackmail - geez that's kind of a stretch. I'm not asking him to force them to do anything. I don’t' think it's out of line to ask her to take another look at the situation and look for some kind of resolution. And at the very least acknowledge that our relationship exists rather than pretend it does not. In large part, I feel that the situation he put his sister in by lying to her also and then not explaining in detail the situation has caused residual problems. I think he owes it to me to at least tell her the full truth and let her make her decision based on that. If at that point there is no desire to find a resolution then so be it. I'm not forcing him to do anything, I stated that in my OP, when I said I don't want him to do something because I told him to and at this point I have not even suggested anything. In addition to this, he doesn't need to force them out of his life, they have for the most part made that decision. The family has always had relationship issues. He did not speak to his mother for 7 years while married to his first wife because his mother "didn't like" his wife. It was only a few years before him and I got together that he introduced his children to their grandmother, the oldest was a teenager. In addition his mother does not talk to one of his brothers and has limited contact with another brother. Her relationship with one of the sisters has been rocky as well. One of the reason I want him to work on this is to get to a place where there is more stability - and I'm sure you will call this self-serving, but I would like to be included in it.

 

You said: So what happens if he does pass your test and estrange himself from his family - and then you decide that still isn't enough and dump him. Now he has no one - and let's face it that scenario is quite likely given the way you have talked about him.

 

I say: Hold the press...I also said that I love him, have gone through counseling and have made a home with him for our children and us. None of these things do I take lightly. Anyone who lives in a blended family knows the challenges and sacrifices that are made to keep the peace. When we were in the thick of discovery of his betrayal, he asked me to stay, to work on it and that he would also, so I did, because I love him very much. Anyone who has gone through a similar situation knows that it takes time, time, time and a lot of emotion and heartbreak to get through and that facing it with transparency is the only way to get through it. I love him very much and I am very committed to our relationship, however, I also believe that we are all human and in the case that he would stray from our relationship again, I would leave him, without doubt. It's not a scenario anyone wants to think about but it's being realistic. Emotionally I have and do reserve myself somewhat because I feel a need to protect myself because of the past. I hope that in time that fades, but again it's a very real feeling.

 

You said: You need to decide whether you love him enough to stay in the relationship and make a commitment to him. If you do and can, then you can work on re-establishing a better relationship with his family. But you won't do that if you try to be a victim who gets to forgive them if they ask nicely - that won't work.

 

I say: I think the above response is enough to cover the commitment part so let me say this about being a victim. I don’t' claim to be a victim of anything his family has done. I take full responsibility for the way I addressed her during that time that I was angry and for the resulting unrest. I should have waited to cool down before doing so and used more logic than emotion to get my point accross. I have apologized to her and told her that I was wrong. I DO NOT expect her to ask me to forgive her - I find that you pulled that out of here interesting. I also see her as being duped in this mess by him - maybe even a victim to some extent.

 

You seem very passionate in your response. Are your responses fired by personal experience similar to this?

[DN]

Well, I have no axe to grind here, you asked for opinions and I gave mine. It is up to you what you do.