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talking since 1 yr... possible meeting... help


LAYAAN
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Sorry, this is a long post.

I've posted about this man before. He is 36. His previous marriage failed b'coz "his wife then was already in a relationship and was too afraid to admit it to her parents and got married to him." he then filed for divorce instead of annulment.

 

 

Our phone conversations have a pattern. He would call regularly for 2-3 months, then stop calling. then start after 1-3 months, go regular, stop calling. The last time we talked in 2008 was somewhere around Aug, Sept

He said "Have you decided not to initiate any phone calls?" He stopped calling after that. I didn't bother either coz I had lost patience.

Alright. So, the reason why I emailed him back after 3-4 months gap is b'coz I think that the man is decent. Our thoughts seemed to match and I wanted to give it a try.

He replied to my email after almost 2 weeks. Then he called and we talked. At that time he said "I'm talking to 2-3 more girls and I'll marry 1 of those. Marriage is a responsibility and I want someone who is ready for that. Will you be able to give me a yes/no in 3 months from now?" I said "Well, I wrote clearly in my email to you that my education is still going on and I have 1-1.5 yrs more left. I'm looking with an intention to get married but I can't leave my education now." Then he didn't call me for 2 more months. Last Sunday when we talked.

Him "are you ready to meet or would you still like to have some more time?"

Me "Ya, I can meet. But can you please elaborate on the 3-month limit?"

Him "Oh, don't worry about it. .... ya, just... forget it."

Me "Well, (his name) I need to feel a certain way about a man after interacting with him for some time and I can't put a date on this. I may not be able to feel a certain way about him even in 6 months. So, after you mentioned it, it really puts a pressure on me."

This has been his calling pattern thus far. Skip this if you want.

he called n talked the first time ---> no calls for a month ---> called back "I was in a diff country" started calling regularly ---> no calls for a month ---> called back said "there was a robbery in my house, my car was stolen, blah, blah" ---> started calling regularly ---> no calls for a month ---> "I moved to another state" (he gave me the name) I was busy with that. Rented my apartment out, blah, blah." ---> asked me if we could meet, so I shared certain things from my side that previously were deal breakers for many men. I clearly said "You can take your time to think and if you feel like going ahead, you give me a call"---> no calls for 3 weeks ---> called back n said "have you decided not to call me unless I call you?" we talked ---> now its been 2 weeks and no calls.

 

Now, I am really wondering if I should ask him BEFORE meeting

- why has he been calling n vanishing then coming back on the radar? I really want to confront him about this.

- why has he suggestively asked me a couple of times if I understand what marriage is, if I'm ready for marriage?

- why has he suddenly said 3 months and now he doesn't want to talk about it?

- is he really at peace with the fact that my education is going on and if we do decide to take things ahead, would he be supportive of that? There is no need to meet if he doesn't agree with this and just wants to meet and get it over with.

 

People, I really need some advice. I'm not happy that this has been going on since 1 year. I want to put an end to this.

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Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

 

Tinu - EVERY single story you post is the same. You meet some dude online, he treats you horribly, so you push him away, then you later rationalize maybe he isn't *so* bad, give him another chance, he continues to be a jerk and then you come here for advice.

 

Tinu - it's always the same pattern, and what's sad, is that I don't think you'll ever see that.

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Tinu - you are Indian, correct? And thereforee insist on marrying an Indian guy, right?

 

It seems that all these guys you meet on whatever Indian dating/marriage site you are on are all total idiots. If this is your only way to meet the kind of men you are seeking, then I think you need to switch strategies, cuz this ain't working, sista!

 

So, I see your options as the following:

 

1 - Move back to India where Indian men are in abundance.

2 - Abort the plan to marry an Indian guy, and open your options to other races.

3 - Find other networks/opportunities to meet Indian men that is NOT the internet site you've been using.

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Ariel, I understand that I've put myself up with a lot of non-sense. But these are the only kind of men out there who are showing interest in me. I want to share something here. Whenever I asked these men a simple Q, they didn't like, they didn't give me another chance after that. But I feel like I'm giving them another chance, when in fact I shouldn't.

 

The reason, I posted my situation with this guy is b'coz I'm not at peace with meeting him. He has been flaky but so far every man has been this way with me and I want to point it out to him and see what he thinks about it BEFORE I decide to meet him or not.

 

Most Indian men, I've seen were disrespectful, agreed, but white men were not looking with an intention of getting married. They were just there for some fun. I can't handle that either. I'm looking for a man who is serious and is not dating just for fun of it. I'm open to finding a man in India but due to distance issue I can't b'coz I wont' get to interact with him.

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It's interesting how you generalize about white men on dating sites just wanting flings (was not my experience) and yet you don't want men to generalize about the fact that you are getting a PhD and assume that you are not marriage material.

 

I would not meet this guy - I would not have been in touch with him again after the first time he disappeared - or maybe one more chance at most. He is one man of many and since you want a serious relationship leading to marriage it's unclear to me why you would waste so much time typing to a stranger who isn't even reliable enough to respond to emails regularly, let alone set a time to meet in person.

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no Batya, he has asked me if I was ready to meet him. I hardly call him. I don't normally call men. I let them call me. Once in a while, I call.

 

No, I'm not generalizing about any race of men. I'm only stating my experiences. Even my friend had heck of a time getting a white guy to marry her.

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Most Indian men, I've seen were disrespectful, agreed, but white men were not looking with an intention of getting married. They were just there for some fun. I can't handle that either. I'm looking for a man who is serious and is not dating just for fun of it. I'm open to finding a man in India but due to distance issue I can't b'coz I wont' get to interact with him.

 

 

I think this is a big cultural difference, Tinu. In India, the goal is marriage from the very beginning of courtship. But, in the US, people date for the fun of it, for companionship, etc., and if it grows into something more, great! And if not, then so be it. People aren't so marriage-focused from the first conversation, and if they are, they certainly don't voice it, or act on it.

 

I think you encounter all your dating situations by interviewing the guy for marriage in the first communication. That would scare off ANY guy! You can't expect a man to be serious about you and his intentions from chatting online, yet this is what you seem to require.

 

But you still keep looping to the same pattern over and over, regardless. Guy is a schmuck, you know he is a schmuck, you delete him, then regret it and try and convince yourself he's not so bad, then you tell yourself again he's a jerk, then you call him out for being a jerk, he says or does something more offensive, and then you feel justified in being bitter about all men being crappy. When really the problem is that you keep engaging with losers.

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I agree with you Ariel on the last part. I was thinking about it today. My problem is once a guy steps over my boundary, I should warn him sternly. I should listen to my gut more, but I don't do this. So, I need to really improve on that. I need to learn to identify losers and not go after them. Every man that I've gone out on a date with, did not tolerate any nonsense. They had an attitude, "I'll get what I want." I need to develop that attitude. I sometimes feel that I'm too nice, too needy, I lack confidence, and faith in myself.

I don't agree with the 2nd para though. Yes, I am looking only with an intention of getting married and I don't want to even go on a date with a man who is not looking for a serious relationship. Those who want to fool around can fool around. I'm at a child-bearing age, so fooling around without marriage means wasting time n valuable years for me. I don't want to do that. I'm not capable of dealing with regrets, resentment, bitterness later on and then gettin my life back on track and look for a suitable person. Not just that, when the right candidate does show up, I want to be in right frame of mind to be able to get together with him. I've never uttered the word marriage with any man that I've talked with so far. I just didn't need to. Indian men that I met were mostly in age group 30-40, ALL looking for a serious relationship, all raised in India, when they serious relationship, they mean marriage. The Qs are right on the money. No time wasted there.

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Tinu, I read a couple of your recent posts because in some ways your situation is like mine. Except that I'm a (s. Asian) guy.

 

One thread before this one, also on the Dating forum, you floated the idea of using sites like match or plentyoffish to get some dating experience. Right now, you seem to be batting pretty strongly for the opposite point of view, which is that each encounter with a guy should ideally lead to a serious relationship. You know, it's perfectly possible for both ideas to be in someone's mind ... so I'm not making a big fuss about the apparent contradiction.

 

It did occur to me that it is plain unethical to use guys harvested from link removed for your dating experience, using the idiots like cannon fodder on the way to finding a long-lasting mate in future. I say this from experience, I have met more than one S. Asian woman on match who had zero romantic experience when they were younger, and now that they were 29-30, happily serially dating and ditching men on match in an effort to make up for lost time. And if you ask them, they would both claim they were in it to look for their soulmate. They probably don't even know themselves that they are behaving like d**ks and if you asked them, it's always the man's fault for never measuring up to their standards.

 

Yes, it's a grey area. No such thing as right or wrong.

 

But I would ask, if you decide to use men for experience - at least put that in your profile and be honest from square one that you are only looking, not buying.

 

In this thread, you're coming out very strongly in favour of dating with an "end view" in mind - a serious relationship. And the issue right now is that you are giving a guy second thoughts who (as Ariel said) is not even worth it. And like Ariel, I have to say it's little use entering a pool of men like in POF where many men are just out to get "some", then crying that you can't find any men who value commitment and importantly, value you and your feelings.

 

I don't get it. Maybe your remark about using men for experience was out of pure exasperation at the behaviour of some people on these dating sites. Believe me, I know what that's like.

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Hey icarus,

You are getting me wrong. Yes, I did think about registering on match to "get dates" but the intention was not to play with any man. The intention was to learn about men more so that I don't get played. I hope it makes sense. I went to a catholic girls school, have no brother, my dad was away for the most part. I have all cousin sisters, so I never really interacted with men. I used to stammer just talking to men. On top of it, I'm quite an introvert and honest person. So, I'm not aware of the games men play and I don't want to waste my time after a wrong guy anymore.

It wasn't really out of frustration but the problem I have is I'm too inexperienced in the world of dating and hence I get easily tricked. So, to be able to read men better, I was thinking of using some not-so-serious sites like match. Also through EH, the men that I was matched with, were very far away from me, so I couldn't meet many of them. I know I'm not looking to utilize anyone.

I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with some south Asian girls.

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I spent a bit more time reading a couple of recent threads of yours .... especially the ones where some other ENAers gave you some (often tough) advice about how you may be often shooting yourself in the foot.

 

I know this is off-topic to this thread, but I can't help but name-check them. There was one time a guy asked to reschedule a phone call, your response was a bright and cheerful "I'm busy" with absolutely no follow-up 'avenue', no alternative time suggested to him when he could call you. It is an example of how, without even intending to, you slam the door in someone's face.

 

As quite a dumb-a$$ guy who doesn't understand social situations an awful lot, even I know that if I got a message like that from a girl - I would be discouraged from trying to make another phone call. In fact, it bemuses me - having tried to date S. Asian women like I mentioned - that many of them, if they are like you, go round hurting men's feelings and destroying potential possibilities for a good connection - out of sheer ignorance, out of absolute fear. Tinu, I think this is why a few people have suggested some counselling for you - because you say you're scared of never getting married, yet you are even more scared of flirting or allowing a man to be close to you - in a physical or emotional sense.

 

Of course, many of the ENAers don't understand that as people from a minority group, you and I have a sense that we have to search for others like us ... and that's why you keep wondering about these men who live 8-9 hours away and wondering how to start something with them.

 

As you say your PhD is going to last another 1.5 years. Why not turn round to thinking of that time as a means to get yourself together, speak to a counsellor (even if only for a few sessions) about the *lessons learnt* from your experiences in online dating ... truly get what good benefit you can from all these harsh times ..

 

The latest guy who is the topic of this thread, even from a brief description of his on-off appearances, does not sound like someone who will stick with you with any commitment. It surprises me that you can't yet see that.

 

You know, I should be writing more angrily to you - because when I started reading your thread, I thought you were another of these arrogant idiot Indian women who have very little true life experience, yet expect everyone to treat them like a princess. But deep down, you're just as scared of some of the same things as I am. So I can't bring myself to be that angry.

 

Stop creating a mess, hurting nice guys, going after the rubbish ones (regardless of whether they are the ones to contact you first), and most of all, living with damage and heartache that poisons you from inside. Take a break from dating. You will never be too old to enjoy life.

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Tinu, are we seeing a pattern here yet? ](*,)

 

If the man is interested he WILL consistently communicate.

 

Not to brag, but I got into an accident on sunday and my car is gone.. But that did not stop me from proceeding with the date I have scheduled tomorrow evening. I am getting a rental car. I need to drive a long way to pick up the girl but I am doing it anyway. Because I am interested in getting to know her.

 

Just a thought.

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Other than the obvious issues that have been pointed out by people here I think the following are your problems:

 

He said "Have you decided not to initiate any phone calls?" He stopped calling after that. I didn't bother either coz I had lost patience.
I hardly call him. I don't normally call men. I let them call me. Once in a while, I call.
May be you are not, but it certainly looks like you are a very egoistic woman. Sorry if my assumption is wrong. You want men to make almost 90% of the effort. Yes, men have to approach women, start conversations, ask them out on a date, pay for the date, and call the first few times. But after that the female needs to start taking some initiative and put some effort. It has to be from both sides - men and women. Why would this guy ask you that question (about initiating calls)? Because you don't. Simple. Your own statement proves that. You got to change that behavior, Tinu.

 

Yes, I am looking only with an intention of getting married and I don't want to even go on a date with a man who is not looking for a serious relationship.
How will you know if the guy you chose to go on a date with is looking for a serious relationship and not just some fun? Because he will be Indian? If that is your assumption you are dead wrong. Indian men can also be out there just for some fun. If you don't even want to go on a date with a guy if a serious relationship cannot come out of it then Dating is not for you. Your expectations are just ridiculously high. The best option for you would be Arranged Marriage. Another thing is that - everything has to be according to you. You will only go out if a certain outcome is feasible but the men must not screen you out because you are still a student? Just like you they also have options and priorities.

 

I'm not aware of the games men play.
Wrong attitude. You got to change that. How do you know that women do not play any games? How do you know that YOU have not played any games? People some times do things unintentionally and that may come accross as playing games.

 

Of course there are men out there that want to play games. You must be careful and screen them out. But you don't. You continue contact with them, give them more and more chances, like the subject of this thread for example, and then sit and wonder 'wow men play lot of games'. Newsflash - you pursue men that play games. Stop that. For your own good.

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