For The Kids Sake

[John Bendix]

Surfjon has written to me and feels that we should start a new thread whose theme will concentrate on the effects of divorce on the children involved.

 

Should the parents consider staying together for the sake of the children?

 

And if the divorce is inevitable, what is the best way to raise the children?

 

If divorce is a means to an end, where do the children fit into this equation?

 

 

JN

[scared and alone]

you should NEVER stay together just for the kids. i know it sounds bad but it will only make things worse if they are around parents that are miserable with each other. and i'm a child of divorce saying this. I completely do not blame my dad for wanting to divorce my mother. I can't even stand her.

[melrich]

Should the parents consider staying together for the sake of the children?

 

I don't think you can make hard and fast rules on something like this. Generally I would say not because an unhappy household is probably the worse of two bads (unhappy vs separated). But there could well be situations where staying together does make sense, particularly if the two parents are still amicable and friendly with each other.

 

And if the divorce is inevitable, what is the best way to raise the children?

 

That's a really hard one. I guess you are talking about the level of custody? I think the first thing that has to be done is things are put into a formal agreement. Ideally I think this includes regular meeting scheduled between the parents where the children's welfare and upbringing is discussed and nothing else. First rule is never bad mouth each other too or in front of the children. Second rule is never try to adversly influence the kids against either parent.

 

In terms of custody, again I think it is hard to make rules. One of the first considerations has to be causing the kids as little disruption as possible. Other than that, I think as long as each parent has some formalised level of contact, then whatever suits the situation.

 

If divorce is a means to an end, where do the children fit into this equation?

 

Kids do adapt. Some better than others but where I have witnessed divorce first hand, those parents who put the concerns of their kids first, over and above their own, the adaption has been generally successful.

[WaterIsLife]

 

Should the parents consider staying together for the sake of the children?

 

 

This is a very good question.

 

I agree with the posters above that an unhappy situation should not be continued and will do the children more harm than good.

 

But I do wonder, how much do circumstances (children being obviously a MAJOR consideration in things) affect when someone gives up? There are certainly situations where a split SHOULD happen, no doubt about it. But I still wonder.

 

I don't have an answer to this, however I do have an experience to share. My mother passed away 4 years ago. My parents had been married since 1961. For a short while when I was small my parents separated (maybe 1978?, I don't remember anymore), my dad moved out, bought the middle-age crisis mobile, etc. But they got back together again and if you knew them later in life you never would have guessed that they had been separated and considering divorce at one time. My father, the chief bread-winner, had retired early (at the ripe old age of 52, woo hoo!) so they got to spend a lot of quality time together before my mother passed at too early an age (60). But during that time they were best of friends and soulmates.

 

Sorry to ramble, but my point is this: I recently had a good talk with my Dad about things. Live, love, relationships. The topic of my mother and their separation came up. He shared with me the reasons for their separation (his shacking up with another woman, something he is not proud of to this day) and he truly believed that if it was not for me and my brother that she would not have had him back. Interesting since she may have initially had him back so as to have the "provider" for me and my brother, but their love and affection for many years after were truly undeniable and a sight to behold. I don't think this would have happened if me and my brother had not been born.

[AnxiousGirl]

I believe the parents owe it to their children to try to make it work. I think divorce is really hard on a lot of kids. However, if there's too much fighting and chaos in the household it's not healthy for anyone. I think the children would benefit more in the long run if their parents were separated, and they no longer had to live in a household with constant tension.

 

Both parents should stay involved in their children's lives, if possible.

 

The parents should put their children first, and set aside their differences. They should try to make things as "normal" as possible for their kids sake.

[scared and alone]

Theres no way in HELL my parents could have made it work and i'm so glad for my dad forgetting out of there. He was still every bit of a parent to us even though he didn't live there anymore. Even more in fact. I'm glad they got divorced.

[Minky]

I agonised over this question for nearly a year. Should I stay with my husband for the sake of the children? There was tension, squabbling, but no violence or loud screeching fights between us. However, when I fast forwarded to fifteen years time when the kids had left home and I would be on my own with him (and older), I knew immediately what had to be done. This may not appeal but I learned that I had to love myself first and foremost if I was to be any sort of parent to my kids. And that meant leaving my husband. I have tried very very hard to keep things amicable. I don't bad mouth him, I involve him in decisions that have to be made regarding the kids, he even comes round to dinner sometimes or just pops round - he still has a set of keys at the moment. Having said that, I have to say that I personally feel total indifference towards him - he is something I have to tolerate because we have children together. But I have no wish to be friends with him. How all of this may affect the kids is yet to be seen but I am hopeful.

[confusedmama]

I tried for 2 years to stay together for "the sake of the children", it mainly meant that the boys saw me being taken advantage of and feeling the tension in the house. They also saw their father acting inappropiately with other women (flirting, etc) while married. The more I thought about it the more I realized I was doing them a disservice as well as myself.

 

Fast forward to the present-the kids only do well if BOTH parents put themselves last and the kids first. Even after almost 4 years of separation/divorce I am still struggling with the behaviors of the boys caused by the break-up of the family. If only 1 parent puts the kids first-everybody pays and the parent that is giving and the kids get taken advantage of in the relationship. Ususally the kids get stuck in the middle and that is no where for children.

 

Looking for my own answers, wish I had them.

[surfjon]

As a dad currently alternating weekends for about 5 months now, I had wondered how much that particular method of "shuffling" kids around affected them.

 

What many people have told me is that it starts of ok, as the kids are adapting to new residences whether the mom ar dad moves, one is in a new location. I happen to be in the house we own because she walked, I did not. She has a townhome where the kids are in an excellent school district, we agreed they would have to be with her due to my work schedule and their school districts here went from goo to terrible. My house happens to be for sale so that I'm able tomove closer to them but the market stinks.

 

What I'm also told, and what makes a bit of sense to me is that as time goes on, and children "settle-in" more at their primary residences, make friends, develop activities and social cirlces. Additionally, it cannot be avoided that the closeness and social circles once had at the original family residence would begin to diminish as less and less time is spent with them and they are now at different schools. I feel it's unavoidable that the old relationships become secondary, they are hard to maintain part-time for a child. The desire to leave the now popular and socially centered "main" home every other weekend and go to the old, original residence becomes something they don't want to do, and begin to show outward unhappiness and displeasure at having to go. This can end up as a resentment towards the parent who is not the full-time parent,and the child not wanting to leave the "main residence" and their full-time friends. I especially see soon that my 15 year old daughter will not be wanting to leave her social circle and friends at all, she's already starting a bit.

 

Might be better for them to just stay in one spot all the time and only come to me a couple nights. It might be more stable for them, but I'd sure miss them. Maybe just do more "outings" as to not do all the shuffling about, but it's fun to have sleepovers.

 

I guess there are no winners in any of this.

[John Bendix]

Minky,

 

 

"This may not appeal but I learned that I had to love myself first and foremost if I was to be any sort of parent to my kids. And that meant leaving my husband."

 

I have heard this before but I do not know what it means. I do not want to get into your personal life.

[jessyd]

you should NEVER stay together just for the kids. i know it sounds bad but it will only make things worse if they are around parents that are miserable with each other. and i'm a child of divorce saying this. I completely do not blame my dad for wanting to divorce my mother. I can't even stand her.

 

This is what I'm afraid of! I don't want any of my children to think that about either one of their parents. I believe I am a good mother and I think my husband is a great father but I would never allow my children to think badly of him in any way and I hope that he would do the same when it comes to me.

[benga]

A very interesting post and many thanks for starting a thread on a very important subject matter.

 

Should parents stay together for the sake of children. Honestly, NO. It is very difficult to be a good parent to your child if you aren't happy inwardly. Being a superficial while parenting could be more damaging to the child in the long run. Neglect creeps in which is altogether not healthy. Children do feel at times responsible for the separation of their parents and irrespective of what the outcome really is, it is critical for parents to keep re-assuring their children that they love them and the issues between the parents have nothing to do with them.

 

During a separation or divorce, children to feel the impact of the pulls of either parent and I have experienced this first hand. It is natural for a child to want both parents. When they are young, they simply cant understand or express themselves. But they do undergo a deep psychological trauma as a result.

 

In my daughter, I sense a great deal of insecurity, confusion, sadness..... Unfortunately, there is nothing I can do about this situation. As much as I may have liked (earlier) to have her mother home, there is nothing I can do about the situation. All I can do is be the best parent and a dad for her and take care of all her needs.....emotionally and psychologically. I did see a child psychologist and got an understanding of how kids think. Divorce and separation does have a lasting impact on their minds and inwardly, children do hold themselves partly responsible. They display behaviours that border insecurity. However, children are resilient. They get used to situations much faster than adults do. They are able to process pain, hurt etc much faster than adults do....

 

if divorce is inevitable, the best way to deal with the situation would be a) to be cordial with the X. Keep conversations limited to the welfare and stability of the children. It is important that the children don't see conflicting parents. A good mutual child custody arrangement should be in order which doesn't result in a conflict between parents. A family meal or an outing periodically should be planned with both parents involved.

 

If divorce is a means to an end - I guess the kids will figure it out soon enough. They are resilient and will be able to adjust if relations between parents are kept cordial. I have heard that its better for the children to be raised by 2 happy parents living separately than to be in a home full of bickering and fighting.

 

My two cents...... I am in the middle of this myself....

[RayKay]

As a child of divorce, I personally think "no". My parents divorced when I was 7; my father was having another affair. He went on to marry his mistress, and my mum met my wonderful stepfather (while never married, they have been together over 22 years) a while later.

 

The only thing I can "complain" about is my father kind of decided that he had a "new family" now and decided to not pay so much attention to his "first family" and he was rather bad about some other issues....BUT...my mother never spoke badly of him (and he did not of my mum either) and always encouraged him to see us....just after a while he became what they term a "ghost dad" of sorts (I really pity him more than anything, and am resentful more for the effect it had on my siblings whom were younger than me)....but I certainly prefer that to them having stayed together. Seeing my mum miserable and seeing how he treated the marriage was certainly far worse.

 

I think it should always be a last resort (though in cases of abuse/infidelity...much much sooner than say "boredom") and couples owe it to one another, and the children, to try every other avenue (be it marriage counseling, etc) but I do not think they should stay together and be miserable if they cannot work it out.

 

Divorce/separation will be tough on any family.....but for me personally it is a better option than raising children in a household where the parents are not getting alone and are actually teaching their own children what to expect (or settle for) in their own future relationships. I hear of the rare case where parents stick together and "get along" until the kids go off to college, but the couple people I know (the children) whom had that happen felt even worse as if their entire lives had been a lie of sorts....

 

Other times those whom stuck together still dated others which I know really messed the children up....

 

Children are very intuitive and know something is amiss when it is.

 

The best way to make it as "easy" as possible is keep the issues of divorce between you & the ex. Deal with support issues, custody privately. Never speak badly of the other parent. Encourage & facilitate visitation. Foster the continuation of their role as a PARENT (not just as "access parent"). My mother, bless her heart, was truly wonderful at this, even though my dad failed to take advantage of that!

[just M.E.]

I believe there are marriages that are "toxic" or very bad for all parties. Some involve dysfunctional parties and are emotionally unhealthy, some are simply the case to two people that are horribly wrong for each other. I do believe it is not healthy for a child to grow up in a emotionally unhealthy marriage. They learn roles through their parents that they will continue in life. This isn't always the case, but it more often than not, I believe it happens.

I have also known those who have stayed together for the children, but it takes TWO people working diligently together to keep that family life healthy, that is an extremely difficult task and it is a rare combination of two people who can do that.

 

I still believe that any person with a conscious and compassion struggles with these concepts. There are no perfect answers. My daughter could not have done well being raised in the emotional chaos of my marriage to her father but she would have been better in a balanced and healthy family. Unfortunately, we can't always snap our fingers and make that appear, because of what she learned she is more mature and committed in her life than she might have been if she had not experienced the life she did.

[newstart56]

When my H told me he had met someone else but he wanted to stay married and in our home "for the kids" but that he would continue to see her fairly regularly, I was in such a state of shock and disbelief that I believed this would be for the best. As we continued on and I began to wake up with help from counseling and anti-depressants, I began to question whether this was really what was best. Of course, the feeback from some other posting sites like this of "What are you thinking" and "How can you let him have his cake and eat it to" kind of helped.

The post that really hit home was simply this - would I want someone to treat my daughter the way I am being treated? Would I want my son to believe it is ok to treat someone like this? Is this what I want them to know of how relationships are supposed to be.

 

Wow - what simply posed questions that never occurred to me. I guess that should be the question to ask yourself. Is the situation the kids are observing the lesson(s) you want them to take forward?

[John Bendix]

I think that repeated infidelity and abuse seem to be situations where the kids would be better off living away from that parent. No child needs to live with a parent that goes to such lengths of self absorbed behavior or emotional instability. Especially when they refuse to acknowledge their problems and seek help.

 

I guess my questions pertains more to the couple with children that are not getting along, connecting, or seem to be induvidually unhappy.

[confusedmama]

I think the answer that lies in the fact that most people when they are unhappy, not getting along or not connecting then begin to become self-absorbed and selfish which can then lead to the abuse and affairs. It seems to be a circular issue.

[John Bendix]

Confusedmama,

 

If this is true in some instances, is it emotional withdrawal that can be construed for selfishness and self-absorbtion?

 

What if the affairs and the abuse never occur?

[confusedmama]

I think there is a difference between emotional withdrawal and selfishness/self-absorbtion. I guess I feel that most people who are considered selfish or self-absorbed have been that way from the beginning, it doesn't "just happen". Emotional withdrawal while it doesn't just happen can usually be traced back to a problem or even a perceived problem.

 

I think the issue, if there aren't affairs and abuse, comes from the "perception" of the person who is withdrawing. There are some underlying issues that aren't being communicated between the partners and this festers in the relationship.

[John Bendix]

Confusedmama,

 

 

I have to agree with you. That was very well put.

[just M.E.]

My experience was that when I found every effort I made ineffectual, I withdrew emotionally in the end as a form of self preservation. I went through the motions, I behaved on the surface very much as I had before, but I had become numb emotionally in order to continue but then I was the recipient of continual emotional abuse.

 

John - I thoughtof the parties in a toxic relationship or marriage should escape, but even when I can see that in others, I never allowed that measure of retreat in myself. I required myself to continue on, almost an obsessive determination.

[shoppingGirl]

I am a child of divorce...but my situation is a little different. My mom left us with my dad when I was 8 so I felt really abandoned. So yes I do wish they could have stayed together for us...but I know in some cases it's not possible to do this. Most kids want their parents to stay together no matter what.

[John Bendix]

Anna,

 

Yes, it is true that some children of divorce hope that their parents will get back together no matter if it is 2,5,10, or even 20 years down the road.

 

M.E.,

 

Emotional withrawal can be used by both partners, no matter what dynamic they are engaged in. In the Walkaway scenario, having both parties emotionally withdrawal from one another and the relationship may be one of the most prevalent events. It further halts any meaningful communication between the spouses.

[confusedmama]

I think emotional withdrawal for protection purposes-thank you M.E. for making me face that issue again, I always seem to overlook it (protecting hm or me?? old habits die hard)-is a completely different dynamic than emotional withdrawal for personal perceptions. It is a dynamic of abuse.

 

I kinda think that in a walkaway scenario it isn't just emotional withdrawal that is causing the walkaway. The emotional withdrawal is simply a sign of something deeper and until or IF the couple gets into the deeper issue the withdrawal will continue until the relationship is done.

 

You find that even in cases of physical abuse children want their parents together, especially with mid-teens and younger. I know that when my parents divorced when I was 20 I had no dreams or wants for them to get back together, while my brother at age 16 did have some issues with it.

[just M.E.]

When I was teen, my parents fought .. a lot, and I wanted it to end even if divorce was the answer. That was nearly 40 yrs ago and they will be married 65 yrs this summer, and doing great. I learned much watching this process they went through.