need to get it out..

[sibling295]

oh Dont worry kellbell , hey if none of us ever felt hurt or sad , we would never know true bliss!!!

 

Also - relationshipcoach once said to another poster this:

 

"Hope is something we hold onto until we realize we are holding someone else."

 

God , dont you love that , i swear i love that quote!!!!

[Hope75]

Hi sib,

 

Can I ask you something? If you want more than anything to get married, and he does not, how can he be the right one for you?

 

You've been with him for almost 2 years already. What is six months going to change for you?

 

Do you think you are going to change your mind about wanting to get married?

 

He's certainly not going to change his mind, he's made if completely clear that he is just not interested.

 

Oh honey, I hate to see you waste another six months and then have to go through this all over again because he will still be telling you then what he's telling you now, that he will never marry you.

[sibling295]

True Hope ,very true.

You make perfect sense.

 

And to answer your question. He is not the right one for me.

Not the right one , because of one reason , marriage.

wait , maybe two reasons , kids

 

so - here i am

in love with not the one.

 

Maybe six months is too long - maybe i will come to my conclusion much more sooner...I dont know..

But - I do know that i have to see , am i in love with this man

or am i in love with my fantasy marriage

 

I still want to give it my six months MAXIMUM..

 

By June the (war) will be over. For Sure . And i more than willing to accept possible death. The only good thing is i wont really die , a whole new world will be in front of me.

Whould any of you guys tell the guy - or keep it to yourself. I am not really giving HIM an ultimatium. So how would you phrase it?

[Hope75]

What exactly would you tell him?

 

That you need six months to see if you really love him?

 

Or that you are giving him six months to propose?

 

If it's the latter, he's likely to tell you that you will be wasting your time, since he does not want to get married, and 6 months won't change that.

 

If it's the first, he's likely to tell you that if you don't know now, after 2 years, why bother?

 

It just seems futile and like you are prolonging the inevitable. You are giving up what you want for this relationship, don't you think you will resent him forever for that, and later, resent yourself for allowing it?

[Itsok]

How are you doing now? Did you break things off? I hope you are doing alright

[sibling295]

Hi itsok ,

Nope nothing yet. Two of our friends are leaving town next week , tonight is his buddies party - i told him to go w/out me (its all his bachelor friends) and have fun. Tomorrow night is our couples friends going away party so we have plans to go.

Tonight i drove to my mom's house , we watched Million Dollar Baby -my god , i thought it was about a friggin boxer who wins in the end.But no, it was soooo depressing!!! Geez .

I dont know my plans exactly - i spoke to my girlfriend who said , you guys just got back together , try to go at least a month before bringing up marriage Sib.

Anyway - i am feeling like i am regaining the power over my life and my choices. I do love him and i hope he turns out to be the one. We shall see.

Also - i like the feeling when i remind myself , its me who decides my fate.

If he isnt up to it , then another man will be. It feel exciting again.

One day i will be married , and one day i will have my own family.

Hope its him , but if not i know i will be okay.

sib

[sibling295]

also -i have found writing these thoughts out and getting advice REALLY REALLY helps.I dont know how else to explain it - except it kind of clears the fog. So thanks All who read !

[Hope75]

I dont know my plans exactly - i spoke to my girlfriend who said , you guys just got back together , try to go at least a month before bringing up marriage Sib.

Anyway - i am feeling like i am regaining the power over my life and my choices. I do love him and i hope he turns out to be the one. We shall see.

Also - i like the feeling when i remind myself , its me who decides my fate.

If he isnt up to it , then another man will be. It feel exciting again.

One day i will be married , and one day i will have my own family.

Hope its him , but if not i know i will be okay.

 

Hey Sibling,

 

See, here's where you lose me.

 

You are talking about still wondering if he is the one and waiting longer to see if he will ask you.

 

But, as plain as day, in crystal clear language, with no room for interpretation, he said to you:

 

I never want to get married. Not to you, not to anyone. I am just not interested in marriage.

 

If he said that, and you want to get married, what is waiting and not pressuring him going to change? He does not want to get married. He's not saying, " Well Gee, I'm not sure, maybe someday..." or, "Yes, I definitely want to get married someday but not any time soon.", or, "Yes.."

 

It's very clear that he does not want to get married, honey. As hard at that is, and as wonderful as you are (and I know that you are), he is not interested in the concept of marriage.

 

If you stay with him, waiting and hoping.... you are not going to get what you want, and even though he has told you this, very clearly, you may begin to resent him and yourself.

[Itsok]

Sorry, but I agree with Hope.

 

He isn't the one for you, he can't be. If you want marriage and he doesn't, that's the clear sign. You can give him another 15 years, he will never propose, he's told you clearly he doesn't want to marry you. Sadly in his mind you are a convenient alternative to having no one.

 

If he truly loves you, he would have at least gotten engaged to you by now because he knows how important marriage is to you. Why would you take him back after the break up if nothing was resolved?

 

Of course you love him, of course it will hurt, but the reality is that if he wanted to get married, he would have married you by now. He's had 7 years! How many more are you willing to waste? If you really want to get married and have children, you are losing time! Not many women want to become a mother at age 50.

 

I know many women like you. They are caring, good-hearted and loving women who give all they have to these men who have no desire to commit in any fashion. I can tell you the ending to each one: the woman breaks up within 10-15 years because he tells her over and over that he isn't ready to get married, doesn't want to get married, doesn't want this or that....the list is endless.

 

If you broke it off and said you are not getting back together until he proposes what do you think he would do? If he wouldn't get back with you because of that, that's not love. That's dependance on a familiar situation. If he loved you he would have proposed so this problem wouldn't come up over and over again, and because he loves you and realizes how badly this hurts you.

 

Inside, you already know that we are right and that you are wasting your time, but there's something holding you back: it's called fear of change, and clinging to this familiar situation.

 

If you want to, enjoy the ride. But the end result will be the same. You'll have wasted more and more time with someone who is not willing to commit, instead of spending your time looking for someone who wants what you do.

 

I'm sorry if this was harsh, but it is truth.

 

Hugs to you...

[sibling295]

I hear what you all are saying.

I guess i am just not prepaired to give up , just yet.

I need to keep building up my confidence. Keep working on myself a bit.

When i do leave him , i just want to make sure i am making the right decision.

I have never give him an ultimatum. I never said , lets get married or i am out of here.

All i have ever said was i wouldnt move in with him without a ring and a date.

You guys are right i am probably just hopeing he will change his mind.

God this is soooo hard.

Well , my chin is up and my eyes are open.

I guess its a start.

hugs to all

sib

[Hope75]

Hi Sibling,

 

Of course it is hard. You love him, and it's not your fault or anything that you did that makes him not want to get married, it's just his own choice and preference.

 

((HUGS))

 

The longer you stay, the harder it will be to leave him. I've seen this before... I have a friend who is 32 now and has been with her guy over 10 years. They do live together, and more than anything she wanted/wants to get married and have a family. He does not. I don't see her much anymore, but when I do and I ask her how she is... her eyes are so sad and she looks so broken. She won't leave him and she knows he will never give her what she truly wants.

 

 

I can tell by your passion about marriage that you want that very badly. I can see that you want to be with a man who loves you so much that he wants to marry you and spend the rest of his life as your husband, to have children with you, and to be a family.

 

You deserve that! You deserve the type of commitment you want, and there are good men out there who will give that to you.

 

The thing is, it is not fair to yourself or to your boyfriend to hang around with false expectations. He does not want to get married, not to you, or anyone. He is firm and clear on that, and has even told you that if that is what you want from life, you should leave him, and find that for yourself.

 

To me that seems a pretty clear indicator that he's never going to change his mind. Think about it: He'd rather lose you than marry you. He told you this!

 

Oh, honey, building up your self esteem is something that you will only be able to do for yourself, and as long as you stay with him out of fear of being without him or of being alone, your self esteem is not going to improve. You are settling. Don't do that to yourself.

 

You desserve more.

 

((HUGS))

[RayKay]

Agree with Hope, every word of it.

 

I TOO know many women whom have stuck around for YEARS..not just one or two, but 5, 10, 15 years with men they wanted to marry but whom did not want to marry them. Some of them said..."one day", others said "no way", but in either case, the actions were pretty clear that there was no intent or plan to marry them.

 

Some of these women broke it off eventually, others were dumped sadly as their man found someone else.

 

Honey, there just is no compromise here, he has been VERY clear, and you are fortunate in that really, but even so, you are still ignoring that. Do you really think staying around another few months is going to help? How is that going to boost your self esteem to be with someone whom everyday makes it clear he does not want the same thing by NOT proposing and by telling you he does not want marriage? That will only make it feel worse in my opinion. You ARE settling, because you are staying with someone whom is incompatible and you know it. Only YOU can create your own happiness.

 

Your friend was wrong in telling you to wait a month to bring it up, because really, what will that do? Nothing. He has said very clearly he does NOT want to get married. If you do, then you should make a choice to leave because he is NOT the one whom is going to propose.

 

You are not prepared to give up "just yet", but honey, he has had SEVEN YEARS. If it has not happened now, I am afraid it won't in the next six months either. Men don't marry you based on ultimatums, or deadlines, or a refusal to move in before a ring. They marry you because they WANT to, because they LOVE you, because they do not want to risk losing you. They want to share their life with you, be your partner, not have you with anyone else. In my opinion if someone married me due to pressure or an ultimatum, I would forever be feeling dread at when they would decide this was not what they wanted after all. He has already made it clear he does not want it.

 

Don't waste the pretty.

[Scout]

Although I agree with most of the points made by the posters here, I do want to point out there are couples who simply don't believe in legalizing their partnership, yet they have every intention of staying together for the rest of their lives. So, marriage doesn't necessarily mean a more committed love than any other kind.

 

That being said, it requires both partners to believe this for it to really be the truth. And, this belief is an indication of a very free spirit type of personality, a worldview that is different than most others'. If your partner has that view and you don't, that means there is a fundamental difference between the two of you. I wonder if this difference doesn't show up in other areas of your relationship? Are you really sure he's the one for you?

[RayKay]

Although I agree with most of the points made by the posters here, I do want to point out there are couples who simply don't believe in legalizing their partnership, yet they have every intention of staying together for the rest of their lives. So, marriage doesn't necessarily mean a more committed love than any other kind.

 

That being said, it requires both partners to believe this for it to really be the truth. And, this belief is an indication of a very free spirit type of personality, a worldview that is different than most others'. If your partner has that view and you don't, that means there is a fundamental difference between the two of you. I wonder if this difference doesn't show up in other areas of your relationship? Are you really sure he's the one for you?

 

Scout, I agree, and never said otherwise! In my first post I did say that neither of them is wrong..he is not wrong for not wanting it, she is not wrong for wanting it. But they are incompatible in what they want in their future together and cannot expect the other to give up their desires either.

 

My mother and stepfather are not married, and been together 20+ years. Neither of them has wanted to get married, and they are honestly my role model couple...they are friends, lovers, supporters. He is by her side as she battles cancer. They are 100% committed, and raised all of us kids together.

 

However, I DO want to get married, for ME. I know I do not have to, but I do want to marry my partner. And if I was with someone whom never wanted to get married, I just would not feel comfortable with giving that up, nor pressuring them to marry me. And I think the poster is in that situation.

 

It is pretty clear SHE does want it, even if he is fine just being together, as she has brought it up numerous times. I don't think any of them should give in at all, just realize their dreams don't mesh and move on to find people whom believe in the same...they are out there.

[Scout]

Oh, I want to get married, too lol. I just was wondering if the OP is so fixated on the marriage issue that she might be overlooking some other areas that indicate long-term incompatibility. I do think many of us sometimes concentrate more on the idea of marriage than the actual partner we have in front of us. Based on your posts, I'm sure that's not the case with you and your man!

 

How lovely of a relationship your mom and step-dad have. That would be my role model, too. Glad he's sticking by her - some marital partners have actually left their spouses when illness occurs, so there you go once again - marriage is no guarantee of commitment, although typically I do think people try to make relationships work when that commitment is in place. Typically - not always.

[RayKay]

Oh, I want to get married, too lol. I just was wondering if the OP is so fixated on the marriage issue that she might be overlooking some other areas that indicate long-term incompatibility. I do think many of us sometimes concentrate more on the idea of marriage than the actual partner we have in front of us. Based on your posts, I'm sure that's not the case with you and your man!

 

How lovely of a relationship your mom and step-dad have. That would be my role model, too. Glad he's sticking by her - some marital partners have actually left their spouses when illness occurs, so there you go once again - marriage is no guarantee of commitment, although typically I do think people try to make relationships work when that commitment is in place. Typically - not always.

 

I know, sad isn't it?

 

When my mum first was diagnosed, I was doing lots of reading about other women's stories on breast cancer. Found a lot of them had their partners leave after mastectomies were done..married or not....so sad

 

When my mum told us, my boyfriend was there with me. I was obviously sad, but also scared, as we have a very strong history and it just reaffirmed that I will likely fight the same battle in my not too distant future, and he quickly told me he loves my breasts, but he would love them even if they were chicken cutlets (ie fakies after a mastectomy) as what matters most is me...awww! I wish more people had that attitude

[Scout]

You know, Ray Kay, I often think about the future and if my current boyfriend would be someone who would stick by in times of trouble. We've only been going out a short while, but so far, this relationship seems very different than previous ones, and I can honestly say he seems like the type that would support me in a situation like you describe, too. One can never guarantee what another will do until the situation actually happens, but our gut instincts are often good indicators.

[RayKay]

You know, Ray Kay, I often think about the future and if my current boyfriend would be someone who would stick by in times of trouble. We've only been going out a short while, but so far, this relationship seems very different than previous ones, and I can honestly say he seems like the type that would support me in a situation like you describe, too. One can never guarantee what another will do until the situation actually happens, but our gut instincts are often good indicators.

 

Yup, it took me many years to learn to listen to my gut, even if my heart was blabbering something else differently....

 

Ultimately I learned it's a good thing when BOTH gut and heart are in agreement...when they aren't, well it's a sure sign of trouble!

 

So glad you are happy Scout, sounds like things are going very well!

[Hope75]

Hey Sibling,

 

How are you doing?

[sibling295]

Hi guys,

One thing i want to point out - I dont know where the confusion has been - it has NOT been seven years - it is coming on to two years. Including the break up three months ago - that lasted about a month and a half.

I couldnt imagine SEVEN YEARS with him at my age with out getting married.

Anyway - last night , i told him that since our relationship will not end in marriage it basically is going to end soon.

I told him i no longer was going to be coming over every night , things have to change. I told him i needed to start thinking with my head and not my heart.I also explained how scared i am to do this - but that i was going to stick with it. He asked how long are you gonna stay with me? I said i wasnt sure , i love you , i am confused but i deserve to be happy too. He was definetly in shock. At first he said I was crazy. He said " its coming up on our two year anniversary, I said I know , after two years you should know.

He asked about my family - they are VERY close. This is gonna be sooo hard on them. Oh god , thats what hurts allot.

I left this morning , actually very cheery. I am tired of being pissed off at him for not marrying me. He said when can i see you again , i said not sure , I will call you later. He also said "why prolong this? Why not break up now." I said maybe thats a better idea" He said "No , please , lets both think about this"

There was no crying , it was all pretty mature - except for the fact that I am still in denial! LOL

I will continue to need support , please keep my updated on everyone's thoughts. I helps , i swear.

It keeps my chin up and me thinking positive.

Thank you all for your ears and eyes!

I dont know if he was serious about thinking about it. I asked him ,"Does this mean you are gonna give it some thought?" He said "YES" but not sure if that is just a lie to keep me around. Whatever - got to think about me right now - not him.

I know allot of you think i should just end it completely , but i can't. I am taking baby steps . I am proud of these baby steps, at least.

So onward - thanks

Sib

[sibling295]

Can anyone recomend some books on my situation?

[Hope75]

Hi Sib,

 

I'm glad to hear that you are thinking about yourself first, at least a little bit.

 

Your guy has been very honest with you- I would hope that by him saying yes he would think about things, he would be continuing to be honest. I would be cautious though, as he's been very firm about saying he does not want to get married.

 

Maybe if he really begins to realize that he will lose you, he will realize what you mean to him and reconsider.

 

I think it's important NOT to give him an ultimatum... since guys do not respond favorably to them and it's not the way you'd want someone to marry you anyway.

 

But is IS important to realize what you want from a relationship and if your needs are not being met, it is not wrong to end the relationship. Two separate things.

 

Keep us updated, you have lots of support here.

[Hope75]

Mun always recommends a good one:

 

"Why Men Love B*tches"

 

link removed

 

I think it's about knowing what you deserve and standing up for it... but I haven't read it myself.

[sibling295]

Thanks Hope , I keep hearing about that book, i have to read it.

Thanks for the compliment on me thinking about myself - it helps!

I am going out with my girlfriend tonight. Nope not waiting to see if he calls me tonight , nope ,not me LOL!!!!

I keep thinking about him saying basically how happy he would be if i found a man who would marry me. He said a couple days ago"I would think to myself , well she found her happiness"

So I said "um yah that means you would let me go rather than marry me?"

He kept tripping on his words like well thats not entirely what i mean.

God , i dont know who is more pathetic here.

Anyway - So life continues forward.

Thank god for my treadmill!!!!!

[RayKay]

Hey Sib,

 

Hm, not sure where I got 7 years either, saw someone else mention it and assumed that they knew more then I did! Heh.

 

You are not pathetic. I think you did a very brave thing - by letting him know where you stand, and also taking some steps to be strong....I say continue doing what you are doing - and if you still want to give it that bit of time, do, but be sure you are ready to walk if you feel he is just talking to keep you around, or of course he is still saying no way.....this may show him that being with you does not mean he loses independence, that you want him for him, but also want to be married...and you are not going to sit around and wait for him forever, and I hope you don't.

 

I keep thinking about him saying basically how happy he would be if i found a man who would marry me. He said a couple days ago"I would think to myself , well she found her happiness"

 

I can see why that comment would bother you, I had an ex whom would say the same thing! I always felt the same...um...what about you? Why would you not be that man...lol. Turns out he was not, but that was okay, as things turned out much better anyway.

 

Sib, you will be fine, no matter what happens. Be strong. And run your heart out anytime you get stressed and anxious....the power of sweat is pretty amazing!