Needy People..

[tiredofvampires]

I would even go so far as to say I find the statement, "I'm not really 'the giving' type unless I get PAID" possibly indicative of something about how you're faring with women. I know it sounds far-fetched. People don't have to actively do volunteer work to be decent people, or to score. But to have the attitude, "hey, what's in it for me?" or "when does this reward me?" and to feel sickened at the idea of serving/helping may well indirectly and globally touch every aspect of your interactions with a superficial self-centeredness that is palpable to women, even in situations that have nothing to do with "volunteering" per se.

 

Being the "giving type" is integral to love, Dougie.

 

I know you're talking about dating.

 

But even in flirting, women like to see signs that you have emotional capacity -- unless they just want one night of sex.

[bulletproof]

I would even go so far as to say I find the statement, "I'm not really 'the giving' type unless I get PAID" possibly indicative of something about how you're faring with women. I know it sounds far-fetched.

 

I don't think it sounds far-fetched at all. I agree with the idea that while someone don't necessarily have to volunteer to be a good person, hating the mere idea of volunteering says a lot about a person. Love does indeed involve giving, and if you are not willing to do that in any area of your life, chances are you will not be so willing in a relationship, either.

[CMS]

Ask open ended questions, engage them in conversation and listen to what they have to say. Make them talk about themselves and go from there, tease them a bit, lean back, be indifferent about getting laid because you are just out having a good time, having that mentality will keep you relaxed. Based on what you said I am sure you are giving out a desperate or needy vibe with your approach, girls can feel it, hows your body language? hows your eye contact? do you have a plan? start conversation by observing what they are doing, if she is reading a book at the bar, or drinking a glass of wine then ask for opinion on that phone or wine, ask they why they got it, what make them get it, and the often times their answer will point to you exactly what you need to say.

 

Dude you say you are confident and not needy, but your initial post is anything but that, it screams that why dont anyone likes me and I bet your body language and demeanor shows that too, find your oasis, you are good at indie music right? then find where do those hipster chicks hang out and you can talk about music together.

 

Also be willing to walk away from conversation, dont be oblivious and overstay your welcome. Dont be a clown, tease a girl, act like you can care less about getting into her pants.

 

Lastly, I fly solo in bars all the time and trust me, it works, just need to have right attitude.

[Dougie_D]

About Volunteering: If I have friends that need help with something I can be giving. I am good tipper. I listen when my roommate cries about her work and her boy problems. I can show love and be emotional.

 

I just don't LIKE the surroundings and such. I don't have anybody (friends or family) that volunteers either or I don't know any homeless people. Also, it's less about the giving part...I think I was be over dramatic on that. I've gave people a dollar there and dollar here. If it FEELS like physical WORK then I won't like it. Now, if it's a setting where I'm in a room and we just TALK about things...that can be fun and stuff. All volunteers have some coordinator like a boss too. All volunteering is working for FREE. It's compensated by the fact that you do it for the "right cause"

 

Oh and by the way...I SCREWED UP again! Argh! I can't pick up the little things...Or do you think I'm over analyzing this?

 

A girl last night kept on asking about the music business. I wasn't sure if she interested in me or just trying to learn something. Also, when I said I from TN she asked me why I was out her, bla ,bla, bla...I felt like she was interested in ME?! And then I realized today I really screwed up when she said

"How are the Tennessee girls compared to the Southern Cali girls"? She was born and raised a Southern Cali girl...Was that a HINT? OR was that just a question? I never know. Girls have to be blunt...I don't understand these damn hints...was it a hint???!!! Argh!!!

[CMS]

Dude, 95% of the girls are not going to be blunt with you, its just not how they operate, girls give subtle hints or indicators that shows they are interested. If she ask you about music, talk about music, demonstrate to her your knowledge about music, then cut the conversation off at high point and close the deal, get her number by saying "I really enjoyed this conversation, you need to give me your number so we can talk more about music sometime".

 

Who knows if TN girl thing is a hint? drop it, you are going to drive yourself crazy.

[CMS]

Seriously dude, you sound like you need a lot of work. I want you to google David DeAngelo and read or listen to all his stuff, especially on inner games, man you need professional help, this is beyond what this board can offer

[tiredofvampires]

Dude, 95% of the girls are not going to be blunt with you, its just not how they operate, girls give subtle hints or indicators that shows they are interested. If she ask you about music, talk about music, demonstrate to her your knowledge about music, then cut the conversation off at high point and close the deal, get her number by saying "I really enjoyed this conversation, you need to give me your number so we can talk more about music sometime".

 

Who knows if TN girl thing is a hint? drop it, you are going to drive yourself crazy.

 

I just wanted to say this would feel like a slap to my face (unless it's followed by, "I hate to do this, but I have to go -- my friend needs to get home, he's not feeling too well and I'm the designated driver" or something real like that) -- it would make me feel like I was being toyed with, that the conversation was just a ploy to "set the stage" rather than genuine interest, and I'd actually write a guy off for doing this to me. I don't care how charming you are -- you just overestimated yourself, bub.

 

But I know you've had success, cmswifty, so I can't argue with that. I just wanted to give my reaction, and though I may be a little outside the "norm" in some ways, I can't believe this would work for every girl. Maybe in this type of venue though with girls that frequent it. I don't know. Just my gut reaction.

 

But I agree with you that girls are going to be subtle.

 

I think it comes down to having the ability to interpret what they said in either light, and using provocative (but equally ambiguous) responses to gauge which direction it's going. That's the key to flirtation.

[Alezia]

When you put it in perspective, if he can cut a conversation on a high point he has 2 things going for him: 1. he's meeting enough women to have conversations with, 2. he's actually relating to the woman. As much as I think these games and pick up techniques are silly, the OP is even worst off!

[Dougie_D]

So, I'm asking... Did I make a MISTAKE? The only mistake I felt like I made was that I didn't end up asking her number...but because she was really asking me more questions about the music business, I felt comfortable just giving her my Business Card would "WOW" her even more...making a point that I was not lying to her that I work in the field.

 

What threw me the curve ball was win she asked me UNRELATED music questions. That's when I wasn't sure what was going on.

 

I shouldn't worry about though. Is it REALLY that easy to CLOSE the deal? I mean, one poster did agree that "it would have been a slap in the face."

 

Is there a TIME limit. Like if we have talked over 30 minutes, no matter what the topic is, it's a good indication that she would want to continue and I could get the number?

[Generation]

So, I'm asking... Did I make a MISTAKE? The only mistake I felt like I made was that I didn't end up asking her number...but because she was really asking me more questions about the music business, I felt comfortable just giving her my Business Card would "WOW" her even more...making a point that I was not lying to her that I work in the field.

 

That's good enough.

 

What threw me the curve ball was win she asked me UNRELATED music questions. That's when I wasn't sure what was going on.

 

I shouldn't worry about though. Is it REALLY that easy to CLOSE the deal? I mean, one poster did agree that "it would have been a slap in the face."

 

Why did unrelated to music questions throw you off? What were they?

 

It's as easy as asking or giving your information, and heading out. The reason I say 'heading out' is because you fly solo, so you're not going back to your friends so you can't say you're gonna go check up on them or something. Ending it abruptly and going elsewhere would've been like a slap in the face. Therefore I must ask, how did the discussion end?

 

Is there a TIME limit. Like if we have talked over 30 minutes, no matter what the topic is, it's a good indication that she would want to continue and I could get the number?

Not necessarily. Really depends.

[Alezia]

I think if you talk for 30 minutes, then it's fair game if you ask for the number. She perhaps has a boyfriend, or is not interested - but I don't think it would be inappropriate to ask by that point in time.

 

I don't see how asking unrelated questions to your work would throw you off? Even with work people, I don't speak strictly about work all the time.

[CMS]

I always set time constraints early to cut conversation off at high note for phone close so yes you are right, I would preface it with "I have to be at somewhere but I really enjoyed this conversation."

[CMS]

But Dougie man, you really do need to learn from some of the dating experts and change the way you behave. What you are right now is a total insecure wussbag, thats fine because I was like you about 6 years ago, you can change that by adopting better way of thinking, read some of David DeAngelo's stuff, that was what turned me around, learn how attraction works (hint its not about being nice to them or buying them stuff or act like wuss to them), learn how to trigger value based attraction and then sexual attraction, learn how to carry yourself through your confidence and body language.

 

Also Dougie, PUA mantra has always been "Leave her better than you found her", Its not about what am I getting out of this and more about making her day better, so aim to make her day better while not holding ulterior motives and you would see a lot better results.

[Dougie_D]

What I meant by "throwing me off" was when we were talking about music and such, I thought it was just a friendly conversation. THEN when she ASKED me more personal questions like "What are TN girls like compared to Southern Cali girls?" I'm not used to girls asking me questions like that. When she asked me that I thought she might have been interested in me and the conversation was becoming flirtier than friendly. It was a feeling I wasn't used to and my mindset was getting confused. That's the reason why I felt "thrown off". I didn't expect that.

 

making her day better, so aim to make her day better while not holding ulterior motives and you would see a lot better results.

 

Haha! Trust me...I'm the master of making girls/guys feel better! Seriously...EVERYONE likes me because I can somehow cheer them up.

[Shudder]

to me it sounds like you just need to learn how to socialize better with women. stop overanalyzing everything they say. if you feel you get along with someone after a talking to them for a while ask for their number. they might give it to you, they might not..

[Polis]

I just don't LIKE the surroundings and such. I don't have anybody (friends or family) that volunteers either or I don't know any homeless people.

 

Lol, Dougie_D not all people that need help are homeless. You can volunteer in your own industry, for instance if a school is having a musical or play or something and you know about sound systems, maybe they need someone to help set up? Or there is a music program around town in low-income neighborhoods you can help out with. Or you can save puppies from puppy mills turning them into puppy flour. Special Olympics, Habitat for Humanity, etc...Stuff like that. Or you can join a young professionals group, alot of time they have food/clothing drives AND you get to meet new peoples all the time.

 

Google this: L.A. young professionals

 

Lots of organizations out there. link removed seems to be a networking organization (aka they drink).

[Alezia]

The homeless people comment really made my day.

[Dougie_D]

Honestly, PLEASE give me an example of where someone has HOOKED up volunteering. I'm just not INTO it. I will have more of an anxiety attack...making sure I do a good JOB of whatever I'm asked. Volunteering isn't laid back. It just can't feel like WORK. I get annoyed with things very easy.

[bulletproof]

Honestly, PLEASE give me an example of where someone has HOOKED up volunteering. I'm just not INTO it. I will have more of an anxiety attack...making sure I do a good JOB of whatever I'm asked. Volunteering isn't laid back. It just can't feel like WORK. I get annoyed with things very easy.

 

I have dated guys I met volunteering. I have also met friends that way. But the reason people are telling you to volunteer is not just about hooking up. It's also about getting out of this self-focused mindset you seem to be in constantly. It wouldn't kill for you to put some energy into doing something good for the world so you could gain some perspective on your own issues and maybe even actually learn something about human nature and how people interact.

 

A lot of your posts, and especially this one, sound like they were written by a very spoiled child. You're a grown man. You say you want an adult relationship with a woman, but everything you say here contradicts that.

[CMS]

I have hooked up many times while volunteering, the key difference between you and me is that I was there to help out and meet new people, to get to know them as human beings first, you sounds like you just want to go there to hook up, which unconsciously creates pressure on yourself and also an air of desperation.

 

When I approach a girl, I dont see her immediately as dating candidate, I am approaching her because I like the way she looked and she looks like an intriguing human being, someone that I want to find out more about. I am indifferent, I dont kiss up to them, hell I make them qualify themselves to me all the time and guess what, often times they would chase me around and asking me out, because I engage them in conversation with no ulterior motives other than trying to find out who they are, I am different from other chumps who chase them around trying to get into their pants.

 

So here is my suggestion to you Dougie, drop that desperate "why won't you like me?" attitude and start thinking that you yourself as the prize. Stop trying to impress them or kiss their ass, or buying them stuff so early on, get to know them instead, be confident, charming, engaging, present, funny, teasing and most of all, knowing that its nothing personal if a girl does not like you, you are just not what she is looking for, but guess what, there are others who are looking for you.

 

Good luck man

[tommytoxen]

Maybe it's your bitter; hateful & resentful attitude that puts them off. just hazarding a guess from the tone of your post.

 

I've no problem with needy people, they're needy for a reason. My girlfriend is incredibly needy, but she's had a rough life and it boils down to her wanting to feel safe and loved.

[Generation]

Honestly, PLEASE give me an example of where someone has HOOKED up volunteering. I'm just not INTO it. I will have more of an anxiety attack...making sure I do a good JOB of whatever I'm asked. Volunteering isn't laid back. It just can't feel like WORK. I get annoyed with things very easy.

 

You don't have to volunteer then. I think what people meant was volunteering will make you more interesting because you're exposed to more things.

The point is though, right now, you seem painfully 2Dimensional. There's not much depth to your character at all. That's the biggest problem I find with guys trying to attract women. I know this of you because of your first page. Feel free to say I'm wrong by telling me something interesting about yourself. Truth be told, it'll probably take more than volunteering to get the depth you need in order to get a quality girl. Also, our opinions are what matters of you as opposed to your opinions of yourself, because girls will be judging you the same way to put it bluntly.

 

Like I said, you don't have to volunteer. But do something. You like travelling? Do that. Make yourself more interesting.

[Alezia]

Honestly, PLEASE give me an example of where someone has HOOKED up volunteering. I'm just not INTO it. I will have more of an anxiety attack...making sure I do a good JOB of whatever I'm asked. Volunteering isn't laid back. It just can't feel like WORK. I get annoyed with things very easy.

 

Honestly, the people I am most attracted to are the people I meet at work. There is just something about seeing someone's character, intelligence, sociability and work ethic that is hot. I know it's still probably not the pure raw character, but still way closer than what is shown when you go out at parties and clubs. I am personally turned off by men in clubs that try to flash their muscles or their money.

 

It's a low pressure environment, and you can learn to know people over time.