I think it's selfish to have kids..

[Trying1]

Yep, I do. People have kids for themselves and more likely than not, that child is going to have to deal with some horrible stuff. ie. death, disease, heartbreak, pain(physical and emotional)etc. All of which I understand is part of life, but it's all irrelevant until you're actually born, and if you're not born, then nothing matters. Right? Right. So there's that, plus the fact that there are way too many people on this earth already and we really don't need anymore for a while. I also understand that if "everyone stopped having kids our world would end" blah blah blah, but does any of that REALLY matter if nobody is here to see the world ending?? Why does life need to exist?? It doesn't. Who is it effecting other than the living and if the living are gone, then it doesn't matter. Right? That's what I believe. I'm not a religious person either, so I guess that doesn't help. Well, anyway, I was just curious what everyone else's thoughts on this are. Not trying to offend anyone, just putting it out there, because I really can't see it any other way right now.

[savignon]

My thoughts are that it's a shame you see no point to life.

I don't think people who have kids are selfish. That's way too big of an assumption of billions of people you don't know.

[Trying1]

Yeah, I guess I wouldn't say that the people are completely selfish with everything they do, but I would say when it comes down to it, it's a selfish act, because you are doing it completely for yourself in the end.

[Thx]

You know what Trying... I agree with many of your points.

 

Yet, some of my friends who are very well off have decided not to have kids.

 

Somehow I think that is self-centered on their part.

(What if their parents took the same attitude?)

 

Oh, but that's different...

 

Geez, this is a super hard question, thank you for bringing it up!

 

It's their choice, and yes I agree, the world does not need more procreating.

 

Still, they have every advantage and take the lazy way out and just live for themselves.

 

In fact, I shed to think what some of them would do with kids...

 

Poor kids...

 

Nice thread!

 

Thx

[wlh22]

I also think that there is some amount of selfishness involved in 'wanting to have a kid'. But again, there is pretty much no act in the world (done by human) which is devoid (completely) of selfishness.

 

But why does life exist! that's deep... and maybe we'll never figure that one out.

[Trying1]

You know what Trying... I agree with many of your points.

 

Yet, some of my friends who are very well off have decided not to have kids.

 

Somehow I think that is self-centered on their part.

(What if their parents took the same attitude?)

 

Oh, but that's different...

 

Geez, this is a super hard question, thank you for bringing it up!

 

It's their choice, and yes I agree, the world does not need more procreating.

 

Still, they have every advantage and take the lazy way out and just live for themselves.

 

In fact, I shed to think what some of them would do with kids...

 

Poor kids...

 

Nice thread!

 

Thx

 

 

 

Yeah, I agree that other things can be selfish as well, such as not having children and then using all of your extra money on yourself, rather than maybe donating it, but at the same time you probably earned that money for yourself and you can use it on yourself. You're not making a conscious decision to perhaps ruin someone else's life. Not saying that there life WILL be ruined or bad in someway, but why even take that gamble. Ya know? But yeah, I agree that people may be selfish in other ways. It's this: I think having kids is a selfish act, but I don't necessarily think that NOT having kids makes you an unselfish person. If that makes any sense. haha. Anyway, yeah, complicated stuff. Thanks for the reply.

[Seymore]

Once you live one of those moments when all that bad crap just. Doesn't. Matter, it really doesn't seem so selfish. What if you had a kid that wound up changing the world for the better - would that be selfish?

[Dako]

I'd suggest sterilization to walk the talk, then pontificate to Mom.

 

I did.

[bulletproof]

I also think that there is some amount of selfishness involved in 'wanting to have a kid'. But again, there is pretty much no act in the world (done by human) which is devoid (completely) of selfishness.

 

True! I had an ethics professor who challenged the class to name one act that wasn't selfish on some small level. Even volunteering brings personal satisfaction, so it's a tough question.

 

I would probably call having children self-indulgent more than selfish. We are all trying to achieve immortality by passing on our genes.

[Trying1]

Once you live one of those moments when all that bad crap just. Doesn't. Matter, it really doesn't seem so selfish. What if you had a kid that wound up changing the world for the better - would that be selfish?

 

I guess I'm just looking at it in the grand scheme of things. Like, what's the point of anyone having kids? If everyone just stopped having kids, would it REALLY be a huge deal? We'd all die and then maybe later the world would die, but who is that effecting...in the end?? So yeah, someone might have a kid that changes the world for the better, but is that worth having millions of kids all the time and having them live this life full of horrible things? Good things too, I know, but if they weren't born, none of it matters.

[Trying1]

True! I had an ethics professor who challenged the class to name one act that wasn't selfish on some small level. Even volunteering brings personal satisfaction, so it's a tough question.

 

I would probably call having children self-indulgent more than selfish. We are all trying to achieve immortality by passing on our genes.

 

I would say it's both. Why do people have kids? So they can pass on their genes, they want someone to love and take care of or someone to love them, it's just the way it is, it's an accident, etc. In all cases, it seems to be either selfish or self-indulgent. And yes, all acts are selfish, but not all acts are hurting other people in the process, such as volunteering. When having a baby, you're taking a gamble with their life, only because you want something out of it. At least, that's the way I see it.

[Trying1]

My thoughts are that it's a shame you see no point to life.

I don't think people who have kids are selfish. That's way too big of an assumption of billions of people you don't know.

 

Wow, you changed your post. Doesn't seem as friendly now. People who have kids are not completely selfish, but I think the act of them choosing to have kids is selfish in ways. Maybe not all. I mean, I do believe people want to give their kids love and happiness, but they're taking a gamble on whether or not their child is going to be happy in life, despite how much love, money, and support they give them. I really don't think people think about what they're actually doing when they have a kid, so it's not a conscious selfishness. If that makes any sense.

[QuirkyCute]

I see your points, and I think they are valid. I want to have children someday, and by virtue of the fact that I want to have them (even if that is the only reason), it is selfish. Like you said, there are more selfish things that one can do.

 

However, the decision not to have children because you don't personally see the point is also selfish. You aren't having kids because YOU don't WANT to, and YOU don't see the point, just like I would have kids because I WANT to. Really, not wanting to have kids (regardless of your personal reasons) is just as selfish as someone else having them because THEY WANT TO, in my humble opinion.

 

Ultimately, this discussion all comes down to intent and a personal belief that life is important on this earth, and should be continued. That is an area of discussion that often doesn't end well, so I'll leave it at that.

[QuirkyCute]

Why does life need to exist?? It doesn't.

 

I'll retract the last sentence of my previous post This is your opinion. No one knows why we have life, and people have been trying to figure it out for the past......forever. Just because you cannot see the need doesn't mean there is no need, and that life should be discounted as some type of biological anarchy. Just like your opinion is that life doesn't need to exist (which I respect), my opinion is that if life didn't need to exist, it wouldn't.

[Fudgie]

Me personally...I do consider having kids to be selfish on a couple levels.

 

Everyone I know who has them had them for at least a couple selfish reasons...usually for "bloodline purpose", which I think is stupid.

 

There are already enough unwanted kids in the world, why make more? It would be better to adopt one of those than to make another and add the overpopulation and pollution.

 

At the very least, have kids because you want to CONTRIBUTE better people to society. Never do it for yourself or someone else. do it for the betterment of everyone else in the world. Again, sort of hard to do when we already have too many kids...but it's a nice thought.

 

That's just my 2 cents.

[QuirkyCute]

Why should someone have kids for anyone but themselves? If you're having kids for "the betterment of everyone else in the world", then you're having kids for "someone else", which is what you oppose.

[Fudgie]

Gah, I'm sorry. I typed that in a hurry. Let me rephrase.

 

I think the best reason to have kids is to make the world a better place...society, you, etc. It's sort of all encompassing.

 

I don't think someone should have kids JUST for their entertainment/self esteem, nor because "Everyone else is doing it" or to appease their mother. Do it because you feel it's the right thing to do and you're going to produce valuable people who will improve the world in ways that you could not.

 

I hope that makes a bit more sense.

[QuirkyCute]

Indeed it does, and I see we agree. Your response is precisely why I see the point in having kids, and why I see it as a type of selfish that can serve to be beneficial to just about all.

[Fudgie]

Good point. I'm glad that's why you want to have kids.

 

Kids aren't for me (can't have them anyways due to health problems) but I know a lot of other people have them and I think that should be the main reason behind it because it empowers them to raise good people and then everyone benefits.

[LBP]

Who is it effecting other than the living and if the living are gone, then it doesn't matter.

 

You mean 'affect', and yes, you're right, but your conclusion is wrong. That they affect the living is exactly why children matter.

[Teaday]

I appreciate my chance at life too much to not pass it along to another.

 

Deciding whether or not it's selfish comes down to semantics, which never makes much sense. There will never be a definite answer or truth. What does it mean to be selfish? What is selflessness? Where is the line drawn? Excuse the faulty logic, but if it's selfish to have a child but having a child would make you happy, does that mean that happiness is selfish? Further, should all selfish things be avoided? What about happiness?

[damagedgood]

I'll give you 10 years. You'll change your mind completely.

[sidehop]

Are you calling your parents selfish then?

 

Raising children takes more time, money and energy where I don't see how it could ever be a selfish act. It's in our nature to carry down our genes, that's what our body is meant to do aside from enjoying the life as much as possible. To say that having children is a selfish act is like saying we weren't meant to reproduce and continue the cycle of life.

[IphigeniaSaysHi]

Humans are selfish. I think as long as there is a single, solitary homeless child, a child in the foster care or a child in the adoption system, birthing children is a selfish act. I don't think it is a reprehensible act, but it is extremely sad that people have 19, 8, 7 of their own kids while other kids suffer alone.

[Sparkly Eyes]

Yes, it is a selfish act imo too.