what are the signs that a girl is wasting her time?

[grymoire]

I guess I was naive, too slow to learn things. I always felt that being a good girl is sufficient to get n keep a man (you know the traditional training). But after I read a lot of posts on here, I realised that beauty is unnecessary, but attraction is a must to get the next date.

 

Yes, I totally understand what you are saying when you talk about traditional training. I also got fooled the same way - study well, get a degree, get a good job, be a very good boy and then you will get a girl Then from my own experiences I learnt that it is all sadly just a BS. Nothing matters if the other person does not feel the attraction.

[LAYAAN]

Yes, I totally understand what you are saying when you talk about traditional training. I also got fooled the same way - study well, get a degree, get a good job, be a very good boy and then you will get a girl Then from my own experiences I learnt that it is all sadly just a BS. Nothing matters if the other person does not feel the attraction.

Attraction is a strange thing for sure. You may be cute/hot looking whatever n the guy may still say "I didn't feel a thing". You see below-average-looking girls around you, married. So, their husbands were gifted with a special set of eyes? I always thought, if you are attractive, you are attractive. There are some common standards for beauty. But I don't know now-a-days.

[grymoire]

Attraction is a strange thing for sure. You may be cute/hot looking whatever n the guy may still say "I didn't feel a thing". You see below-average-looking girls around you, married. So, their husbands were gifted with a special set of eyes? I always thought, if you are attractive, you are attractive. There are some common standards for beauty. But I don't know now-a-days.

 

Nope.. there is a difference.

 

You may be a very beautiful woman but still I may not find you attractive. Why? because you may not fit my preference. I usually get attracted to girls that are short. If a girl is as tall as me or taller than me then I can't feel the attraction for her regardless of how beautiful she may be. So unbelievable as it is I think Aishwarya Rai is very beautiful but I am not attracted to her. And also, just because I am not attracted to her does not mean she is not beautiful.

 

In the same way a guy may be very handsome and good-looking. But if you prefer tall guys and if this guy is just normal height then you may not be attracted to him. Understand now?

[LAYAAN]

got it gry, thanx for explaining.

[LAYAAN]

thanx Batya for your detailed reply. I really appreciate it.

[Batya33]

Attraction is a strange thing for sure. You may be cute/hot looking whatever n the guy may still say "I didn't feel a thing". You see below-average-looking girls around you, married. So, their husbands were gifted with a special set of eyes? I always thought, if you are attractive, you are attractive. There are some common standards for beauty. But I don't know now-a-days.

 

You are assuming that your opinion of "below average looking" is a general standard. You're assuming that just because someone is married their relationship includes chemistry. I met many men who I guess the media would consider "hot" and they did nothing for me, usually because of what they said or how they acted in a first conversation.

 

Want to know what's really attractive? Sharing a look with someone you love or care about and knowing that he is thinking of the same inside "couple

private joke that you are. Nothing to do with above average, below average whatever "looks" that you refer to.

 

In a word, you're confusing attraction with a narrow focus on "looks" and making it even narrower by superimposing your own standards on what is above and below average.

[LAYAAN]

okay Batya, what I meant was whether you get a date or not is based on looks. I'm not talking only about the online thing. Even in person, someone sees me in a book store, they can't see my personality right there, can they? so if they will initiate a conversation or not again is based on how I look to them. I agree with you. From that point on, its your personality and the whole package that the other person should feel attracted to. Am I clear, now?

[ManAbout]

I'm taking a break from dating.

 

For someone who is taking a break from dating, you seem to be spending an awful lot of time thinking, worrying, posting about it.

[LAYAAN]

I'm not going on dates. That is my def. of taking a break. Yes, I'm new to dating n I want to know how I can make myself better. I've done some mistakes in the past and I don't want to repeat those now. I've so far gotten useful advice on this forum, so I'm posting about my doubts, questions, opinions. I'd not call it worrying. I'd call it preparing myself when I do get into the field in few more months.

This is your 2nd post ManAbout asking me why I'm doing this, doing that while I say I'm taking a break. You seem to be overly concerned, I must say

[ManAbout]

I'm not going on dates. That is my def. of taking a break. Yes, I'm new to dating n I want to know how I can make myself better. I've done some mistakes in the past and I don't want to repeat those now. I've so far gotten useful advice on this forum, so I'm posting about my doubts, questions, opinions. I'd not call it worrying. I'd call it preparing myself when I do get into the field in few more months.

This is your 2nd post ManAbout asking me why I'm doing this, doing that while I say I'm taking a break. You seem to be overly concerned, I must say

 

Sorry, but you seem to keep going around in circles. Getting advice on a forum is fine. But it is like reading a book. You only learn from experience. You could sit here all day asking questions and reading replies, but that is no substitute.

[LAYAAN]

I agree, but in my opinion, the advice can serve as a guideline while I'm not actually playing the field.

[grymoire]

okay Batya, what I meant was whether you get a date or not is based on looks. I'm not talking only about the online thing. Even in person, someone sees me in a book store, they can't see my personality right there, can they? so if they will initiate a conversation or not again is based on how I look to them. I agree with you. From that point on, its your personality and the whole package that the other person should feel attracted to. Am I clear, now?

 

I agree with this completely. You and I are on the same page in this regard. The first step to Dating is always based on looks. Personality and confidence and other things kick in during the date but to get to the date its looks.

 

I have always said this but many people do not agree to that. Just like you I asked how can some one see my confidence or personality just by looking at me???

 

This is an online forum Tinu... what you hear here and what you see happening in the real world are usually two different things. All day long you will hear about personality here and then you step out in the real world and see people choosing whom to go on a first date with based on looks.

[Batya33]

okay Batya, what I meant was whether you get a date or not is based on looks. I'm not talking only about the online thing. Even in person, someone sees me in a book store, they can't see my personality right there, can they? so if they will initiate a conversation or not again is based on how I look to them. I agree with you. From that point on, its your personality and the whole package that the other person should feel attracted to. Am I clear, now?

 

I completely disagree with this. I might first notice physical "features" of a person but unless they are scary looking to me, or much too old, or much too young, or I see a wedding ring, if we end up speaking I make my decision based on the conversation as to whether there is potential for a date (at least, that's what I did when I was dating). I can see "personality' very often right away - an intelligent look, a warm vibe, the way he makes eye contact - that is all looking at the inside, not at the outside. That is why my friend started talking to her future husband in her building's laundry room - because she heard him talking to someone and liked the warmth in his voice. Is it based on looks for me? Only to a partial extent. When it comes to whether there will be a date looks is one factor of many.

[LAYAAN]

"I can see "personality' very often right away - an intelligent look, a warm vibe, the way he makes eye contact - that is all looking at the inside, not at the outside."

Yes, Batya, I'll have to agree with this one. You can "see personality", absolutely. I forgot about this. Thank you for bringing this to my attention.

[ManAbout]

I agree with this completely. You and I are on the same page in this regard. The first step to Dating is always based on looks. Personality and confidence and other things kick in during the date but to get to the date its looks.

 

I have always said this but many people do not agree to that. Just like you I asked how can some one see my confidence or personality just by looking at me???.

 

First of all, men and women think differently. For a man it is very much based on physical appearance, i.e looks. For women attraction is based on a number of other factors, with looks just being one of them. Ugly guys still date hot women, they just have other things that a woman finds attractive.

 

Now if you are talking about online dating, looks become much more important to the woman, she will base everything on the picture.

[Batya33]

First of all, men and women think differently. For a man it is very much based on physical appearance, i.e looks. For women attraction is based on a number of other factors, with looks just being one of them. Ugly guys still date hot women, they just have other things that a woman finds attractive.

 

Now if you are talking about online dating, looks become much more important to the woman, she will base everything on the picture.

 

That was not true of me, I corresponded with hundreds of men on line and met over 100 of them in person.

[grymoire]

That was not true of me, I corresponded with hundreds of men on line and met over 100 of them in person.

 

how did u decide to meet them in person? what criteria?

[Batya33]

how did u decide to meet them in person? what criteria?

 

The criteria were that we had a conversation by phone where I felt that I could have a comfortable conversation with the person, in person, over coffee for about 45 minutes.

 

The basics were that he expressed interest in marriage and family in the not too distant future (typically on the profile, but fine if on the phone as well or instead), he was at least college educated, financially stable, intelligent, articulate, respectful/well-mannered, honest about the basic facts (age, marital status, job, where he lived, etc.) and a decent/good conversationalist. As far as looks, I was fine as long as I wasn't repulsed by his picture because I found that pictures were not always accurate anyway.

 

Obviously I had to take a leap of faith that he actually had all these qualities - but if I felt comfortable enough that he did, since I was only meeting him for a coffee, I was willing to take the small risk that he did not.

[LAYAAN]

Thank you Batya, you have mentioned some good points here. I'll remember these.

But I still have a Q. How did you find out that the guy was interested in marriage (if he didn't have it on his profile)? I mean, everywhere we get to hear this advice, "dont mention the words like kids, marriage and scare the guy off, don't ask "are we exclusive yet?" Honestly, I want to know if the guy is looking with an intention of marriage or not, if not, I've no interest. If the very mention of marriage is gonna freak the man out, why bother going out on a date with him n waste our time?

[grymoire]

Thank you Batya, you have mentioned some good points here. I'll remember these.

But I still have a Q. How did you find out that the guy was interested in marriage (if he didn't have it on his profile)? I mean, everywhere we get to hear this advice, "dont mention the words like kids, marriage and scare the guy off, don't ask "are we exclusive yet?" Honestly, I want to know if the guy is looking with an intention of marriage or not, if not, I've no interest. If the very mention of marriage is gonna freak the man out, why bother going out on a date with him n waste our time?

 

The guys Batya spoke with may have mentioned marriage as an eventual outcome.. As in, they are not looking for casual dating but serious relationship culminating in marriage.

 

If the guy immediately started to drop hints about marrying Batya (without properly getting to know her) then that is a red flag that would have driven her.

[LAYAAN]

no, I didn't mean to say that Gry. I understand that part. Even I'm like that. The man doesn't need to marry me. Thats okay. But I want to know if he is looking with an intention to get married or not. As long as he is serious about things, I'm in, if not, I'm not gonna waste my time.

[Batya33]

The guys Batya spoke with may have mentioned marriage as an eventual outcome.. As in, they are not looking for casual dating but serious relationship culminating in marriage.

 

If the guy immediately started to drop hints about marrying Batya (without properly getting to know her) then that is a red flag that would have driven her.

 

Please don't put words in my posts that aren't there. Thank you. I would be wary of a man who said he wanted to marry me and wasn't joking before he met me - as most women would be, I presume.

 

I screened profiles for checking off the "marriage and family" box on the sites I was on, and often I could tell by the discussion - whether and how he mentioned his family - what his goals were. If the profile did not list marriage or family or mention it in the description most often I moved on to the next profile (and instructed those who read my profile, "if you are not interested in marriage or family in the not too distant future, that's fine, but then we are probably not a match" - and as noted I had a great deal of interest in my profile).

 

In my experience in dating, after my mid 20s or so, and even sometimes before (especially if the man was 24 or over), most men I met more than once brought up their interest in getting married and starting a family. I found that I brought out that "side" in men - I used to joke that men never wanted to date me, they just wanted to marry me, lol.

 

I did not bring up marrying "me" ever (i.e. never initiated that discussion), from what I can recall, and I wouldn't have brought up "the future" unless we were dating several months. I never had to, because those men I dated several months with few exceptions asked me to be exclusive and discussed future goals in general and then specifically soon enough. The few times I mentioned exclusivity first it was because the relationship wasn't going in that direction in general (i.e. if I had to raise it first it was a negative sign).

[grymoire]

Please don't put words in my posts that aren't there. Thank you. I would be wary of a man who said he wanted to marry me and wasn't joking before he met me - as most women would be, I presume.

 

what did i say wrong about you?

[Batya33]

what did i say wrong about you?

 

"If the guy immediately started to drop hints about marrying Batya (without properly getting to know her) then that is a red flag that would have driven her."

 

That is incorrect.

[grymoire]

"If the guy immediately started to drop hints about marrying Batya (without properly getting to know her) then that is a red flag that would have driven her."

 

That is incorrect.

 

heh?!?!

 

how is that different from this ->

I would be wary of a man who said he wanted to marry me and wasn't joking before he met me - as most women would be, I presume.

 

if a guy wants to marry you just like that without taking the effort to know you isn't that a red flag?