talking about suicide & doing it?

[gracerules2008]

Do you think people who talk about suicide never do it? Is that always true? Are there any cases where someone has talked about suicide and eventually did it?

 

What is your take on this? Also do you think it's possible for someone to take the challenge of attempting suicide just to prove someone's prediction wrong of "the fact you are talking about suicide is proof positive that you'll never do it"?

 

In my opinion it can be dangerous to tell a suicidal person that the fact they are talking about it is proof that they'll never do it. Why? because you never know if that motivates a person to kill themselves just to prove you wrong.

[Jonboy582]

Every single person I have ever met and come accross who talks about suicide never does it. Reason being the whole suicide issue comes around for attention, and they tell you for attention.

 

If they really wanted to kill themselves and die, they would not tell you and give you a chance to stop them. They would go out and do it.

 

I would never say that to someone who was threatening such things encase something did happen. But I agree if they talk about it they probably wont do it. Its the silent sufferers you have to be careful of.

[gracerules2008]

Every single person I have ever met and come accross who talks about suicide never does it. Reason being the whole suicide issue comes around for attention, and they tell you for attention.

 

If they really wanted to kill themselves and die, they would not tell you and give you a chance to stop them. They would go out and do it.

 

I would never say that to someone who was threatening such things encase something did happen. But I agree if they talk about it they probably wont do it. Its the silent sufferers you have to be careful of.

 

But how would you be able to identify the "silent sufferers?" If the silent sufferers are so careful not to leave any clues or signs that they are suicidal then how would you know they are suicidal? How can you predict that they are a danger to themselves?

 

The thing is if a person never talks about it then nobody would be able to stop them because nobody would suspect they are suicidal. I'm assuming the silent sufferers don't want to be caught right? Well they'll do everything they can in their power to never give those around them a reason to suspect that they are about to kill themselves.

[Madman22]

Most cases of suicide have always made it clear to the people around them that it is something they are thinking strongly about.

[Jonboy582]

Exactly and that's the problem and that's why they end up killing themselves. Very rarely do you hear of someone who's friends and family knew of their depression and still killed themselves.

 

I guess for silent people its very hard but you have to pick up on minimal signs. I have had VERY low points, and suffered from depression for over 2 years and NO ONE knew. Not my friends or parents, and I came close to ending it. But I thought what I was leaving behind and its a judge of character how you turn from this point. Ok that's going off the subject a lot.

 

As Malibu Barbie said, they might make it clear there is a problem, but they wont keep on about it. Well in my experience they wont, they will say there is a problem but keep things to them selves.

 

Pretty much what I am getting at is the silent sufferers you can rarely tell, and there is nothing you can do unless you suspect something is going on.

[gracerules2008]

I would agree that the ones who talk about it are looking for attention. Why? they are in need of attention! They are looking for a reason to live. They are looking for someone to give them a reason to live.

 

So maybe they are planning to end it but they are looking for one final nail in the coffin to confirm that they are making the right decision or to stick around longer.

 

Nobody wants to die unless they believe in their mind that it is a last resort. I think it's human nature to look for a reason to hope before pulling the plug.

[gracerules2008]

thereforeee it's nearly impossible to be careful about the silent sufferers because they don't give you any reason to be careful and watch out for them.

[Jonboy582]

I would agree that the ones who talk about it are looking for attention. Why? they are in need of attention! They are looking for a reason to live. They are looking for someone to give them a reason to live.

 

So maybe they are planning to end it but they are looking for one final nail in the coffin to confirm that they are making the right decision or to stick around longer.

I guess that could be the case. When I came closest, I told my friend of my depression finally after 2 years.

 

But I have met countless people who I knew would never kill themselves moan about how they are so sad and want to kill them selves I am talking 20 or 30 people. Not one has ended it and only 1 person has had a suicide attempt which was just a cry for attention. I.e. taking 5 packs of paracetamol, you know you wont die from it you just want a reaction.

[Mythical_Suicide]

Everytime I attempted suicide, I never told anyone, never let anyone even have a clue that I was depressed and contemplating taking my life.. It wasn't until I was found nearly dead both times that people knew something was wrong.

 

As for those who talk about it but never do, given yes it's true alot of people do talk about it to get attention on themselves some who are contemplating it talk about it because it's a relief to get it out and it's a call for help and they know no other way to get the help besides saying "Im going to kill myself". Unforunately the 'silent sufferers' it's usually too late.

[CallingAllAngels]

My boyfriend committed suicide when he was 20 and I was 19. He talked about it, but I didn't really take him seriously. I was too young, and too dumb.

 

No one has any idea how I wish I had listened. I have never gotten over his death.

 

~Allie

[Jonboy582]

Everytime I attempted suicide, I never told anyone, never let anyone even have a clue that I was depressed and contemplating taking my life.. It wasn't until I was found nearly dead both times that people knew something was wrong.

 

As for those who talk about it but never do, given yes it's true alot of people do talk about it to get attention on themselves some who are contemplating it talk about it because it's a relief to get it out and it's a call for help and they know no other way to get the help besides saying "Im going to kill myself". Unforunately the 'silent sufferers' it's usually too late.

I agree 100% and btw hope things are better for you now !

 

As for gracerules2008 I am assuming by your language you are directly affected by this in 1 of 3 ways.

- You yourself are contemplating suicide?

- Someone close is giving all the talk about killing themselves?

- Someone you know killed themselves and you want to know if there was more you could have done?

[tiredofvampires]

There are no hard-and-fast rules here. It's true that people who are serious about taking their lives very often do not want to be dissuaded, and thereforeee keep their intentions secret. By the very nature of their determination to go through with it, in their minds it stands to reason that it would be counterproductive to their purpose to "let someone in on it" so that it might be stopped.

 

There are still sometimes some classic "warning signs" in these cases (e.g., giving away/selling possessions, not seeming to care about things that normally they would, or even appearing unusually cheery in a way that would be out of character with a situation); but again, not always and there are still no hard-and-fast rules. Sometimes the signs are so subtle, people around them cannot possibly interpret these as "warning signs" of an impending suicide attempt. After all, if a loved one is depressed and troubled, it would be normal for them to be somewhat more apathetic or to "not be themselves" in certain ways, so it is ALWAYS through hindsight that people might notice there were some "cues", if there were any at all. Signals can easily be too subtle to interpret or discern as suicidality, loved ones not being mind-readers.

 

Some give NO indications whatsoever.

 

However, I do know of people who have threatened suicide and then attempted it. It's not at all the exception -- and ANY suicide threat should be taken at face value, which is VERY seriously.

 

I also think it's rather stigmatizing and misguided to say a person who speaks about wanting to commit suicide as "needing attention." I really personally bristle at that wording and its connotations, because it makes the person sound self-indulgent and whimsical. A person who speaks about their suicidality is putting out a plea for HELP. A cry for help is not to be confused with "trying to get attention", per se. The implication that someone is "trying to get attention" is that they should be ignored, since people who do that are just being melodramatic. This is NOT how to deal with someone who is suicidal, regardless of the intensity or potency of their intentions. The bottom line is that they need help.

 

When I was younger, and spoke of wanting to die quite a bit, it's true that I felt no one was taking me seriously or caring what was happening to me. My suicide attempt(s) were half-hearted last-ditch efforts to either get myself out of the pain, or get someone to SEE. I think my ambivalence saved my life. And I DID "get attention", that's for sure. But I didn't get the HELP I needed, so I continued to suffer for a very long time (and, more and more bad and destructive things then happened, some of which have affected me to this day). For another person, this could have easily turned into yet another, more concerted effort that did succeed.

[gracerules2008]

Even if someone is threatening suicide for attention purposes only there is a reason for it. They still need help to figure out why they feel the need to go to extreme measures to get attention when there are other ways of getting it.

[CallingAllAngels]

Even if someone is threatening suicide for attention purposes only there is a reason for it. They still need help to figure out why they feel the need to go to extreme measures to get attention when there are other ways of getting it.

 

Absolutely agree...and they need to get help before they "attempt", and that "attempt" just might be a success.

[ElasticMagnetic]

I never tried to kill myself, but boy have I thought about it. It took a while for me to realize the differences between wishing you were dead, wanting to kill youself, and actually doing it.

 

Usually people who truly want to kill themselves don't tell anyone. I mean, there will be some signs, if any, but nothing more. And usually it's very hard to tell.

 

I dispise people who use it for, not as a 'cry for help', but for meer attention.

[Jonboy582]

The thing is you are forgetting about certain groups of people where they believe its cool to be depressed or attempt suicide.

 

Some people fabricate issues and problems just so they can fit in with other groups of people.

 

I don't want to be stereotypical here and I don't like to label. But this is the case with a lot of emo people.

 

tiredofvampires I can see you point about the attention issue. But I don't 100% agree, a lot of people do only do it for the attention it gets them and it really winds me up as people who have got real issues get looked over.

 

For example 1 girl I knew said she was all depressed and she was going to kill herself. She automatically became centre of attention and she would be perfect until something else happened to make her 2nd. So of course she would make up an elaborate tale or say she is going to end her life to keep her in the limelight. This just gives people with real depression or suicidal tendencies a bad reputation.

[Mythical_Suicide]

Jonboy that would be considered "emo".. These "emo" people seem to think it is cool to be depressed, self injure and threaten suicide. It's really sad too because they don't understand the impact actually being depressed and suicidal has on families and those around them.

[JeckyllNHyde]

Do you think people who talk about suicide never do it? Is that always true? Are there any cases where someone has talked about suicide and eventually did it?

 

What is your take on this? Also do you think it's possible for someone to take the challenge of attempting suicide just to prove someone's prediction wrong of "the fact you are talking about suicide is proof positive that you'll never do it"?

 

In my opinion it can be dangerous to tell a suicidal person that the fact they are talking about it is proof that they'll never do it. Why? because you never know if that motivates a person to kill themselves just to prove you wrong.

i don't have much experience with people i know commiting suicide. i know of one girl who threatened to do it, and have proof she did it to guilt people. she got fired and then ran away from home, etc so everyone would get worried and the whole company would find out.

 

other then that a friend of mine used to complain that he wants to do it some days, etc but now he is better then ever and it's like he never even thought of it.

 

the other ones i know who DID do it, they did it when they where on cocaine and they just killed themself, like with a rope, etc.

 

i think if someone was serious about it, why would they TELL everyone, and risk being stopped? so yea, in that sense i do think someone who is serious about it wont speak much and make it public to even their best friend.

[jmantra]

A lot of times when people are suicidal they are ambivalent about it meaning they don't whether or not they want to live or die. A lot of times people who say they are going to commit suicide is for attention, however it's needed attention because as much as a person wants to kill himself their is still a little spark in him that wants to live and thats where the threats and statements come from.

 

Their was a girl, a youung girl (16 years old) at another forum I belong kept saying she was going to off herself. Nobody believed thought she was saying it to get attention. Guess what? She ended up killing herself.

[gracerules2008]

It's only the folks who never witnessed anyone to follow through on their suicide threats that believe people who talk about it don't do it.

 

You just never know if someone might follow through just to prove everyone wrong.

[tiredofvampires]

Good post, jmantra.

 

As for looking "cool" and being "emo"...I think if you're into wearing your hair, shoes and clothing a certain way, listening to certain types of music and generally behaving with an attitude that would make you feel you "belong", as a card-carrying member in a certain social niche, that is one thing. You are a typical teenager enjoying the status of conformism. In most cases, if you are doing things to appear "cool" with your peers, you still value your reputation, your self-image, your possessions and most everything that keeps you tethered to this life.

 

If you gravitate towards this look/lifestyle, you tend to be young and depressed on some level, whether or not this confers some status upon you; whether this sanctions your depression, you've still got depression. And that needs to be looked into with adults who are close to you -- parents, family, etc. If you are not close enough to relate to your family or parents, you've already got problems.

 

And if it gets to the point that you're "trying to be cool" by actually cutting yourself, threatening suicide or feeling aligned with doing these things, you are already on a road that's not healthy. As another poster said, if you need THESE things to call attention to yourself, you are by that time acting out in a very unhealthy way and need help anyway.

 

By the time a person is an adult, the need and desire to look "hip" by being depressed and certainly suicidal declines as such phases are grown out of. So what you're talking about with the "emo" crowd really is a phenomenon of teenage "clique-ishness". The adult who becomes depressed enough to threaten suicide isn't "cool" in anyone's eyes, and is certainly really depressed about their lives. So I think there is an age factor here to consider.

 

Either way, what I'm saying is that if a person is trying to be accepted in a crowd that glorifies depresssion and suicidality to the point of actually making attempts, threatening attempts or hurting themselves, then there IS a REAL problem.