Love and religion

[Nitemarehippy]

I think I need some advice...I've been with my boyfriend for a little over 2 years now.There are many differences between us.One of the most important ones is religion.He's a Christian,and I'm Wicca.So tonight we were discussing religion (I will never EVER make that mistake again...) And he said he believed everyone that doesn't believe in Jesus would go to hell.So I asked him if he thought I would,and he said yes, probably.Well,I guess it makes sense,considering what he believes in,but for some reason it really hurt me to hear him say that.What does this mean for us?And if he loves me,and thinks that I'm going to hell,shouldn't he be trying to save me or something??I don't know,I just wanted to hear someones opinion on this...

 

Hilde from Norway

[mercurydreams]

That is a hard one. Religion causes so many people to split up that are otherwise perfect for each other.

 

Tell him you felt hurt that he said he thinks you are going to go to hell. Ask if he cares. If you are wondering why he is not trying to save you, maybe he thinks that the direct aproach will scare you off.

 

I know religion is a difficult topic to talk on when your views are different. But if you have been together this long and see a future together you have to talk about it, or later on it will just come between you. Don't argue about it though. Just tell him what you believe and ask him questions about his beliefs. Even if the religions are very different, you might find that you have some common beliefs about some things.

[jakebarnes]

Hi there,

well I think this is quite serious.

I' have to admit in the first place, that I've never heard the term Wicca,

no offence, but what I'm going to say just doesn' t depend on that.

Being Christian for myself, I am just disappointed every time I come to know tstories like yours. I think I don't have to tell all this about friendly coexistence of religions, this should be in our minds forever, particularly in Europe, where there were so many wars in the name of religion, not to mention the crusades.

I'm really amazed, when young people act like your boyfriend. Has he never heard of the enlightment or everything?

But apart from this historical approach, which I hope you forgive me, talking like this is of course very nasty and cruel of him. You have every right to feel hurt. I don't want to question your relationship at all(you mentioned other differences, what are they about?), but in my opinion, he should apologize for his comments and he should promise to do this never again. What would be the worth of a relationship, otherwise? And even if he apologises, what if he can't help thinking this? Again, it seems quite serious to me, but it's only my view, and I hope you will receive more opinions.

[the_tiger_striped_cat]

First my rant:

Sound's like your bf is closed-minded. I don't put any stock in the opinions of die-hard atheists or the die-hard theists (esp fundamentalists). You'll see that generally see that the die hard atheists are "reaction responding" to their childhood, and the die-hard theists have been externally indoctrinated beyond belief. The most intelligent in history realize that after we die it doesn't really matter whether we believed in God or not, as long as we have something we can live and die for.

 

 

 

IMPORTANT PART

 

 

 

But if you do get in another discussion with him. I've always found the best case against the "you're going to hell" crowd is to resort to the fact that you're doing EVERYTHING you think is right. It's not that you're actively defying God. I mean why would God send you to hell? Seriously think abou tit. Is it because you were Wicca? Because you didn't accept JC as your personal lord and savor? You were only doing what you thought was right. Who you are is largely if not entirely the product of your past and circumstances beyond your control. So basically God is sending you to hell because you were unlucky. Don't you think that there would be a REALLY good chance that you're bf would be Wicca if he had grew up EXACTLY like you did? What if he grew up in a Wiccan convent on the moon and never heard of Christianity? Would he suddenly just know what Christianity is? How would God save him?

 

Theses beliefs are comical. You see the Catholics, Protestants, Mormons, Hindus, Muslims, and basically all long established religions have realized long ago that arguing that only a certain group of people are going to heaven is an untenable position--because salvation is then tantamount to the roll of the dice.

 

HA. Sorry this is mostly a rant. HA! And I'm Christian too!

[Duderanomi]

Wicca is pointless, just convert to make him happy.

[parisian_pink]

Ok, this is a tough question. Living very near the borders of the Bible belt, I can say that I have encountered much of the same myself. I am Jewish, and I have friends who are Hindu, Atheist, Wiccan, and more, and from discussions had with them, I can tell you how difficult it is to run into people who tell you that you are going to Hell--especially people you love. The difficulty here is that SINCE they love you, they sometimes think it is their duty to "save" you, or they wouldn't be showing you love. THAT is the tough part. If this happens, I find that the best thing to do is to simply try your darndest to smile and say, "I know how very much it must hurt you to think of my eternal soul being compromised in any way. I appreciate and understand that by sharing your beliefs with me, you are attempting to get closer to me and to help me, which I appreciate, but there must also come a time where you must realize that if God had wanted the same path for me that he wanted for you, he wouldn't have given me the beliefs and ideas that he did."

 

Generally, even if you don't believe all this yourself, it is a very neutral and simple way to let him know that you respect his beliefs, but need the same consideration shown to yours. Unfortunately, many fundamentalists raise their children to believe very specific things about the superiority of their faith, and it allows for little tolerance of others. Educating your boyfriend on the pagan roots of many Christian traditions, for example, or preparing for him some information that he could read about your faith and practices, might demystify your beliefs and bring you closer together.

[keep45]

I have to agree with others. That was a bad move he did, and not nice at all. You should, as others suggested, ask him if he cares about you 'going to hell' and/or if he wants to 'help you' in any way, so you wouldn't 'go to hell'.

 

Note that I've put all those things in ''s, as I am an atheist. Don't flame me yet! I may be an atheist but I'm also open minded. The person I love is a Christian, and it poses no problems for me. Heck, if she'd want me to become a believer, I could even try (although it probably wouldn't work), or at least go to the church, etc...

 

Why I'm saying this is just so you get another point of view. I don't believe in either your god (or gods - I'm sorry, I haven't heard of Wiccas yet, probably because I'm not interested in religion - no offence meant here!), or the Christian god, or any other, for that matter.

 

And as it was already said - it is important to have something in life to live for. If it's religion - that's great. If it's the person you love - great. If it's both - great.

 

And to sum this rant up (excuse me ) - what he did was really not appropriate, even if he's a hardcore Christian. You should confront him, especially because it hurt you.

 

Good luck!

[Nitemarehippy]

Well,I just wanted to say thank you for your replies!And aside from this religion business we really have a great relationship!

And religion is not really a deal breaker for any of us,so I think it will be allright!

 

Hilde!

[Francis]

Freedom of Religion

 

There is a fundamental difference between : 1. Expressing one's own opinion and 2. Trying to convert other people.

 

Everybody is entitled to freedom of thought, freedom of religion and freedom of expression.

 

I feel that when your bf told you that he thinks you are going to go to hell because that is what he believes, then he was just being honest and answered honestly to a question you asked. Would you prefer him to be dishonest and desguise his feelings and thoughts? He is entitled to believe that, we all have the right to grow at our own pace.

 

Now, if your bf said that in order to convert you, then he would be wrong for trying to change your beliefs, he would be trespassing against your rights.

 

In the same vein, if you try to convert him, then you will trespass upon his rights.

 

I am happy that the two of you are getting along and overcoming a problem that is not there, but in your own mind : people have the right to their opinion, if their opinion bothers, you then you have a problem, not them. In the same way, if someone finds fault with your ideas, then they have a problem, not you.

 

Take care!

[Francis]

In Reply to Parisian Pink's Comment :

 

When Christians try to convert you, they are then trespassing against your right to freedom of religion, just tell them the truth : that Jews did not accept Jesus as a messiah because Jews have major difficulties understanding how God, who is supposedly perfectly good and just, how is it that God chose to sacrifice his innocent and pure child in order to save the wicked sinners.

 

This is just absolutely contrary to justice! A fair and just God would normally protect the innocent and the pure and punish the wicked and the sinners.

 

However, according to them, God chose to do the opposite by punishing and torturing an innocent to protect the wicked forever, and that just seems rather unbelievable for Jews. It is no surprise that Jews never accepted Jesus as a messiah. The whole story sounds suspect, to say the least.

[trumptenor]

So my girlfriend and I have been together for about three months... and the relationship is amazing... everything is so great... we have great things to talk about. We connect so well. But when ever she mentions Christianity we quarrel. I don't really have a religion and I'm not all that sure that I believe in God.

 

She's not sure how we could stay together if we don't meet eye to eye in this category.

 

But... she also tells me that I live my life like a Christian, a really good one at that. Better then her. But, since I haven't "accepted" Christ into my life... I won't be spending eternity by her side.

 

Now,... yes you're right we've only been together for three months but the relationship is so great... We don't really fight, we're truthful, etc.

 

She told me that I'm like a perfect puzzle with one piece missing. How do I go from here?!?!!?

 

 

HELP!

[Judith123]

Im in the same situation. Except Ive been with my boyfriend for 2 years.

He a catholics, and if we ever have kids, he wants them to be raised catholic.

I am very much against this, but i respect his beliefs.

Its an extremely tough situation, and a tragedy if it breaks up a relationship.

At the moment Im searching for others who may be in similar situations to myself.

[sareba39]

I'm in amost the exact situation as trumptenor, just 4 years down the road, and very happy! I actually made a very similar analogy to the puzzle analogy about my bf. Now I'm starting to see how beautiful a puzzle can be if it's got holes! My boyfriend sounds like he has similar beliefs to trumptenor, and I'm a Christian, although my belief's differ somewhat form trumptenor's girlfriend. Anyway, I've got some advice for both trumptenor and the OP.

 

First, certainly tell your SO that their belief about the afterlife hurts you, but at the same time really try and remember that they don't believe this to hurt you. More likely, now that they have someone that doesn't fit in the "appropriate category" that they love they are struggling to make sense out of something they've probably believed much longer than they've known you. So, it might also be helpful to add when you tell them that their belief hurts, to say that you know (at least intellectually) that you shouldn't take it personally.

 

Second, ask them to really pray about the situation, and study up on what the Bible actually says about heaven/hell. As a bonus to really strengthen the bond between the two of you, you could offer to do the reading part together. If interested, I have some passages from the Bible that might be good to consider, just let me know. Some caution about this though: Make sure that they know you aren't considering conversion, just trying to understand them better because you love them. If this isn't clear before hand, things could get sticky. Also, make sure that you could handle reading biblical text without getting worked up, the goal is to reduce hostilities, not increase them. Remember when you are reading together to respect how seriously they take it, regardless if you think it's a bunch of bull. Also, if you do decide to read with them, make sure you set up some time to talk to them about your beliefs as well. It's important to "be fair" about time devoted to understanding each other, otherwise someone feels like they are putting forth all the effort, and hostilities can occur. A last caution is to avoid praying together. Since you don't believe in your SO's God, there is no reason to pretend to talk to their God. Prayer is a very sprititual and personal time for a Christian, and if you don't believe you are talking to God, it's just a bad idea to go through the motions.

 

Also, though neither of you mentioned this, my bf and I new that as long as it was just the two of us, we could work things out. So, fairly early on, our conversations revolved around kids. I learned later on that because the only time that we talked about kids, it was in reference to religious upbringing, by bf got the impression that I felt the only thing I planned to teach my kids was about Jesus, and that I wanted to do this 24/7. This of course was ridiculus, but it was accidently the impression he got. So, if you do start the kids discussion, make sure you occasionaly slip in how important you think education/arts/whatever plays a role in parenting, and make sure your SO agrees.

Well, I think that's my 2 cents for now! Good luck! It's a hard road, but so much fun!!