My boyfriend and porn

[stellablue18]

ok, this porn thing really gets me going. I currently live (on and off) with my boyfriend, and have been for about a year. He enjoyed using the internet to view porn at the start of out relationship. Fine, but he knew that I was really insecure about myself, and the idea of him looking at porn upset me. Well, he didn't tell me that he looked at it, until I found all this junk on his computer. Honesty, isn't that a word?

 

So, then, can porn ruin a relationship? Well, it has ruined ours. Then I found that that he actually contacted a girl over the internet and told her that hot she was, how her breasts were beautiful, she made his all rilled up, and so on....

 

I found this, and moved out that night. He explained that it was a joke, and he wouldn't have written it if it wasn't a joke. Well, I wasn't laughing.

 

Bottum line, I think that porn can ruin a relationship. Just like jealousy, depression, and so on. I use to be into porn with my last boyfriend, and so was he. Then I realized that I would rather be with my significant other than sitting at a computer watching some guy or girl do their thang. It is all about respect, and that is that.

 

Also, what ever happen to the imagination?

[stellablue18]

Amen to all that was just posted. I am not one to participate in a chat board like this one, but I have realized that it helps. For the longest time, I had so much anger and I had no one to talk to about my concerns. Grant it, I am friends with college guys, who enjoy going out to bars weekly to check out the new bartender, or the barely clothed women that frequently visit the bar sccene.

 

I would call myself attractive, but when I am placed in front of a women with large breasts and a tight butt, I feel so worthless. The reason, I have realized, is that everywhere I look, these big breasted tight butted women are being praised. I go to check my email, and there is an ad waiting for me on the screen with a women in a bathing suit talking about how she lost 30 pounds in 30 days and she feels great. Well, who cares if you have that extra 30 pounds on you---everyone.

 

My guy friends are fed up with me "preaching" about the subordination of women, because their philosophy is that, with porn in particular, women choose the industry. Well, I have to ask, do women choose this becuase it makes them feel liberated, or do they feel like they are acting liberated in order to please men?

 

I am one strange chick- don't shave my legs, have a shaved head every 2 years (when my hair grows enough to donate it), and my idea of dressing up is sitting down at the sewing machine and making a skirt out of fabric I just bought at a garage sale. And I can't help but question my own motives- am I the way I am because I feel comfortable being me, or am I constantly rebeling against society's view of how women should be?

 

I even turned to some feminist books to motivate me, so I picked up the BUST book. Well, I got half way through, feeling more womanly and stronger than ever, and then the topic of porn is discussed. Many feminists love porn. They love being involved personally, and just enjoying it over the computer. This has been my biggest struggle lately. These women that I thought were just like me- liberation!!!- are in the same cycle as the horny boy sitting next to me on the bus.

 

Thank you for everyone out there who is standing up for their views, especially on a topic that is too often over-looked as "normal".

[stellablue18]

Crazycow-

 

If you are still watching this post forum, I would like to let you know that I read your post and I am very sorry for your situation. I have never been married, though I have been engaged, I am only 22, but have too many friends who are in a married situation.

 

What is there to do? First and foremost, stand up for yourself. I live with my boyfriend, and when I caught him not only looking at porn, but contacting the girls, I had to do what was best for me. At the time, I had to leave. I got a new apartment, dated other people, and then realized that I still was in love with my ex-boyfriend.

 

It is funny though, when I moved out, I ended it. Then I slept with 2 other people, and now I am back. He still calls me a *beep* for sleeping with other people while we "were still together". Funny how that works. We were actually not together, though still talking and trying to get things straight. And yet, he says that his contacting these girls WHILE I WAS LIVING WITH HIM, SLEEPING NEXT TO HIM AT NIGHT, SHARING A TOOTHBRUSH WITH HIM, was alright. The whole thing about contacting this girl, oh, well, he says, "it was just a joke".

 

I do not have perfect advice, no one does. I think the first and foremost ideas to remember are:

 

1. If you are hurting, he should care.

 

2. You are not alone in this situation.

 

There is a respect and a trust issue in my situation, and maybe yours. If you need to get more off your chest, just write again.

 

 

Peace.

 

stellablue

22 years old.

[gettingout]

I only read the first page.

 

My boyfriend won't stop looking at porn.

He loves me, he will be physically faithful. But the freaking porn.

I can't ask him to stop. He won't be "Happy" -- ???

Last night I decided to ask him how often -- this was his email to me:

 

 

"I do it about 3-4 times a week. I don't need to do it before I go to

sleep. It's something I do with myself. I've been doing it for 10-12 years

straight. If I stopped or was made to stop I wouldn't be happy. It's

perfectly healthy for men to do this. You can't understand because you

are a woman. men and women have different psychologies and physiologies and just work differently. That's me and just about any other healthy man. So when I go home I don't start furiously masturbating when I get in the door, sometimes I just like my quiet and my space.

It's a vice, just like alcohol or weed. When if starts to interfere with

your life is when it becomes a problem (ie. milti-hundred dollar phone

bills, liver failure and forgetfulness and depression)."

 

He's 24. I am 35 with a child. We have been together a year and will be moving in together this fall. I love him as I need the air I breathe.

 

I need to get past this. He won't meet me on any ground with this one. I am so sad. I hope I can be productive today.

[Celadon]

The problem with porn is that it treats women like sex objects. And that attitude can carry right on over to the real relationship. When I was with one guy who had a growing addiction to porn, I noticed he became much less tender, less attentive and much more "goal oriented." I was a means to his end, basically.

 

An earlier poster called porn selfish. Bingo! If someone can get off without having to spend time pleasing the other person, why wouldn't they look at it?

 

I know I'm being blunt in my condemnation of porn. I don't mean to condemn people, though, just porn. I think porn is bad for people and relationships. There have been some candid guys who posted earlier about how much of a struggle it is to get away from looking at porn. I really commend those guys for realizing it for what it is. And as one guy said, he's been able to wean himself from it -- good for him. Now he's got time to live life, and to pursue love instead of simply gratification.

 

We all have addictions, weaknesses, of course. It just seems this one is a major habit and causes such genuine problems for people.

[finallyknowme]

my bf is a pervert. i should have known when i first met him. he had no shame! he outwardly admitted to masturbating all the time. had bottles of lube out in full view, had about 200 porn mags under his bed. in a galant effort to prove that he was a gentlemen- he finally tossed them. not only does he look at girl porn but men as well. we have talked many times and he says "since I know this upsets you, i love you so much i am going to stop." BS- just the other day he said he came home for lunch just to look at porn because he was "jonesing". and you can't believe the night he told me he couldn't wait to be with me because he was "playing on the net and really got horny". so i had enough and wanted to find out, what is the big deal about porn?

 

i took matters into my own hands- found out what websites most guys liked (one of my guy friends gave me a list- my bf refused to tell he where he went- always cleans his computer of all files) and checked it out for myself. first of all- it was very arrousing. i'm not going to lie to you. HOWEVER- after a while, I realized- some of these girls did not look like they were having a good time. most of them were basically being raped in every way imaginable. in fact- some looked like they were drugged. it was pathetic. these men were treating them like dogs, like pieces of crap laying on the ground. calling them degrading names and basically using them in the most demeaning and horrific of ways. and for you men out there who think it's ok to view this stuff- saying "it's just a picture, movie, i love you... it relieves stress... bla bla bla". how discusting. If this is your excuse- how sad for you. no wonder my bf would rather watch porn than make love with me. it's easier- and after what I saw, i could never match up. first of all- i wouldn't put up with that crap. i will not allow any man to basially rape me and treat me like sh--! i mean- i am not prude. i will do pretty much anything in the context of mutual affection and respect. i am hot- have a great body and no sexual hang ups. but i was mortified by what is on the net, it is nothing but filth.

 

c'mon people. is this what we've reduced the most beautiful thing on this planet to? and girls! have some respect for yourselves!!! if your man chooses the demeaning, degrading, filth that porn is over the beauty of your soul-- tell him to take his computer and his penis and hit the road. we deserve better!!!

 

i plan on telling my bf it is over between us. i advise you girls to get on the net and see what's up- and then hold your damn head up and proclaim your right to be treated with respect.

[lifeisgood13]

Hi Ladies,

 

I stumbled accross this thread and want you to know that many other women feel the same way - that is, disrespected by porn. Help is at hand for ladies who are trying to eliminate porn from their partner's life, at link removed This site also helps men who are trying to eliminate porn from their lives. It is not just a site for addicts, but for anyone trying to eliminate porn from their own life or the life of their partner.

 

All the women here have a right to a man who is loyal and committed in every conceivable way - and that means, no porn.

 

Best to all -

 

lifeisgood

[gfdu]

I am an woman, not a prude, recognize that men and women have two different lists of turn-ons etc etc, in fact, some porn I quite like. But porn IS a problem if it replaces real life in the minds of some people.

 

In my sad case my beau of 3 years recently ditched me for the 6th time. I am his first girlfriend at his age 36. Puritanical Christian upbringing. Childhood issues like we all have etc. And a steady diet of porn in lieu of dating up to the age of 33. Always came back to me saying he was sorry, and that he really did love me so I took him back. But over time withheld sex and became verbally dismissive and remote.

 

Said 'I don't feel what a man is supposed to feel' which is 'wrong' so 'we should never have had a relationship', and sex takes some 'effort' which is also 'wrong'. adament that 'If a man doesn't feel the hots for a woman from day 1, he should never start anything because you cannot engineer it later...'

 

Yet we did - sex was good and got better, as it does with practice like anything. But after all the things we shared he ended it with ' there are some women I want to see with their clothes off and others don't interest me' - and I am one of the latter. Then had the nerve to say 'porn does not devalue women, I don't devalue them, I respect and admire them.' Hmmm.. how were you respecting and admiring the one and only woman in your life for 3 years? All the while surfing 'nude celebrities' and downloading thousands of pictures, while snapping at me if I came in the room.

 

My point is that I can understand someone falling out of love with me or not finding me physically their 'type', if types are what you go for. That the someone you loved and shared a life with for years now suddenly becomes a thing to be discarded and emotionally abused once you feel the grass is greener is the sad part. Without porn it would have been, 'I'm sorry, it isn't working for me, let's be friends.'

 

Therapist said: "If there is porn in there I would consider it a big red flag. Like Cocteau said of drugs, it's like a mistress you cannot live without, but who you will never speak against. In many relationships, porn will always take energy from what is possible between two people."

[aprildawn]

my boyfriend is always watching porn, he always locks the bedroom door on me when he thinks i'm gone and watches porn and masturbates, i'm so scared that it's because he doesn't find me attractive anymore, and that's how it makes me feel, in fact, like someone else said on here, i caught him writing back to girls with his pic saying "if you're interested, i can show you things no one else has..." and he told me that he was just messing around, trying to see different reactions, and he had pics of those girls, and asked them for more. in fact! he had an email address he was keeping from me and i figured out how to log-in to it and he was receiving emails from porn sites he had to pay $33/mo. for saying they found a match for him, and i freaked out! he said it means nothing. he said "at least i'm not cheating on you!" but it feels the same! what am i supposed to do? people constantly tell me how beautiful i am and what a lucky guy he is to have me... what about these things? can someone help me a little?

[lifeisgood13]

I can give some advice.

 

What you should do is to detach from him emotionally by focusing on doing things for yourself that do not include him. Eg Go to the movies with a girlfriend, read a good book, start a get fit campaign, etc.

 

Also, insist that he stop looking at porn and that he does not masturbate (as he would just think of the porn women, which is just as bad as watching). Let him know that you are serious, and that if you discover he has watched porn again, you will have a temporary separation. If he is living with you, he will have to sleep in the living room.

 

If he objects to any of the above, then kick him out. He is disrespectful. To love yourself, you have to say "I won't put up with this cr-p" and you have to mean it and follow through with your boundary rule above if you catch him watching porn or mb-ing.

 

third, I suggest you see a counsellor who specialises in sexual addiction as they will be sympathetic and help you with great advice. You can find such a counsellor by phoning any counsellor and asking for a referral.

 

Don't let him ruin your life. You deserve much better treatment than this cr-p!

 

hugs,

 

lifeisgood

[OceanEyes]

It's incredible to see how many women's lives have been so affected negatively by pornography. Up until about a few days ago I never had that feeling.

 

I noticed that there was a site that my boyfriend visited briefly (saw the address in the address bar, then of course, was suspicious and checked the temporary internet files). The thing that bothered me so much was that we had been separated for months and I was only back a week and it seemed that he was already 'unsatisfied' with our sex life. The feeling I got was literally nauseating when I saw all the files - I started crying and couldn't bring myself to rationalize it in my head.

 

I confronted him about it and he said that he was just "messing around while running a virus check", that he "never usually visits porn sites", etc., etc. He seemed truly apologetic and I could tell that he felt horrible about it. The reason I sort of chose to overlook it was because our sex life is the same as it's always been. He is probably the most generous lover I've ever had, always making sure that I am satisfied before he is. He was obviously fibbing about it, but I didn't really expect him to come right out and tell me everything.

 

The problem most women seem to be having with porn is that men are sort of just expecting us to accept it. So in so many words saying, "I'm a guy, I need this, so DEAL WITH IT". It makes a lot of women feel very inadequate, unappreciated and unloved. So while men are askng us to understand that their porn vices are harmless, we would also like to be heard and understood.

 

There are some important questions to ask yourself if you think your boyfriend may watch too much porn:

 

1. Does he always respect me and make me feel loved? Or is he withdrawn, disrespectful and dishonest a lot of the time?

 

2. Is he a considerate lover? Is he concerned with pleasing me too? Or does he roll over and go to sleep after getting what he needs?

 

I guess I am more on the fence with this one. I know for a fact that my boyfriend has watched porn for a long time and gotten used to just getting himself off. But to women, it seems dirty and that he doesn't care about you as much.

 

I try to look at it this way - you cannot control how he feels or what he thinks. You can try, but this is only going to create tension, unrealistic expectations and resentment. I think one of the bigger problems here is that most men are lying about it. So naturally, when women catch men in lies about one thing, they are going to assume that they lie about a whole bunch of other things.

 

Since my relationship is fulfilling and he always goes out of his way to make me happy, I've chosen - for now - not to question his devotion or his honour. The way I see it, is that as soon as I start imposing my views or trying to control his thoughts or behaviour are when he may comply, but he's always going to resent me for trying to control him. I've simply let him know that it hurts me (not really the porn itself, but the sneakiness and dishonesty), and that I would really appreciate it and feel better about it if he stopped. I think it is simply unrealistic to assume that you can control a man and expect him to be happy about it. It's better to be open and understand each other, try to negotiate and set limits.

[lifeisgood13]

A woman certainly cannot and should not control a man. However, she can control who she plans to talk to, sleep next to and live with. She can control whose clothes she washes and whose she doesn't. She can control who she loves. She can choose to let her porn watching partner know what she is doing to protect herself from pain. She might choose to control any or all of the above things as a means to protect herself from pain. If he doesn't like that, he can control himself by leaving, as he and she are clearly incompatible. On the other hand, maybe he loves her so much that he will choose to control his porn watching and wandering eye instead.

 

Some women are clearly not in a great deal of pain about this issue, and can put up with porn watching, such as Ocean Eyes. However, others are in a lot more pain and can choose not to have porn in their lives in any way. Each woman must decide for herself how much his porn watching matters to them. I know how I feel - and my partner no longer watches porn so now we are both happy and enjoying special closeness of which no other party partakes, together.

 

lifeisgood

[grfx13]

I don't know if I should be upset or not. My boyfriend and I just moved in together. He never really seemed to be interested in porn mainly because his sister is involved in that profession. So far I've found 2 DVD's, 1 tape, and a lot of porn sites in his computers history. I confronted him about the web sites he visited and he claimed that he was just looking for sexaul games (like strip poker). He actually got really offended when I confromted him, so I figured that I was overreacting. But just today I found the DVD's and tape, and I remember seeing his DVD player opened up on his computer a few days ago. So I put 2 and 2 together and figured that was what he was watchng on his computer. Normally porn does not bother or offend me, but in this case it does because we do not have much of a sex life... and when we do it's real fast. I almost feel like I am getting less attention than the porns are. It really hurts me and is starting to make me feel really self conscious about myself. I think the worst part of all is that he's hiding it and trying to be sneaky about it... or am I once again overreacting. Please help! I'm sick of crying about it.

[imported_admin]

what happens when your boyfriend is watching so much porn he barely can be bothered actually doing the real thing... and well, i try to gently suggest what i'd like to get more of, but i believe he's sex drive is demolished because he can just sit in a chair and jerk off. it really makes me feel like he's cheating on me in the way that he is gaining sexuall gratification of some other girl, having him imagining having sex with the girls on those sites makes me feel ill, and i try everything, i'm almost too adventurous, but i don't think it's fair, because i choose not to use toys, and watch porn, since we've started going out, i think it's only fair that he shouldn't too, so we can enjoy eachother more.. he lies about not watching it too, when i find loads of files on the computer, which i think are mp3s! till i click on them... this guy isn't a jerk, but how do i bring this up in the first place, with out making myself look stupid or selfish...

[imported_admin]

i just read your comment, and i feel EXACTLY the same way. i too feel like the girls on tv are having a much better time then what i'm having. I wish i knew the answer, maybe if you have any ideas, or got help from someone else it would be great if you could pass on the information...

[jaiva]

Men aren't like women. Women will sometimes read between the lines but if you aren't blunt with men then they don't seem to understand. If you feel strongly about something your mate is doing then you must tell them whether you like or hate what it is. A relationship is based on honesty so you must be open and honest at all times. If you don't want him to look at porn with other people make him some pics of yourself or film the two of you making love and then he'll have porn to look at that you might possibly approve of.

Jaiva

[shuffleputter]

hi everyone, new here. I too, have this problem. Perfect man in everyother way!! SO then, has anyone been to successfully get past this and have a good relationship? I can't seem to forgive months later: I lost a lot of weight, he said I looked great but then looked up fat porn 2x. Then he got a 40+ magazine because it was "on sale". I am 19. He did all of this while he had pictures of me. Does he have a fetish or was it really on sale? Also snoopy ladies: what is the best software to track the history of internet sites and or overall computer usage? where could he hide other stuff, mags ,dvds? thanks everyone!

[finallyknowme]

hey girls. let me tell you from experience. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE HIM. been there, done that- will never do it again. finally put my foot down and told my boyfriend- who is now the ex- he could take his hand- since he loves it soooo much, and his computer and get lost. BEST THING I EVER DID.

 

let me say it again... YOU ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE HIM.

 

stand up for your selves. women need to stop putting up with men and their lousy excuses for their pathetic behaviour.

 

stand up- dust your selves off, hold your head up high and HAVE SOME SELF RESPECT. on your way out the door, leave a nice gift for him and his new found love- his hand! A nice ring oughta do the trick.

[Annonimius]

hey girls. let me tell you from experience. YOU ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE HIM. been there, done that- will never do it again.

 

finally put my foot down and told my boyfriend- who is now the ex- he could take his hand- since he loves it soooo much, and his computer and get lost. BEST THING I EVER DID.

 

let me say it again... YOU ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE HIM.

Don't think that because it didn't work with your bf, it will never work with any man. I myself have taken steps to stop watching porn and I am really determined to stop it forever. This is not some vague promise, but a real decision because I realise I also don't like it. I don't like the way it's made, I don't like to have sex outside my relationship and I don't want to hurt her feelings. The fact remains however that I still get aroused from seeing naked women. That will never change, but it's a matter of willpower and determination. It's not easy (I guess) but I refuse to believe it's impossible.

 

Honesty is very important to our relationship and I think it should be important for every relationship.

stand up for your selves. women need to stop putting up with men and their lousy excuses for their pathetic behaviour.

Pathetic behaviour perhaps (although that is really subjective), but don't underestimate where it comes from. Our sexuality is something we are born with. It is in many ways a primal instict that you can never get rid of. You can however keep your feelings at bay, if you really want to. Everyone can. We can put decency standards over such primal instincts, to give them a nice form in our relationship and our lives. For me that means to stop watching porn and if you as a girl want your man to stop, you have to realise you have to change him profoundly (in his deepest sexual behavior). It's really not that easy as you (may) think: you say stop it and if he loves you he stops it. He also has to stop for himself, not just for you.

[finallyknowme]

you have to realise you have to change him profoundly (in his deepest sexual behavior). It's really not that easy as you (may) think: you say stop it and if he loves you he stops it. He also has to stop for himself, not just for you.

 

The truth is- you can't change anyone. they have to change for themselves. my by told me that, although he understood how hurtful it was to me, he would not change. knowing this- i made the concsious decision to leave the relationship and I am much better for it.

 

I believe there are men like yourself that believe porn has no place in a respectful relationship. if you truly love each other- you would not need to look at porn to get excited. you would already be that way just by being together.

[CherryGrl]

Wow, 10 pages on this topic! This one hits a lot of hot buttons.

 

Yeah, my boyfriend looks at porn too, and 99 percent of the time it doesn't bother me at all. Frequently we watch it together, sometimes at his instigation and sometimes at mine. On occasion I have experienced minor irritation at his attention to his internet collection, like recently when I was at my laptop and he was on his accross the room, and while waiting for something to download he was cruising porn. Certainly not to get aroused at that moment, in fact we had just had great sex, he was just idly looking.

 

I said to him, god, why would you be looking at that now and he could tell I was mildly annoyed. Right away I could see this hurt his feelings and I realized it was the silliest thing to get irked about. Who cares? I decided to just never say another word, as long as porn doesn't get in the way of real life (and it never has.)

 

For the girls who walk in on their guys while they're watching porn and masturbating -- why not surprise your guy by joining in? Certainly might get you right past that ackward moment! What a great time to give him a BJ, and I'll bet it does a lot more for your relationship than screaming and crying and demanding he stop that disgusting behavior. Let him keep watching the porno. In a minute or two I'll bet you have a lot more of his attention than the girls on the screen.

 

There's a lot of porn out there these days and apparently there are guys who are seriously addicted to it, but this doesn't seem to apply to most guys. If your guy watches porn and beats off sometimes, even though the two of you have a good sex life, try to just take it in stride. He's not comparing you to the girls in the flicks and finding you lacking. I really think it has nothing to do with you or his love for you. (If he's visiting sites where he is trying to hook up with the girls in real life, that's a whole other thing, I'm talking about looking at photos or movies of basically anonymous women.)

 

There are many areas in relationships where people have to compromise. I realize that not all women are comfortable with pornography, and if that's the case you probably won't feel like joining in. But I think demanding the guy never look at porn again or you're going to leave him is a bit over the top.

 

Lots of guys look at the stuff. Are you going to eliminate every guy who ever looks at porn from your list of potential mates? I'm sure there are some guys who have no interest whatsoever in porn, so you might find a guy, but it certainly will decrease the number of men you have to choose from, and eliminate a lot of really nice men.

[finallyknowme]

very good article... written by a man:

 

 

link removed

 

kinda says it all.

[CherryGrl]

Finallyknowme, I just read that article, and I do agree that a lot of porn these days is violent and degrading to women, but I don't think that applies to all porn. I don't think, as this guy apparently does, that we should eliminate all porn.

 

If I were involved with a guy who watched things I found really disgusting, like porn that depicts violence toward women or child porn or women having sex with animals or a woman being degraded by a group of guys (as the video this guy is describing apparently does) I would have an issue with that. The issue wouldn't be over the watching of porn in general though, rather it would be over why these particular images that I find unacceptable would arouse him.

 

I don't think we should make a blanket statement that all pornography is bad. Lots of porn just depicts one man with one woman performing what most people would probably describe as normal sex acts.

[finallyknowme]

Why? Why do two people who are in love with each other, need to watch other "actors" have sex. you see... it just goes against anything real or deep. it kinda takes something that should be beautiful and sacred and turns it into something commercial and ordinary.

 

porn is porn. you can't take it and put it in pretty little boxes. And do you think your boyfriend is watching the "nice" porn. Uh... probably not. Because experts say the tame stuff gets boring to the human mind after a while and it needs to keep "raising the bar". either he's with you or he's not. like it or not, he is spending sexual energy with someTHING else other than you. don't you think you deserve better?

[CherryGrl]

Well, I see where you're coming from, but I think my guy and I see sex as both sacred at times and fun at times. We certainly don't watch porn every time we make love, but it's part of variety and games.

 

I'm pretty familiar with my boyfriend's taste in porn, and he's famliar with mine, it's not something we've ever hidden from each other. After nearly a decade of observing what he chooses to buy and watch, he is attracted to pretty much the same thing now as he always has been and is turned off by violence or cruelty toward women. In fact, he's a very tender and sensual guy.

 

And no, I don't see his watching porn as him giving his sexual energy to something other than me. I don't find it threatening or feel that I "deserve better." If he masturbates, that's his business, practically all humans do. If he likes to look at porn while masturbating, that's his business too, as long as he doesn't masturbate so excessively that he doesn't have enough energy for me, and that has never been even close to the case.