mysterious are women

[Clevertrevor]

Hi,

What I love about this forum is reading of the many complex combinations of heart-ache that stem from the same simple pairing. We really do make life hard for ourselves sometimes!

 

So here's my sad story, with a question at the end;

 

3 yr relationship, mostly all good, if not always great. We had a bit of a hard year, not relationship-wise, more to do with being in an new city and coping with being really broke for a few months. I know that coping with outside pressures can lead to niggles within the relationship, but I thought we had done OK, we were looking forwards and had talked about this great year we were going to have, which commenced with a trip home (a very long way) to visit friends & family.

 

We got back to the big city and 2 weeks later, the day after I had found a couple of great little flats which I was looking forward to showing her, she walks, saying she 'just couldn't see it' (our shared view of a future together, which had marriage and babies in it).

p.s. the trip home didn't make us home-sick, in fact the opposite.

 

Here's what has happened post-break-up;

 

1. We met at a party, and it was great, talked a lot, until the wee hours. We know the love is still there.

2. Next evening she called, upset, wanted me to come over to her new flat. I consider declining, but she sounded really upset, so I went over, stayed the night (no sex offered or wanted). We hugged goodbye in the am, felt OK.

3. We meet the next week (at her initiative) for dinner, talk some more.

4. Next weekend she asks if she can come and use my landline (her phone not yet connected) to call friends overseas. I said "of course" and then when she arrived just left her to it and went off to a party. This last meeting was almost 2 weeks ago, and didn't feel so good for me, no hugs or kisses. Also, on this occasion she forgot to take a towel that she had left at my place from when she moved out. Now, forgetfulness is not something she does. (I'm know, I'm probably reading too much into the towel!)

 

So, that's it, apart from a group txt to her flat-warming. I am in no-contact mode (2 weeks), which is hard; more than once I have deleted a txt message just before sending it, or sat there with my finger over the 'connect' key.

 

Yesterday I called my sister, she's pretty smart. I gave her the above sequence of events, not looking for answers, just telling her what had been going on, and she says to me "She is trying to tell you something."

Err, what? I ask.

Sister thinks this could be my ex's way of telling me she wants me to propose marriage. This idea could be wishful thinking on behalf of my sister, but she tends to call a spade a bloody spade in my experience. And as I said, I thought marriage was on the cards.

 

Some things about us for background;

I can be hard on people, and I reserve extra hardness for those closest to me (as you do).

I have a tendency towards moodiness (diagnosed as mild dysthymia), which is always so much fun to be around.

She's not a great communicator. I'm OK in that department.

And we love each other, no questions there.

 

 

What do you think?

[bzborow1]

You really haven't posted enough information for us to form an opinion. It could just be her wanting to see you because over the time you've developed a friendship. They could be excuses to come see you, or she could be using you. There's not enough info in here I think to form an oppinion.

[woopsydaisy]

weird one.......women huh ( huffs!!).The only thing that i can think of is that you may be moving to fast in the relationship according to her.But then again you have probally discussed it with her loads of times.Is their an age gap in the relationship or anything like that.And i know age should have nothing to do with it ...its love that counts ( big slap on the wrist for woopsydaisy).What does she say she wants ?.I wouldnt agree with your sisters point of view because i see it as if you do propose to her it might make the situation worse....hmmm (scratches head)..sorry thats all i can think of.

[strong1]

The way you describe what you do (moody) and how she is (doesn't always state her needs) are classic male/female challenges. Your sis COULD be correct. Sometimes women (who don't always say what's on their mind but rather try to 'lead' you into saying what they want you to say) make a statement that is just the opposite of what she really feels so you will contradict them. Like 'I look really fat in this don't I?' or.....as in, "I can't see us having a future together" (meaning....'I'm saying this so you refute my point..that way..I'll know how you feel w/out coming out and asking you...So I'll say it first and see what your response it. Twisted I know..but I've done that before.

 

And leaving something behind at your place (the towel) it's a classic move. My girlfriends and I laugh about that being a standard operating procedure a gal sometimes does to get back into your place (I forgot my hairbrush, purse, phone, etc.) Even something as lame as a towel.

 

More details tho..so we can all fully assess. The above is just my quick 2 cents based on your initial info.

[woopsydaisy]

maybe i was wrong then about the towel business!

[Clevertrevor]

Hello,

Thanks for your replies, I certainly appreciate them all. Sorry if I was a bit thin with detail, just didn't want to bore you. And the thing is, there isn't really a lot else, which is why I'm scratching my head too, along with friends and family; typical responses along the lines of- "WHAT? But you seemed so happy!" and "She was telling me last week how much she loved you".

 

So in answer to your questions;

 

Marriage was certainly a mutual goal; she had asked me on several occasions about the idea (though always in a roundabout squirmy kind of way, never directly) and I always answered positively.

 

There is an age-gap of 10 years (I'm older) which never mattered to us.

 

I guess the common-sense answer is that she just wants to retain the friendship. What I can't reconcile is the break-up itself; things were truly not bad, there is no-one else, we have mutual values, mutual goals, mutual interests, mutual respect (except from me when I was being a dick and being impatient/grumpy etc).

 

I love her to bits and to be respectful to that love I feel I will have to stay away from her for time to re-cast it as love in friendship. Otherwise it may turn into pure poison. My fear is that if in fact the commitment issue was the trigger, 'no-contact' may reinforce for her the rightness of her decision. My disappearance may confirm for her that I was not able to commit. Or am I over-thinking it? So, duh, why don't I just ask her? Well, I am scared. Scared that I'm wrong, that it really is over.

 

Your thoughts please...

[bzborow1]

You answered it for yourself. Normally I would say if she dumps you to just let her go and move on, but this situation really seems weird. I would talk to her. Find out what's going on in her head, what she's thinking, maybe there's something you missed? You don't have to approach it from the "i want you back" tone...just questions....

[Clevertrevor]

Last night, went out with some friends got a bit drunk and surprise surprise broke 2 weeks of no-contact. I sent her a txt along the lines of;

"Hi, I'm at (venue) in (location) watching (band) and their very f***in' funky drummer, wish you were here."

She was always keen on drumming, in fact I gave her drumsticks and drumming lessons for christmas last year. So I don't know about you, but I thought that was quite smart, y'know; broke the no-contact, but showed her I was out enjoying myself (which I very much was) and let her know I was thinking of her. And as an aside, part of me hates the game-playing; I think I've always been up for honesty and clarity, this feels a little bit dirty. Then again, the sentiments within the txt were 100% true, it's just the motivation behind it that troubles me a bit.

[bzborow1]

Yeah accept:

 

1.) you were drunk, and

2.) it sounds like u r trying to show off...not too good.

 

I'd just ask her to coffee, and then ask her what's going on. Be direct.

[Clevertrevor]

Yes! Got a reply, and (not wanting to read anything into it no no not me) she rang me in her lunch-break; it wasn't a txt, and she waited until she would have had time to talk.

I saw her name come up on the phone, literally took a deep breath and relaaaaxed into it. She said she was jealous; "sounds like you had a better night than me, in bed by 9.30 with a book".

God it was nice to hear her voice. I was friendly, she asked me some stuff like "are you coming to my party?" I replied no because I will be working out of town, and I offered a few more details about what I was going to be up to that w/end, but not before she asked for them.

The conversational tone was OK, a bit wobbly at the end bit where you wonder if the other is going to 'say something'. We didn't.

 

So that is a result I think, I'm happy that I have integrity in this conversation, and after talking to some more smart women, I feel that love isn't the issue, like isn't the issue, it may be all about commitment. Now as a man I tend to not see stuff, and assumed we were on the same page, but when I think about a couple of events pre break-up, I am wondering if she decided that I couldn't commit. The events were a best friends wedding that we travelled overseas for, and another friends hen party the night before she left me. This may be a test, and I may be failing it.

 

So here is a situation where I think one has to be very careful with no contact; it should be carefully applied, or it may look as if I have written off the relationship and it obviously wasn't that important to me. Which is so not true.

 

Then again, what if she just wants to be friends? Well I shall pluck up the courage to call her tonight and ask her out for dinner or similar; something with alcohol in it anyway! What's to lose?

[bzborow1]

Yes but that's open-ended. She may think you are asking her out as friends. So if you two do go out, i'd ask her what's going on with this whole situation...where she's coming from...because it sounds like u 2 never really talked about it.

[Clevertrevor]

So do you think I should I set up a date this week, or wait a bit, and give her a bit more of the old NC? It's not like I'm going to pop the question, I just want to find out really what's going on in her head.

[bzborow1]

I don't see any reason why not? As long as you're not calling her everyday it's all good I would think.

[Clevertrevor]

Well, I called her, and found that her Saturday call had left her feeling like I hadn't enjoyed talking to her. Geez, and I thought she was the bad communicator! So that was bad right? Anyway, got a date, Thurs night. Phew, this is hard, but as danimal said, "I never gave up on her"

 

So its not that she doesn't love me or doesn't like me. It's that she can't see our future together; it was getting too hard.

I spoke to her Mum today to sound out what the ex said to her Mum about us. Turns out she said it's over, it's definitely over, no looking back. She also said something a bit odd; in essense, it was that the destination (marriage) was going to be good, but the journey wasn't worth it.

She still wants to be friends, there has been no post-breakup drama, in fact I have I think been surprising her with my calmness.

So, there was no big bad thing going on between us, in fact I think her thing was it seems that she couldn't see us together, she couldn't see a shared future. Our recent past has been lacking in vision, and I hoped that this year would be our great year together, (the ingredients were there) but I guess we weren't communicating effectively recently. So how do I speak to her NO? How do I have her understand that things will be easy & fun from now on? To renew the relationship? Or do I just turn up with a ring? HELP!

[GeeCee]

No Clevertrevor - no ring just yet. You are going to have to be very cool with this one. Talk little and listen a lot. See where she leads the converstion and adapt yours to suit. But try and stay away from relationship talk.

 

G xx

[Clevertrevor]

OK got it. Am going to...FEED THE BIRD! Thanks MajorD, I love that. It's a great mental image to keep in front of mind when your brain is melting. Beec reckoned a fun casual date is the best idea, it's hard when you just want to jump ahead to the good stuff. Like, I'm thinking how can I get her to go away to the seaside for Easter, but I know that's too much too soon. Isn't it?

[Clevertrevor]

And G, I look forward to being in your position soonish. Use The Force wisely you will.

We will have a lot to post about on Friday I feel.

Here's a mental tip for keeping calm; I use it when going through Customs at an airport (not that I have anything to be worried about, I've never had to spread 'em- touch wood) It's simply to think Gray. Think of the colour, think of whatever that means to you, but think GRAY, and keep thinking it.

[GeeCee]

Thanks Clevertrevor - Grey it is then!!

 

How are you feeling.

 

Me - I have done all the proactive things to get myself ready. Clothes bought, and of course, matching shoes and handbag. New ear-rings, necklace. French manicure on finger and toenails. Having hair cut tomorrow. All this and when he turns up - I will be hoping to look 'naturally' gorgeous!! Ha!!!

 

I can't deny that I am feeling nervous - especially with what poor Spatz went through. Really nervous - but that is a good thing for me. I am usually too confident - nerves will ground me.

 

Have a great parrot joke that will have him roaring.

 

G xx

 

P.S. Perhaps I could ask him to wear sunglasses, that way I could avoid looking at those pretty green eyes!!

[Clevertrevor]

So, let's just all act natural alright? Good Luck G!

 

My problem is going to be keeping my head on straight. And not blurt anything. Had a bit of a bawl before; important safety tip; don't blub while your on your scooter.

 

So I am using the following mantra:

I AM GOING TO BE FUN. I DO NOT NEED ANY ANSWERS. I ROCK. I WILL LISTEN. AND I WILL GET HER BACK. EVENTUALLY.

 

Sheesh. Makes it hard to move on though, if that is necessary. That's why I wanted to talk relationship stuff, so I know whether to continue moving on. I guess she'll tell me tomorrow, and if she doesn't, then I won't ask.

[GeeCee]

Most important mantra of them all, Clevertrevor:

 

DON'T ASK ANYTHING ABOUT THE RELATIONSHIP!!!

 

Just look hot, act light, flirty, lots of teeth and eyes!! Oh, piece of cake!!!

 

G xx

[Clevertrevor]

I don't know if I can do this. I think I will cancel tomorrow. I'm a wreck. I managed it well the first time we met post-breakup; this just feels too heavy.

[GeeCee]

Whoa Clevertrevor - WFT is going on in your mind. Calm down. Calm down. Think grey. Dikaia got accepted for him MBA today. You and I are going on a date tomorrow - for goodness sake - do not rock me to my foundations right now - too many things to think about. You are not going to cancel - you can do this - you ROCK remember?

 

We are going to treat this as a first date. Remember that first date. My ex called SMSd me at the end of the night to say he had a great day. I did not reply. He SMSd me the next day to say he had a really great time, I did not reply. An hour later - shall we do it again. I replied to that one saying hmmmm - we'll see. My ex thought I was not interested in him at the time, because I looked all vague and slightly disinterested. Remember what drew her to you inthe first place, and just repeat more of the same.

 

You will be good - really good. You have waited for this, prepared for this and you know what to do. No-one said it was going to be easy. Now get to it. I will post earlier than you Friday because of the time difference. But I will be thinking about you later. Post on Friday.

 

G xx

[GeeCee]

Whoa Clevertrevor - WFT is going on in your mind. Calm down. Calm down. Think grey. Dikaia got accepted for him MBA today. You and I are going on a date tomorrow - for goodness sake - do not rock me to my foundations right now - too many things to think about. You are not going to cancel - you can do this - you ROCK remember?

 

We are going to treat this as a first date. Remember that first date. My ex SMSd me at the end of the night to say he had a great time. I did not reply. He SMSd me the next day to say he had a really great time, I did not reply. An hour later - shall we do it again. I replied to that one saying hmmmm - we'll see. My ex thought I was not interested in him at the time, because I looked all vague and slightly disinterested. Remember what drew her to you inthe first place, and just repeat more of the same.

 

You will be good - really good. You have waited for this, prepared for this and you know what to do. No-one said it was going to be easy. Now get to it. I will post earlier than you Friday because of the time difference. But I will be thinking about you later. Post on Friday.

 

G xx