Lessons learned the hard way...

[browneyedgirl36]

Just a little lesson learned by yours truly, one that I think many of us can benefit from. I've actually been "taught" this lesson several times in my life already, but for some reason it's taken 38 years for it to sink in. It's pretty simple, and most of us already know it, even if we don't admit it to ourselves:

 

The temptation is REALLY great to remain friends with an ex directly after a break-up, not only because we still want him or her in our life, but also because we hope that, if he or she continues to see us and be reminded of how great we are -- how caring, loving, funny, compassionate, smart, what have you -- that he or she will snap to attention and realize "Wow! I NEVER should have broken up with him/her! He/She is SO great! What was I thinking?" and that the person will snatch us back up and be ours forever. In my experience, this has NEVER worked. I can count 4 times (hopefully, the fourth time will be the last), that I have attempted this "stay-in-his-life-to-remind-him-of-how-great-you-are-and-hopefully-he'll-come-around" maneuver, and it has never worked for me. In every case, I didn't end up with the guy, and in ALL four cases, they ultimately chose to be with someone else. (Two went back to previous exes, two found new people entirely.) I'm not saying it has never worked for ANYONE, but it hasn't worked for me or anyone else I know, and in fact it has only prolonged the suffering AND the healing process.

 

I know that NC is not a cure-all, and I know it cannot be done in every situation (mine is one of them, as I work with my most recent ex and have no intention of giving up a career that I worked so hard for, especially not in these tough economic times), but I think that, wherever it can be done, it should be, at least until the urge to "hang around until they come around" subsides and you can be in contact with the ex without having any significant expectations as to the outcome. In cases in which NC can't be done, being polite and cordial is fine; being flirty, overly attentive, and obviously "available" often results in disappointment and further heartbreak. I have learned from some very heartbreaking experience. I have been TOO kind, too available, too open, too friendly with my most recent ex (though all contact outside of work has been initiated by him, and any flirty behavior has initiated with him as well -- I have respected the fact that he is with someone else and have made no overt attempts to get him back), and the result has been a tremendous amount of mixed signals from him, a lot of very hot and cold behavior, a lot carrots dangled only to be ripped away, and a LOT of disappointment and frustration for me.

 

My advice to others who might be in a similar situation and who hope that sticking around will make him or her realize what he or she lost and come running back...don't do it. Shift your focus. Pursue other interests (including other people, if you feel so inclined). Don't allow yourself to have carrots dangled in front of you and ripped away. Don't read into the fact that he or she texts you sometimes or calls or asks you to lunch or stops by your desk to chat. Don't get caught up in thinking that anything you do or say can "make" him or her come around. People come around -- or don't -- entirely of their own free will.

 

The sad thing for me is that I have known ever since the FIRST time I was in this situation, in my early 20's, that hanging around hoping he'd change his mind was NOT effective or productive --not to mention the fact that it wasn't healthy for me. Yet, I have found myself in this exact same place THREE more times since (four if you count a guy friend that I kept contacting and hanging around with in the hope that he would see me as more than a friend). In my case, I chalk it up to lack of confidence in my ability to find a great guy who will love me, a lack of confidence that was instilled in me as a child and has continued to hinder me will into my 30's. I want to change this, and I know I need help to do so. Therapy has not helped much, as both of the therapists I've seen recently seem to think that online dating is the answer to all of my problems and don't seem all that interested in helping me get at the roots of my distorted thinking and helping me to change it.

 

Anyway...this post has gone on too long. I just wanted to pass on a bit of wisdom from someone who has made the same mistake repeatedly. I am hopeful that, the next time a guy breaks up with me (or expresses that he sees me as "just a friend") that I will not hang around in the hope that he will change his mind, that instead I will let him go and shift my focus elsewhere.

[Share Hate]

I read your really long post I have to say it really is a text full of wisdom. What you wrote is kind of the answer to a threat I just started an ahour ago. In any case, the problem is, I know exactly what you mean but cannot apply it to my life, which would be to set the boundaries after the break up and stop hoping that she will realize I am the best thing that has ever happened to her and will come back begging. That is the last feeling I have left from a 6 year relationship and it is kind of freightening to let that feeling go as well. But I am working on it.

[Struggling23]

I agree, my own experience with "friends" is such a joke, first time after my ex fiance left me and I tried being friends, I was the one who was always initiating contact, and it just felt so weird. This time around again same thing, i thought I could be friends we were great friends before, but again its been 2 weeks and both times I initiated the contact, so again I just said screw it and dissappeared..

[rebelfac]

My wife of twelve years left me 5 months ago and moved in with another guy. She is very happy and also wants me to find somebody else. He is filling the affection void that I created and I see no hope at all that we will ever get back together but I miss being with her so much. We have a twelve year old daughter so I can't go completely NC but It's hard to go even limited contact. We talk once a week and instant message from work twice a week. It's so hard to understand how she can throw the memories away. I am at the point where I think I have no chance and that limited contact won't help.

[browneyedgirl36]

I read your really long post I have to say it really is a text full of wisdom. What you wrote is kind of the answer to a threat I just started an ahour ago. In any case, the problem is, I know exactly what you mean but cannot apply it to my life, which would be to set the boundaries after the break up and stop hoping that she will realize I am the best thing that has ever happened to her and will come back begging. That is the last feeling I have left from a 6 year relationship and it is kind of freightening to let that feeling go as well. But I am working on it.

 

I know it's very hard. Believe me, I have been working on it for some time, but I am still not entirely *there* yet. I was just thinking today about the whole letting go thing and how scary that is. It IS really scary. Even just setting boundaries with my ex, even if I don't cut him off completely, will be scary and painful. I keep coming back to the same question: What am I holding on to, anyway? The answer is, NOTHING. There is nothing to hold on to, other than a few conversations at work every week, a text or e-mail here and there...at this point, that's all it amounts to.

 

Hang in there. I know it's hard. You'll know when it's time for you to let go.

[browneyedgirl36]

I agree, my own experience with "friends" is such a joke, first time after my ex fiance left me and I tried being friends, I was the one who was always initiating contact, and it just felt so weird. This time around again same thing, i thought I could be friends we were great friends before, but again its been 2 weeks and both times I initiated the contact, so again I just said screw it and dissappeared..

 

That would be difficult, for sure. In every situation I've been in except for my current one, I was always the one doing the initiating and getting delayed or very polite/brief responses (or sometimes no response at all). It really wore on me after awhile. In this current case, HE is the one doing all the initiating, but it still doesn't feel great, because it still amounts to nothing. He's still with someone else, even if it really isn't working out.

 

In a way, it helps if they aren't really all that responsive. After awhile, you start to get sick of being in that position, and you realize it's time to let go. It's painful getting to that point, but once it happens, you realize it's a good thing.

[browneyedgirl36]

My wife of twelve years left me 5 months ago and moved in with another guy. She is very happy and also wants me to find somebody else. He is filling the affection void that I created and I see no hope at all that we will ever get back together but I miss being with her so much. We have a twelve year old daughter so I can't go completely NC but It's hard to go even limited contact. We talk once a week and instant message from work twice a week. It's so hard to understand how she can throw the memories away. I am at the point where I think I have no chance and that limited contact won't help.

 

I'm sorry you're going through this. I know you must really miss her. You're probably right, limited contact probably won't help. It's best, if she has someone else, just to back away and only have contact as it pertains to your daughter. That must be really difficult because you can't cut contact with her completely, but if you could just keep it to e-mails or very brief contact about your daughter, that will help a little.

[unwritten law]

Thank you for your post. I am having very similiar feelings about being "friends" with my ex. I am nearing 2 months of NC. My ex wanted to be friends and as painful as it was for me, I tried to be her friend. During our brief contact as "friends" she became very rude and insulting to me. I just couldn't take it from her and just cut off all contact and disappeared.

 

I still miss her and think about her very often. At times I think I should try and be her friend again. I keep reminding myself that she made the decision to dump me. I did try to be her friend and she was terrible to me. I realize she isn't good for me. I have to truly and completely let go and move on with my life. She can't be a part of my life at all.

[rapunzel]

hi BEG36-

 

This is a tough lesson to learn. I wonder if in your current situation, working with your ex, if you did NOT work with him, would you have tried to be his "friend" and stay in his life somehow? I know for a fact, at this point in my life, that if my ex and I did not work together, that I would not contact him nor try to be his friend. I would do complete NC and maybe in a year or two, if he contacted me, we could then be "friends" possibly, depending on the circumstances. If he did not contact me, I would just let him go.

 

It is very difficult when you have to have regular contact with an ex as we both know. Your ex has been going through tough times and being the nice person that you are, you have been kind and helpful to him. It sounds like lately this has made you feel worse...did something happen, some news with his relationship? Have you decided to be less helpful and kind to him and how does that make you feel?

 

We all know how easy it is to be misled by contact from our ex. After the first break up with my ex, he dangled carrots for several months...I should give myself a wee bit of credit that I gave it 10 months before anything happened....but during that time he consistently contacted me, asked me to hang out, kissed me on the lips twice, etc. But he never made a real move on me and after he poured his heart out to me 9 months later, apologized for how he had treated me, gazed into my eyes and told me I was a wonderful, beautiful person, etc, wanted to be my friend for a long long time, I thought it meant something else. And a month later somehow, he was in my apartment. I threw caution to the wind, made a move on him which was so, so unwise. Yet he took me up on it and spent another 3.5 months with me, probably knowing all along he had no intention of anything serious with me, and here I was thinking I might have another chance. ](*,)

 

Yeah, chalk it up to a lesson learned the hard way. Without question the best and most self-preserving thing to do as a woman, when a man breaks up with you, is to (if you can) - poof - disappear - without a trace. If he wants you, he will find you and he will have to PROVE through his actions that he has made a mistake and wants to try again. If you were dumped by a man, you should never make it easy for him to come back. Huge mistake. We all do it at some point, and we all (hopefully) learn from it.

 

If you have to work together, which can be an untenable situation and can definitely lead to prolonged healing, the best thing is as you said, polite and cordial but business only, no talking about personal stuff, no lunches together, no grabbing a drink. This just keeps you on a string, hoping for more, and emotionally involved with the man who told you he just wants to be "friends".

 

The bottom line is everyone wants what they can't have. I saw this firsthand with my ex. He would not commit to his ex and they were 'friends' for over a year. I believe she was hoping he would come back to her so she stayed in his life in that capacity. Then, as often happens, she got sick of it, got over him and decided he wasn't worth the risk. He had been so wishy washy with her that she decided to turn the tables on him. He tried to get her back and she told him, sorry, I'm seeing someone and by the way, I would really like to be "friends" with you. He THEN wanted her back with a vengeance and fell into a deep depression.

 

Not all people are like this but some are. Some would say, a man like that, forget it...you will never really have his heart, he will always want the one who let him go. Maybe they are right.

 

Anyway, I did not mean to hijack your thread but I hope you are doing OK. I think your ex will always remember how kind you were to him, and I'm sure he appreciates it. But he is addicted to this woman, who has dumped him in the past, and what has it been - off and on for 10 years? She has the upper hand and for some reason which really has NOTHING to do with you, he gets off on that. The best thing to remember is that what people do has really NOTHING to do with us, it has to do with THEM. Never take anything personally. It is so, so hard to do but it really is true.

 

Sorry my response is SO long. There is some great wisdom in your post that hopefully others will take to heart. Hang in there!

[rebelfac]

I'm sorry you're going through this. I know you must really miss her. You're probably right, limited contact probably won't help. It's best, if she has someone else, just to back away and only have contact as it pertains to your daughter. That must be really difficult because you can't cut contact with her completely, but if you could just keep it to e-mails or very brief contact about your daughter, that will help a little.

 

Thanks for the feedback. I know it's over but wonder why if we see each other and it wasn't planned and she doesn't have her makeup on , she feels the need to explain in advance that she isn't looking good at the moment. Why does she care if I see her not looking her best? I really wish I had another chance to show her how much I have changed and wonder if the honeymoon phase will wear off.

[rapunzel]

To Rebelfac - She's only been with this new guy for 5 months and as you said, it's still in the "honeymoon" phase which means it could go either way - it might not survive - but don't get your hopes up as it also COULD survive. It is still an anxious time for anyone in a new relationship. She still wants to look good for you because she wants to keep you on the back burner, the security blanket thing. I agree that you should try to limit your contact as to what pertains to your daughter.

 

Since she is with someone else, you should not hold out hope. The best thing for you to do, as hard as it is, is try to accept and move on. Mourn your loss as long as you need to. It won't do any good to try and show her how much you've changed, she would have to come back out of her own free will. As BEG36 pointed out in her post, the worst thing you can do is "wait" , try to be "friends" and hope that she will see how wonderful you really are, will miss you and will come back. It doesn't work. We cannot influence other people. The best thing we can do is give them what they want - their freedom - to do whatever they want - so give her what she wanted when she left you - her freedom. That means YOU become scarce - physically, emotionally - except for your obligations to your daughter.

 

Hang in there!

[InRecovery]

Yeah I think friendship is impossible, in fact any sort of relationship is impossible until/ unless you both want the same things out of it ... so as long as one wants more from the relationship then the other is prepared to give its just not going to work.

 

I can't imagine, with the way it ended between me and my ex, with all the things that were said and all the things we had planned, that we could ever go back to being just friends. It doesn't seem possible, but then I know right now that I'm still incredibly hurt/ let down by how things turned out and a lot of the stuff that was said that I could forgive but not forget.

 

Maybe after a prolonged period of no contact where I'm happy and comfortable in my situation then we could have some form of friendship, but I wouldn't imagine my future partner being comfortable with me having my first true love who I thought I'd spend the rest of my life with as part of my life.

 

So yeah ... realistically, I don't speak to any of my ex's, we're not friends and while this relationship was different, I think the outcome will be the same in that she'll just be a memory that fades and nothing more. Thats what I hope anyway.

[rebelfac]

Thanks so much rapunzel for the thoughts. She is making long term plans with him and he picks my daughter up from school. She mentioned yesterday the high school near his home that Maddy will go to in addition to the new middle school. She is in the 7th grade. I am currently living with a friend 4.5 hours away and miss my daughter too. I am wondering how important it is now that she is into her friends to be nearby. I guess I should be glad I loved and lost for 14 years than to have never loved/met her. I was so happy with her but didn't appreciate it and am now suffering the consequences. It will be extremely hard to become scarce but if it increases my low odds I will do it. My thoughts though are that she is way to into him to miss me and that she will forget about me. I have to realize I guess that we will talk occassionally about our daughter and I do want to hear about Maddy from her POV. I have never been so sad but I do know that meeting someone new will help.

[canali]

First change your therapist ...there are as you know tons out there and you are paying for a business service to love you and to help you...they currently aren't meeting these needs so hasta la vista baby! ...2/you are holding onto something and that's a dream that is sadly no longer real ...we all yearn for it...but I get you in that ultimately its nothing too/an illusion....hugs sweetheart!

I know it's very hard. Believe me, I have been working on it for some time, but I am still not entirely *there* yet. I was just thinking today about the whole letting go thing and how scary that is. It IS really scary. Even just setting boundaries with my ex, even if I don't cut him off completely, will be scary and painful. I keep coming back to the same question: What am I holding on to, anyway? The answer is, NOTHING. There is nothing to hold on to, other than a few conversations at work every week, a text or e-mail here and there...at this point, that's all it amounts to.

 

Hang in there. I know it's hard. You'll know when it's time for you to let go.

[browneyedgirl36]

First change your therapist ...there are as you know tons out there and you are paying for a business service to love you and to help you...they currently aren't meeting these needs so hasta la vista baby! ...2/you are holding onto something and that's a dream that is sadly no longer real ...we all yearn for it...but I get you in that ultimately its nothing too/an illusion....hugs sweetheart!

 

Yeah...I've thought about getting a different therapist. I've only been to two, but BOTH have, after talking to me for a session or two, started pressuring me to do online dating, as if that were the solution to everything that causes me pain. The last one wasn't quite as bad as the first one; the first one put so much pressure on my that I abruptly cancelled my last appointment and never went back. I KNOW I need to make myself more *available* if I want to find someone, but I also know that finding someone is NOT going to solve all of my problems -- I want to get at why I hang on to situations that I'm getting nothing out of, why I have trouble letting go even if I am getting nothing -- so that I can fix these things (or at least work toward changing them).

 

Thanks for your response!

[canali]

What of joining clubs ie hobbies or sports or link removed in your area....just meeting more people and friends in more casual settings ....that's how I met me ex.

[browneyedgirl36]

What of joining clubs ie hobbies or sports or link removed in your area....just meeting more people and friends in more casual settings ....that's how I met me ex.

 

I am going to do this. I have a list of link removed groups that I haven't done anyting with yet. I know I need to get on that!

[Clabs]

I am going to do this. I have a list of link removed groups that I haven't done anyting with yet. I know I need to get on that!

 

Browneyedgirl

 

Get on with it!

 

Mark

[browneyedgirl36]

Browneyedgirl

 

Get on with it!

 

Mark

 

LOL! Yes sir!

 

I promise I will, very soon, and I will even post about it, just to keep myself honest.

[Clabs]

This'l be so good for you darling!

 

Mark