in limbo

[jman311]

I need some help. I'm not sure what I should do. I haven't posted my story on here yet although I've been on here reading and posting on other's threads for a little while. Anyhow the last 24 hours have been terrible for me and I feel like I need to get this out, so figured this is a good place for it. I will probably ramble on though …

 

My ex of 1 and ½ years broke up with me almost 2 months ago, the week before both Valentine's and my birthday. We had broken up back in October of last year (that time was my choice) but we got back together in December. January was, at least for me, close to the best our relationship ever was. We spent a lot of time together, everything seemed to go very well, and during that period she told me if she were to ever marry anyone it would be me. All of a sudden, she 180'd on me. She started blowing me off, and then she accused me of taking her for granted, although she couldn't really back it up when I asked her to explain herself, and eventually she turned around and said she didn't really feel that way, but that she was having a lot of issues with herself and needed time to work on her. This I can agree with, because I have to admit she does have problems … she is a bartender and she drinks way too much. She spends a lot of time in that environment and associates with a big party/drinking crowd. And when she does drink she gets carried away often … now, I like to drink myself, but during our relationship I was always the one who was looking after her and never the other way around. I broke up with her the first time basically because of a drunken episode she had. She began becoming negative towards me when she was drunk, and I think she was dealing with any relationship issues that way instead of communicating with me properly. Before we broke up the second time though, this wasn't the case, and things were much better in that regard.

 

Anyhow she started back in school in January. She had also fallen out of contact with a lot of her old friends in the last few years, and wanted to rebuild some of her friendships. So I can understand her being busy and needing to focus on those things. She said she can't be with me now, and because she needs to get herself together I understand that … she knows she has issues to work out. The hard part for me is I am still head over heels in love with her, but I have no real way of knowing if she'll want to be with me again down the road … so basically I feel stuck in limbo and I hate it. I so love this girl, I love everything about her, her flaws and all. We have a connection like none I've experienced with anyone else, the thought of her melts my heart. And our physical relationship was the best we've both ever experienced, basically perfect. But I think if she really wanted to be with me, she would find a way, or at least make it clear that's how she felt, right? She said "doesn't want me out of her life" but that's all I really know.

 

After the break-up I tried NC, but I broke it several times. She also broke it by drunk dialing me and asking me if I'd have sex with her (but not meaning our relationship was back on). I said I would (even though I shouldn't have), but I was actually at work and unable to meet her, so she said we could meet later. When I called her later she didn't answer, my guess is she sobered up and changed her mind. Another time she emailed and said she wanted to go out with me, but didn't follow through and basically ignored my inquiries about it later. She said over a few emails we exchanged that she was teetering on this, that she wanted to see me but was afraid because she'd end up wanting to spend all her time with me again, and she was afraid I'd think we were getting back together. I asked her to go to The Strokes concert with me a while back (the first time we ever went out was to see them). She said she'd have gone but her parents were visiting her so she couldn't, I was actually surprised she said that she'd have gone if she could have, but I'm not even sure if she was just saying that or what. I ended up breaking down and crying in the middle of the show, ugh.

 

I have been really confused because of communications like this mixed with the fact that when I have contacted her, as normally I got either a very limited response or no response at all. I ended up feeling like I was annoying her when I contacted her usually, and even though she acted that way she said that wasn't the case when I talked to her. But I started to realize pretty much all our communication was initiated by me and not her, although she would reply to me (eventually). So, I have realized I really need to do NC and stick to it, I know my focus needs to be to let things be and work on me, and I feel like I must assume that the relationship is over so I can go on with my life and center myself again. I got to the point where the thought of being in contact with her made me feel almost ill, because I was just hurting myself more. Unfortunately my feelings can flip flop all too easily sometimes too.

 

Last week she sent me a forward of some little blurb regarding going through major life transitions, and she said she sent it because it outlined what she was going through and it had made her cry. But no real explanation of her feelings. She didn't say anything that requested a reply so I didn't answer, I had initiated NC again and I didn't talk to her all week. Until yesterday, she emailed me again to say hello and that she was going to call me. She did call me last night, but I was out with friends, so even though I answered I said I couldn't talk.

 

This morning I check my email, she'd emailed me last night and she asked me "So I was thinking about getting a boob job and was curious to your opinion?" I am actually pretty upset and hurt she asked me this… all things considered. I don't know what to say, or if I should just not reply. I would tell her she doesn't need one, cause I love her just how she is, but I think that might not be a good idea to say anything like that … to show my emotions for her. I don't want to be her security blanket now. If she really wanted to get one I'd be ok with it too, whatever makes her happy. But the thing is why should it matter as far as I'm concerned, we're not even together! Why that question? It makes me think things like how many more guys would end up hitting on her, etc, and it puts me in a bad place…

 

For anyone that made it through all that thank you! I just realized how much I wrote, and I feel a little better just having said it all… this site is great and it's helped me a lot already.

 

J

[tylercdurden2004]

And when she does drink she gets carried away often … now, I like to drink myself, but during our relationship I was always the one who was looking after her and never the other way around.

 

Read this over and over again. Maybe this is what she means by taking her for granted. Although it seems on the surface she is taking you for granted deep down it maybe says something different. To me it says two things

 

1) Anything she does she knows you will always be there for her no matter how she behaves.

 

2) You take for granted the relationship and that her love for you will always mean you will be together even if she changes.

 

Love and a realtionship are not one and the same. You can have a realtionship without love and love without a relationship. The first is never healthy and thats where you have to use logic cause a relationship is the logical part of the equation. The second although not great is quite normal and is the feelings part of the equation. In sum feelings (heart) and logic (mind) are needed for a healthy relationship. Without either its doomed to fail.

[Bethany]

Stick to NC, you know in your gut that it's what needs to happen. Trust your inner defenses, because they are trying to protect you.

Do not reply, do not reply to any mails that do not specifically say that she wants to get back with you or at very least say that she misses you and wants to talk about getting back together. You are not her best mate, you have been her intimate partner and she's using you to get HERSELF through the seperation process and is being extremely selfish.

[jman311]

tylercdurden and Bethany ... thanks for the replies

 

tylercdurden,

I see some truth to what you said. She has had some really bad behavior towards me in our relationship, but I have always looked past it and let it go, while on the other hand I think she always held some unfair grudges against me. I never really thought about your #2 there, but I think that may be what she was getting at there. It makes sense when I look at the whole enchilada...

 

Bethany,

Do you think I should not be there for her at all? I know now I am not going to actively pursue her anymore, and I won't initiate contact with her ... but it's hard to not want to be a friend and at least see how her feelings evolve, and I feel like not replying will really end it all in the long run...

[tylercdurden2004]

Now eat that enchilada and enjoy it! My favorite mexican food.

[PocoDiablo]

Interesting. Sounds like my ex-wife....

 

Some things I noticed...

 

We had broken up back in October of last year (that time was my choice) but we got back together in December. .... All of a sudden, she 180'd on me.

I've noticed that once folks break up and get back together, things rarely work out well. It is almost like you needed to work on whatever the problem was, not walk out. Now that someone has set the precedent for walking out, it's not a sacred bond, it's a technique - a tool - to manipulate the other person in the relationship.

 

she is a bartender and she drinks way too much. She spends a lot of time in that environment and associates with a big party/drinking crowd.

She basically needs a lot of excitement in her day-to-day affairs? Hard to settle down with someone who needs that...

 

I think if she really wanted to be with me, she would find a way

Yes but ...

 

or at least make it clear that's how she felt, right?

No. I think if she were interested she would/should/could change her behaviors. But if the can't ... hey, doesn't matter what she *says* if she's not backing it up with action.

 

She said "doesn't want me out of her life" but that's all I really know.

Sounds like you got friendzoned in a way.

 

I ended up breaking down and crying in the middle of the show, ugh.

Tough, man, that's tough. On a related note, that's the kind of stuff to keep to yourself if possible (not show her.)

 

I have been really confused because of communications like this mixed with the fact that when I have contacted her, as normally I got either a very limited response or no response at all

 

....

 

I have realized I really need to do NC and stick to it

 

....

 

Last week she sent me a forward of some little blurb regarding going through major life transitions

 

...

 

I had initiated NC again and I didn't talk to her all week.

 

...

 

she emailed me again to say hello and that she was going to call me. She did call me last night, but I was out with friends, so even though I answered I said I couldn't talk.

 

This morning I check my email, she'd emailed me last night and she asked me "So I was thinking about getting a boob job and was curious to your opinion?" I am actually pretty upset and hurt she asked me this…

Notice something here... The LESS you email her, the MORE she emails you. The LESS effort you put into things, the MORE she wants you. You're being a challenge, and that's fun for her.

 

Notice also that she was not getting replies, so she upped the ante! Boom! She sent you something designed to get a rise out of you and it looks like it's about to work. If you get emotionally involved with the response and reply ... hey, she won. She took control of your horns and twisted you to the ground.

 

I don't want to be her security blanket now.

AKA, Therapist.

 

If she really wanted to get one I'd be ok with it too, whatever makes her happy. But the thing is why should it matter as far as I'm concerned, we're not even together! Why that question? It makes me think things like how many more guys would end up hitting on her, etc, and it puts me in a bad place…

It's *supposed* to. It's designed to upset you so you come charging back, and if you are really so predictable as to fall for that "test" you'll fail it, and she'll deduct another mental point as to why she doesn't want to be with you. She's looking for you to be strong, aloof, and non responsive. Believe it or not, she wants to WORK at getting you back.

 

haven't you ever heard a woman say "Oh, I can't leave him, I have too much invested in him!" Yeah, maybe she sees you as a project ... and if it ain't broken she can't fix it ... so ... be broken. Don't respond like she wants you to.

 

-------------

 

Personally, I divorced my alcoholic bartender ex-wife because of the same kind of things you are going through. She was just not my type. I wanted a smart, stable, caring woman. And a few years later I met her. Me? I'd tell you to NC and move on.

[jman311]

PocoDiablo, thanks much for your reply!

 

On a related note, that's the kind of stuff to keep to yourself if possible

 

Yeah I was tempted to tell her that at first but decided not to, and was glad I didn't.

 

You're being a challenge, and that's fun for her....

Believe it or not, she wants to WORK at getting you back.

 

That would make a LOT of sense knowing her. She loves to create challenges in her own life all the time and she'll even admit it. I really hope she's not playing the games she appears to be playing with this whole situation, but that's probably just me making excuses for her again. So sad.

 

As tough as it is I'm gonna just ignore that email from her. Having thought about it I wouldn't know what to say even if I did answer it.

 

Now I just have to choose between really moving on and pretending to move on. I have been working at the former but seems like I always end up on the latter. Setbacks like this sure don't help.

 

Thanks so much the help!

[PocoDiablo]

You know, I would point out that her creating challenges is not a game, per se, but more of a ... genetic predisposition. I would not hold it against her as something she is doing on purpose, because I really don't think she has any control over that. For a long list of reasons, I find that many women can have this same trait. Whether or not you want to work with it, or how demanding it is, is something you need to figure out. I've found that strippers, bartenders, waitresses, and other high-profile types of women are more prone to needing MORE challenge than more down-to-earth women. (Not always, of course, just making an example.)

 

So, I tell guys to pick a woman who has the same level of challenge and excitement as you do. If you're a flirt and like to go out and party/drink like she does, then go for it. But the problem is that you cannot be *acting* like that. You TRULY have to be that person. If you are only partying and drinking because you met her, then it's not going to work. It's like you are lying to her to be with her. You can't do that. If you like to go out once a week, and she likes to go out 5 times a week, that's not going to work - in my opinion.

 

So, if you really think you want her back, you've got to become the ultimate challenge. You have to make her work for you, work to get you back. Me? Yeah, I could get her back in a heartbeat. Sad to say but the level of games she is playing is very easy to work with. She's not thinking on her feet, she's just going with what she feels.

 

If you wanted to get her back, next time she asks you for something, you tell her "Nah, you're back on probabtion." You know she's going to want to know what that is ... and why she's "back" on "probabtion." The concept is simple and fun. Let her know you've got standards - high standards, which I know you do - and while you think she's okay, she started acting in a way that made you think she's not really the kind woman you thought she was. (Whoa!) Tell her she lost a point when she did such-and-such thing and now she's got to work to get back into your graces. Then PLAY. Play with it. PLAY and have fun. Flirt with her, and if she does something sweet, nice, etc., tell her she earned a point. Don't give points out easily, and never let her know how many points she has - even though she will ask. And Yes, she is ALWAYS on probabtion, even after you are married.

 

The concept here is simple: You have STANDARDS. All you are doing is telling her. The difference here is that most guys have standards but won't tell a woman. Well, sh**, that's like telling me I broke a rule but never told me the rules to start with!!! Unless you tell someone your standards, how can they meet them??? My standards start out easily enough:

 

First, she MUST be clinically sane.

Integrity (made up of Loyalty, Trust, and Honesty)

Giving

Flexibility

 

Brunette

Thin

Non-smoker

No drug use

Sexually active and experienced

Is *not* a stripper or bartender

Is not an alcoholic

etc.

 

The first four are CRITICAL. If I meet a woman who is not like that, she is IMMEDIATELY off my list. Period. End of story. I won't even talk to her after that. It's just that simple.

 

Now everyone's list is different, but you have one. Have you ever thought about it? Probably not. But you know when someone does something that does NOT meet your standards.

 

So ... think about it. Is she the quality woman you deserve, want, need? Do you want to maintain the huge level of challenge she is going to need, and constantly test you on? Me? Nah, not any more. I'd move on. She's at the top of the game in terms of knowing how to handle her (sure, it can be done, but ... man, so much work and the returns are not what you want for a long term relationship) and it can be done, but I don't see it happening.

 

If you are looking for a quality long term partner, I'd say move on. Go out tonight, open your eyes, and walk over and say hi to someone and see what happens. (Just don't talk about the ex!) You never know who you might meet if you go out!