My Turn (I Suppose) for a Story (37 Years Old...)

[bmmg39]

I do thank those of you who've written supportively, such as AuthenticAuthor, Aries73, MarshmloFluff.

 

redtan: "True, but again a 35 year old woman in a relationship with a man will want MORE than just pecking and holding hands. While things like that and going to ballgames and sitting on swings is definitely cool and most women like it, there needs to be more. No woman will date someone that will only go as far as that."

 

Your use of phrases like "no woman" qualifies as hyperbole. Everyone's different. You could just as easily say "no guy" will be happy not French-kissing or having sex, and we know from my post that that would be false. People who are similar in temperament or what they want to do and not do tend to gravitate towards each other.

 

SnowFox: "There are people who are asexual - and although I am no expert on this, my understanding is that asexual people do want companionship and relationships- but they just do not have strong sexual urges."

 

I agreed with Michael Stipe when he said that "labels are for canned food," but if we're to use labels, "asexual" is at least closer than most others to describe me. Things could change, of course, and I don't know how I would have turned out had I been having G-rated relationships in junior high school (though I still doubt I'd be a sex maniac even if things had gone more eventfully before).

 

And, yes, having visited the websites, I know that some asexual people are also aromantic (not seeking romance as well as not seeking sex), but many asexual people do crave romantic relationships, and efforts are being made to help them to meet.

 

HulloThere: "Another piece of advice I will give you is to not tell any potential girls you meet that you have NEVER dated before (at least not for a while). Not only will it put pressure on her but it will make you less attractive to her. Subconsciously she will think, 'whats wrong with him that no other woman wanted to date him'."

 

Let's assume, for the moment, that I'd be 100% comfortable going out with someone with more romantic experience than I. Why, in that case, would I want someone who didn't accept me as I am? Why would I want someone for whom I thought I had to pretend to be something other than I am?

 

"hrm women in 200 AD were attracted to men with physical power, social mobility / power, wealth, and finally potential ability for any of the before mentioned.

 

women in 2010 are generally attracted to good looking strong men (physical power), people in positions of power (doctors, lawyers, movie stars, athletes, etc), and do i even need to go on wealth?

 

I'm pretty sure hollywood wasn't around in 200AD. And yes you can list exceptions just like on everything else but they are just that, exceptions."

 

That would depend upon how many "exceptions" there are.

[AuthenticAuthor]

Let's assume, for the moment, that I'd be 100% comfortable going out with someone with more romantic experience than I. Why, in that case, would I want someone who didn't accept me as I am? Why would I want someone for whom I thought I had to pretend to be something other than I am?

 

There is something missing bmmg39, not that I disagree with you. If you're seeking to go out with the common woman, it's sometimes best to reveal some things later rather than upfront. Of course, I'm not suggesting you blatantly lie to women about your lack of experience, but that you should try to put off such details til later when they're more comfortable with you.

 

I know I learned this the hard way with women in the past. Blast them with the TRUTH and they often will not be prepared for it. Give the Truth in trickles, and they'll be more willing to accept you as you are.

 

Of course, if you're strictly seeking that special someone who sees the virtue in honesty, then my advice may not matter at all. In which case, I admire your courage.

[pcmodemtcg]

I think that all of you need to understand something re: the OP.

 

He clearly stated in his post, that he never had any romantic relationships in 37 years. That means that the things you may have taken for granted during your younger years, he never experienced. That means there is no basis for his emotional growth and to desire the "adult" aspects of a relationship. It also can mean that he desires these because he never got the chance to experience what most of the rest of you have. I too am in your boat and I personally can say that I desire many of the things you want (and many of the more asexual aspects, such as holding hands, kiss on the cheek, etc are stronger emotionally to me as well than the rest).

 

That said, I would say that if you do ever find the person for you, I would think that you probably would need to adapt to some degree with regard to sex, kissing, etc. I somewhat agree that telling someone that you never dated before, are a virgin, etc. early in the potential relationship probably wont work, although I too wish it would. It simply is a facet of the society we live in.

 

I wish you more luck than I have found, but as you eloquently put, time is slipping away, any with each birthday marks lost time and a narrowing window of opportunity.

[Things]

OP, what an interesting post and believe it or not, you seem like someone I have been wanting to meet all my life.

 

I too, at age 39 have had very little 'dating' experience. I have only ever kissed one guy and a sexual relationship would be out of the question if I am not married. So it narrows the dating pool for sure, but that is who I am and will not forego my beliefs for anyone and any society. Am I happy? Extremely! Content? Very!

No one ever forces this issue as I believe that if there is someone out there for me, we'll meet and if not, I will enjoy my life nevertheless.

 

I have many close friends who appreciate my values and never question them and because of that, believe it or not, I have had quite a few potentials, but there was no spark and we therefore remained friends. I want my future husband to know that he can fully trust me and I hope I would him (knowing that i wouldn't sleep around..)

 

And incase you are wondering...I was raised in a wonderfully happy home and have no childhood issues...

 

And please, I am not judging anyone - for each their own.

[Leftright]

Hi bmmg, One thing for certain, in today's dating standards. You can't take anything related to dating and relationships at face value. It's either attraction, or no attraction. What I would do if i were you is to seek some counselling. It really seems like you're feeling down after years of negative thinking. I admit, I am subject to it as well, but I try to catch myself in the act and correct it with something positive. There are alot of great women out there who would probably love to date a guy like you. Unfortunately, you do eventually have to grow up and meld yourself to what women want this day in age in order to be a candidate, but its not that hard. Just read some books on the subject just to get an idea. I'm in the same boat as well, and I'm learning along the way. Just learn to think more positively. Negative equals zero attraction.

 

-Leftright.

[somethngwrng]

That said, I would say that if you do ever find the person for you, I would think that you probably would need to adapt to some degree with regard to sex, kissing, etc. I somewhat agree that telling someone that you never dated before, are a virgin, etc. early in the potential relationship probably wont work, although I too wish it would. It simply is a facet of the society we live in.

 

Agree. Majority of girls will think you're weird, or it will just turn them off because they don't think you're desirable to other women... thus making you too easy/available

[bmmg39]

You seem like a neat person to meet, Things. It's always comforting to know one isn't out on an island as far as how he feels is concerned.

 

And, again, thanks to all of those who have sought to be helpful.

[bmmg39]

I think that all of you need to understand something re: the OP.

 

He clearly stated in his post, that he never had any romantic relationships in 37 years. That means that the things you may have taken for granted during your younger years, he never experienced. That means there is no basis for his emotional growth and to desire the "adult" aspects of a relationship. It also can mean that he desires these because he never got the chance to experience what most of the rest of you have. I too am in your boat and I personally can say that I desire many of the things you want (and many of the more asexual aspects, such as holding hands, kiss on the cheek, etc are stronger emotionally to me as well than the rest).

 

I went poring through this again, and, like some others here, you've nailed this. I don't know what I'd be like if I had these experiences early on (as others did). I doubt I'd be Charlie Sheen's character in Two and a Half Men, but there's a good chance I'd at least be married with a few kids. But it's true: many people who DID get to experience this at at early age no longer understand why I'd want to now.

[Brightest Dark]

I find it refreshing that there are guys out there that are shy and haven't had relationship after relationship. It reminds me of the guy I liked... and still like... who I think is shy and lives far away. It's hard to tell what he thinks or know what he's like. The one thing is, I wish shy guys could somehow communicate a bit more if they do like a girl. I'd be happy if I knew he liked me - I wouldn't care if he'd had little or no experience. But if the guy never lets on that he likes you then it will never get anywhere. Not all females will be shocked that you've had no experience, and some may actually like that. But if there are any shy girls that like you, and you don't let them know that you like them you'll be single forever.

[bmmg39]

Thank you for your kind words, "Brightest." Have you let HIM know that you like HIM? That could break the ice...

[Brightest Dark]

Thank you for your kind words, "Brightest." Have you let HIM know that you like HIM? That could break the ice...

 

Well, I've told him things like 'I've missed you'. Isn't that a sign that he'd pick up on? (I started a thread here - )

 

Think I'm gonna give up on him again since he hasn't replied to my last email. Maybe he's really not interested - although when we met he specifically came to talk to me, held my hand after we hugged bye etc. I don't get him. He's nice when we meet but lame at replying to emails. And he lives so far away I probably won't see him again for ages.

[bmmg39]

It can be very difficult to tell if a person is simply not interested or if (s)he is just painfully shy.

 

I wish shy people who are novices at love could be introduced to one another. That would be so much better than a person with no romantic experience being with someone with more of it. (I do not mean sex, since I am not interested in sex, but the same thing could apply there.)

[OahuGrown808]

This post really hit home. Although I'm only 22, I feel a strong aversion to "conforming" to the dating trends of today. I've always fantasized of that special someone with whom a relationship buds over a long period of time, hand holding, pecks on the cheek, amusement parks, that kind of thing. Maybe I'm just old-fashioned, but I always wince a little when people talk about "cold approaches" or dating someone that I've only known for a day or so. Something always tells me that I need to get to know them first before I can date, but this mentality inevitably and consistently leads to the dreaded friend-zone. Because of my lack of success, I feel like I'm always a step or two emotionally behind my peers, and I fear the implications. I guess I'm a bit hard-headed in my ways, but I don't know why I stand by them when they only seem to hold me back. Fear, perhaps? Anyway, I know I'm still pretty young, so I'm trying to become more open-minded about the dating scene as it is today. It's just a shame that the only way for me to be successful with dating and with women in general is to diverge from what I feel ought to be the right way. Adapt or die, I guess.

[bmmg39]

Maybe we're not emotionally behind our peers, OahuGrown808. Maybe there's a parallel track. Personally, I think that the approach of wanting to know a person and sort of have feelings for that person is a far more mature way of going about dating than the "get as many phone numbers and dates as you can" mentality. People will go out with someone who's practically a stranger...they've established zero feelings for each other, no crush, no interest, nothing...and then they come home and say, "Well, that date was a disaster!" as if there could be any other outcome.

[OahuGrown808]

Maybe we're not emotionally behind our peers, OahuGrown808. Maybe there's a parallel track. Personally, I think that the approach of wanting to know a person and sort of have feelings for that person is a far more mature way of going about dating than the "get as many phone numbers and dates as you can" mentality. People will go out with someone who's practically a stranger...they've established zero feelings for each other, no crush, no interest, nothing...and then they come home and say, "Well, that date was a disaster!" as if there could be any other outcome.

 

Agreed. I think that the whole "pick-up artist" approach to dating is incredibly immature and inauthentic. After thinking on it for a bit, I realized that none of my friends who are either currently in a relationship or have been in one have ever approached a woman in this fashion. It's all probably just a result of social programming and too much television. Of course, if people don't question this sleazy form of dating, women, in both our cases, will expect exactly the kind of behavior that you and I are having trouble with. I guess it just narrows the dating pool for us "traditional" fellows, but I'd bet that we wouldn't want to date those kinds of women anyway.

 

I'd hate to think that clubs and bars are the only place to get a date. I've always felt uncomfortable in those kinds of places. They feel like mating grounds for humans, something you'd see on discovery channel where the male peacocks strut their feathers around and rams butt their heads together to impress the females (i.e. who dresses the flashiest, who has the nicest car, who has the most muscles). Disgusting.

[bmmg39]

It was a while back, OahuGrown, that I got tired of hearing about the term "wingman" and decided to see exactly what it means. When I looked it up, I was horrified. Horrified that there apparently are people who behave like they're in a Vince Vaughn movie, or that it's actually understood that "Hot Women" will go to a bar with the "Ugly Friend" just to be left alone, and then a man will use a "wing man" to occupy the "Ugly Friend" so the man can go after the "Hot Woman." If this is such a common tactic, how is that "Ugly Woman" supposed to feel? And how am I supposed to feel, told that my gender cares about "Only One Thing" and that we don't care whom we hurt along the way?

 

If that's what the "dating pool" looks like, I'm glad I haven't been a part of it. I still think my way is valid, and has worked for people, even if not for me.

[marshmlofluff]

No need to stereotype the entire dating population based on something that some 14 year old kid wrote in Urban Dictionary.

 

I also would have preferred to date one of my friends. However, my geographic location, career, and shyness prevented that from happening. So by necessity, I spent my twenties and very early thirties swimming around the "dating pool." Maybe it's because I'm a shy and understated nerd and not a "Hot Woman," but I never once met a man who behaved like you describe. Maybe a few men are of that nature, but for the most part, I met a lot of commitment-minded men who were looking for a wife.

 

As you know, I've been following your threads for a long time. You long to meet someone--and the most efficient way to do that in your 40s is to date. However you seem to scare yourself out of actually dating by inventing really negative scenarios in your head for what the dating process is like, that are far from any reality that I personally ever experienced.

 

You seem a very intelligent guy, and I am sure that on some level you know that there is nothing wrong with dating, that successful marriages do not have to grow out of long friendships, and that the part of a marriage that actually matters in the long-term is the life you build together, not whether you met your spouse organically at church or in a contrived way from a dating site.

 

Unfortunately I suspect that the longer you hold these prejudices about what dating is like, the more invested in maintaining them you become. The problem is that changing your mindset at this stage means accepting that the two decades you spent looking down on the "dating pool," you could instead have dated, and very probably met a wonderful woman and fulfilled your dream of marriage and a family. That will be a painful thing to swallow--that all these years, nothing has been preventing you from finding companionship except your own fears. It's the concept of the "sunk cost."

 

The sooner you cut that loss, though, the more chance you have of fulfilling your dream before it is too late.

 

Just my $0.02. As I've said, I hope things go well for you.

[OahuGrown808]

Interesting. I do think that the media has a lot to do with this constructed image of dating that both bmmg39 and I seem to share. I'm sure not ALL men behave in that

"wingman" kind of way, at least as it is defined on Urban Dictionary. But you can see where we are coming from, right? With all this "swag" and "yolo" nonsense going around, it's pretty easy to start making assumptions and sweeping generalizations, especially when everywhere I turn I see these scummy guys with girlfriends.

 

I'm sure a lot of what puts me off about dating is rooted in my fears/insecurities. It's weird, but I almost feel like any sort of advance on a woman is creepy and aggressive. Perhaps that's just my inexperience talking. I guess it would be helpful to know how much of an advance is flattering and likely to result in a date, as opposed to a slap in the face.

 

Anyway, don't mean to thread jack. I'll try and organize the rest of my thoughts in my own thread.

[GirlontheLam]

There are different types of wingmen too. I know plenty of people who bring a "wing person" to help break the ice so they feel more at ease. The wing person guides the convo a bit until the primary takes over. Or laughs at his jokes so he seems funnier. Stuff like "oh you should tell the story about XYZ, it was such a good one."

[bmmg39]

M-Fluff, I didn't mean to suggest that the entire "dating scene" is full of "wing men" and cruelty and debauchery, and I'm sorry if it came accross this way. I am glad you have not come accross any guys who act in the aforementioned way. So why does that sort of thing receive so much attention?

[bmmg39]

And, M-Fluff, I do appreciate your thoughtfulness and attempts to help.