he's insane or I am or ahh I don't know

[3992eyes]

Okay. So.

 

There's this dude at my school who's... well, let's just say for now that he's really weird. I like his strange appearance though and actually I guess his weirdness in general both attracts and disgusts me. I'm not gay normally by the way. Just this guy. He's kind of androgynous, yet very tall. Also very thin/pale/sickly/weak. Like abnormally thin and he has bruises and scars everywhere. He lives with his dad, who is really * * * * ing scary, but I don't think he's being abused. Sometimes he wears a cast on his arm. It's weird; it's like on and off. I don't know if there's something wrong with it.

 

He never really talks to anyone at all. I just kind of started bothering him I guess and I guess we became friends. I don't even know how, we never really talk. I thought he didn't know English at first, because he's from Ukraine originally, but he does well in school. He reads a lot. I think he likes philosophy. It's hard to tell what his interests are. I think he likes the philosopher Kierkegard? Should I read some philosophy to understand him better? I don't know if it'll help.

 

But forget all of that, that's not what the weird insane part is at all. When I'm around him, i feel like I'm dreaming. Not in the romantic stupid way, but in the what the * * * * is going on way. Like I'm really high. So how our relationship started for real, I think it was like a week ago, maybe more. Uh yeah. He came over my house. I got really drunk and you can guess what happened. But then * * * * just started getting really weird, like a nightmare. I usually like weird stuff, but it's getting a bit creepy. Like basically he wants me to hurt him and I don't mean like lame BDSM nonsense. I can't even describe it. Am I insane or is he? What the hell. I get this feeling that he wants me to kill him. I think I love him, though. I've never been in a relationship before so I don't know. Last time we got together, I thought I would have to drive him to the hospital because i couldn't get the bleeding to stop. I totally get those action movies now. But yeah he wanted me to slice through him with a knife so I cut his leg. It seemed right at the time. I get really confused around him. It's like he's controlling me and I don't know how and I get really angry.

 

Everyone else I know really disproves of me being with this dude too. Like all of my friends think he's a retarded autistic psychopath, but he doesn't have any deformities. He's really beautiful and fragile. I don't really care so much about alienating my friends. They're not that interesting anyway.

 

SO yeah I'm confused. Does this mean I'm crazy too? I'm worried something bad will happen if this goes on but I can't stop.

[BYOB]

What did you do to him so that the bleeding wouldn't stop?

[3992eyes]

What did you do to him so that the bleeding wouldn't stop?

 

I collect fancy old knives and swords. He wanted me to use one on him but I don't keep them sharpened. So I cut him with a regular knife that's pretty nice. The back of his thigh. It was so creepy. He was like squirming and it was kind of hot. I hate the smell of blood, though. For a moment I thought he wanted me to * * * * him in the wound, but that would be weird. But yeah it was bleeding a lot and took several hours to get it to stop eventually. He still kind of staggers around. We were hanging out at school and he took my hand and pressed it to where I hurt his leg. I don't know what he wants me to do. I wouldn't normally do stuff like that. Just he makes me.

[Emernate]

Sounds like he has some serious issues. I honestly don't know what to make of this, but i think talking to a professional would be best.

 

And don't worry about getting in trouble. They are required to keep things confidential.

[eurocar]

Don't worry about labels like "crazy." They are likely neither applicable here nor do they serve any real purpose other than to deprecate ourselves.

 

But, I don't understand your dynamic, and I'd like to. This certainly sounds like an interesting fellow. Can you go into more detail about both of you? For instance, this Ukranian kid, is he gay? Do you have sexual feelings for him? Or are you just really intrigued by him, in a platonic way? Perhaps you like the feeling of providing security and comfort and he's a perfect medium by which to do that--and to explore your sexuality. You must be true to yourself, though. Look inside and query yourself: do you have real feelings for him?

 

Also, a little more about yourself: are you a relatively stable person, in school, outside of school (behaviorally), and emotionally? Do you feel lonely? Have/had a girlfriend?

 

This may just be a fairly typical (well, this particular instance isn't necessarily typical, but the general concept is), benign situation of sexual (and general) experimentation--or, it may be something more.

 

At this point, all I would advise is that you do not get too far deep into this BDSM stuff: masochism, while clearly a legitimate fetish, can be potentially dangerous, and most teenagers don't have the best judgment. Just be careful with what you do. He is likely confused and rather mentally affected, as well, by his father's abuse, so tread carefully.

[Catdancer]

Does he often want you to cut him? Has he asked you to do anything else that would kill him? Does he ask you to hurt him only during sex, or is it not sexual at all?

[Excalibur]

The guy is like Jim Jones, David Koresch, or any other cult leader....people without identity seek to follow the right to the most destructive end.

 

To mature, secure, success oriented peopple this guy seems like a freak and they have no use for freaks.

 

The OP sees him as "unqiue"...and so he'll follow his commands thinking he's in the presense and under the influence of a more powerful being than himself.

 

Jim Jones - Koolaid

[BYOB]

Your parents might help you in your situation. Have you considered talking to them about it? Why haven't you yet?

 

Your parents bear a very important role in such circumstances.

[eurocar]

Your parents might help you in your situation. Have you considered talking to them about it? Why haven't you yet?

 

Your parents bear a very important role in such circumstances.

 

Parents are not necessarily well-disposed to the idea of any hint of homosexuality, let alone BDSM or anything that isn't extremely conventional. It isn't always a good idea to bring them into the equation; clearly, they are going to be very biased to the perceived sake of your safety and well-being and all but the most liberal and free-spirited are going to discourage this kind of perceived "deviant" and highly stigmatized behavior. I personally wouldn't advocate involving them--even my parents, who are generally extremely tolerant.

[BYOB]

I know parents are sometimes bad advocates...

 

If it's hot, it might not be because of homosexuality at all. It's all about new experience. It's a thrill. Sexuality is still a confusing concept for young people to make a distinct difference between attractive and exciting.

 

The parents are very important because they should be the moral side of their children. I see a lack, here. They are not there to protect him or communication doesn't go well in this family. Or maybe worse, fear prevents from speaking about these activities.

 

Plus, if the guy's dad looks scary, it tells me that he is surely the author of something in this guy's family. In the point of view that a father is implied, it makes me think that it's best to talk adults to adults rather than between adolescents, especially if the father starts slowly interacting in these activities.

[3992eyes]

Sounds like he has some serious issues. I honestly don't know what to make of this, but i think talking to a professional would be best.

 

And don't worry about getting in trouble. They are required to keep things confidential.

 

I don't think I have the money for that and he definitly doesn't.

 

Don't worry about labels like "crazy." They are likely neither applicable here nor do they serve any real purpose other than to deprecate ourselves.

 

But, I don't understand your dynamic, and I'd like to. This certainly sounds like an interesting fellow. Can you go into more detail about both of you? For instance, this Ukranian kid, is he gay? Do you have sexual feelings for him? Or are you just really intrigued by him, in a platonic way? Perhaps you like the feeling of providing security and comfort and he's a perfect medium by which to do that--and to explore your sexuality. You must be true to yourself, though. Look inside and query yourself: do you have real feelings for him?

 

Also, a little more about yourself: are you a relatively stable person, in school, outside of school (behaviorally), and emotionally? Do you feel lonely? Have/had a girlfriend?

 

This may just be a fairly typical (well, this particular instance isn't necessarily typical, but the general concept is), benign situation of sexual (and general) experimentation--or, it may be something more.

 

At this point, all I would advise is that you do not get too far deep into this BDSM stuff: masochism, while clearly a legitimate fetish, can be potentially dangerous, and most teenagers don't have the best judgment. Just be careful with what you do. He is likely confused and rather mentally affected, as well, by his father's abuse, so tread carefully.

 

I've never really had a girlfriend before. I've had sex a few times before, but it was forgettable, plus I was reallllllllly drunk. I've never really fantasized about any real person that's not like imaginary before I met him. He just fascinates me so much and I think he's very beautiful. He's like a god compared to all of the other people I see. Everyone else just seems really dull in comparison.

 

I don't really know too much about him since he rarely talks. I know he's really smart. He's taking linear algebra and calculus 3 at the nearby college. I don't know if he's "gay." It's never really been an issue between us. I dunno if he cares. Before I got "involved" with him, I saw him hanging around older dudes before. There's this one other older guy he's still kind of involved with and it kind of annoys me. The older guy is more handsome/interesting than me, so I'm probably just being needlessly jealous, but I can't help it.

 

As for the masochism... It's like the foundation of our entire relationship. I don't know how to control it or stop it when it happens.

 

And as for me, I think I'm normally pretty stable. I have kind of a bad temper at times, but nothing too crazy normally. I do alright in school. Probably would do better if I tried. I'm more interested in art and music and stuff like that. My parents are both musicians. My grandad is a rabbi.

[3992eyes]

Does he often want you to cut him? Has he asked you to do anything else that would kill him? Does he ask you to hurt him only during sex, or is it not sexual at all?

 

It all seems sexual to me, but maybe I'm warped. I think he wants me to kill him sometimes, though. Like he puts my hand on his heart and stuff.

 

The guy is like Jim Jones, David Koresch, or any other cult leader....people without identity seek to follow the right to the most destructive end.

 

To mature, secure, success oriented peopple this guy seems like a freak and they have no use for freaks.

 

The OP sees him as "unqiue"...and so he'll follow his commands thinking he's in the presense and under the influence of a more powerful being than himself.

 

Jim Jones - Koolaid

 

He's not hurting me, I'm hurting him.

 

Your parents might help you in your situation. Have you considered talking to them about it? Why haven't you yet?

 

Your parents bear a very important role in such circumstances.

 

I can't talk to my parents about this. Can you imagine talking to your parents about that? Ew.

[eurocar]

You're clearly a very bright person, albeit confused about your sexual identity (as many of us are...) and your basic need to feel wanted is manifest here. This guy clearly wants you, insofar as it makes him feel good physically. Does your relationship exhibit any emotional involvement? Do you treat each other like boyfriends, do you hang out other than for sexual interactions, what is your dynamic like? It sounds like he wants you mainly to satisfy his sexual deviance. To some degree, he's using you. That isn't necessarily an intrinsically bad thing, but it does honestly sound like his ideation is quite disturbed and abnormal. You've mentioned several times that he is masochistic and even that it appears he "wants" (to some degree) you to kill him. Even if it's just an act for sexual gratification, it might be best to distance yourself from that kind of thing; you don't want something to happen, and you're kind of playing with fire with this guy and what you're doing. Can you imagine what his already-abusive dad might do if he suspects anything remotely approaching this? It could be very, very bad.

 

You mentioned you don't know how to control or stop the masochism. Let me ask you something: do you want to stop it, or do you either a) derive pleasure yourself from it, or b) do it to please this guy (or both)? If the former, it's clearly not just not "knowing" how to stop it; it's that you don't really want to. If the latter, it's trickier yet, because that's what he seems to like and you seem to have a thing for him. But, I don't think it is healthy, for the aforementioned reasons.

 

It's hard for me to tell exactly what your feelings are for him, physically. You say he's beautiful, like a god, etc., but that doesn't always imply you're attracted to him in a sexual sense. Only you can truly know that. What do you think? My gut tells me you're just now discovering your sexuality, that you're at least partially homosexual. You may later discover you're 85% straight, but it does seem like you do feel a legitimate sexual attraction to this guy (and potentially others?).

 

BTW, how old are you?

[BYOB]

Of course, I can imagine you to talk about it with your parents, but I can also imagine their reaction and that's why I'm considering if you should talk about it with my parents.

 

I think it's a chance that your parents are musicians. Being artists, they are probably more open minded than the majority of parents.

 

If you believed that it's not a good idea to talk with them, why do you think it should be right to continue to see this guy?

[3992eyes]

What do you mean emotional involvement? Like I get a weird/sick/nervous feeling in my chest when I'm around him? And I don't know how boyfriends and girlfriends treat eachother really. We hang out often. He usually would just stand around somewhere by himself and read. When I first started... approaching him. I would just talk and talk and talk and talk non-stop like an idiot and he'd just keep reading and ignoring me. Don't really remember how the transition happened, but eventually I just shut up and he stopped reading and we'd just stand next to each other. I'm not sure how he feels since he doesn't talk, but I feel satisfied just standing next to me. So I kind of followed him one time after school. I don't mean in a stalker way. He was walking and I said "hey what's up" or something and we just started walking together. We went to like the creepy industrial parts of town and walked through some vacant warehouses and junk. It was kind of fun. I came over to his house... uh yeah it's not a house. He lives in like the back room of someone else's house. It's tiny. Just one main room and one bathroom. His creepy dad just hangs out outside and smokes. I don't know what his dad would do if he knew about us. He's scary and yells a lot.

 

The masochism. I don't know. It seems like he enjoys it. He shows emotion when he's hurt and I don't really see him show any emotion otherwise. I don't know how else I can get emotion out of him. Do you think there's something wrong with him? I don't know if I want it to stop either. I kind of get pleasure from it and I guess he does. Like when I'm doing it, I like it a lot. But then when I think back to it, I'm like what the hell did I just do, I hurt someone like some kind of monster.

 

I don't really know if I'm gay or not. I just like this person. No one else interests me.

 

I'm 16 and he's 15 right now.

 

 

 

 

And I can't imagine ever telling my parents I'm in a relationship with someone, even if it was perfectly normal. They don't think I'm that kind of person and it'd be so weird and awkward.

[eurocar]

Wait, wait, so he doesn't really talk, period? Or just doesn't talk that much?

 

What I meant by emotional involvement was, do you have romantic feelings for him that transcend the sexual gratification and intrigue he provides for you? That is, could you see yourself with this person a few years down the line, happy and content, and loving him? Or is he more a medium of your sexual exploration, to find out what you're all about? Honestly, it sounds like he has way too many problems to commit to a real relationship; I've never heard of anybody like him. That doesn't mean he's a bad person or he's insane (or that you're insane), but it means that he may not be the best influence. I'm not saying that in a paternal way, but from the perspective of a concerned person who has evaluated your posts and made a fairly-educated conclusion about this relationship. Obviously, I still don't know the vast majority of the details and circumstances. And, if you'd like to talk about it privately, on AIM or something, I'd be happy to.

 

It does sound like you enjoy being with him but have conflicted feelings about him. That may be your conscience speaking up, trying to override the gratification you get from the masochism; it doesn't know if it feels right hurting somebody even at his own request.

 

It's clear that you want emotion out of him. You view him as this mysterious, almost enchanting, and perhaps as a direct result of that, highly attractive person. You're trying to extract emotion out of him, see if there's a "real" person under there--trying to peel the layers of the onion off. Masochism is one way to do that, because he appears hurt when you do it. Be aware, though, that pain isn't necessarily an emotion; it's a physiological response to something that hurts (i.e. isn't good, per se). He sounds either deeply disturbed at an innate level, or more likely, severely affected and repressing his humanity from the years of abuse he has endured at the hands of his terrible father.

 

If I were you, I would sit down and really talk with him. Be there for him and ask him if he wants to talk about things. I bet he's holding a LOT of stuff in, and his way of "getting it out" is through masochism; but it isn't necessarily a complete or even satisfactory way. Often, it just helps to talk about things and have a shoulder to lean on. If he tells you stuff that you find deeply disturbing, such as what his dad does to him (that may require a bit of time for him to have the confidence to tell you that... or it may never happen), you may want to honestly call child protective services anonymously and have them investigate. That may be just what this boy and his dad need for his dad to get the message that it's not okay to beat his child.

 

Actually, I'm more than a bit surprised that none of your teachers or faculty at school has noticed the bruises, black eyes, and other trademark signs of abuse and taken it upon themselves to call CPS. That's rather inconceivable, unless he hides it well, or perhaps unless you live in a really bad area. But you can only hide so well a black eye.

 

BTW, how do you guys do your "thing" when his dad's there all the time? And what is an example of some stuff you would do with him?

[AntiLove_SuperStar]

sorry deleted.