Strangers after 8 mths.

[darkpumpkin]

Totally confused.

 

Dating bf for 8 months, had our ups and downs. He's been out of town probably for a good 4 months of the 8.

 

Things are awkard between us. I mean we've had our issues and the butterflies and the first love phase. Now that we have moved to the more laid back phase things are sort of akward between us. Like sometimes when we talk or are together its like we don't even know the other person.

 

I brought it up when we went camping this weekend. He says that's it's not as awkard for him as it may be for me.... what does that mean? And that him being out of town its like we have to re-learn each other over and over again.

 

See when he goes out of town I sort of just put the relatioship on hold a bit and then when he comes back start off from where we left off.

 

Not sure if this is a bad thing, good thing, normal thing. I'm a bit at a loss really. Anyone ever experiance this?

[i_win]

Sounds like you really don't know eachother and the on and off again aspect of the relationship is the reason why you two haven't been able to get close.

 

I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing, but it could just mean that it will take a lot longer than a normal couple before you really feel comfortable around him.

 

It could, unfortunately, mean that it took longer to figure out that he isn't for you!

[Excalibur]

Technically - you two should still be in the heat of infatuation. The first 6-9 months is always "oh my God, your attention to me, your desire for me makes me feel so great about myself, I can't get enough of you. I love the image of me, I have when I'm with you."

 

You've been really in contact 4 months....that should still be going strong.

 

It probably is for him.......but for you - it appears you think alot abaout this "relationship" as what it all means, portends, and is going to allow or require of you for future identity and security.

 

So you think "I have to get to know him all over again every time" - whreas the reality is you don't know him aat all and you refuse to enjoy what is - for what it is, whenyou're together.

 

That's all he meant...when he's spending time with you he enjoys himself....and when he's not with you he's not thinking about how being in this association with you is changing his options, his requirements, his future or his present.

 

. He says that's it's not as awkard for him as it may be for me.... what does that mean? It take it to mean he doesn't suffer the delusion that he knows you as a person in terms of beliefs, standards, values, priorities or goals at all. So he's discovering things about you, because of no preconceived expectations, whenever you two are together. That's not awkward....that's fun.

 

You on the other hand have ways he needs to be in orderfor him to be your ideal partner..and you're spending all this "time" together (8 months) but you're really not together that much (4 months).

 

So you tend to delude yourself thinking you know his character, integrity, intelligence, beliefs, and values really well - or else you wouldn't be living together, or be with him for 8 months, or whatever else applies...while he's quite aware that he doesn't know anything about you, he's quite comfortable with the arrangement as it is, he's not obligated to it or threatened by it - just enjoying it as it is.

[george237]

I agree I was in the honeymoon stage for over 2 years.

[Excalibur]

I've made a commitment to me to NEVER make commitments to other people while I think "they're so wonderful, they're all that'.

 

I want to know they are by objective evaluation, not feel they are based on titillation.

[darkpumpkin]

True, I guess after the time we have spent together there are some very basic core values he has which I myself share and admire but there is a lot of other qualities that are coming out. It’s not awkward on his end at all; it is mostly awkward on mine. But I have never assumed KNOWING him, just certain actions that back up what he expressed was his morals.

Once again it’s me. Really wish I could just let go and enjoy each moment as it comes, but I'm really not like that. I tend to dissect things until I find the root of what they are made of and compare that to societies view.

[darkpumpkin]

Sounds like you really don't know eachother and the on and off again aspect of the relationship is the reason why you two haven't been able to get close.

 

I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing, but it could just mean that it will take a lot longer than a normal couple before you really feel comfortable around him.

 

It could, unfortunately, mean that it took longer to figure out that he isn't for you!

 

This is a huge one. He's in a comfortable zone with me, I am not there yet. I enjoy what we have but I need to know him better, like who he really is before I can be so comfortable to open up completely into that "relaxed honeymoon is over phase".

 

To me I'm still in the honeymoon phase because I don't know him, where it seems like he is past it and getting comfortable.

[Excalibur]

True, I guess after the time we have spent together there are some very basic core values he has which I myself share and admire but there is a lot of other qualities that are coming out. to even address it - a specific would be needed as an example, and I can understand being loathe to do that on apublic forum.

 

It’s not awkward on his end at all; it is mostly awkward on mine. But I have never assumed KNOWING him, just certain actions that back up what he expressed was his morals. His "expressing his morals" with his actions - when you heard his statements of his morals - you put your own spin on his words. But he's living by his code in his actions.....or else he'd feel guilt/regret/remorse/frustration/anger/etc.

 

Once again it’s me. Really wish I could just let go and enjoy each moment as it comes, but I'm really not like that. I tend to dissect things until I find the root of what they are made of and compare that to societies view. Has that gotten you the results in your life you enjoy living with? If not, it's time to change the method to get the results you want to get.

 

 

To me I'm still in the honeymoon phase because I don't know him, where it seems like he is past it and getting comfortable.

Here's the thing - if this doesn't "work out' - he's not going to sto phaving his life, his goals, his interests, his identity or his security - so he's not necessarily past the honey moon phase, but he's not letting this relationship and it's continuance or lack tehreof determine his destiny. He's in charge of that - all the time.

 

You areletting this relationship and where it goes determine your fate...you're never giong to be comfortable with him or anybody as a result of taking that approach - have you found that to be accurate in your previous relationships?

[darkpumpkin]

You areletting this relationship and where it goes determine your fate...you're never giong to be comfortable with him or anybody as a result of taking that approach - have you found that to be accurate in your previous relationships?

 

You know I have grown to hate and appreciate your accurate advice.

Yes, I am preventing myself with this relationship by wondering when it will end, if we are on the right track. Is this normal behavior for a healthy relationship? Am I happy? if not am I unhappy enough to end it?

 

Do I trust the relationship to go where it is to go, no

I was hurt and my whole world ended! I won't have that again; my world is worth more then that. But the way I go about it is to not let things play out knowing I have a fantastic fulfilled life either way.

[darkpumpkin]

I have never thought about it that way before.

[Excalibur]

You know I have grown to hate and appreciate your accurate advice. ah, so you have found the reason for the moniker Excalibur? The sword of King Arthur used to slay those that sought to destroy Camelot, that only he could pull from the stone in which it was buried because of his honesty and integrity to the greater good, not his own agenda as king. Excalibur was known as the sword of honor and uprightness.

 

 

Yes, I am preventing myself with this relationship by wondering when it will end, if we are on the right track. This might help as an example...think running marathon.

 

If you've trained, committed to running the marathon of your life to be the person you want to be, you're going to pass many at your pace, and be passed by many as well going at thier own pace. No relationship or lack thereof, loss of could stop you from "being who you want to be and who you require you to become' - if you stay true to the path you've set for yourself....if they fall off the pace - they weren't for you - if tey pass you after staying at your pace for awhile - they weren't for you. But you realizing nobody can run your marathon "for you" - just because they run it "with you" - whiel accepting that millions of people are running "with you" in the big picture...that brings it all home.

 

That's why evaluating "where a relationship is headed, taking me, wwhether it's following the conventional path to success' is all jjust a serious waste of time and energy. it's proof of the delusion that a relationship is a form of identity, security, completion, or valuation to you as a person.

 

I know - I did it in four marriages.....the last 9 years, after a few years on my own before that - I've never asked once "are we going in the right direction, are "we" taking a conentional path to successful conclusion". What conclusion - death - the finish line...

 

What you're doing - it'll put you in a 12-step program, or a nuthouse, or a grave, seriously, I've seen all happen to a great many who believe thier fate is in the hands of an entity they don't control and can't make conform or perform to their specifications.

 

 

 

Is this normal behavior for a healthy relationship? Am I happy? if not am I unhappy enough to end it? Try this - happy is who you are being who you are - situations can't dictate happiness or lack of it. Situations can create elation or sorrow - but not happiness. So if you're not happy being you on your own - and if you're not the samee you in couplehood that are you in singlehood - then you're not "happy being you" - expecting yourself to be happy becuase they're in the picture is unrealistic, and you can shoot for being frustrated, joyful, elated, disappointed, etc. instead.

 

If you'd stop evaluating 'if it's going to last" - you'd realize as long as you keep following 4 steps behind him - it's going to last...which is what you're doing now.

 

What you're really not processing is the fact that while you follow the 4 steps behind him to make sure you have a relationship for identity and security - you're giong "are you going to take me eventually to a place where my needs, my priorities, my goals are met?" The answer is likely nto....given that you're following blindly behind him 4 steps, only looking at his back.

 

Do I trust the relationship to go where it is to go, no I'm not sure how to interpret that. Do you mean that you have a destination for "relationship" that you want to achieve and you do not believe this one will go there becuase of his priorities, values, and involvements?

 

I was hurt and my whole world ended! I won't have that again; my world is worth more then that. I'll venture out on a really thick limb here...the world you inhabit without "someone" is as worthless to you and as avoided by you as the collection agent is to the debtor. What you mean, it paperas, is that at one point you had a life path going that the partnership youy had ws integral to continuing - in short - had they died vs. left you - the lifestyle you had, the interests, and pursuits, successes - all would have been buried with them. That's vicarious living - it just means you didn't have a life you love living, but you had a world you wanted to inhabit - provided the person who wanted all that for themselves - was willing to share it with you.

 

But the way I go about it is to not let things play out knowing I have a fantastic fulfilled life either way. Okay - so all the time you're doing what fulfills you, empowers you, pleases you and expands you as a person - so that if they get the benefit of you being like you are - that's wonderful you're not "giving' them anything - they're sharing in it by you being in proximty to them by your choice? If so, why all teh consternation about if they're not there at some point......you wouldn't hardly notice.

[darkpumpkin]

But the way I go about it is to not let things play out knowing I have a fantastic fulfilled life either way. Okay - so all the time you're doing what fulfills you, empowers you, pleases you and expands you as a person - so that if they get the benefit of you being like you are - that's wonderful you're not "giving' them anything - they're sharing in it by you being in proximty to them by your choice? If so, why all teh consternation about if they're not there at some point......you wouldn't hardly notice

 

 

 

I was taught from an early age, I grew up being told that how life works is you meet someone, get married, have children, toil away until you die. That is what I grew up in. When the first one left me I didn't have a clue what was to happen next, I felt from then on that I wasn't worth that life if I couldn't keep him ( talk about warped thinking I guess). I am worth enough for me, when I am on my own. I enjoy my time and who I have become, in fact I'm proud to be who I am. But when it comes to a second individual I become consumed with, am I worthy enough for them and if I'm not where that does leave me?

 

I think we are re-hashing here but that’s what it has always come down to. I just don't know how to take what I know and recognize as my problem and try to change it.

[ghost69]

This is a huge one. He's in a comfortable zone with me, I am not there yet. I enjoy what we have but I need to know him better, like who he really is before I can be so comfortable to open up completely into that "relaxed honeymoon is over phase".

 

To me I'm still in the honeymoon phase because I don't know him, where it seems like he is past it and getting comfortable.

 

i thought you were all about moving in together and starting a real relationship and all that and he seemed like he was backing off that idea? now it's you that's unsure and he is sure? i still don't understand this relationship.

[Excalibur]

was taught from an early age, I grew up being told that how life works is you meet someone, get married, have children, toil away until you die.

 

And it's your option and right to hold that set of priorities. But it's your obligation to understand that what you're wnating to be is an adjunct, that receives little attention or credit, and has no real inteerests or identity of her own. What rankles you is that there is not enough for you to do while he's gone......tell him to assign you more tasks and chores so that more of your time is filling doing what assists and enables him to be a success.

 

That scares you to death in our society that divides assets in the event of a split.....so you're in an internal war.

 

If you want to hang onto the expectation of "your life being someone's partner" as a goal - you'd want to only associate with people of the same mindset. People that also "believe that is the only right way" - are the people you'd wnat to date. You do control who you fallin love with - by who you affiliate with.

 

People aren't in your life to "prove your worth" - people only affiliate iwth those worthy of affiliation.

 

If you want a partner to "meet your needs' - you have to switch partners as your needs change.

 

If you are with someone you respect and admire in terms of character and intelligence, then you can agree to disagree, you can trust themwhen not in your presense, and you're not reliant on them to become who you want to be.

 

I think we are re-hashing here but that’s what it has always come down to. I just don't know how to take what I know and recognize as my problem and try to change it. It's too long to go over here.

 

But let's put it this way - nobody changes until they want to.

 

If you don't want to change, you want conformation by the rest of the world to your standards and expectations - you need to find teh group that shares those standards and expectations...so that you fall for someone that wants what you want, defines "wife" in the same way, etc.

 

Or....you can go around battering and beating yourself against brick walls and hard objects called other people that wants different things from themselves and life, while you offer up your assets and energy and time.

 

At the point you've battered yourself into nearly non-existence you'll be terrified to affiliate or align with anybody while coming to terms iwth the fact that 'battered you" is all you've got - and youo'll spend lots of years getting yourself back into survival shape.....and that'll change how you view the world.

 

You'll know the beating you can inflict on yourself, and the beating you can come back from...and yo'll realize you're in charge of your destiny.

[LikeYouImagined]

Well the reason why you feel like you don't always know each other when you talk is because you don't (haven't spent enough time together yet)...so that's a reason to keep talking right there.

 

Obviously he is comfortable with the way the relationship "feels" right now and you aren't...You also are the type of person, much like me, who barely needs a reason to over-analyze.

 

Basically, I get the feeling like it's actually somewhat unnatural for you to be involved with someone who's in-town and out-of-town on and off like this, and it is messing with your emotions and with the natural progression or flow between you and him that you'd like to have as you grow closer to one another. It's like a "2 steps forward, one step back" type of thing happening because of these trips he has to go on

 

Maybe you need to decide if you can come to terms with dating someone under these circumstances and with how it messes with your emotions...it would be a lot easier for you I think if he was around all the time for the first year or two and then started going away all the time...but unfortunately this is not the case. Do you think you can handle the awkwardness?

[darkpumpkin]

I think I can. He just picked me up from work for lunch he was really sweet.

I was telling him about a friend(who wanted to hang out with the both of us) I have who always has to bring her boyfriend with her and never does anything on her own, that she won't ever just met me for a coffee . And that as much as I like being a couple I also like to be known for myself.

He got really upset and distant on me now.

I can't shake the feeling that this thing is coming to an end.

[Excalibur]

I thinnk you spend alot of time writing the script in your head, and you play out your end, he doesn't always play out his end like you wrote it in your head - and then you get upset having to evaluate "what he meant" by that remark or action.

[LikeYouImagined]

Well this isn't really going to help, but my boyfriend says it is normal (not that all guys do it) for a man to sort of be really sweet and say intimate things and act very affectionate and then to pull away and be distant (sometimes all in one day) in the first part of a relationship because a lot of guys, including the ones who really want committment get cold feet at first until finally they get so involved with you that they can't just step back like that anymore. It's sort of part of the male psychology and maybe an actual guy can explain what I am trying to better.

[darkpumpkin]

No I get upset because I remind myself to be who I am and not what I think the person I'm with wants, and say what I want to say. Say things I would say to a friend or anyone else I associate with. Then I get a negative reaction and I question if I should have been myself and just kept my damn mouth closed.

[ghost69]

are you sure you aren't attached to this guy cause he seems to be the only one paying you any kind of attention at this point? this is just all puzzling to me and somewhat unhealthy. you have all these ???s that you never get answered. you are always questioning your relationship with him. one day it's all gravy and you are moving in, then the next you are unsure what you want to do and how serious you are with him. you need to make a choice as to what you want. it's almost like you don't want the concept of being single to be a reality. you love the being in a relationship thing too much to look that way. even at the cost of complete happiness and control.

[Excalibur]

"I want a committed relationship"..is not 'I want a commitment to/with YOU".

 

That's where most women get confused. The man is talking about hsi future, his desire for commitment - and she puts herself in there - becuase she's hearing his words, and sitting with him atthe time.

 

It takes a long ttime for someone very self-invested and self-requirement oriented to want to share and put at risk the lifestyle they've created with someone else - and so tehey're evauating you for a good fit.

 

Women date - it feels so good - they want to own the dress, without ever looking in the mirror or realizing with it zipped up they can't breathe or move. they look at it on the hanger, go I must have it - and they buy it, believing they'll make adjustments to themselves to fit in it.

 

Men are going in - trying on the pants...putting back on their own clothes - going out and living life - coming back and trying on the pants again...for a long time - becuase they want the pants to fit and fit the purpose...not just make the giddy and excited about a purchase right now.

[Excalibur]

Say things I would say to a friend or anyone else I associate with. Then I get a negative reaction and I question if I should have been myself and just kept my damn mouth closed.

 

But all you're stating here is taht you think it might be better not to be who you are, but conform to his image that you think he wants, in order to keep the relationship.

 

That's the problem...you're always conflicted about whether to appear as you think he wants for identity and security, or whether to be yourself and be self-reliant and accountable.

[darkpumpkin]

That's the problem...you're always conflicted about whether to appear as you think he wants for identity and security, or whether to be yourself and be self-reliant and accountable.

 

 

It comes down to swollowing fear on my part. Just dealing with the fact that he may no accept me for who I am and if thats the case its no one's fault he was just not right for me. I am afraid to be alone, I enjoy a relationship but more so I like him. I like who he is and the time we spend together. Almost like you said trying to hard to run the fastest you almost become slower then you are capable of.

[Excalibur]

It comes down to swollowing fear on my part. Just dealing with the fact that he may no accept me for who I am All of the methods and ways and reasons we interact with others is really telling us about ourselves. So you don't like, admire, respect, trust, or appeal to you - so you're constantly attempting to re-invent yourself to what you believe appeals to him. You're always evaluating waht is said and done, to figure out how to fit the image.

 

There's a quick example for it- if you followed the rules of all religions - you'd be breaking the rules and not meeting the expectations of all religions at some point.

 

Yuo've got to decide right and wrong "for me" - what you hold to as a standard and keep within your boundaries, etc....that way you're consistent in who you are, to keep your self-respect. If other people dont' like you as you are - you're certainly not goingto think you're bad or wrong just becuase they're not like you - if you respect and trust, admire, and accept yourself.

 

If you don't -there is no "you" - there's a piece of playdoh you're always contorting into differnt shapes and sizes. That is you just not being able to choose a path and become the master and commander of your own destiny - but always going along with the priorities and style of others...until they don't wnat you around.

 

In becoming indispensable in your mind - you become completely invisible and irrelevant to the person you're looking to serve.

 

 

and if thats the case its no one's fault he was just not right for me.Fault/blame aren't a solution, they don't change situations. Fault/blame are a product of immature reasoning patterns...that hve you believing if it's not your fault - you won't get the spanking and will get dessert. There's no fault/blame in the adult world ever to place, except on yourself for not living up to your obligation to self. Childhood has lots of rules - that you perceive as right and wrong sets of "laws" - that you believe all must adhere to in order to be safe and accepted. Adulthood is realizing only laws are laws, they apply to all in a uniform manner, and are really only punished when they are broken...but they're "self-enforced".

 

There's nothing wrong with being different than someone else - it's not wrong or bad. Different isn't better or worse, it's just different than you.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I am afraid to be alone, that would make you lack objectivity in the evaluation period.

 

 

I enjoy a relationship but more so I like him. I do get that - I've met some of the most incredible, fascinating, eye-opening individuals in my life that in a romantic approach for me would have been 'so wrong' - but our differences in beliefs, perspectives, approaches made us tremendous friends, athletic partners, etc. If you find him fascinating and enlightening - learn from that interaction about yourself. If the relationship romantically doesn't survive, the relationship platonically can resume at some point if there is enough respect of your individuality on both sides.

 

 

I like who he is would you like who he is if he stopped dating you tomorrow, with appropriate notice, and went on to date someone else?

 

 

 

and the time we spend together. How do you spend the time on your own when you're not together - do you like that time in your life any less than time spent with him?

 

Almost like you said trying to hard to run the fastest you almost become slower then you are capable of. overtraining causes injury - injury sidelines you from the race itself called life. Injury can be avoided with self-arwareness, responsiblity and control.

[ghost69]

i'm getting the impression that she is young, hasn't had many relationships to where there were a lot of feelings involved. almost like not realizing that it's not working out. just staying in the situation to 'have' a relationship.