value and trust

[ramsickle1369]

Ever since I was about 14, I had this image in my head that some guy (no one in particular, tho many I have held this hope for throughout the years) that whatever guy I liked at that time would "surprise" me and show up at my house unannounced simply because he missed me. I've always romanticized the idea that a guy that I liked would actually risk everything to be with ME. This has never happened. Not one has ever really gone any distance because the connection HE felt to ME was strong enough that he'd do anything to be with ME. Not one. I cannot and will not be the manipulative person to create the response I hope for. I don't know how to do that. I don't understand what I do wrong to make them think they do not need to go any distance to "get" me. I am a VERY easy going person, until I feel the distance being applied.

 

What is wrong with me? I fall for them and want them to be happy and seem to have some kind of barrier issues. All I know now is that I can’t trust any man. That I can’t be ME. I can’t be a good, honest and open person. All time has proven to me is that I cannot have feelings, emotions or needs. Because somehow that translates to desperate. Now I am just broken and hollow.

 

Nothing changes and I am a good person and I refuse to lose my own values in order to “make” someone do something. I want them to do it, show up, make an effort, because it’s what’s in THEIR heart---to SHOW me they really care. I guess they simply don’t.

[Batya33]

That's fine to have that dream, just understand that it has little connection to a healthy relationship. A healthy relationship isn't where you expect someone to do something dramatic or extraordinary to show how much he cares - you have to have the security within yourself that he cares about you.

 

About 10 years ago I was dating someone seriously. He worked about 5 miles from me, about a half hour drive in heavy traffic. I had a horrific experience at work with a co-worker. I was shaken, traumatized, but I couldn't leave the office because there was work to be done. He dropped everything and in heavy traffic drove to my office, took me to lunch where he watched me not eat a thing because I was so upset and shaky, and tried to calm me down so I could return to the office dry eyed and a bit more pulled together. I will never forget how he went all out for me that day. But, I didn't need him to do that to prove how special he thought I was. That's the difference.

[ramsickle1369]

Bat--I don't understand the difference. Sure, the grand gestures are glaringly obvious that they care. The little things are often just as important.

 

Let me add this scenario... My birthday fell on a day that my XH and his group of friend met at this pizza parlor every Thursday. He decided to surprise me and bought a cake (a carrot cake that he knew full well I didn't like). He didn't call anyone to "plan" something. He didn't contact any of MY friends or family. He did what was convenient for HIM. Anything that made him go out of his way was off the table. Not one person knew in advance of his plan. I was surprised, yes. But it was barely an effort. And sadly about the most effort he'd ever put into our marriage.

 

Another time, when we first began dating, I lived about 30 miles from him. He wanted to see me, and when I asked him to pick me up, he says I was "out of the way". How could i be out of his way if it was ME he was wanting to see? So what did I do? I drove to his place, thereby setting the standard... i.e., I don't have any of my own and that he was more important than me.

 

Just a couple examples ... I deserve a little effort. I'm not asking for the moon, just something that he had to go out of his way to please me. This hurts me very deeply.

[Batya33]

Your first post described someone moving heaven and earth. We get treated the way we treat ourselves. Now you know not to tolerate what you consider to be disrespectful treatment. someone else would have been fine with her husband remembering her bday. You were not. That's cool, all that means is that you need to find someone who treats you up to your standards. But the grand gestures you described in the first post to me don't really make that point that you made in this last post.

[ramsickle1369]

I don't see how that post described someone moving heaven and earth. I only described a little fantasy I had as a teenager... How is showing up at someone's home to surprise them asking them to move heaven and earth? Obviously every situation has more to it than can be described in a few sentences. What I wasn't understanding is having "security within myself that he cares about me"... I don't quite follow the thought there...?? His lack of action over many many years created this insecurity. Thanks for the input.

[Batya33]

"I've always romanticized the idea that a guy that I liked would actually risk everything to be with ME"

 

I disagree that anyone can create insecurity in you. If you had a secure core, then you would not have put up with his treatment. His treatment in part reinforced the already existing insecure part of you and you stayed because you didn't believe you deserved better. Now you do but I am just advising not to go overboard and expect the heaven and earth part which I quoted here.

[ramsickle1369]

OK, I understand now. Thanks. I guess that was a bit dramatic, but I do want someone to value me enough to WANT to make things happen for me rather than just cheer me on--altho that's important, too.

 

Someone can make you insecure, however. When it's someone that vowed to be honest with you and betrays that trust with lies, that will make any trusting secure person insecure.

[Batya33]

I will agree that someone can feed into your insecurities. Everyone has insecurities. But depending on how secure the person is the reaction - instead of becoming more insecure - will be to leave the situation or assert oneself and assert boundaries so that the person is treated with respect.

 

It sounds like you are looking for a man to make up for the sins of your ex. That might be alot to ask of someone.

[ramsickle1369]

No not at all... There's more than one ex that has demonstrated their ability to manipulate me. That's something I CAN work on. I did have insecurities and boundary issues, that's not debatable. But these men in my past have exploited these insecurities and used me to feed their own ego's. This is what causes me the feelings un being valueless... I have value, and now boundaries I didn't have before... One of those being, "meet me 1/2 way or no dice."

[Batya33]

I am sorry you allowed yourself to be exploited and I am glad you're going to make a different choice now - good for you!. Your meet me halfway sentence sounds far different from your first post or your post where you wrote that you wanted someone to go out of his way for you. I didn't read anything about what you planned to do in return in this "meet me halfway" set up.

[ramsickle1369]

I don't know if you're intending it, Bat, but you're coming accross very condescending. Am I reading this wrong?

 

My original post was stating that I deserve a love where the man I love will go the distance for me that I would for him. That said, this is how I felt about one man in particular. And he took advantage of that. Lesson learned...

 

I didn't ALLOW myself to be used. HE KNEW I was vulnerable. HE pursued me in the beginning stages of a divorce. He manipulated ME. He took advantage of me during a VERY WEAK time -- and he's been divorced so he knew full well what the story was.

 

He was a jerk and unwilling to lift a little finger to SHOW ME how he felt. My XH didn't and this latest a-hole didn't. Why I carried on was simply because I was in a weakened state and he totally took advantage of that. He's a complete apathetic loser.

[Batya33]

I hope you mean that you learned that this one particular man took you for granted. Surely you can't be generalizing to all men?

 

Edited to add- the OP changed her post after I responded, so this post might no longer be responsive.

[law1204]

Ram, your fantasy is a form of intimacy. You are looking for a man to identify with you and interact with you on a level YOU can understand. I am in the same boat, although my fantasy is usually us holding each other on the couch in the dark watching television.

 

Batya, I didn't see anything about Ram's post that indicated that her expectations were too high, which is what you seem to be implying. I would assume Ram is willing to meet the needs of whoever is meeting hers.

 

We are all looking for fulfilling relationships. It takes work, communication, empathy. But you want definitely to accept the gestures that others make to you even if they aren't that SPECIFIC one. I don't think it's wrong to expect NOT carrot cake for your bday if you hate it and your SO knows it, however.

[Batya33]

OP - you seem very defensive and you seem to be misreading my posts as condescending, and misreading even when I referred to the words you used in your first post, so I will bow out. I am sorry you had negative experiences with certain men and I hope your next experience is positive. good luck to you.

[ramsickle1369]

I hope you mean that you learned that this one particular man took you for granted. Surely you can't be generalizing to all men?

 

I never said anything about all men. Where are you getting this from?

[Batya33]

I never said anything about all men.

 

I never said you did. Once again, you misunderstand and your tone seems defensive - I certainly didn't intend to provoke that type of reaction -- and as I wrote in the previous post, I wish you all the best -- good luck!

[ramsickle1369]

Bat, my tone IS defensive. I am sensing condescendence here and that's why I asked if this was a misunderstanding. It appears to me that you are trying to make a point but not quite getting it thru... ???

[Batya33]

Bat, my tone IS defensive. I am sensing condescendence here and that's why I asked if this was a misunderstanding. It appears to me that you are trying to make a point but not quite getting it thru... ???

 

Nope, the only point I ws trying to make is that is seemed to me from your original post that you were seeking in a new relationship someone to make up for the hurt you experienced from your ex or exes. Apparently I was wrong -sorry, I do my best here with what is written and what is written is open to interpretation. However, I am not comfortable giving input where it is read as condescending or misread several times now, and with the all caps and bolded "tone". I am sure you will get great input from others on here.

 

Again, good luck.

[ramsickle1369]

Nope, the only point I ws trying to make is that is seemed to me from your original post that you were seeking in a new relationship someone to make up for the hurt you experienced from your ex or exes. Apparently I was wrong -sorry, I do my best here with what is written and what is written is open to interpretation. However, I am not comfortable giving input where it is read as condescending or misread several times now, and with the all caps and bolded "tone". I am sure you will get great input from others on here.

 

Again, good luck.

 

Yeah... I see now. Best of luck to you too...

 

I wan't seeking anything new. I am not interested in any more lies and am clearly still too vulnerable and hurt to attempt any relationship at this time. Ha, there's not even any prospects, LOL. I was just wondering, the bottom line, why is it perceived as needy to want a man to literally SHOW his affections? Not just state how he feels and then physically do the exact opposite? It's incredibly painful and confusing... an outright lie. And that makes one insecure. A stronger or perhaps colder person might be able to dismiss them and move on quickly. I am a sensitive person and have feelings. Words aren't enough.

 

With regard to the original post, simply remembering I had a birthday means nothing when his response to it showed me that he put no thought at all into the "gift"....