PearlHarbor

Why do you reach out to me and breadcrumb? I hear that you are now in love - or just telling others to manipulate those others in your harem. I just came across some old emails from when we first started "dating" when it was hot and heavy - although you were still sleeping with the others telling me you loved me. While i know i've sent some wrong messages over the past years saying that i'm ok with being friends, i'm not. And why now do you say you're giving up your multiple partners when you made it clear you weren't interested. That just makes me angry that i wasn't around for this timing - but i've seen your patterns long enough that you are likely still lying and manipulating. no i wont help you for helping source a speaker for your panel. i just want to say f-u and make you understand how angry I still am. Despite believing at one point i've let things go. I want to respond to that email "how will your gf think of you reachign out to an old lover/gf whom you cheated on and lied to multiple times". ok, that felt good to unload here and will maintain my willpower not to even respond to your breadcrumby email. You don't deserve me. and i don't deserve your behaviour.!

I hate this. You tempted me by reaching out two weeks ago and reminding me that I did enjoy our banter/sharing, but I struggle with the fact I know it's not fair or healthy for me to be a part of your ego-stroking selfish pattern (will it change?). Yet all I wanted to do last week was tell you about my meeting with XYZ company [breaking MY sobriety]. PVC bread with duct tape is inedible and poisonous.

Your mundane text asking if I know W sponsored WSL is a test to see if I would respond. Feed your ego. It also tells me you are not doing the work on yourself and likely not going to your LASA meetings. I can't imagine they would encourage you to non-chalantly reach out to one of the many women you were screwing around with who actually fell for you. It's a bread crumb. Once again your selfishness prevails. Still no empathy or ability to have restraint.

Great post (or is it a song!?) you wrote what I was thinking. I so support you in your creative outlet and your commitment to moving on. .. Hard as it may be!!!! You got this!!! You are not alone!

Ugh. Why are you still in my head. I read all these posts and know that I'm further along. And for the most part I am. But I still have one desire to let you know how much you hurt me and the fact that i found out MORE lies about our relationship. Sadly, our time together was real for me and Im remembering what I learned from it. Why, WHY do I give a poop that you haven't learned anything and are still so afraid to admit who you really are - and then maybe learn to start loving yourself (instead of sleeping with - not LOVING - other women who are almost as messed up as you are). Get out of my system. Grow up. You're hurting your kids with that revolving door of women through your house for "sleep overs". Your kids are not dumb. You're hurting them, more than any woman you're lying to!! Go work on yourself instead of hiding from your own issues.

[Yup, another long one. It's helpful to get these out here rather than them sit in my drafts. They will NEVER get sent as I know how ridiculous and dramatic they are after I reread them. Likely more crazy when someone who doesn't know me reads them. I can have these conversations in person with him should he reach out again.] I can't do this. I can't be lied to any more. I tried this being in your life because you keep coming back and manipulating me into getting physical with you and tell me that you still don't know where you are regarding a relationship. You know i'm vulnerable and I care. I have too strong a gut feeling that you are leading these other women on convincing them you are monogamous with them like you were adamantly telling me that I was the only one. Lying straight to my face when you knew you weren't monogamous. Believing your own lies. I also have too strong a gut feeling that when you say you're spending time with just your kids on your birthday, alone time, that's code for you've got someone else who you are spending it with. Whether true or not, my gut feels it can read your tells when you're lying. And I'm pretty sure that when I would joke about you having affairs or other women you kept saying "i'm not like that" with your "tell" face. I seriously was only joking and at that time had no reason not to trust you, but now that i reflect back on it, you automatically retreated into your 'defense/lying' mode. I keep thinking back to all the times you lied to me when you said you were out, or going with a friend when in fact you were with a woman. What did you tell them at the time? That you're not sure about a relationship and still figuring it out? I so want to believe you M**. I want you to be the person I thought you were and who I fell in love with. I know i can never change you and people have to want to change. I do believe people can change if they want to. Sadly, your low self-esteem is so strong that you have such fear in wanting to. Couple that with your selfishness. Are you a lost cause? Telling me now that MM** is with someone so you haven't seen her. That's complete BS. Why then, wouldn't she respect you when you were in a relationship? Or did you not tell her? And the bigger question is why couldn't YOU say no when you were in a relationship with people you say are "amazing women". You flat out told me that you were no longer hooking up with her. The two of you only hooked up when you were both between relationships. You were not BETWEEN relationships when you were with me. Telling me you loved me and were monogamous. Do you even know what those terms mean? And that C** has not contacted you because she's got more emotionally connected to you? That too, is BS - whatever that means? By the power of social media, I see that you are recently FB friends. That doesn't sound like someone who's not communicating. Are you leading her on too saying youre committed to her while trying to bed me? and others? Did you ever tell these other women you were in love with me? Or did you so callously blow it off when they asked if you were in love with me like your response to me when I asked if you loved them? And what is it with you and older women? The times I'm 95% sure you lied to me during our relationship: (and i'm sure there are other times that I'm not sure, but wont claim them unless I am closer to sure) Early in our relationship, you said you were going out with the B*** guys, and was supposed to call me later, but you got really drunk, said you drove home and left your phone in your car. I was pissed you drove. I'm pretty sure you were with a woman (you also had mentioned that the woman saw our photo from the lifestyles section - so it wasn't a business meeting after all it was a f*** date) You said you've never had another woman in your bed since you moved back into the house. When in fact, I'm pretty sure you had one in your bed while I was away for Thanksgiving. I also saw panty liner wrappers in the garbage. And then that accidental text about orgasms that was meant to be to the other MM**. When you were supposed to come and pick me up one monday night after Yoga and I called and called and no answer. I was so worried you were hurt or were in an accident. You were in fact with a woman. F******. You claim to have gotten consumed into reading the Economist and left your phone downstairs. The night you were supposed to go out with P**. It was a thursday. Basketball finals or something going on when I was out with a friend. He cancelled and you were just going to the gym. When in fact you were with C**. F*******. The night you had dinner with R** and she wanted you back. You said you just kissed. More bulls*** because I know your sexual appetite. And then we had sex - or was it just f*** - while on the couch and in bed the next morning before you made your "decision". Whenever you pull the "i just need time alone" bulls***, i knew it was (most of the time) code for ive got someone else to f*** - and I can only imaging you will tell them the sob story that you dont know if you want a relationship and convince them you are into them while not having to commit. And lying to me that you are committed. i realize this is a serious problem, a sickness you have. I'm almost as much a fool for continuing to let you manipulate me knowing you're sick but not fully accepting it and falling for the sweet talk. I genuinely enjoy your company - but it's because I'm the one being genuine and believing that you are too. And this is hard for me, the only way that we can remain in each others lives if you are willing to work on yourself and figure out why you lie. I can't continue to have such false hopes about you. If you want to stay in each others lives, are you willing to do the work? Otherwise, I hear you loud and clear that 1) I'm not worth working for and 2) you are so scared of doing the work and addressing your shame that you prefer to continue in the "safety" of your lying addiction. I am someone who genuinely cares about you despite your illness. When all the literature and research tells me to run and move on, I'm still here. Yes, I admit, i'm that textbook sad case willing, wishing, hoping that you can get better.

Hi Yes. We do well outside. In the sun. By the water. In flip flops and tank tops. As well as in each other's company regardless of weather, locale, or clothing. Where we (I) don't do well is dealing with your transgressions. Trying not to continue this cycle where we see each other, have a good chat, (nearly or) fully get physical and then silence. Is it fair to reiterate that our physical, emotional, and intellectual chemistry has something powerful over the both of US? An addictive drug with a an affective [sic] hangover? One that keeps bringing us back to this? While neither of us, today, can define what us "should" look like, this ambiguity is tough. But then again, I will admit with matters of the heart there is often ambiguity. Isn't that the case with most relationships? (Sadly the trust you broke is creating that ambiguity here). The other ambiguity we experience in relationships is understanding what the other gender is thinking or motivated by? That's why I am so communicative with you - to best understand where you're coming from. Hoping you'll also try to understand where I'm coming from. I give you credit for engaging in this communication. You know I hate these conversations over email (and feeling like a broken record - but hoping this email is different and I've moved on to CDs or even mp3s - they don't skip, you just replay or delete them, or if you have the tech skills, you mix them. But clearly I digress) I struggle to my inner core wanting to be with you because I enjoy your company yet it pains me to sacrifice my self respect being with you knowing you're still with other women. Not to mention having been hurt by your lying and cheating before. The mere fact you said that when M would call that's when you would go be with her and now that she has a man you have stopped being with her. Btw, that was a bull answer and makes me angry thinking about it now. Why couldn't she have respect that YOU were in a relationship or bigger question why YOU couldn't say NO to her and respect the fact YOU were in a relationship with an amazing person? That's just selfish. And you tell me that C has been "not communicating" with you because she is getting emotionally attached? Sounds like she and I are not so different here. What am I to believe here? Did you come to me today because you didn't have them available? It's a fair question from where I stand. And one I would appreciate you to defend. And not just dig deeper into your bag of lies. You are a smart man. How would you convince me honestly at this stage?(Ugh, I hate sounding like I need this validation - but that's what it's come to) It still stands that I don't want "this" (whatever "this"'is) to be just about sex. (I will add that it's amazing sex and some part of me wishes I could detach the emotion from it, but that's what makes it so amazing. #DigressAgain). I do hear you that you say it's not just about sex and I want to believe you. I really do. And most of me does. I've just never been adamant with you about making you prove it. You take the easy way out with "you're not going to believe me anyway, so why should i try". How can you prove it to me? That's what you need to figure out if you want me to believe. I believed you the first time we had our nooner and you said it wasn't about sex, but I also know you've told me things that you thought i wanted to hear. (An example when I flat out asked you if we were monogamous and you looked me straight in the eye and said yes, we are monogamous only for me to find out two days later it was all a lie. I would have preferred the truth as painful as it would have been - and you risk me walking out - but hey, i'm still here even now). So I worry that you can still lie to my face and live with your selfish self. I deserve the truth. You were at least mostly honest about Ana and how you were feeling about her when you thought that's what you wanted. I know we went pretty fast in our relationship but I don't regret it. (it's nearly a year since our first date, btw). I hope to find that excitement again getting to know someone and falling for some one with reckless abandonment. With someone who feels the same. I had asked you a question today about "why" you want to have a relationship with me ("relationship" defined in it's broadest of terms). And your answer is that you don't know. Which I understand because you don't know what you want in general where it comes to the heart/partner/relationship space. So, in all fairness and respect to me, I want you to answer the following with genuine thought. Take your time. And I will do the same, if you are interested in what I think. Why do you want me in your life? Is there something (more) special about me that you genuinely want or need that makes you want to be a better person? What is drawing you to wanting an "us"? And what does that look like for you? Yup. So there ya go. I just wrote the email someone would write in their 20s. So if you can be 20 again and do the things you didn't get to do at that age, like sleep with many women like a player, I can be that girl who writes these emails.....that will never get sent. (I know this will just feel like pressure - and the fact we can talk about this in person is how I prefer. But I always seem to hear things AFTER we leave each other that are full on half-truths or lies) Ball back in your court. I enjoyed being with you and glad I didn't allow you to come upstairs. Because we both know what would happen - starting with you staring at me at the door to my building where we both stare into each others eyes and then had to make out. I was proud of myself for sending you on your way. Yes, incredibly conflicted wishing I could separate the sex, passion, emotion, and "friendship", and the selfish lying and cheating you pulled on me. It's a complete sacrifice of my self-respect.

Ugh, I thought I had moved on from you by not contacting you - especially while you were traveling. I just reread the emails I sent you after your affairs and I gave you way too much credit!! WHY? And you now reach out to me asking to connect. While I know how happy I am when I am in your presence - when we are in each other presences - I know that I'm not your only one. Why do I do that? I struggle with having my self-respect and also meeting my needs physically at the same time you getting what you want. It's easier for you to walk away as I still have such strong emotions towards you. Why have I been able to separate your lying and cheating and yet still craving your company!? i have no respect for women like that, and I am that woman. Why do I keep believing that people can change? You are so f'in selfish that I don't think you know how to change. You had probably the best thing you will ever have and because you are so insecure and don't feel "enough" you just throw it all away out of fear. I know I shouldn't respond to you. And I"m doing my best to refrain, but I know deep down between my ego and my id, I likely will because I want to feel wanted. You are a bad drug. I know it's such a high high when I'm with you and I'm alright for a day after, but then I come down off that high and realize you just want to keep me in your life as this 'friend' to ally the guilt you have for what you did. and then know it's alright because I'm not angry and you continue to say you're not in a space to be exclusive which then gives you permission to continue to sleep with those other women. I know should be stronger than what I am and i am completely mindful of where I am - and miss the feeling I had when I was with you. Likely not YOU but the feeling I had when I was with you. I just reread what I wrote and what woman in her right mind would allow someone like you to disrespect her with your charm and promises. Despite the fact now you think you're in the clear because you are up front with your sleeping with multiple women - you were in a committed relationship with me!! Or played it as such. Do you even have any remorse? I know since I've let you back in, you think you don't need to have any more remorse because I checked my self-respect at the door.

I wasn't finished loving you.

I know how you feel FJMSLM! I have tried NC for over a month and got to day 29 and it was broken (he broke it). Went another week or so and then I believe I broke it. Finally we had a sit down good chat and then some and I feel ok. I know I'm playing with fire, but I totally get what you feel when there is communication. I think it will help me move forward as it's put me in a better mood and attitude open to meeting new people and letting new people in. Just wanted to validate your emotions - bot that "lowest point" and the glimmer of happiness.

woah, JA0371 - What you said about getting "used to the sadness", or in my case "not letting it go" because it's my connection to my ex - really resonated with me! I've completely broken NC with him and we've been communicating. He wants me in his life and we're trying to evaluate what it would look like. I know it's selfish on his end, but I'm seeing how I can leverage it in order for me to move on. But I digress. I'm also hoping to get a puppy/dog so I can focus on something else. And even more, give all this love that I have in the direction of something that will give me unconditional love in return. You are doing so well!! Keep it up! I envy you on your path with such a clean healthy productive break. Cheers!

thetwist - i read these posts from time to time and I know all too well what you're going through, I'm going through exact same excruciating pain. Wanting to tell the man who betrayed me how much I love(d) him. While nothing I can say can remove or even lesson your pain, I want you to know the words I read from you don't make me believe you are weak or insecure. I think you know who you are and should embrace it. Don't ever underestimate knowing who you are. It's a very powerful thing. Your limitations are only the time you spend compare yourself to the "societal norms" (you know the ones - that the magazines promote or your facebook friends over-publicize). Believe in your own norms. Never apologize for what you think are your insecurities. I feel your pain, I really do! (As to many people on here). Continue to love with all your heart where ever and when ever you can. It's the highest energy frequency. And can help you move past this indescribable (unless you're a poet) pain Remember to love yourself first.

Day 17 NC, 2 months (62 days) since BU This sucks. It is not getting any easier. It's easy for you because you've got your other to distract you. Numb you. It's pretty sad. And i sit here trying to pat myself on the back that I've successfully refrained from communications - which is a lot easier than refraining from having you in my thoughts. I am hoping these three weeks NC and a trip back east will lesson the pain and remove you from my thoughts. So if I do hear from you after your marathon I will be able to be strong. Stronger than I feel right now. Although I am so committed to NC. Is that really "strength"? You don't deserve me and I don't deserve what you did to me. At times I envy you that you can not experience what I feel in this painful emotional state - but then you couldn't either experience the incredible high when I was in such a happy emotional state. It was heaven. I'm hoping these amino acids will help balance me more and take away the pain so I can have a more realistic emotional experience.

I can't take it. I can't take it. While it should be so easy for me to walk away and forget you for what you did to me - sleeping with MULTIPLE women saying you loved me, want me to move in and that it was not emotional with them and you don't know why you did it. The cheating is one this, but the lying is more painful. You are a drug and I'm going through intense withdrawal. I'm assuming it's also a chemical imbalance since you took away the source of all my endorphin highs. I do hope you are still getting help - despite the fact you said you told your therapist you're doing it for me. You need to do it for you. I had to cut off communication - no breadcrumbs - no IM - you don't get your cake and eat it too with me as your "friend". Friend's don't lie and cheat and break their hearts. You can't imagine how much pain I'm in - and I struggle more than the average Jane to shake it off. You know I was the best thing to ever happen to you. All I wanted was to be in a reciprocal, honest, faithful love relationship. Unconditionally. It doesn't work when only one of us commits to it. Thankfully, I have no regrets of anything because I know your issues are not mine. Your choices were all yours. Selfish. Narcissistic. Hurtful. Disgusting. I'm not beating myself up because I know I was good for you and to you. Maybe that's why you did it - did you think I was too good and you didn't think you could live up to it? I have no regrets because I was 100% authentic. I was me. I liked me when I was with you. You made me happy. I hope you are continuing therapy for you. And learning about yourself. And getting over whatever insecurities you have about not being able to be with one woman who loved you dearly. I don't know if you'll call me after your 6 weeks of therapy and marathon. It's not the same this time as I now know your sick secrets of lying and cheating - FOR YEARS! While I'm hearing from my support system that I am very strong, I don't feel it. And if I do hear from you, I hope I have the courage to keep you away. I don't deserve what you did to me. And you don't deserve me. I do deserve love. And happiness. I just am so drained to have to put the energy in to start all over again with someone new.

This is so well said. It resonates to my core.