Bluejay1

Hey Everyone - thanks again for sharing your insight and suggestions. It's been tremendously helpful and I really appreciate it! 😀

Batya33 - Yeah I hear you... does seem like a red flag because it shouldn’t be such a complicated issue that we need help resolving. With his other family, there are no apparent issues as of now and in general I’m pretty easy-going, flexible, and accommodating when they’re around. There’s no craziness with them in terms of ethics or attitude, and they’re very kind. SO and I are able to work out daily issues fairly quickly too when it involves just us. Sometimes I adjust/give, and other times he does... and that part is normal and just as you described. Maybe the family vacations problem is more complex because it involves family pressure (and all the variables that come with that... pride, ego, expectations, etc.?), as DancingFool pointed out before, along with being on opposite sides of the spectrum, as you pointed out, on how to deal with toxic people. If there was no pressure, there probably wouldn’t be this issue, because he’s normally very supportive. I'd like to be understanding and supportive of what he may be feeling that drives his negative reactions, while also maintaining my own sanity, and I hope we can balance that together. We haven't yet discussed a lot of these suggestions/topics in-depth that you have all shared (I'm out of town for a few more days), and maybe once we do, we can improve our understanding. Congratulations to your parents! That’s great that they found something that works for everyone.

DancingFool - My SO and I both want this to work and love each other very much; that part is mutual. I don’t want to give up just yet and I’m certain that he doesn’t want to either. I showed him what I was going to write before posting yesterday and he said to go ahead and ask for advice, and now we have more to work with in terms of discussing resolutions (with or without a professional). His easiest way of solving this vacation problem is just sweeping it under a rug, so when I expressed interest in seeing a professional about it, he wasn’t excited because the easier no-fuss solution to him is for me to ignore his SIL. But I’m not really dragging or pulling him to a therapist either. He’s willing, so maybe a few sessions is worth a try? My willingness to “try several therapists if necessary” is not to find one for the purposes of suiting my end goal, though I understand now how I may have sounded and I didn’t mean to come off that way. I generally prefer not to rely on one source. Also told my SO before that we could find both male and female therapists if he preferred, to see how their suggestions compare. My ex had formerly accused me of solely discussing our issues with female friends and thus was all unreliable confirmation bias because females are more prone to siding with other females (!), but it wasn’t my intent back then; they were just who my closer friends were. Still, that was an interesting point. So I find no harm in obtaining various feedback from different lenses when working through the issue. If SO is okay with one therapist, that’s okay too. I also have friends who met with several before settling on someone they were comfortable with. I’m grateful for what you wrote before, because I wasn’t able to articulate precisely, yet outlining that feels like a positive step. We'll try to go through these issues together step-by-step, but not giving up yet. Thank you again!

Boltnrun - Yeah he said he is willing to discuss and compromise and usually he’s good with that, so I believe it for now. He’s not enthusiastic about this topic (or discussing any conflict for that matter), and I was aware I’d prob have to initiate and find the therapist myself etc, which is fine with me...also willing to try several if necessary and unsure if he feels the same urge. I just found a few names in our area yesterday but have yet to call. What I’m really hoping for is that he won’t be internally upset over this though if we do decide to try limited contact/vacations. Their family tendency to accept something despite being upset over it (and holding it in until they can vent), isn’t really what I want to perpetuate in my relationship with him (hard for me to explain precisely what I mean - I just don’t want him to be uncomfortable either). Don’t really want a certain cycle to continue, and yeah I guess this absolutely begins to tread in dangerous territory of changing someone. I just hope we can reach the best possible solution without ending the relationship, and I’m hoping that a therapist can help reach fair ground.

Boltnrun - Yeah it felt like it was his-way-or-be-upset despite my discomfort/requests, which is why I suggested counseling as I saw that as the only way to stop the back and forth between us. I really don’t want to fight, but I also can’t just sit on things that bother me this much. I think he is willing to discuss/compromise, and we have a lot we need to work on at this point. Thank you!

DancingFool - Wow you articulated precisely... I wasn’t able to organize it this accurately/concisely in my mind despite understanding and agreeing with all that you’ve brought up. Yet it was driving me crazy but I kept wondering if I was overreacting. I was hoping a counselor would not only be able to help us work out vacation arrangements, but also relay the notions you’ve mentioned to my SO. Thank you.. really needed this.

Lambert - That’s true. It doesn’t help to compare at all and I’ve been trying to work on that, but yes in moments of what I see, hear, and have experienced myself with how his SIL behaves with his family, it does feel harmful. It wasn’t helpful when SO said it would be weird if I sat out of functions... I started feeling guilty for my thoughts, which is exactly why I posted for advice. Everyone has been so helpful and I’m grateful for the additional insight. Yes I am willing to compromise by agreeing to reduced visits, and also setting up exit strategies and other means of distancing, such as not carpooling, though SO still seems upset at idea of this. I do agree with you that it’s how hard times are handled that show how strong our relationship is, and I really hope we can work through this.

Batya33 - Thank you yeah it’s been the hardest part (and hurtful) trying to explain to my upset SO why I don’t want to be around someone who is not only disrespectful to me, but also to him and his family. They are simply just used to ignoring her or appeasing her in most scenarios. Yeah there are marriage plans, which is why this feels awful. I do believe SO would still be upset if I was his wife (maybe even more upset, as I’d perhaps have more of an obligation to attend any/all family gatherings). Yes that is absolutely true - he has a very different view of "family," and I'm glad you brought that up. I no longer choose to tolerate certain behaviors I consider extreme (I really can’t for sake of my own sanity), but he sees this as my not putting family first. There's no right answer, just a compatibility issue, which is also awful to consider. I’m really sorry you experienced that with your FIL, and glad to hear he was still great with your son, and you were all okay with an arrangement for your me time. The me time is exactly what I’m trying to discuss and establish with my SO, and I hope we can come to a similar compromise. Thank you so much!

Rose Mosse - From stories I’ve heard from SO and members of his immediate family, it doesn’t sound like she’s trapped. It sounds like SO’s SIL is controlling, manipulative, and prone to outbursts if people disagree with her. I want to avoid specifics, but her actions have also been unethical and hypocritical (concerning, given her profession), and I kept those observations to myself in the last year, yet members of my SO’s family would then point it out but no one ever confronts her. That’s okay as I realize that’s how they’ve dealt with her for 10+ years, but I’d like to limit my own exposure to his SIL severely (if cutting off is not an option) after seeing/experiencing this, and my SO is upset at this idea. I love my SO’s mom and she vents about SIL frequently and I feel bad hearing about mom’s complaints. But as others have shared, it’s their priority to maintain peace so they can continue to vacation together among other things. Is it right for me to ask that I only attend a gathering 1x/year max? Ideally leading to every other year? SO might be willing to see someone with me re this issue, so we’d need to talk to a professional about what he’s able to accept, because we’ve been stressed out every time this topic comes up and unable to reach a conclusion. For sure I resent my older half sibling. Yes I should work this out privately in counseling as it’s long overdue. Not sure there’s resentment when it comes to females in a family unit in general though as I also deeply resent an uncle and my ex for their actions too, but I’d be willing to explore all possibilities. It’s just sad because I get along with SO’s family very well and I want to see them, but I just don’t want to be around for the drama and in-fighting that occurs when walking on eggshells around his SIL fails.

Wiseman2 - Sorry I didn’t clarify, the counseling would be solely for the purpose of reaching a compromise for this issue only between us. I’d ask counselor if it’s fair that I request SO to only allow me to spend 1 holiday/year or every other year if his SIL there. The expected frequency would be much higher if I did not bring this up after our recent 3rd gathering. SO and I are not sure how to compromise, even though we want to, and he got upset at the thought that I’d want to sit out on functions at all. I’m not trying to change their family dynamic.. I’d prefer if he just vacationed with them without me, and I’m happy he can spend time with them. The issue is that he wants me there on (all) their family vacations if possible, and I’d prefer to stay home if the SIL is there (I am fine with his other family); this is what we are disagreeing about. I even told him that because I’m so new to their gatherings, no one would even notice if I wasn’t there, so why not let me sit out? But this upset him. SO does not like his SIL at all, but has learned to ignore her entirely when she’s in the room with his family. He literally doesn’t talk to her and is only there to spend time with other family members. Sometimes they both ignore each other simultaneously. The issue is he’s asking me to do the same, but that makes me uncomfortable in general and I’d rather just not be present. She talks to me more than I desire and it becomes unpleasant quickly if I or anyone else disagrees with her on even trivial subjects. I have now learned just to agree, nod, and exit the conversation as soon as possible by finding a nearby distraction. People have suggested I just stay away from toxic people, but I’m unable to if we’re in a close setting and she decides to interact with me. Would it be fair to say he’s trying to change how I respond to this situation by telling me I should ignore her? While I’m just requesting that I not attend functions with SIL present at all... and I can compromise and attend important holidays (and when/how/where etc, is what we’d discuss with a counselor). SO and I otherwise get along very well and rarely argue about anything else. In terms of lifestyle, I believe we are compatible, but it would be nice to find middle ground on this issue, and it’s looking like we can’t without some help.

Rose Mosse - Yes true, her ongoing behaviors could be due to a number of reasons. I didn’t mean to base my observations on my past and I apologize. It would help to recognize signs to know what I’m potentially dealing with only if I stay with my SO though, which I do want to do. I think regarding this we would benefit from seeing a professional together and running through possible scenarios so I can be prepared. It’s likely not realistic to avoid her completely, but I agree it’s best to keep it as simple as possible. Thank you!

Wiseman2 - Yeah I do think compatibility needs work, though communication is okay and we’ve been trying to listen more to each other in general. His immediate family is close knit and we all get along, but it’s his Sister in Law that they all walk on eggshells around and warn each other about when they sense she’s in a bad mood. They prefer to avoid adding fuel when she has “outbursts” and just carry on when it’s over. I apologize for not providing additional details, but the consensus among them is that the outbursts are very rarely warranted. The advice I’ve gotten has helped so much and I no longer feel as guilty/weird as I did (before posting) for asking him if I can avoid her at least most of the time (and yes for sure staying polite and brief if I do have to see her hopefully only once in a while going forward). Thank you!

1a1a - Yes exactly your first paragraph accurately describes what went on in my mind and it was difficult for me to express that to him without hurting him, because he truly is kind and not intentionally inconsiderate. It doesn’t have to be a hard boundary, and I think your potential compromise would work. The escape part helps a lot - Thank you!

Hey Everyone, thanks for all your thoughtful and helpful responses. Seraphim - I’m sorry that occurred... I love my SO as well and really want it to work. That’s what makes this hard. Agree though, compatibility may need work. I’m grateful communication is okay. Thank you. Melancholy123 - Wow, I’m sorry... I’m glad it worked out to distance. Psychologist told me the same about last relationship. Until then, it didn’t really occur to me that I should just avoid him. You’re right the only thing I can change is my own reaction. Thank you.

Hi Everyone, Hope you’re all doing well. Was hoping to gain insight and get some advice. I’m in my 30s and have been dating my SO for 1.5 years. Things are serious and happy between us, and I’ve since met SO’s family, including his older SIL. The SIL possibly has NPD. I can identify traits because I dated someone with NPD for 5 years before understanding it and leaving - the entire ordeal was traumatizing. My SO and his family are incredibly kind individuals. They always attempt to maintain peace, but needless to say, end up walking on eggshells around SIL to appease her. This has gone on for over a decade and stories I’ve heard are disturbing. I’ve joined my SO and his family ~3 times in the last year, and 2 times, SIL had outbursts, which I identified as “NPD rage.” The outbursts were unwarranted and unreasonable. After the 1st incident, which did not involve me, I revealed to SO that witnessing the episode made me uncomfortable. He suggested I ignore SIL and redirect my focus, as that has helped him. I attempted to, and kept my distance from his SIL the following trip. The 2nd incident, however, involved me, though wasn’t initially directed at me. After this, I asked my SO if it was okay that I just sit out of his future family gatherings that involved his SIL (or at minimal, not share a roof or car) as these incidents have been extremely uncomfortable for me. Also, based on how SIL continues to treat SO’s family, things get worse over time, not better. SO sounded displeased with my request and asked if this meant I “wouldn’t be joining them ever, if they got together for trips or holidays?” He said he didn’t see why I couldn’t just ignore his SIL, and that it would be weird if I just chose to stay home anytime they vacationed as a family. I responded that I understand he enjoys spending time with his family, and in no way am I trying to disrupt that. I’ve even encouraged it as much as possible that he go on trips with them. I don’t get much vacation time these days, but in the event that I do get off, I’m perfectly fine backpacking by myself or visiting my own family during SO’s family trips. For context, I grew up in a family that insisted on spending time together despite toxic behaviors, many of which were directed at me by my much older half-sister. The last and final incident happened only a few years ago, as since then, I’ve finally made a more conscious effort to avoid toxic family members regardless of event. Doing so has made me happier and brought long-term relief. My SO’s responses have so far been hurtful because it’s clear he thinks I should just endure it, if anything (for sake of appearances, I believe). He understands my past and why I try to avoid toxic people in my personal life (I tolerate toxic people in a professional setting, but would rather not in my personal life). I suggested couples counseling today for this issue, but he hasn’t decided. Have any of you been through this? What’s worked for you? Do you have suggestions for us? Thank you for reading.