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We talked again tonight..still don't know how I feel.

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I returned her call from a couple nights ago. I was really thinking something might bad have happened cuz she hadn't been on her myspace in 3-4 days, and she's usually on everyday filling my inbox. She answered and sounded completely down and out. First words out of my mouth were "Everything ok?", she told me a good friend of hers (I met him once or twice when we were together) died of an overdose Monday, and his funeral was today. She was pretty close to this kid, and was with him the night before it happened. This also marks the 1 year period that her grampa, pretty much her dad, passed away. So on top of that, losing a friend really has her down in the dumps.


I just let her talk. She talked about her friend that passed, how they're having a remembrance deal this weekend for her grampa, just talked about her feelings for a good 10-15 minutes, then asked if I had found a place yet (Im moving back out towards her). We then just talked about me moving back out there, how she's in the process of finding her own place etc.


Then out of no where she turns on the stereo and blasts BackStreet Boys. She used to always turn music on, and sing at the top of her lungs while I was on the phone, and we'd both laugh about it. She's a total hip hop head, so it was funny to hear her play some BSB's. She sang at the top of her lungs throwing in "Come on sing, don't act like you don't know the words!!!" I was cracking up, saying "I don't think we can talk anymore after this" she started laughing then said "You know, that's the first time I've actually smiled today" and continued singing off key.


She started making jokes about this girl I talk to, and have been friends with saying "So I bet XXXX is SOOOO excited for you to move back out here huh!!!" (completely sarcastic). I said "You know, under different circumstances I think you guys would really get along, meaning if I wasn't in the picture". She said "Yeah, well, you ARE in the picture and me and her will not get along, as long as you are in the picture".


I turned the tables and said "So, how about you, who are you dating". She laughed saying no one can tolerate her. I laughed agreeing with her. Then she says "Oh whatever, you're the only one that has ever been able to tolerate my attitude". I then said "Which explains why we're not together". She comes back with "Don't lie, you know you can still tolerate it, you'll always be able to". Whatever she means by that.


Overall we had a good conversation. She ended it before I had the chance to cuz she was going to get food, but was quick to say "I'll call you tomorrow, I love you XXX". It doesn't matter if she calls or not, I'm not expecting anything. I'm just having a hard time deciphering my feelings right now. I'm working to get my life back on track, and once I finally get this move out of the way my head will be MUCH clearer.


I guess I'm just battling with what I want/expect with her and I. I went through the angry stage immediately after we broke up, and in the month of NC. I kept a cool head, and she ended up weaseling her way back into contact with me. Right NOW, I know I wouldn't take her back. If she was to call and say "I'm sorry for my mistakes, I want to try again", I'd say no. But I guess I can't say in a month or two or five from now, that isn't what I want. I wish I could just come out and ask her "Why do you keep contacting me, telling me you love me and miss me", but I won't let myself cave to that.


In the long run, I'd like things to gives things another go with us. After she gets out on her own, and gets clean (Which seems to be the path she's taking). I just wish right now I knew how she felt, or why she keeps in contact.


I guess I really don't know what I want. I'm going to move on with my life regardless, and keep on improving my own self. I guess I just don't know how to keep on carrying things on with her how we have been. Things seem fine, but at the same time it gets confusing.


I don't want to have to make a choice. Either stay in LC, or go complete NC. Because I really don't know where my head is at right now, anyone been through this, or something similiar?


How likely is it things can continue on like this? I don't feel like I'm the "doormat", not now at least. Our contact with eachother always starts with small talk about eachothers lives, then somehow turns into her telling me how much she still loves me, and misses me. I do a good job of holding most of my feelings back about "us" and what happened. I continue to tell her things wouldn't work out without change, she knows that. Could she just be "testing the waters" so to speak, trying to get a feel for how I feel about her/us?


Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, I need to stop analyzing things.

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Hey GQ,

I've been replying on a diffrent post not even knowing what your history was but I've just read over most of your original threads and I have to say that this woman is BAD BAD NEWS.


You will NEVER change her and she will never stop messing with your mind, not ever.


The reason she keeps contacing you? It's because YOU LET HER. Stop this right now before she takes you down and destroys you.


LISTEN TO YOUR INTUITION.... Keep far, far away from her.

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I understand what both of you are saying. On the outside looking in, she does look like poison. I guess it's just harder for me to see it because I know her good side too?


As far as our history I've posted, I've posted mostly the bad because I'm looking for advice lol


I know I can't change her, believe me, I tried. I know that she has major issues she needs to work out with herself. She won't destroy me, I'm not that much of a sap. I'm not fighting with "Do I want to be with her, do I not want to be with her", more so than I'm fighting do I want to turn my back on her like everyone else in her life has, including family.


It doesn't matter if I cut her off for good, our families are connected. And it's only a matter of time until we'd end up having to have contact again.


I guess I'm guilty of having a big heart. I'll never forget the BS she put me through, but I can forgive. If there's one thing this whole process has taught me, is to forgive and let go of the hate/resentment, something I was never good at before.


Me and her would of never been able to be "just friends" in the beginning, because the attraction/connection was laid on too thick. Would she be lying if she told me she really wanted to be just FRIENDS? It's obvious at this stage, she wouldn't be comfortable with knowing I was in another relationship. And thinking about her being intimate with another guy, really doesn't bother me anymore, but I think seeing her with someone else would be a different story.


So are you guys saying even a mutual friendship is out of the question?

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Most definitely. Our first year together, we didn't have many problems beside your normal arguments between a couple that lives together. That and it was hard on US living in her drama ridden mothers household (obviously where she gets it from).


The second time around, well, let's just say I kinda kept one foot in, and one foot out. I had faith in us, and really wanted it to work. I believe she did too at first, then decided to fill her time with drugs being I wasn't around.


Like most addicts, she's a COMPLETELY different person when she's using. We talked about that tonight too. I told her she was a horrible liar, and I knew she was using before we broke up, I just didn't want to believe it. She had to keep asking questions about the last 2 weeks of our relationship, because she was too far gone at the time to remember anything.


She was clean the whole year we were together the first time (besides social drinking around one another). So I know who she is sober, and it's a beautiful person. She said a week ago when we talked "Last year at this time, I was truly happy, I was happy with you, I was happy with us, I hate feeling this way".


I know I won't get THAT person back, ever again. I like to think she can get on the road to recovery, and become that happy girl again. I think I believe in her, more than she believes in herself.


My own mother has said time and time again "You guys feed off eachother, when one walks away, the other goes chasing". And I think she's right. The only thing is, I don't chase her. She always contacts, and Im guilty of responding. My love for her runs deep. We've been through extremely hard times together, that have not been posted here, and formed this bond that seems like it's unbreakable. No I won't bend over backwards and be s*** all over. NC is possible, and very doable from my side, so why don't I want to do it? I really don't know.


I've been through a lot of what she's going through right now, when I was 17,18,19. Only difference is, I had both parents that were there, constantly saving me and picking me back up, until I snapped out of it, and grew up. She doesn't have that, no guidance, no role models. She has a mother, who stuck with her step dad, even after knowing he molested/raped her for 5 years. The only RIGHT thing her mom has done, is put a roof over her kids head, and she's barely doing that.


I have read, and read, and read, and tried to understand as best as I can about people who have been abused from an early age. From what I understand is, it's a cycle, that will likely repeat itself over and over again unless they break that cycle and heal.


I've seen her continue it. Her mother uses men for money, yet there's never food in their house. She spends her money, on herself. My ex has done the same things. She'll lead guys on who like her, get what she wants, then disappear out of their lives.


Something she never did with me. We always both worked, and when we did go out to eat, she'd get p*****d when I always tried to pay. It caused numerous arguments. We got into it in the car in a drive thru joint one night because I went to pay, she snatched my credit card out of my hand, threw it back on me and was like "I can pay once in a while too XXX! Quit trying to pay for everything". She always bought me expensive gifts, spent loads on me for xmas, bdays.


I don't know honestly, what I'm going to do. Like I said, right now my #1 priority is this move. Which is only going to mean we're back in seeing distance of each other. Right now we're 1,500 miles apart, so NC wouldn't be too hard. I get mad at myself for answering her calls, talking to her, answering her emails. But we never really talk about "us". So I snap myself out of it and say " * * * am I mad about, we can be FRIENDS". I think it's just the fact I still love and care for her that gets in the way of that.


Alright now that I've written a novel I'm going to shut up. I think I'll give it a good long thought over the weekend, and figure out where to go from there.

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Haven't heard that one. She was diagnosed with bi-polar a few years back. She took meds for a short while, but her mother (whose insurance) she was on, didn't refill them because she said "She doesn't need meds to feel good".


Can you fill me in on what a Sociopath is?

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I just googled, and read up on it. She definitely has characteristics of one. And it stings a little when it says they can never truly really be helped, unless at a young age.


I know this is probably a stupid suggestion for myself, but do you think it would be a bad idea, when the time is right, to just be stern with her? Not really break her apart, just tell her exactly why I can't continue this fake relationship with her? I have kind of sugar-coated things lately, mainly just saying "I couldn't be with you now cuz of the lies and drugs". Would it be a bad idea to just lay it all out there?


Reading that Sociopath thing described me to almost a T from my late teen years. I'm the complete opposite of who I was then, and definitely grew up. Part of it was my own doing, just maturing. But a lot of it too, was hearing people I loved, not just family, but an ex gf and a couple friends, pretty much just tell me I was a selfish p***k and they weren't putting up with it anymore. I cared about NO ONE back then, and a trillion dollars wouldn't make me want to feel that way again. It was a very lonely feeling, all the while I was surrounded by people I loved.


Only problem with that is, I'd almost have to pick a fight with her just to give myself a reason to snap. And that seems pretty immature.

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If she is a sociopath you're wasting your time and life on her 100%. The mani difference between you and her from what I can see if that you care and have a conscience, which is why you post here while she doesn't care and "grooms" you (for lack of a better word) and has no consicence.


I'm not a Psychologist so read as much as you can, find out as much as you can. Read "Without Conscience" by Robert Hare Ph.d because whilst talking about 'Alice' he describes her to a T to be honest.

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She means a lot to me, not enough to waste my life on. The only reason I'm not back out in the dating scene is because I"m moving out of state shortly, and it wouldn't be fair to start up something beforehand. I'm still going out, hanging out, going to the club etc.


I have a job waiting for me on the west coast, as soon as I find an apt, I'll be nose deep in my new life, something I couldn't be more excited about.


Taking myself out of the equation, it could really go either way. I know she has somewhat of a conscience, I've seen it numerous times, not just on my behalf. But she is very selfish, to the point she uses her past to justify her mistakes. At the same time she's one of the most open-minded non judgmental people I know, which is probably because of what she's been through, so that makes sense.


I'll look into the "Without Conscience", thanks for the heads up. Do you think because she is still young (19) she'd have a chance to break free of all these things? Given that she worked at it, of course. And realistically, do you think she could be ok with JUST a friendship with us? Or would she always be wanting more?


I'm going to hit the weights for a while, but I really appreciate your help Bethany. I definitely learned something new this morning.

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Hey, good luck. I pray I'm wrong for your sake, but whatever she is, there is alot of manipulation and emotional blackmail going on that's for sure.


Hope you pay attention to your intution, guts feelings are for self-protection and are there for a reason.

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I know it's not good to put labels on people without knowing the truth. I guess you could say nothing can really surprise me when it comes to her. I could give prime examples of her at her worst, but it doesn't really matter.


I agree 100% that we had "combustible" relationship. The first year we were together, things for the most part were really good between us. We always got along great, we pushed each other through hard times in our life, and were the best of friends. We only had a couple fights that first year, but when we did get into it, it was bad. I know she has that natural fight instinct in her from her abusive past, so when things got heated between us I always walked away before blowing up. She told me a couple times "I can't believe you didn't hit me, I thought you'd hit me" cuz that's what she's used to, not just from her childhood, but past relationships. I would NEVER lay a hand on a woman, and after she finally trusted that, when we did get into it, she had an easier time actually talking things out, and not yelling and screaming.


I'm extremely stubborn and hard headed, and so is she. So when we didn't agree on something, things got heated. She's a VERY good athlete, something she threw to the side when she started using. She had 4 scholarships staring down her throat, and I hope she can get those back.


I also grew up into athletics. I screwed up my scholarship towards the end of my high school, and still to this day want to kick myself in the face for it. I'm very competitive in anything I do in life. When we fought, it was almost like we were competing against each other. Instead of going in circles, I was always the one to back off, collect my thoughts, take a breather, and come back in a more calm state and "talk things through", instead of lashing out.


I am going to move on with my life, regardless. That's kind of where my question landed. Where do I put her. Do I continue to answer her phone calls, emails, etc. Or do I disappear to her. She knows I'm moving back out that way, and has been bringing it up every time we talk. "Have you found a place yet" "When are you going to be here" "I think we should get together when you get back out".


She has a lot to work through in her life, and I want nothing but the best for her, she knows that. Hence the "You're the only one that can tolerate my attitude". She knows there's nothing she can't tell me. The only thing she hides now is her dating. Which she kind of "hinted" at once she found out I had other women in my life wanting to date. If she didn't know that, she wouldn't tell me she was dating.


As far as "wanting the drama she brings", you know, subconsciously, probably. I wouldn't say I WANT it, I've never had drama in my life like I had with her, I guess I got used to it? There isn't much confusion as to where "we" stand right now. She knows I wouldn't take her back right now. The confusion is my own, how to sort out the feelings that are still there. I don't get confused until she starts in with the I love you's, talking sexual, and talking about "getting together".

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hey man. it's me.


Ex communicate her like the pope!

Good to hear your life is going pretty snazzy bro. But this girl sounds like she's been more trouble than good. Don't let her play with you. LC but if she starts her games then disappear. Maybe in a few years when she stops being immature you guys can be friends.


I'm still in my angry phase so take what I say with a grain of salt.


Cheers bro

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LOL. Good to hear from ya my man!


Eh, yeah she can be trouble. I've always liked a bit of a challenge I guess, that's one way to look at it.


I'm missing the angry phase! Immediately after I broke up with her, I was in that angry stage for a good month, and to be honest, it felt great. And definitely a good sign of "moving on".


Hope you're well bro. Hope your mom is feeling better too.

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