Am I attracted or not ?

[Batya33]

3 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

Secondly, I rarely experience attraction right away. Sure, there have been guys for whom I have developed an insane attraction almost instantly , but it was only physical and wasn't a good predictor of future compatibility ! I sometimes need a bit of time to warm up and I feel like when it comes to online dating, things have to move pretty fast. Realistically, I can't say to a guy "well, I need some time, could we hang out for a few months so I can assess if I am attracted to you or not ?" .

How about saying nothing and simply go on dates and during those dates you will know whether you feel attraction? I think things can move faster when you initially meet online if the people who are meeting both want things  to move fast.  I don't think meeting through a website first has anything to do with pace any different than meeting a new person at a singles event or at your dancing activity.  I met over 100 men in person through dating sites. I never took anything fast -the opposite especially when it came to sexual intimacy. Those who wanted to take things fast I either didn't meet in the first place if it was obvious from our phone call or if I got the sense we weren't on the same wavelength etc I stopped seeing the person.  The friends I have who met their spouses through online sites dated well over a year or longer before getting engaged.  

No need to date or to have first contacts  through a dating site. I was surprised you thought contacting through a dating site had to do with how fast things would happen.  

I am so glad you are healing and growing from this!

[rainbowsandroses]

4 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

Besides, I remember that when we started our discussion, he brought up the fact that I told him after our first dinner that I didn't want anything more than friendship. He said that my text surprised him at the time because "you know me, I didn't have an ulterior motive, I just love getting to know new people blabla".

But it's simply not true. I am sure he was attracted to me from the beginning because he was sitting very close to me when he didn't need to. And I even remember at some point, that he was already touchy, which prompted me to send that text !

^^I think it was true, and it would be helpful for you to learn to differentiate between a man who is interested in dating you and wanting to develop a relationship and a man who is attracted to you (your appearance) and whose goal is seducing you and having casual sex with you. 

Big difference between those two things and quite easy to differentiate IF you're paying attention and taking your ego out of it. 

As you know, I caught on to his game very early on; in fact pretty much immediately after he said what's in first bold above but nevertheless began boldly (and inappropriately) becoming so touchy/feely with you regardless.

I'm curious what your thought process was at the time - did you interpret his behavior as genuine interest in wanting to date you?  

It wasn't! 

Going forward when a men sends mixed messages like this (first message - I don't have ulterior motives, I simply enjoy getting to know new people BUT yet second message - he's all touchy feely with you), pay attention to BOTH messages, not just the one you want to hear and/or that builds your ego up more (i.e he wants to date/develop a relationship with me).

I think you sensed something was off too but for some reason you didn't trust your own judgment and intuition, created a thread and thus became confused by all the various opinions including the opinion of your friend whose advice was the worst of all!

Learn to trust yourself more @Shycarrot, trust your judgement and intuition.  You're an intelligent person, you're not unaware.

There were signs way WAY before he told you he preferred your situationship be kept secret and if you had paid attention and trusted your judgment from the very beginning, you would not have become so attached and hurting as you are now. 

For example, the first time he began touching you inappropriately and made you uncomfortable, you would have said (to yourself) no thanks and stopped seeing him.

Big fat NEXT, especially considering YOU were not even sure if you were attracted to him at the time!

In any event, big lesson learned and I'm happy to hear you're starting to feel better! 

 

 

[SophiaG]

4 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

Thank you so much ! Well, I finally canceled the dates because I thought it wouldn't be fair to those guys because I am still not over the last guy.

That's fair! Great to hear you are feeling better and liking your new therapist. Regarding dating apps I agree with @Batya33 that you don't have to say anything regarding pace etc. - just approach it like another way of meeting people and let chips fall where they may. Of course if someone is moving faster than you'd like, speak up and don't compromise your boundaries like in this case. Good luck!

[Jaunty]

At some point I asked you what a "serious relationship" with that particular guy looked like to you.

He's out of the picture now, and that's good.  

I think it would be a good idea for you to get kind of a clear idea of what a "serious relationship" looks like to you, in general. 

This might help you navigate what goes on during dating new men.   

I was not being glib when I asked that about that guy - I do want you to know that YOUR idea of serious might be much different than some other peoples'.  

For example, does yours include sex?  If it does,  are there specific conditions?   Would sex happen only if a future is planned, like marriage?  Or is exclusivity but without a future plan going to be acceptable?   

You know - for some people, being sexually monogamous does define "serious."  Some people are "serial monogamists" and go from one relationship to the next.  Often this is not a plan of action, it's just the way things play out in their lives.  I was one.  Ultimately something changes for some, and they decide to make it permanent.

For the record, I am not suggesting that you share this stuff with new guys you are dating, but you do owe it to yourself to understand where YOU stand, and that you can tell if things are heading in a good direction for you.  This is assuming that the person is not a "player," which unfortunately is a real thing.  

 

[Shycarrot]

6 hours ago, catfeeder said:

How did your therapist respond to the idea that this guy wanted secrecy? Have you explored this?

Thank you ! Well, she didn't say anything particular other than the fact that it was not what I wanted and hence, ending things was the right choice. 

 

6 hours ago, catfeeder said:

As you've noticed, I think it's crucially important for you to recognize such a thing as a complete, total, and unequivocal deal-breaker. Fully processing and understanding WHY can connect the necessary dots to alleviate unnecessary suffering.

I understand. I am not sure I have fully processed this yet...

I mean, when he said those words " I am discreet, I don't necessarily want to say everybody that we're seeing each other etc ...", I remember that I was nervously laughing in my head. 

I was thinking "omg, he can't be serious ! Is this a joke ? Does he think I am stupid ?" but my facial expression remained completely neutral.

I knew something fishy was going on the minute he said that.

But then, my emotions kind of clouded my judgement.

6 hours ago, catfeeder said:

Good. Consider what, exactly, you are grieving. Is it the actual guy, or the fantasies you created 'around' him? This is not an invalidation, but an empowerment.

Thank you so much. It's interesting because I said something similar to my therapist ! 

I explained to her that I didn't "love" this guy, I only liked the idea of him.

Now that the dust has settled and that I have a better understanding of the whole situation, it's pretty clear to me that we are not compatible and that I don't like him (I am not saying he's a horrible person, but I am put off by his behavior).

And yes, it helps tremendously ! 

I also wrote a long list on my phone of all the negative things about him (does not respects my boundaries, wasn't excited to commit to me, gave me breadcrumbs etc ...) and I read it everytime I lose perspective but it happens less and less often.

 

 

[Shycarrot]

5 hours ago, Batya33 said:

I don't think meeting through a website first has anything to do with pace any different than meeting a new person at a singles event or at your dancing activity.  I met over 100 men in person through dating sites. I never took anything fast -the opposite especially when it came to sexual intimacy.

Thank you so much that's very reassuring. But I keep reading that "if you don't feel an attraction by date number X, you should stop seeing the person because you are wasting their time". I was speaking from this perspective, because sometimes it does take me a long time to figure it out. 

And I can understand if the other person is not okay with this/wants to dump me because I am still unsure. I don't know if that makes sense ? 

4 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

Going forward when a men sends mixed messages like this (first message - I don't have ulterior motives, I simply enjoy getting to know new people BUT yet second message - he's all touchy feely with you), pay attention to BOTH messages, not just the one you want to hear and/or that builds your ego up more (i.e he wants to date/develop a relationship with me).

No, he only told me "I don't have an ulterior motive blabla" during our discussion, after I confessed my feelings. Like, he talked about the first text (the one where I told him I only wanted to be friends with him) and the second one (where I told him my feelings had evolved) during the same conversation. 

4 hours ago, SophiaG said:

Of course if someone is moving faster than you'd like, speak up and don't compromise your boundaries like in this case. Good luck!

Thank you very much, I will do it when I feel ready 🙂 

4 hours ago, Jaunty said:

I think it would be a good idea for you to get kind of a clear idea of what a "serious relationship" looks like to you, in general. 

I was not being glib when I asked that about that guy - I do want you to know that YOUR idea of serious might be much different than some other peoples'. 

I understand. But I feel like my idea of a "serious relationship" is pretty conventional ? 

Monogamous, heterosexual in my case. Yes, it includes sex as long as the relationship is exclusive. 

4 hours ago, Jaunty said:

For the record, I am not suggesting that you share this stuff with new guys you are dating, but you do owe it to yourself to understand where YOU stand, and that you can tell if things are heading in a good direction for you.  This is assuming that the person is not a "player," which unfortunately is a real thing. 

I get it. 

I should have asked him what he wanted out of our relationship sooner.

In the very beginning, I don't think there were signs that this was headed to a casual relationship though. He texted me everyday, asked a lot of questions, seemed genuinely interested in me, we had deep conversations about everything, he was very consistent and was planning a lot of hangouts multiples times a week, told me I was kind/empathetic, and he loved that about me ... 

I don't know. I reject a lot of men and usually can tell when they're only looking for sex/something short-term. I am very put off by sentences like "I wish I could spend all my nights with a doctor, just to be safe" (this one happened recently 🤦‍♀️). I generally know it when someone only wants me for my body. 

But this guy acted similarly to my ex in the beginning, who was clearly looking for something serious with me ! 

Obviously, things fizzled out with the guy, he started to become more inconsistent which fueled my anxiety etc ... 

Moral of the story : sometimes I can't tell. Next time, I will ask ! 

 

[Batya33]

10 minutes ago, Shycarrot said:

But I keep reading that "if you don't feel an attraction by date number X, you should stop seeing the person because you are wasting their time". I was speaking from this perspective, because sometimes it does take me a long time to figure it out. 

Any chance you are assuming this so it's a self-fulfilling prophecy? If by the 4th date you don't desire to kiss him I'd stop dating him.  I say this because you don't have to be super attracted or "know" if you are "attracted" but if you think you would enjoy kissing him, holding hands,  touching like sitting close together then whether or not this meets your standard of "attracted" it means that you are open to dating this person as opposed to hanging out as friends- now if you kiss him and feel nothing or hold hands and feel nothing - ok then you're likely not attracted enough by that stage.  And I'm talking about 4 dates over a period of a month - because I think getting to know someone over a period of time -not going on 4 dates in 6 days - allows the relationship to develop at a reasonable pace -including potential attraction.

I'd say if the kiss is neutral/icky or simply a no go -that's your answer as far as not seeing that person anymore.  I know - your attraction grows slowly- but what I'm doing is saying you can enjoy kissing a person and be attracted enough to enjoy that -even though it might be you're not yet attracted enough to stop looking to date others, to commit to that person - to feel really intense chemistry.  And -maybe he's not there yet either. Many people kiss by the 4th date or hold hands etc - with rare exception so that is why I am using that as an example.

 

[catfeeder]

58 minutes ago, Shycarrot said:

Moral of the story : sometimes I can't tell. Next time, I will ask ! 

Good. You don't need to take on the uncomfortable task of nailing him down on his attraction level to you, specifically. Instead, you can flush out on the first date whether your goals for dating align by telling him that you are dating to seek the right person for a long term relationship. Then, ask him if he shares the same goal for dating. If he doesn't know, or he wants to date casually, then his answer is "no." 

If you really like him, you can thank him for his honesty, and when you end the date you can clarify that if he ever sees himself as long-term relationship material, he's welcome to reach out to you for another date because you really like him.

Boom! Boundary. You're leaving your door open a crack, but only for the right reason.

I also hope you've learned a lesson about blurring the lines with the word 'friendship.' Don't go there again with anyone you might ever consider dating for romance in the future. Keep your boundaries clean, and you will thank yourself.

[rainbowsandroses]

 

3 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

No, he only told me "I don't have an ulterior motive blabla" during our discussion, after I confessed my feelings. Like, he talked about the first text (the one where I told him I only wanted to be friends with him) and the second one (where I told him my feelings had evolved) during the same conversation. 

^^I knew exactly what happened and what you were referring to, and my opinion remains the same.

3 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

But this guy acted similarly to my ex in the beginning, who was clearly looking for something serious with me ! 

^^ Really?  Was your ex all over your body physically without you ever reciprocating?

Did your ex never try and kiss you?

When a man is attracted and interested in dating you, kissing you comes before any other blatant physical touchy/feely stuff as this person was doing (in an attempt to seduce you).  Which turned out to be precisely what he was after. 

A kiss goodnight at the end of the evening for example.  Or more but YOU are giving clear signs and it's mutual.  

Re blatant physical touching as he was doing, I am not referring to holding hands or a light touch here and there that you're both engaging in indicating mutual attraction, but rather him boldly touching your body in an attempt to seduce you/turn you on!   

A man interested in dating you doesn't do this, he respects boundaries (including physical) that's like the bare minimum!  

As has been said many times throughout this thread, his actions in this regard were disrespectful especially in light of the fact you had stated you only wanted to be friends!  

It doesn't matter if he was calling/texting asking you to spend time regularly, men who only want casual sex do this as well however their motivations for doing so are different from men who want to "date" you and it's important to learn how to differentiate between the two. 

When you are aware of the signs, of which there were plenty here imo, you won't even have to ask, you will trust your own judgment and go from there. 

Personally I have never asked what a man is looking for, I am perceptive, aware and judge by his actions. 

Many men who only want casual sex will often times skirt around the truth of what they want anyway, sending mixed messages confusing you more!

Just like this *** did, a few times!  

I don't mean to sound insensitive Shycarrot, but it's unclear why you're still going round and round about this, it's all been said previously.

Continue on your journey, you're doing great!  At least I thought you were.

Please don't fall back to where you were, time to let go.   xo

 

[Jaunty]

1 hour ago, Shycarrot said:

 

I understand. But I feel like my idea of a "serious relationship" is pretty conventional ? 

Monogamous, heterosexual in my case. Yes, it includes sex as long as the relationship is exclusive. 

But, not if the guy is going to leave the area at some point.  Correct?  So you must have some kind of criteria for "future plans" in the mix.  

I'm curious about why you have not had sex so far.  I've read your posts, you have sparse dating experience etc.  But, you have an ex boyfriend.   So it seems that you were in a "serious" relationship that did not turn out well.   What prevented you from having sex with that person?   

Please know that I don't have any negative judgements at all about people who don't take sexual relationships lightly and have a lot of standards that must be met before sex would happen.  I'm interested in what yours are.  Also, in how you will be able to communicate them to a man you're seeing.

 

[ShySoul]

2 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

I understand. But I feel like my idea of a "serious relationship" is pretty conventional ? 

Monogamous, heterosexual in my case. Yes, it includes sex as long as the relationship is exclusive. 

Hey Shy. From everything I've read of yours, I think you're view on a serious relationship and what you are looking for is spot on. More importantly, it's your view. It's what you want. That's all that matters. Any guy lucky enough to be with you should want the same thing and respect that. If he doesn't, he isn't right for you.

Relationships vary from couple to couple. What is normal or conventional for them may not be normal or conventional for others. What counts is that you both agree to wanting the same things. 

2 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

But I keep reading that "if you don't feel an attraction by date number X, you should stop seeing the person because you are wasting their time". I was speaking from this perspective, because sometimes it does take me a long time to figure it out. 

It takes as long as it takes. So take as much time as you need. The ones who are committed and really want it, will wait as long as necessary for it to be right for BOTH sides.

I've danced around the subject for months with someone. We both were unsure and took awhile to get on the same page. But when we did, it was well worth the wait.

Trust your instincts. When it's right, you will know.

[Jaunty]

2 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

 Any guy lucky enough to be with you should want the same thing and respect that.

That might be a slippery slope.  The guy might be thinking exactly the same thing in reverse:  That the woman is "lucky enough" to be with HIM, and thus, she "should" want the same thing.  'Cause, after all, he's a major prize.

.Both people are equally deserving of having their needs met.  They both will need to find ways to communicate their needs and wants, and understand how and were compromise is appropriate and, conversely, where compromise would be very damaging to ones own self.  In which case, maybe the relationship is not going to succeed.

This is why I and some other people here are encouraging OP to define what it is she is looking for and to learn how and when to communicate it.  Also to learn how to read the signs that it's not going to be a fit.  It seems that she has few if any tools for that.

 

 

[ShySoul]

23 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

Both people are equally deserving of having their needs met. 

37 minutes ago, ShySoul said:

What counts is that you both agree to wanting the same things. 

Which is what I've always said to everyone. That everyone is equal and that it is a partnership where both side work TOGETHER.

I tell a person that the other person will be lucky as a way to be encouraging and help them to see that what they want is perfectly fine.

Rather then try to get a person to define something, I encourage people to look in themselves and see that they already know what they want. Love and relationships don't necessarily fit a rigid definiton of what we want it to be. Sometimes the things we think are musts, will change when the right person comes along.

The important things - trust, honesty, communication, etc. - I think she already knows. I don't think she needs to define much. I think she needs to have faith and believe in herself. I think she overthinks things, secondguessing and questioning, rather then going with what she knows is right. Trusting herself will help with that.

@Shycarrot A lot of the things you've said remind me of ways I feel. I take longer to decide feelings. I question myself. I give people chances when others say it's not a good fit. I have little romantic experience and would wait for sex. I'm shy. So I think I can relate.

What's helped me most is understanding myself. It's trusting myself and how I feel inside. I stopped trying to examine everything and set rules. I just listened to what I knew I wanted in my heart. And the more I trusted it, more good things happened.

Believe in yourself. With the right relationship, things will flow. I hope you find that.

[SophiaG]

4 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

But I keep reading that "if you don't feel an attraction by date number X, you should stop seeing the person because you are wasting their time". I was speaking from this perspective, because sometimes it does take me a long time to figure it out. 

And I can understand if the other person is not okay with this/wants to dump me because I am still unsure. I don't know if that makes sense ?

I am guilty of this a lot of the time - not that I feel really guilty about it - it is what it is. I think people who meet in real life versus people who meet online can both range from going very fast to taking things very slow. It really depends on the individual. The right person should move at roughly the same pace or at least be okay with your pace. If they are too slow or too fast for you, you're just not a good match.

A lot of people hates the apps because they seem to turn meeting people into a "numbers game" but that's actually what I like: you can screen people for basic deal breakers, must haves, goals and values, etc. upfront. I don't see the "shopping" stage on those apps as actually dating or building a connection, rather you are just building a list of potential matches to meet and maybe date so when you meet them in person, the chance of being compatible if you like them (or "click" or "have chemistry") is higher than two random people who are attracted to each other. So if someone dumps you for developing feelings too slow (or anything else, really) you can simply move on to the next in line. I've met many guys who were not okay with me taking time to decide if I'm attracted them and moved on. I respected that and had no hard feelings - we were simply not a good match. I don't see that as reducing people to numbers or "treating people as disposable" - it's just saving my and everyone else's time so they are free to look for and meet someone who's on their wavelength.

[Shycarrot]

8 hours ago, rainbowsandroses said:

I don't mean to sound insensitive Shycarrot, but it's unclear why you're still going round and round about this, it's all been said previously.

I am sorry and I know you mean to help, but your reply is really detrimental to my mental health right now. My self-talk is pretty negative as it is, I don't need to beat myself over my perceived mistakes over and over again.

I'd rather focus on the positive : imo, the main takeaway is that in the end I was able to prioritize my needs and self-respect. That's huge.

It was especially hard knowing that I had been yearning for physical affection for 6+ years. But, I was still able to walk away and to do what was best for me. Maybe that does not mean much to you, but personally, I am proud of how far I have come. 

Of course there are many others things that I also put together in another list lol 

8 hours ago, Jaunty said:

But, not if the guy is going to leave the area at some point.  Correct?  So you must have some kind of criteria for "future plans" in the mix.  

Yes, I need some kind of stability. If the guy is planning to move before our relationship has a chance to develop/grow, I would rather pass. I can picture myself giving a long-distance-relationship a try but only if the relationship has a solid base or has a lot of potential. 

8 hours ago, Jaunty said:

I'm curious about why you have not had sex so far.  I've read your posts, you have sparse dating experience etc.  But, you have an ex boyfriend.   So it seems that you were in a "serious" relationship that did not turn out well.   What prevented you from having sex with that person? 

I think I already replied to the question ? 

I was young (23 yo) with no self-esteem, a crippling social anxiety, a lot of insecurities about my physical appearance and I had not done the work in therapy to dismantle this nor to address the cause (my childhood), I was pretty unaware.

So I was extremely wary, scared of physical intimacy and it probably would have taken me months (6  maybe?) to get there. But he broke up with me before.

He was so mean that I am so, so glad that I haven't had sex with him though !!! No regrets  

16 hours ago, Batya33 said:

I don't think meeting through a website first has anything to do with pace any different than meeting a new person at a singles event or at your dancing activity.  I met over 100 men in person through dating sites. I never took anything fast -the opposite especially when it came to sexual intimacy. Those who wanted to take things fast I either didn't meet in the first place if it was obvious from our phone call or if I got the sense we weren't on the same wavelength etc I stopped seeing the person.

Thank you very much, that's very interesting ! I admit that it causes me to reevaluate my perspective ! 

100 men, that's a lot !!

When I read about people going on 50+ first dates a year, it makes me think that I may be giving up too fast.

Once I am over this guy (soon, I hope) I will try to go on more dates ! Thanks again for your reply. 

 

I have a lot of work so I have to go, but I will get back to you as soon as I can to reply more thoroughly to all of you ! 

Thank you again for your help and I hope you have a nice day ! 🙂 

 

 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, Shycarrot said:

100 men, that's a lot !!

When I read about people going on 50+ first dates a year, it makes me think that I may be giving up too fast.

Once I am over this guy (soon, I hope) I will try to go on more dates ! Thanks again for your reply. 

 

I have a lot of work so I have to go, but I will get back to you as soon as I can to reply more thoroughly to all of you ! 

Thank you again for your help and I hope you have a nice day ! 🙂 

I met over 100 men in person for first meets and dated many men over the 24 years I was in the dating scene (for about 17 of those years I was in long term exclusive relationships).  

FWIW I was briefly engaged at age 23 and we were waiting for marriage to have intercourse. The next man I got serious with - I dated for over a year before we had sex and I was 24 (he was 23).  I didn't have anxiety in that sense but realized I no longer wanted to wait for marriage.  I wasn't thrilled with the emotional stuff going on then around that first time but I'm glad I didn't wait for marriage seeing that I married at 42 ;-).  It's not an easy decision for many people for so many reasons -and it is easy for others.  I haven't had many partners in my life and I'm happy about that -for myself - meaning I don't judge those who enjoy having many partners as long as it's adults/mature teenagers/consensual, etc.

[Jaunty]

It's probably a good idea for you to go on quite a few dates when you feel ready to get back out there.  I think that some further experience with dating will help you develop your awareness of what's going on with the men you encounter.

Please don't let this discourage you, but it's a fact that a lot of guys on OLD will state that they are "looking for a serious relationship" because they know that is good bait.   

So you SHOULD select for guys who say that - but when you're meeting and, if it progresses, getting to know them further, you will need to read them in ways that you might not quite "get" yet.  

It's possible to spend time with a person, start to *like* them, and yet not become truly invested until / unless you come to really know enough about them and what they're up to.   

If the guy turns out to be a disappointment, yes, it can hurt your feelings and leave you down - but it doesn't have to be a serious letdown.  

You can learn how to navigate this kind of thing to some extent.

I get that you're shy, inexperienced and an introvert.  That's ok,  you can be you, and no need to try to go out with dozens of guys if that is very counter to your real self.  But some more exposure to dating and figuring out the "courtship" stuff will be good for you, I think.

[rainbowsandroses]

1 hour ago, Jaunty said:

It's probably a good idea for you to go on quite a few dates when you feel ready to get back out there.  I think that some further experience with dating will help you develop your awareness of what's going on with the men you encounter.

Please don't let this discourage you, but it's a fact that a lot of guys on OLD will state that they are "looking for a serious relationship" because they know that is good bait.   

So you SHOULD select for guys who say that - but when you're meeting and, if it progresses, getting to know them further, you will need to read them in ways that you might not quite "get" yet.  

It's possible to spend time with a person, start to *like* them, and yet not become truly invested until / unless you come to really know enough about them and what they're up to.   

If the guy turns out to be a disappointment, yes, it can hurt your feelings and leave you down - but it doesn't have to be a serious letdown.  

You can learn how to navigate this kind of thing to some extent.

I get that you're shy, inexperienced and an introvert.  That's ok,  you can be you, and no need to try to go out with dozens of guys if that is very counter to your real self.  But some more exposure to dating and figuring out the "courtship" stuff will be good for you, I think.

^^I very much agree with this and was the basis of my last post. 

@ShycarrotI am truly sorry you found the advice given in my last detrimental, that was certainly not my intention - my intention was the opposite.  

It was intended to help you recognize certain behaviors between men who want to date and develop a relationship and men who are "players" (for lack of a more appropriate word to describe their motivations).

It's the same (or similar) advice given to me (or learned through reading relevant books etc) when I lacked the experience to determine for myself and found it extremely helpful!

All in an effort to help you avoid what you just experienced with this man and avoid  getting hurt. 

Perhaps the way I posted it, the tone, etc, was a bit too harsh while you're still healing and if so again I do apologize.

Anyway, I said you were doing great and I meant it!  😀

Take good care and as always, wish you the best moving forward!  

 

 

[ShySoul]

8 hours ago, Shycarrot said:

100 men, that's a lot !!

When I read about people going on 50+ first dates a year, it makes me think that I may be giving up too fast.

Once I am over this guy (soon, I hope) I will try to go on more dates ! Thanks again for your reply. 

You can go on a hundred or a thousand dates and not find anyone. You can go on one date and meet the love of your life.

I've never had dated in my life. Yet I've experienced love with more then one person.

It's not about numbers, meeting more people, gaining experience. It's about knowing yourself and trusting your intuition.

People are individuals. Everyone you meet will have their own quirks, traitis, motivations, etc. Just because you've been around other guys, doesn't mean you will be able to read any one correctly. You can also run the risk of making assumptions about people because you are expecting certain things or because you are caught up in comparing them to something or someone.

Just focus on you. Focus on knowing people as you get to know them and on truly learning about them. Don't worry about anything else. Value them for the person they show themselves to be. Value yourself by listening to what that voice inside tells you, trusting your judgement. And let things happen as they are supposed to happen.

It doesn't have to be complicated. We don't need checklists or mountains of experience. Trust yourself and trust the process as it happens naturally. Good things tend to come from that. At least that's been my experience.

[rainbowsandroses]

On 9/8/2024 at 10:35 AM, Shycarrot said:

Besides, I am also worried about his behavior : I told him I only wanted to be friends, so I find it sad that he's pushing for more. Plus, if he kept his hands to himself, I would not have this problem lol

Just want to say that while I do believe more experience will benefit you, I agree with @ShySoul have faith and trust in your own judgment.  It's what I have said several times myself. 

The above quote was from your original post almost three months ago. 

You were questioning HIS behavior, rightfully so!  That his "pushing for more" physically was inappropriate and you were spot on, it was!

Your instincts and judgment about that were correct! 

The only issue was that you interpreted his 'pushing' as meaning he was interested in dating you versus what it truly meant and has now been confirmed almost three months later - his intention was casual sex. 

Yes it's important to determine how we ourselves feel but it's also important to determine what a man's true motives are as well - dating/developing a relationship OR casual. 

It can be tricky as many of their behaviors can appear similar but when you gain some experience, it will become easier to tell the difference, I promise you!  

And also, sadly as @Jauntypointed out, when you ask, they are not always so forthcoming.

So it's up to you to determine which I have no doubt you will!

Perhaps even sooner than you think. 

 

 

 

[Shycarrot]

On 11/29/2024 at 12:27 AM, rainbowsandroses said:

It can be tricky as many of their behaviors can appear similar but when you gain some experience, it will become easier to tell the difference, I promise you!  

Thank you very much, yes I hope so !! 🙂 

The thing is, I remember that he also said many, many things that made him sound romantic (on our first dinner together, he told me how we said "girlfriend/boyfriend" in his native language, he told me he enjoyed and sent me many romantic songs, his brother had gotten married on august and he raved about how cute they were, asked me what kind of wedding dress I wanted as we were walking past a bridal shop ... etc)

Even when I was unsure about him, I remember that his behavior strucked me as someone who wasn't necessarily looking for something casual.

But it was just a part of his game 😉 He was using romance-like language to keep me invested. From now on, I will be better equipped to see through this kind of thing ! 

 

On 11/28/2024 at 8:47 PM, ShySoul said:

You can go on a hundred or a thousand dates and not find anyone. You can go on one date and meet the love of your life.

Yes, I agree 😅 

On 11/28/2024 at 8:47 PM, ShySoul said:

People are individuals. Everyone you meet will have their own quirks, traitis, motivations, etc. Just because you've been around other guys, doesn't mean you will be able to read any one correctly. You can also run the risk of making assumptions about people because you are expecting certain things or because you are caught up in comparing them to something or someone.

Just focus on you. Focus on knowing people as you get to know them and on truly learning about them. Don't worry about anything else. Value them for the person they show themselves to be. Value yourself by listening to what that voice inside tells you, trusting your judgement. And let things happen as they are supposed to happen.

Thank you very much 🙂 That's really interesting ! 

On 11/28/2024 at 6:52 PM, Jaunty said:

It's probably a good idea for you to go on quite a few dates when you feel ready to get back out there.  I think that some further experience with dating will help you develop your awareness of what's going on with the men you encounter.

Yes, that's what I am planning to do 🙂 

[Shycarrot]

On 11/28/2024 at 6:52 PM, Jaunty said:

It's possible to spend time with a person, start to *like* them, and yet not become truly invested until / unless you come to really know enough about them and what they're up to.   

If the guy turns out to be a disappointment, yes, it can hurt your feelings and leave you down - but it doesn't have to be a serious letdown

YES 

I definitely get this now ... 

This guy was such a disappointment because I had a lot of hopes, even before I was clear about his intentions 😅 Huge mistake of mine, but you live and you learn ! 

 

On 11/28/2024 at 7:33 PM, rainbowsandroses said:

I am truly sorry you found the advice given in my last detrimental, that was certainly not my intention - my intention was the opposite.  

It was intended to help you recognize certain behaviors between men who want to date and develop a relationship and men who are "players" (for lack of a more appropriate word to describe their motivations).

It's the same (or similar) advice given to me (or learned through reading relevant books etc) when I lacked the experience to determine for myself and found it extremely helpful!

All in an effort to help you avoid what you just experienced with this man and avoid  getting hurt. 

Perhaps the way I posted it, the tone, etc, was a bit too harsh while you're still healing and if so again I do apologize.

Anyway, I said you were doing great and I meant it!  😀

Take good care and as always, wish you the best moving forward!  

It's okay, really 🙂 I appreciate your apology, thank you ! 

My emotional attachment is fading anyway ! I have done a good job at reframing the situation to a point where, when I think about him, the first thing that comes to mind is "him = a dishonest person who didn't respect my boundaries and tried to give me false hope in order to string me along".

A lot of songs, and places are not triggering anymore, I have been able to hang out in the same places with different people and I felt nothing when I had to drive by this place 🙌

I muted his profile on instagram, and I missed a lot of dance events to avoid visuals-reminders of him. But I looked at the story of a common friend earlier who attended yesterday dance event, and of course, this guy was there, laughing and playing with the lady who was filming. Seeing him immediately triggered a fight or flight response. This reaction lasted a few minutes and wasn't followed by any sadness or longing either.

I apologize because it's very petty and mean but I am going to say it anyway : the fact that I didn't find him physically attractive in the first place is helping me 🙈

Now that my emotional attachment is almost gone, I see him as an unattractive guy in my friend's instagram story. 

Anyway, I really, really miss going to these dance events ! But I am also very scared that this will undo all of my healing ... The fact that I still experience a fight-or-flight reaction when seeing his face makes me think that I am not ready yet ? 😅

The thing is, next Tuesday some of my friends want to give this dance a try, they asked me to supervise them. I want to do it, but I am also reluctant ! 

How do you know if you are ready ? I suppose that if I am worrying about this, it means that it's still not the case ? 

[Shycarrot]

On 11/28/2024 at 6:09 AM, SophiaG said:

I am guilty of this a lot of the time - not that I feel really guilty about it - it is what it is. I think people who meet in real life versus people who meet online can both range from going very fast to taking things very slow.

Thank you very much for this, I have thought about this a lot these last few days and it changed my perspective .

On 11/28/2024 at 6:09 AM, SophiaG said:

A lot of people hates the apps because they seem to turn meeting people into a "numbers game" but that's actually what I like: you can screen people for basic deal breakers, must haves, goals and values, etc. upfront. I don't see the "shopping" stage on those apps as actually dating or building a connection, rather you are just building a list of potential matches to meet and maybe date so when you meet them in person, the chance of being compatible if you like them (or "click" or "have chemistry") is higher than two random people who are attracted to each other.

That's a great approach ! 🙂 May I ask what kind of deal breakers, must haves and goals you had in mind ? 

I find that dating apps are SO time-consuming to me ! To be honest, I think I am even considering paying for Hinge or Bumble, so I can filter more effectively and not get stuck in the swipe left loop ! 

I hate the fact that I sometimes have to swipe on lot of profiles just to find one that has potential and that does not exhibits majors red-flags. 

On 11/28/2024 at 6:09 AM, SophiaG said:

I've met many guys who were not okay with me taking time to decide if I'm attracted them and moved on. I respected that and had no hard feelings - we were simply not a good match. I don't see that as reducing people to numbers or "treating people as disposable" - it's just saving my and everyone else's time so they are free to look for and meet someone who's on their wavelength.

Thank you, that's really interesting 🙂 

[Batya33]

Is there a compromise -can you - attend an event but only for a shorter amount of time (or do you know when he typically arrives??) -if you go with friends can  you laser focus on them such that you sort of block out the visuals of him-is it a large enough gathering? Are there other events that are similar that he does not attend?

You -won't really know.  You "seem" ready but you know be prepared for those pesky feelings to sneak up on you. I think it's fine that you remind yourself the physical attraction was problematic. 

(Like Sophia having specific must haves and dealbreakers helped make the online website process far less consuming)

[Shycarrot]

9 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Is there a compromise -can you - attend an event but only for a shorter amount of time (or do you know when he typically arrives??) -if you go with friends can  you laser focus on them such that you sort of block out the visuals of him-is it a large enough gathering? Are there other events that are similar that he does not attend?

You -won't really know.  You "seem" ready but you know be prepared for those pesky feelings to sneak up on you. I think it's fine that you remind yourself the physical attraction was problematic.

Thank you for your reply ! I guess I can definitely try to focus on my new friends 🙂 

Also, I am a bit short-sighted. So if I go there without my contacts nor my glasses, I won't be able to see him clearly from a distance, plus the place is quite dark, that might help lol. I can take advantage of my vision problem 😂

Yes, there are others events he does not attend like the one on Thursday (it's a small one and I actually went this week ! 🙂