MIL Made Extremely Rude Comment

[rainbowsandroses]

22 hours ago, niceknowingyou45 said:

Since the engagement involves both of us and she didn't specify it being just the 2 of them we just assumed I was invited.

Exactly, you "assumed" you were invited. 

Why can't you leave room for the  possibility that SHE "assumed" it was a dinner with only TIm to his celebrate his engagement? 

It's not unheard of for a mother to want to take her son to dinner to celebrate his engagement.  Whatever he told you was his own misunderstanding of it.

Why did you choose to take such offense and make it so awkward running off in tears?  It's was a miscommunication, period. 

She didn't make a "rude" remark, that is catastrophizing an incident that occurred only in your own mind based on your "assumption" it was a dinner among the three of you.  

in her mind, she was only expecting Tim based on her "assumption" that it was only going to be Tim.  And she expressed that to him -- "I was only expecting you."

Untactful perhaps, but not "rude" imo. 

She didn't intentionally exclude you, she's not making rude comments about you to Tim, again you are catastrophizing and if you don't get a handle on that, your marriage is NOT going to last.

22 hours ago, niceknowingyou45 said:

Being that we been together so long, live together, and are now engaged for dinner invitations it doesn't need to be spelled out that they mean the couple is invited together it is an implied invite at this point.

When my mom invites me over to the house for dinner on the weekend at this stage in the game I don't feel the need to ask is my fiance invited because we have been an established couple for a while it's expected for family events/dinners and such we come together and the invite is meant for both of us. 

I completely disagree with this^^ it's also unreasonable for you to have this mindset.  

Do you honestly believe that once a couple gets married, that mother and son (or mother and daughter or father and daughter) aren't allowed to share lone time together, having lunch or dinner together just the two of them? 

And that even if nothing is said about you coming along, that because you've been together so long and/or married, that it's "implied" or "assumed" that you will join too?  And you'll take offense and feel hurt and excluded if you're not?

That's exactly what you said above.

Honestly OP, I don't know what to think anymore. I am inclined to think that you're over-emotional, take things too personally, catastrophizing, blowing things way out of proportion, but don't want to "assume."

If you're intent on marrying him, I suggest couples counseling for both of you and individual counseling for you.

Good luck. 

[Batya33]

At least in my experience when it comes to celebrating a couples engagement  or marriage the only time it’s for just one person is if it’s gender based like a traditional bridal shower or bachelorette party or bachelor party. Even when coworkers want to celebrate a milestone like this there’s an invitation to the couple even if only one works for the company. Not saying it can’t happen but especially not with a future in law. Yes it’s assumed. Yes it’s ok to say “I’d like to meet privately “. Sometimes the parent has a family heirloom to give that will be a surprise to the future son or daughter in law etc. 

[Jaunty]

My daughter is in her 30's and I am still 100% her parent.  If she gets engaged it would be highly likely for me to want to get together one on one with her. Just the two of us.  ESPECIALLY since they live together and I rarely see her alone.

I have very high regard for her partner but the marriage of ones child is a milestone and if you're close, like we are (and evidently your fiance and his mother), then this is not weird at all.

It's not necessarily all about you, even though, of course, you are the betrothed.

 

[rainbowsandroses]

There can be engagement celebrations/parties/gatherings wherein family and friends are invited and there can be times when a parent (or parents) want to celebrate privately with their son or daughter. 

This very much sounded like the latter and perhaps a more formal celebration among families (both families) and friends would be planned at a later date. 

I am thoroughly convinced this was a misunderstanding /miscommunication and OP I am glad you are choosing to let it go. 

[mylolita]

Hey OP,

 

I have been glancing at this thread - and I sympathise and feel for you, I do! 
 

From my perspective, your mother in law has been nothing but lovely to you, you announce your engagement, and then one day she turns cold? And then further makes comments that aren’t too great? 
 

I think this is not just a mother in law, daughter in law thing, or husband and wife thing - I think this is a case of, you felt wronged, and someone was rude to you, and you feel maybe as if you didn’t stick up for yourself and no one else did? 
 

Tone and passive aggressive tendencies often are lost when you simply explain the outside facts of something, and outsiders don’t see the gravity of it, or how it could hurt your feelings. It happens all the time and it’s unfair! 
 

All I will say OP is, whoever it is, and this time it’s your future mother in law - you have a choice how you want to carry on. Sometimes the first “slight” or “offence” and how you handle it goes forward to set a prescient on how conflict for the rest of the relationship is handled.

 

I personally think, if you feel like she was rude, passive aggressive, men spirited even, you should stand up for yourself and maturely say this to her, I really do, because, if she is the type of behave like this, it will only carry in because she will see you as a push over, and use her status to play games. If she is like this, by the way, as we don’t know her like you do.

 

I would simply say it straight and calm, “By the way, the dinner before, you were rude and off with me the whole time, when it was supposed to be a happy celebration. Why?” And leave a huge silence! Let her explain or even apologise. Don’t say anything else until she does!

 

There is not a worse feeling sometimes than the feeling of being passively trodden down, and not speaking your grievances. It is always better out in the open. Short term pain for long term betterment, in my opinion! 
 

Or, you can mumble around her and everyone else in the future to “keep the peace” which, by the way, builds hateful and toxic resentment inside yourself and causes terrible relationships based on phoney actions and masking anyway! 
 

That’s my two cents and I realise it is different advice to all above - but you should stick up for yourself OP and say it calmly and straightly, how it is, and how you feel! 
 

x

[boltnrun]

I'm in favor of clearing the air.

This happened with my brother and his wife. They were estranged from me and our mother. I was getting married and wished for my brother to walk me down the aisle at my wedding. So I asked for a meeting at a neutral location. His wife initially resisted because she felt she was right and didn't want to "give in". But he convinced her. We talked (well, she yelled but only at first), we came to a mutual understanding and after that we had a really good relationship. She did try to sabotage my wedding but we also talked through that and afterwards we were all close. Even after she and my brother divorced she wanted to remain friendly with me.

So I do encourage you to talk with her but I would avoid accusing her of being "rude". Sure, that's how you feel but that's not productive IMO. You could say you felt hurt and were frankly surprised that she would expect you to not attend the engagement celebration dinner. Tell her how you feel, then give her a chance to explain how she feels.

For me, yes, it felt strange for my son to go from being super close to me to being super close to his spouse. I miss the closeness we used to share but I'm glad he's happy and has found his person. And I gained another child (his spouse), so that's a positive. And I'm hoping to be a grandmother some day!

[Seraphim]

Hopefully, speaking up would work for her , peace is made when two people want peace . 

[Batya33]

1 hour ago, Jaunty said:

My daughter is in her 30's and I am still 100% her parent.  If she gets engaged it would be highly likely for me to want to get together one on one with her. Just the two of us.  ESPECIALLY since they live together and I rarely see her alone.

I have very high regard for her partner but the marriage of ones child is a milestone and if you're close, like we are (and evidently your fiance and his mother), then this is not weird at all.

It's not necessarily all about you, even though, of course, you are the betrothed.

 

Thanks!  I did not know especially for the first celebration.  I learned something and thanks again!

[Jaunty]

23 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Thanks!  I did not know especially for the first celebration.  

I wouldn't even be thinking of it as a "first celebration."  More like being excited to connect personally with your child / parent about such a momentous event - prior to the onslaught of celebrations where everybody will be participating.

Potentially a very sweet moment.

[Seraphim]

6 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

I wouldn't even be thinking of it as a "first celebration."  More like being excited to connect personally with your child / parent about such a momentous event - prior to the onslaught of celebrations where everybody will be participating.

Potentially a very sweet moment.

Agreed. About once a month I go and spend time with my mom alone without everyone in tow. My husband goes to help his mom and sometimes I opt to stay home . Everyone needs space for their own relationships and sanity and interests. 

[boltnrun]

I wanted to add that my SIL and I came to blows after she physically attacked my mother. Police were involved. If we could come back from that I think some insensitive words spoken in an unthinking manner can be resolved. 

[niceknowingyou45]

1 hour ago, rainbowsandroses said:

There can be engagement celebrations/parties/gatherings wherein family and friends are invited and there can be times when a parent (or parents) want to celebrate privately with their son or daughter. 

This very much sounded like the latter and perhaps a more formal celebration among families (both families) and friends would be planned at a later date. 

I am thoroughly convinced this was a misunderstanding /miscommunication and OP I am glad you are choosing to let it go. 

I don't get though why my FMIL wouldn't want part of the reason (me) her son is engaged there to celebrate.  Obviously if she is asking her son to celebrate with her I am thinking she is happy about the engagement.  I am just unsure as to why she wouldn't want to include her FDIL to be especially since we have a relationship and we have been together a while.

Again for the millionth time I have never ever said a mother couldn't spend alone time with her married son.  For an engagement celebration though I am confused why a mother would want to leave her son's future bride out of that specific celebration.  That's hurtful.

I didn't walk away when his mother made that comment to my fiance.  This isn't a friend taking him out to celebrate man to man this is my future family member and I would think she would want to include me in a dinner where her son is able to make me his wife.

Again any other time she calls him up and asks him to go out alone to dinner with her no problem and completely understandable. She has always been welcoming to me and seems to like me so it was just shocking that suddenly I wouldn't be included in this particular type of celebration.

Like I said at the moment I don't plan on addressing it anymore with my fiance or FMIL but if I keep being excluded or comments keep being made I don't think letting it fester is the best idea either.  Family should clear the air with eachother.

[LotusBlack]

I don’t know, OP; I think this is a lot or energy spent on one comment that seems to me like it was made more out of surprise than the intention of being rude. Sure, you had concerns about the level of enmeshment your FMIL has with her son, but you were genuinely surprised by the comment for the very fact that she has always treated you kindly. 

In your shoes, I’d forget about it and brush it off as a one-off unintended slight. Yes, it is a bit strange that it was presented to you as an engagement dinner and yet she was surprised you were there. But, perhaps something got lost in translation. In any case, don’t let this be the hill you die on. Forget about it and move forward with her just as you would have had she not made the comment. No need to twist yourself up in a knotted pretzel speculating on her intentions. It’s not your problem what she thinks. You do you. It’s not worth the stress.

[rainbowsandroses]

2 hours ago, niceknowingyou45 said:

Again for the millionth time I have never ever said a mother couldn't spend alone time with her married son...

@niceknowingyou45 perhaps things are getting lost in translation, but to be fair to us, the readers, the narrative keeps changing.

For example, yesterday you wrote this (below quoted) which somewhat contradicts what's quoted above.  My read on it anyway.

And look, if that's how you feel, that's fine!! I disagree but no judgment.  Just own it versus changing the narrative because it can get confusing, at least to me. 

On 11/19/2023 at 8:54 AM, niceknowingyou45 said:

When my mom invites me over to the house for dinner on the weekend at this stage in the game I don't feel the need to ask is my fiance invited because we have been an established couple for a while it's expected for family events/dinners and such we come together and the invite is meant for both of us. 

Do you see the contradiction and how it might be confusing?  

In any event, I think we've all said our piece, you have chosen to let it go which IMO is what's best, and move forward. 

Again, I wish you both the best! 

[Tinydance]

9 minutes ago, rainbowsandroses said:

@niceknowingyou45 perhaps things are getting lost in translation, but to be fair to us, the readers, the narrative keeps changing.

For example, yesterday you wrote this (below quoted) which somewhat contradicts what's quoted above.  My read on it anyway.

And look, if that's how you feel, that's fine!! I disagree but no judgment.  Just own it versus changing the narrative because it can get confusing, at least to me. 

Do you see the contradiction and how it might be confusing?  

In any event, I think we've all said our piece, you have chosen to let it go which IMO is what's best, and move forward. 

Again, I wish you both the best! 

Yes I agree with what you said. I think a family dinner would be when a few family members are invited but OP wasn't invited. If it's just mother and son then it's not exactly a family dinner. Personally I value my stand alone relationships with people so I still want to catch up with friends and family members one-on-one. Just because I'm catching up with a friend or family, it doesn't "automatically" mean my partner is invited. It's not just a given every time.

In my opinion when you get married, you don't become one person or joined at the hip. It's important to still have your own life to some extent. I've never neglected my friends or family when I was in a relationships. Relationships can end and if you push people away then once you're single, you'll end up all alone.

I don't think saying: "Oh I was only expecting you" to her son is EXTREMELY rude. Maybe a little tactless but it's not super rude. It's like if say I invited my friend "John" for dinner but a friend "Sam" also turned up. And I say to John: "Oh I was only expecting you." It's not like I hate Sam. I'm simply saying I was only expecting John because that's who I was expecting. 

[Batya33]

2 hours ago, Jaunty said:

I wouldn't even be thinking of it as a "first celebration."  More like being excited to connect personally with your child / parent about such a momentous event - prior to the onslaught of celebrations where everybody will be participating.

Potentially a very sweet moment.

Yes. It’s also then - sort of on him - perhaps he should have clarified. And for sure totally fine if she’d said “let’s have dinner two of us” and he told his fiancée this time just mother son. I wish when I had my baby there’d been more limits on how many people came at a time to see me/new baby. It was too much despite being a celebration of sorts. One gal brought her new boyfriend I’d never met. My son was 2 weeks old. They walk in. “Ok we’re going to wash our hands now and hold the baby”. I said - I was shocked - “we’re only letting immediate family hold him “. 
years later when they had a son she wouldn’t let me come over to see her even because they decided no outsiders until baby was at least 3 months old lol. 
So yes people sure have different ideas about these sorts of boundaries!

[Jaunty]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

Yes. It’s also then - sort of on him - perhaps he should have clarified. And for sure totally fine if she’d said “let’s have dinner two of us” and he told his fiancée this time just mother son.

My latest take on it is that everybody is innocent. 

The guy thought that mom meant both he and the OP.  The mother probably said something casual like "let's get together for dinner in celebration of your engagement" and then was honestly caught off guard to see the two of them.   Fiance took care of the OP by trying to smooth it over and the MIL also did her part to put it behind the three of them and have a nice dinner, but at this point the OP was not having it and it started its blossoming into a huge thing.  

I would say that this "we are engaged and everywhere he goes I go and that is the way it is supposed to be and the way it always will be" is out of line.

Also, the MIL was ALONE.  This was clearly not a "regular family get together," she thought she was meeting her son for dinner.   

It's fine.

[Jaunty]

4 hours ago, niceknowingyou45 said:

I don't get though why my FMIL wouldn't want part of the reason (me) her son is engaged there to celebrate.  Obviously if she is asking her son to celebrate with her

BECAUSE SHE IS HIS MOTHER AND HE IS HER SON.   They have, and always will have (hopefully) a relationship independent of you.  

You have a lot of people here including me who are parents, and who also have parents.  Many of us, me included, have said that if our kid gets engaged we can easily envision getting together with them one on one to mark this milestone in their life journey - for which we have been by their side since they were conceived.   

Is any of this penetrating your self centered stance that he's engaged BECAUSE OF YOU,  and therefore should not be having celebrations with his own parent because HE has reached the stage of his life where he is going to take that step?

What is so threatening about this to you?  

 

[LotusBlack]

24 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

 

 

30 minutes ago, Jaunty said:

My latest take on it is that everybody is innocent. 

The guy thought that mom meant both he and the OP.  The mother probably said something casual like "let's get together for dinner in celebration of your engagement" and then was honestly caught off guard to see the two of them.   Fiance took care of the OP by trying to smooth it over and the MIL also did her part to put it behind the three of them and have a nice dinner, but at this point the OP was not having it and it started its blossoming into a huge thing.  

I would say that this "we are engaged and everywhere he goes I go and that is the way it is supposed to be and the way it always will be" is out of line.

Also, the MIL was ALONE.  This was clearly not a "regular family get together," she thought she was meeting her son for dinner.   

It's fine.

I agree with all of this. OP, I don’t think anything untoward was intended. I have a 3yo son and hope one day if he decides to commit to a partner, he can still independently pursue events with me and others without his partner assuming dual attendance each time.

[itsallgrand]

I agree with Jaunty. And I think you are going to continue to be offended, not only by her but friends and others, if you keep these rigid strong ideas of how people must react to your engagement. After engagement there's the marriage and sounds like you want children as well. I've seen so many people fall into rigid expectations of others during these major life events and then be disappointed and wondering why there's so few left standing to listen to the expectations anymore. 

 

 

[niceknowingyou45]

2 hours ago, Tinydance said:

Yes I agree with what you said. I think a family dinner would be when a few family members are invited but OP wasn't invited. If it's just mother and son then it's not exactly a family dinner. Personally I value my stand alone relationships with people so I still want to catch up with friends and family members one-on-one. Just because I'm catching up with a friend or family, it doesn't "automatically" mean my partner is invited. It's not just a given every time.

In my opinion when you get married, you don't become one person or joined at the hip. It's important to still have your own life to some extent. I've never neglected my friends or family when I was in a relationships. Relationships can end and if you push people away then once you're single, you'll end up all alone.

I don't think saying: "Oh I was only expecting you" to her son is EXTREMELY rude. Maybe a little tactless but it's not super rude. It's like if say I invited my friend "John" for dinner but a friend "Sam" also turned up. And I say to John: "Oh I was only expecting you." It's not like I hate Sam. I'm simply saying I was only expecting John because that's who I was expecting. 

See there we go again with implying because a marriage could end it should be less important than other relationships.  Friendships can end as well and I hate to break it to you but being blood related also doesn't guarantee that a relationship can't end either.  My dad has full blood brother who he doesn't talk to and doesn't ever plan on talking to again.  So yes it can happen with blood relatives as well.  Being blood related doesn't automatically make you immune to the relationship going south.  But guess who stood by my dad's side when his relationship with his brother went south my mom, his WIFE.  I hate this narrative that we should keep people in our life because a divorce could happen one day.  It's like you are trying to water down the seriousness of marriage and elevating other relationships as more important than marriage because we could possibly divorce one day.  Well at the time being we aren't divorced.

Now that all being said I can most certainly see your point that my FMIL was just making a surprised comment that she was just expecting her son to come to the dinner and I plan on letting it go and not making a fuss.  However considering that my FMIL threw a hissy because her 28 year old grown son who is about to be married is putting his wife on his bank account and taking his mother off and not allowing his mother to track his every move clearly that plays a factor in this as well. If my FMIL acted like a "normal" mother of an adult about to be married son and was understanding that these changes are a natural part of grouping up and separating from your parents as an adult (not never talking to them but changing the dynamic to an adult relationship with your parents) then it would be easier for me to move on from her clearly enmeshed behaviors. 

 

It's not like she realized and then moved on no she doubled down and had a fit about it.  It's not the behavior itself that is as much the problem but rather the reaction when the unhealthy behavior is addressed,  It has been mentioned that there are lots of mothers on here of adult children.  Don't you want your adult child whether it's a son or daughter to grow up and eventually form their own life and not need you in the same way as they did when they were 5, 10, or even 15?  Don't you want them to spread their wings and not need to track their every move or spending habits.  This is something you should hope for for your child.  Be happy that they found that special someone.  Certain things are now nod towards the spouse such as bank account info.  That becomes family money.  

 

  This isn't a case of where his mother has exhibited normal healthy boundaries with her adult son and this was just a stand alone comment this is aligned with other behaviors.  Like the advice you and other posters have given I plan on letting my husband handle those conversations with his mother and I plan on just continuing my relationship with his mother as usual.

Again to be clear I am not at all against my fiance having a meal or whatever it may be alone with his mother.  I was just shocked that this expectation of my FMIL seeing my fiance alone wasn't mentioned in the original phone call to him.  I can appreciate everyone's points and they are completely valid that you may want to celebrate this milestone alone with your child.  I am now seeing and understanding that POV.  Thank you for pointing that out to me. 

However considering I always had a good relationship with my MIL I would have thought she would have followed up with me via text/phone call something to acknowledge me officially joining the family such as a text, "hey congratulations on your engagement to my son I am excited to have you as my DIL."  Or even after she asked my son to meet her to celebrate the engagement a, "hey I want to celebrate this milestone in my son's life with him just mother/son however I would love to go to lunch on such and such day in addition to my solo dinner with my son to celebrate all together."  I dunno it would have been nice for her to do something to include me in the engagement excitement considering I am about to be a member of her family and to start off the relationship on the right foot.  I didn't get one single text, message, or phone call congratulations from her when we got engaged it was radio silence.  That's extremely hurtful considering how well we know each other, how many times we been around each other, and our relationship has always been.

I mean just like everyone on here is saying obviously his mother is going to be around a lot time and will always be a part of my husband's life so I should try my best to show her kindness and give her the benefit of the doubt which is accurate and I agree with that point.  However shouldn't it go both ways?  That my MIL should make the effort to include me as well because I am the love of her son's life, the woman he is about to make vows to spend the rest of his life with, and I will always be an important part of his life as well?  Not to mention the mother of any potential grandchildren.  I am not saying this in a, "I could not bring my children around her or withhold them from her" type of way.  Rather in a, "we are about to become family to each other type of way and we will be both connected through her son so it would be nice to include her rather than exclude her right off the bat to show I am happy to have her as a part of my family."

Also my parents took us BOTH out to celebrate our engagement first.  Then a week later I had a dinner alone with my mom.  However my mom made the effort to show my fiance she cared for him and was including him and acknowledging him as a big reason for the engagement and then we had a nice little mother/daughter dinner.  Hell, my mother even personally texted my fiance one on one to say she is so excited for her daughter to marry such a wonderful man and she is excited to officially have him as her son in law.  

[niceknowingyou45]

1 minute ago, niceknowingyou45 said:

See there we go again with implying because a marriage could end it should be less important than other relationships.  Friendships can end as well and I hate to break it to you but being blood related also doesn't guarantee that a relationship can't end either.  My dad has full blood brother who he doesn't talk to and doesn't ever plan on talking to again.  So yes it can happen with blood relatives as well.  Being blood related doesn't automatically make you immune to the relationship going south.  But guess who stood by my dad's side when his relationship with his brother went south my mom, his WIFE.  I hate this narrative that we should keep people in our life because a divorce could happen one day.  It's like you are trying to water down the seriousness of marriage and elevating other relationships as more important than marriage because we could possibly divorce one day.  Well at the time being we aren't divorced.

Now that all being said I can most certainly see your point that my FMIL was just making a surprised comment that she was just expecting her son to come to the dinner and I plan on letting it go and not making a fuss.  However considering that my FMIL threw a hissy because her 28 year old grown son who is about to be married is putting his wife on his bank account and taking his mother off and not allowing his mother to track his every move clearly that plays a factor in this as well. If my FMIL acted like a "normal" mother of an adult about to be married son and was understanding that these changes are a natural part of grouping up and separating from your parents as an adult (not never talking to them but changing the dynamic to an adult relationship with your parents) then it would be easier for me to move on from her clearly enmeshed behaviors. 

 

It's not like she realized and then moved on no she doubled down and had a fit about it.  It's not the behavior itself that is as much the problem but rather the reaction when the unhealthy behavior is addressed,  It has been mentioned that there are lots of mothers on here of adult children.  Don't you want your adult child whether it's a son or daughter to grow up and eventually form their own life and not need you in the same way as they did when they were 5, 10, or even 15?  Don't you want them to spread their wings and not need to track their every move or spending habits.  This is something you should hope for for your child.  Be happy that they found that special someone.  Certain things are now nod towards the spouse such as bank account info.  That becomes family money.  

 

  This isn't a case of where his mother has exhibited normal healthy boundaries with her adult son and this was just a stand alone comment this is aligned with other behaviors.  Like the advice you and other posters have given I plan on letting my husband handle those conversations with his mother and I plan on just continuing my relationship with his mother as usual.

Again to be clear I am not at all against my fiance having a meal or whatever it may be alone with his mother.  I was just shocked that this expectation of my FMIL seeing my fiance alone wasn't mentioned in the original phone call to him.  I can appreciate everyone's points and they are completely valid that you may want to celebrate this milestone alone with your child.  I am now seeing and understanding that POV.  Thank you for pointing that out to me. 

However considering I always had a good relationship with my MIL I would have thought she would have followed up with me via text/phone call something to acknowledge me officially joining the family such as a text, "hey congratulations on your engagement to my son I am excited to have you as my DIL."  Or even after she asked my son to meet her to celebrate the engagement a, "hey I want to celebrate this milestone in my son's life with him just mother/son however I would love to go to lunch on such and such day in addition to my solo dinner with my son to celebrate all together."  I dunno it would have been nice for her to do something to include me in the engagement excitement considering I am about to be a member of her family and to start off the relationship on the right foot.  I didn't get one single text, message, or phone call congratulations from her when we got engaged it was radio silence.  That's extremely hurtful considering how well we know each other, how many times we been around each other, and our relationship has always been.

I mean just like everyone on here is saying obviously his mother is going to be around a lot time and will always be a part of my husband's life so I should try my best to show her kindness and give her the benefit of the doubt which is accurate and I agree with that point.  However shouldn't it go both ways?  That my MIL should make the effort to include me as well because I am the love of her son's life, the woman he is about to make vows to spend the rest of his life with, and I will always be an important part of his life as well?  Not to mention the mother of any potential grandchildren.  I am not saying this in a, "I could not bring my children around her or withhold them from her" type of way.  Rather in a, "we are about to become family to each other type of way and we will be both connected through her son so it would be nice to include her rather than exclude her right off the bat to show I am happy to have her as a part of my family."

Also my parents took us BOTH out to celebrate our engagement first.  Then a week later I had a dinner alone with my mom.  However my mom made the effort to show my fiance she cared for him and was including him and acknowledging him as a big reason for the engagement and then we had a nice little mother/daughter dinner.  Hell, my mother even personally texted my fiance one on one to say she is so excited for her daughter to marry such a wonderful man and she is excited to officially have him as her son in law.  

growing up*

[niceknowingyou45]

1 hour ago, Jaunty said:

BECAUSE SHE IS HIS MOTHER AND HE IS HER SON.   They have, and always will have (hopefully) a relationship independent of you.  

You have a lot of people here including me who are parents, and who also have parents.  Many of us, me included, have said that if our kid gets engaged we can easily envision getting together with them one on one to mark this milestone in their life journey - for which we have been by their side since they were conceived.   

Is any of this penetrating your self centered stance that he's engaged BECAUSE OF YOU,  and therefore should not be having celebrations with his own parent because HE has reached the stage of his life where he is going to take that step?

What is so threatening about this to you?  

 

I can see everyone's point about a parent wanting to celebrate this milestone in their child's life solo.  However I don't see how my stance of my fiance being engaged because of me is self centered.  To be engaged does it not take two people?  So yes I am literally part of the reason he is engaged because he is engaged to me.  

We aren't talking a job promotion here where it is just his doing that I am taking credit for.  An engagement takes two people.  

[Batya33]

I say this with all respect to you and based on what I've read about your "good" relationship with your MIL -meaning you've gotten along, you've interacted politely. Look - you don't like her much.  It's ok -but it's obvious to me.  He does like her much.  So much that it took this engagement for him to make significant change in the financial/tracking entanglements.

So my totally respectful suggestion - don't try to have large parties to celebrate the engagement or the marriage - start preparing for the marriage - we all can use preparation right?? - and get married in a quiet, loving, joyous way -that doesn't involve a big reception that will need planning and input from both families most likely.  It's - just not worth the potential train wreck/drama/comments you might misinterpret- or she might -walking on eggshells.  I mean maybe do a party later on -if things are actually good -meaning actually close and you somehow realize you like and admire this woman and you don't just tolerate her and play nicely in the sandbox.  

I'm not of course sure what you were planning but since you were this focused on the protocol and propriety of celebrating an engagement I'd - avoid the much larger protocol involved in planning a large reception to celebrate a marriage.  

[niceknowingyou45]

6 hours ago, boltnrun said:

I'm in favor of clearing the air.

This happened with my brother and his wife. They were estranged from me and our mother. I was getting married and wished for my brother to walk me down the aisle at my wedding. So I asked for a meeting at a neutral location. His wife initially resisted because she felt she was right and didn't want to "give in". But he convinced her. We talked (well, she yelled but only at first), we came to a mutual understanding and after that we had a really good relationship. She did try to sabotage my wedding but we also talked through that and afterwards we were all close. Even after she and my brother divorced she wanted to remain friendly with me.

So I do encourage you to talk with her but I would avoid accusing her of being "rude". Sure, that's how you feel but that's not productive IMO. You could say you felt hurt and were frankly surprised that she would expect you to not attend the engagement celebration dinner. Tell her how you feel, then give her a chance to explain how she feels.

For me, yes, it felt strange for my son to go from being super close to me to being super close to his spouse. I miss the closeness we used to share but I'm glad he's happy and has found his person. And I gained another child (his spouse), so that's a positive. And I'm hoping to be a grandmother some day!

Wow!!  I am impressed.  How were you able to end up coming back from your SIL trying to sabotage your wedding?  Why did his wife have a problem with you asking your brother/her husband to walk you down the aisle?

I was thinking about addressing that I felt surprised that she would expect me not to attend the engagement celebration dinner however a lot of other posters on here are saying it's completely normal for a parent and child to celebrate this alone. That being said I think considering the majority of posters are saying that's a normal thing it's probably best to just move on from it and not address it with my MIL.  Now if she continues to have a lot of dinners where I am excluded or continues to make passive aggressive remarks either about me or to my face then I will have a politely worded "clear the air" conversation with her.  However I am going to follow the advice of other posters and just move on from this incident and interact with my MIL how I always have,

In fact maybe I will reach out to her to offer to treat her to lunch the following weekend just her and I.  This can show her I am trying to extend the olive branch and that I value my relationship with her as well.  That way it doesn't look as one sided.  Like I am expecting her to reach out to me but I am not reaching out to her.