Big problem with ex-wife and daughters mother

[Coily]

Good on you for insisting on being part of your daughter’s mental health service. And more importantly good for you on having this uncomfortable conversation with your ex. 
 

I think there was far too much unfair pressure on you to genuflect by people who didn’t know the context of what caused the problem with your ex. It really sounds like you two finally had to listen to each other, and hopefully going forward you will continue to do so.

Honestly other than posting this issue where your ex could read it, I think it’s vitally important for co-parents to get outside perspectives. Maybe more discrete in future, but fathers need more support than most are willing to give.

Keep the conversations open and productive, and remember your daughter is the focus for both of you.

[Whirling D]

2 hours ago, Batya33 said:

No IMHO it doesn't justify as a parent of a teenager doing it in this way. There are ways to get it out that don't involve what you did -  As parents we often have to make those tough sacrifices. And not just parents of course -professionally as well.

I am glad you resolved things. I'm sorry you so badly needed to be "validated" for what you did but she seems to be amenable to resolving this.  I know you're experiencing a difficult time and I am sorry.

Thank you, Bat.

you know, a lot of people on here seem annoyed that I felt OK putting this out on a public platform. People have different tolerances for that kind of thing, and when I look at the risk assessment, I don’t feel it to be that high. I guess I may be a little bit more of a risk taker than some in that regard. I just don’t feel like there’s anything to really hide about myself, or even about my kid. There’s a little likelihood that anybody’s going to trace it back to my kid, or even to me.  I’m usually pretty careful not to reveal identities, etc., and it would take someone really working hard to trace it back to my kid. Really hard, I think. And why would they do that? She’s a 15-year-old kid with nothing to offer anyone, except for perhaps a predator, and why would a predator be on a parenting page on Facebook?

On the other hand, Facebook is a bit wonky and I think has a terrible algorithm for privacy. For example, countless times, my own mother has been upset with me because she will read something on a Facebook post that I write on that has nothing to do with her… And she gets upset because of something nasty that I wrote in response to someone saying something about political topics that I think it’s absurd.  
 

Facebook should have a way of controlling that, but they don’t, and I sometimes forget and write something that can be a bit unnerving to someone I know. This is one of those cases.

even before this, I was trying to be more careful about what I say, because of the possibility somebody I know is going to see it in some strange algorithm. This time I slipped. I don’t think it’s a big deal. I did hurt somebody that I cared about, and for that I am regretful and sorry. I’m not really sorry that I wrote it, I am more sorry that it hurt someone I care about. If that makes any sense.  
 

i’ve been on this enotalone platform for a couple of years, and I remember going on and on about a girl that I was dating that I’m quite certain was an undiagnosed borderline personality disorder… you may remember this.  I was a complete basket case for about a year.  And I did take some heat when I described what I was experiencing, and was engaging in a bit of armchair psychology.
 

There are people that don’t appreciate when someone on a forum says derogatory things about people they know.  I do get that, but there are times that I think that writing something, on what is presumably a relatively safe space, is a good way to get out some of that negative energy without sending it out into the physical world, if you will.  Again, people seem to have different tolerances and expectations for different ways of managing things.  
 

My ex-wife‘s tolerance for that kind of thing are very low. She seems to believe that it could be traced back to her and that someone might actually think that she was a bad mom, or that her boyfriend is a bad dude. I think that’s pretty silly, but that’s what she thought, and I have to try to respect that moving forward.  Although I’m doing the same thing now, and saying something potentially derogatory about my ex-wife.  Geesh.  Can I not say anything anymore?  🤣

thank you, as usual, for engaging.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Seraphim]

Are you serious ????? Why would a predator be on a Facebook parenting page are you kidding????!!! Where do you think they hunt? They are EVERYWHERE they can find at risk kids. What if someone who knows your daughter sees it ?? Your ex-wife is correct and you’re very naïve. 

[Whirling D]

2 hours ago, Coily said:

Good on you for insisting on being part of your daughter’s mental health service. And more importantly good for you on having this uncomfortable conversation with your ex. 
 

I think there was far too much unfair pressure on you to genuflect by people who didn’t know the context of what caused the problem with your ex. It really sounds like you two finally had to listen to each other, and hopefully going forward you will continue to do so.

Honestly other than posting this issue where your ex could read it, I think it’s vitally important for co-parents to get outside perspectives. Maybe more discrete in future, but fathers need more support than most are willing to give.

Keep the conversations open and productive, and remember your daughter is the focus for both of you.

Thank you, Coily.  That’s a very thoughtful and supportive thing to say.

I’m not feeling any huge sense of pride for hurting my ex wife. She is important to me, and I told her that today. I also told her that I have a lot of regard for many of the decisions that she’s made recently in regard to coparenting, and that’s how I feel. I think she needed to hear that, and I thought it was important that I gather the courage to say those things to her. I think it made a difference.

But I also think you are correct… Dad‘s need good portals to sometimes just vent. It’s not always easy, because we are expected to keep everything under control, including our emotions. Everybody on here knows that I’m pretty sensitive, and my emotions can sometimes be a vortex of unpredictability. Sometimes, online forums are where I go to either give some feedback to someone on a topic that I may have experienced, which is exactly what I was doing, or to get something else off my chest. I think they are valuable for that reason. 

That being said, this episode has given me a reason for concern about even saying stuff on social media at all, which is kind of frustrating, really. 
 

Thank you for your thoughts!

 

 

[Seraphim]

I am on multiple different Facebook pages and I know multiple people that cross those multiple Facebook pages and they are all about different subjects. And they are not personal friends of mine. I just noticed that they are on these different pages and they don’t know me and I don’t know them. So if you think this is just some anonymous body and nobody knows and nobody’s ever going to see, that’s a joke.

[Whirling D]

3 minutes ago, Seraphim said:

Are you serious ????? Why would a predator be on a Facebook parenting page are you kidding????!!! Where do you think they hunt? They are EVERYWHERE they can find at risk kids. What if someone who knows your daughter sees it ?? Your ex-wife is correct and you’re very naïve. 

I don’t think so. That’s a bit like saying that I shouldn’t let my kid walk through the mall by herself, because the likelihood of there being a predator in the local mall is likely exponentially higher than it would be on a limited parenting Facebook page.

that may be a bit of a stretch, but I think you know what I mean. I personally don’t think that there is a huge amount of risk saying something like I did on a private Facebook group, despite the lousy algorithms. I’m not going to go out of my way to do that again, and it was a bit of a shortsighted thing to do. 

Now I feel a bit handcuffed to be able to not say anything on these pages, and I know there’s a way enable your posting to not have your name on it, but I was trying to look for today and couldn’t find it, and thus, I couldn’t comment on something that I thought might be useful and relevant.  

[Whirling D]

3 minutes ago, Seraphim said:

I am on multiple different Facebook pages and I know multiple people that cross those multiple Facebook pages and they are all about different subjects. And they are not personal friends of mine. I just noticed that they are on these different pages and they don’t know me and I don’t know them. So if you think this is just some anonymous body and nobody knows and nobody’s ever going to see, that’s a joke.

So if they don’t know you, and you don’t know them, why would anybody really care? The likelihood that they would turn out to be someone with mal intent is probably quite low. Extremely low, I think.

additionally, there is zero about my daughter on any of my Facebook profiles or business accounts, except for my last name, and I don’t even live in the same town as my daughter does most of the time.

I suppose, in a stretch, some creep could take my name off of my Facebook profile and Google my address, and stalk the house.  That’s probably about a 10,000 to one chance, and I don’t spend a lot of my time worrying about those kinds of chances.

ironically, I spend a lot more of my time worrying about the fact that my daughter storms out the door from the school we were working at and decides she wants to walk home in the dark along the highway in town to go to her mothers house about a 10 minute walk away. What’s the chance she would get hit, or abducted? Fairly astronomically low, but I would deny her that possibility way more than I would worry about somebody finding out about her through a Facebook posting.

But that’s just my tolerance. Not everybody else is going to agree with that. my ex-wife certainly did not, and she made her point clear, and I will try to respect that.  

[Seraphim]

4 minutes ago, Whirling D said:

I don’t think so. That’s a bit like saying that I shouldn’t let my kid walk through the mall by herself, because the likelihood of there being a predator in the local mall is likely exponentially higher than it would be on a limited parenting Facebook page.

that may be a bit of a stretch, but I think you know what I mean. I personally don’t think that there is a huge amount of risk saying something like I did on a private Facebook group, despite the lousy algorithms. I’m not going to go out of my way to do that again, and it was a bit of a shortsighted thing to do. 

Now I feel a bit handcuffed to be able to not say anything on these pages, and I know there’s a way enable your posting to not have your name on it, but I was trying to look for today and couldn’t find it, and thus, I couldn’t comment on something that I thought might be useful and relevant.  

There is a feature on Facebook it’s called ,”group member anonymous post”. And as someone who was hunted by a predator as a child, I don’t see it as a far off Oopsie doopsie. I know exactly where predators hunt . 

[boltnrun]

I'm confused. If you posted this anonymously on Facebook how did your ex wife know it was you?

And like I mentioned, my cousin's husband posts on swinging and masturbation Facebook pages which I do not frequent nor am I a member of those groups, yet his posts appear on my news feed. So anyone who's friends with you on Facebook and who follows your posts would have seen it. 

Are you and your daughter "friends" on Facebook?

[Wiseman2]

10 hours ago, Whirling D said:

 my daughter storms out the door from the school we were working at and decides she wants to walk home in the dark along the highway in town to go to her mothers house about a 10 minute walk away. 

It seems like you and her mother have some things to sort out. It's good you came together to help your daughter with her issues.

Although it's your 'right' to post whatever you want on social media, your misuse of it is backfiring on you so rethink your settings and content.

[Batya33]

10 hours ago, Seraphim said:

Are you serious ????? Why would a predator be on a Facebook parenting page are you kidding????!!! Where do you think they hunt? They are EVERYWHERE they can find at risk kids. What if someone who knows your daughter sees it ?? Your ex-wife is correct and you’re very naïve. 

I agree and that is my response too if any is needed to the OP's long post above.

There is no excuse for posting as the OP described it.  Is it forgiveable -I mean -I think so -but only with a sincere apology and accountability otherwise this sort of situation is likely to recur and be worse next time. I've had to restrain myself many times from letting it all out as you describe because of my role as parent and employee of a place where it's best to restrict yourself even on "personal" social media (over the last few years we've been encouraged to connect on LinkedIn and my employer has an FB page which I visit, click like, etc.)

I am on a local area moms group with I believe thousands of members.  Years ago a question was asked about commute times/traffic related to moving to my area.  I posted that I had a colleague who did that commute and who had shared with me that it was a challenge.  I use my name.  I didn't mention her name or any details. 

I did not know at that time she was on that group-never occurred to me even that anyone else would know her -naive of me!.  She posted back "I am the colleague she is  referring to and she is right!"  It was a wake up call.  Obviously what I wrote was fine.  But -wow -out of thousands -she was there, she saw my post, she figured out it was she.  Imagine if by "mistake" I'd posted something remotely personal/inappropriate. 

I don't make those mistakes.  It's hard because sometimes I literally have to walk away from an upsetting post or comment.  But I do.  It's not worth it.  OP -in your situation it's really not worth it no matter how much you twist things or argue about it or mention fancy words like algorithm.  I saw you said something like you're not going to go "out of your way to post" again - I'd take a much much stronger stance with yourself with a no excuses standard even if it means not being on that particular group if it's too tempting.

[Whirling D]

16 hours ago, Seraphim said:

There is a feature on Facebook it’s called ,”group member anonymous post”. And as someone who was hunted by a predator as a child, I don’t see it as a far off Oopsie doopsie. I know exactly where predators hunt . 

I looked for that feature, because I know it exists, and I know you can use it when you create a post, but I couldn’t find how to answer or reply to a post using that feature.

[Cherylyn]

Should you continue thinking how you do and taking action upon it,  don't be surprised as your daughter and your ex-wife continue to alienate you. 

If you want a normal,  healthy,  close father-daughter relationship with your daughter and a peaceful rapport with your ex-wife,  you have to do a 180 by improving your behavior otherwise you'll continue to set yourself up for unnecessary tension between the three of you and do you want that? 

Do the right thing by being a good guy.  Don't be messy.  People avoid messy people because messy people are risky,  dangerous,  not admired and disrespected.  Is this the type of example you want to set as a father to your daughter?  It's time to grow up and be a man. 

[Whirling D]

I am still unclear about private Facebook groups. It’s always been my understanding that to even see something that anyone has posted, you have to be a member of the group. No?

Yes, my ex-wife is a member of that group, because I invited her to be a part of the group a week earlier, but forgot that I had done that. I am on many groups.

yes, my daughter has a Facebook profile, but doesn’t use the platform much at all. I’m not really worried about that, and I’m not entirely worried about her even reading my post.

She loves her mother, as I’m sure she does me, but she would probably tell you that we both drive her crazy. I don’t think she would even disagree with anything that I wrote on that reply, but I would have little interest in sharing that information with her one way or the other.  
 

I do feel like I have simmered down in that regard over about the last three years.  I used to complain to my daughter about her mother once in a while, in moments of weakness, but I don’t really do that much anymore. I suspect both my ex-wife and I complain about each other a little bit, but I don’t think it amounts to much.

 

 

 

 

[Whirling D]

3 minutes ago, Cherylyn said:

Should you continue thinking how you do and taking action upon it,  don't be surprised as your daughter and your ex-wife continue to alienate you. 

If you want a normal,  healthy,  close father-daughter relationship with your daughter and a peaceful rapport with your ex-wife,  you have to do a 180 by improving your behavior otherwise you'll continue to set yourself up for unnecessary tension between the three of you and do you want that? 

Do the right thing by being a good guy.  Don't be messy.  People avoid messy people because messy people are risky,  dangerous,  not admired and disrespected.  Is this the type of example you want to set as a father to your daughter?  It's time to grow up and be a man. 

Seriously? No offense, but you really have no idea whether I’m a good dad or not. You are going to make that judgment by one posting on a Facebook platform, and anything I’ve said here?

Where is the goodness in that?

I do just fine with my own kid, and for the most part with my ex-wife, as well. I’m not perfect, but I do OK.

 

[Coily]

6 minutes ago, Cherylyn said:

  It's time to grow up and be a man. 

Wow really? Really? This is insufferable, you know nothing about the man. Have you not heard don't snap lest ye be snapped?

[Cherylyn]

1 minute ago, Whirling D said:

Seriously? No offense, but you really have no idea whether I’m a good dad or not. You are going to make that judgment by one posting on a Facebook platform, and anything I’ve said here?

Where is the goodness in that?

I do just fine with my own kid, and for the most part with my ex-wife, as well. I’m not perfect, but I do OK.

 

If you're a good dad,  actions speak louder than words.  Be careful.  Tread lightly.  Confer with your ex-wife privately if you have concerns;  not on social media.  This is out of respect for your daughter and the mother of your child.  You're not perfect but learn from your mistakes and try to be near as perfect as possible because don't you think it's in your best interest to set a fine example as a great father to your daughter?  She is observing your behavior and you're teaching her what type of man she wants to marry someday.  Possessing exemplary behavior to your ex-wife will definitely improve your relationships and rapport with them.  Your goal is to have a close,  peaceful relationship with your daughter and cordial rapport with your ex-wife.  In order to do that,  it starts with you and how you behave.  If you don't want stress,  angst and strife or alienation with them,  then don't set yourself up for their negative reaction in the first place.  It's not rocket science. 

[Cherylyn]

3 minutes ago, Coily said:

Wow really? Really? This is insufferable, you know nothing about the man. Have you not heard don't snap lest ye be snapped?

I meant if he desires a normal, close, loving,  father-daughter relationship and a cordial rapport with his ex-wife, it's time to man up and do the right thing by conferring privately with them regarding family matters instead of FB / social media if it's not anonymous.  Don't anger people if you want peace with them.  Keep the peace by being prudent.

[boltnrun]

55 minutes ago, Whirling D said:

It’s always been my understanding that to even see something that anyone has posted, you have to be a member of the group. No?

Not true.

Like I wrote previously, I am certainly not a member of the "private" swinging or masturbation groups my cousin's husband posts on but I (unfortunately) see what he posts in those groups. 

There is no such thing as "private" on social media platforms or anything you post online, really. 

[Cherylyn]

@Coily / @Whirling D  If my ex-husband had issues with me,  I would prefer to have a private conversation with him regarding these concerns or issues and any conversation regarding our daughter should also be a private conversation. 

If posts are anonymous, I'd be OK with that. 

When there are identities,  names and the like,  then no,  I wouldn't want the family's dirty laundry aired on social media out of respect for my family's privacy. 

[Coily]

5 minutes ago, Cherylyn said:

@Coily / @Whirling D  If my ex-husband had issues with me,  I would prefer to have a private conversation with him regarding these concerns or issues and any conversation regarding our daughter should also be a private conversation. 

If posts are anonymous, I'd be OK with that. 

When there are identities,  names and the like,  then no,  I wouldn't want the family's dirty laundry aired on social media out of respect for my family's privacy. 

Then maybe you should have lead with that and left the sexist "man up" drivel. You want to get a point across, don't be an insufferable sexist. Plenty of other posters here gave the same advice without insulting the OP with childish bra snapping attitudes.

[Cherylyn]

38 minutes ago, Coily said:

Then maybe you should have lead with that and left the sexist "man up" drivel. You want to get a point across, don't be an insufferable sexist. Plenty of other posters here gave the same advice without insulting the OP with childish bra snapping attitudes.

@Coily "Man up" is an ubiquitous metaphor which means a real man is honorable.  It's not sexist.  It's a figure of speech.  For example,  a strong father figure in a son's life teaches him how to be a man meaning how to respect women in particular.  I've observed the difference.  My husband grew up with a strong father figure and instead of lectures,  he set a fine example.  My husband is the same as his late father as he followed his footsteps in every way whether it's being a handyman at the home front,  responsible, HONORABLE  father and husband and knowing how to respect women.  (Of course, respect everyone men and children included but I'm referring to a lot of men who don't respect women in particular.) 

Unfortunately,  I've observed a lot of men who grew up without a strong father figure in their life and ended up not having a fine example regarding how a man should behave not only toward others but to women in particular.  Why?  Because they've never observed how women (or mothers / daughters / sisters) should be treated with respect.  It started with their home life.  Hence, their minds and actions go wayward.  Granted, not all fatherless sons grow up this way but unfortunately,  many of them do.  Look at a lot of broken families,  the jail system,  the prison population,  gangs, etc.  The majority of them:  Fatherless without proper guidance.

There are successful stories of mothers going it alone and doing a great job.  However,  I see it in my own fatherless brother.  He's a good guy but there's something missing because he didn't have a strong father figure in his life.  He doesn't know how to do anything and rather helpless unlike my husband who can fix anything because his father taught him and in addition,  his father treated his mother like a queen.  

It becomes generation to generation. 

I agree, my cousin's husband snapping the back of my bra strap twice in one morning after my husband and I treated them to an expensive brunch was predatory behavior.  Upon confronting my cousin about what her husband did to me years earlier, her husband sexually harassed her mother,  stepmother, an aunt whom we share,  her friends,  neighbor and niece.  Childish?  Hmmm.  My husband would say otherwise.  Misogyny and pariah would be more like it. 

[Cherylyn]

@Coily 😄

[Coily]

@CherylynYou are a boorish ans sexist bully and you seem to revel in it. The OP deserved better than such low quality gaslighting advice.

OP My sincere apologies for derailing this very important topic with personal beefs. Just seeing someone get bullied and insulted, who is going through turmoil makes me rather disgusted. I unfortunately let that get the better of me, knowing that it would just result in paragraphs of tedious and repetitious insults.

To the Other readers and Mods, I also apologize. This has become silly and tedious, I have not lived up to my personal standards of trying to help the OPs and not devolving into an egotistical fight with questionable morals and character.

[Seraphim]

What I am saying is you weren’t taking this risk for ONLY YOURSELF. You made the choice to include other people. 
 

Also any Counsellor will tell you to never never never badmouth the other parent to a child. It demeans the child and destroys their esteem . My dad used to demean our mother to me and my brother and we grew to hate him. Kids aren’t kids forever and they remember everything. For reference my son is 25 and I have seen mistakes in parenting come home to roost at time .