Together but separate

[Rosie]

Hi everyone,

Please help with sharing what you think about this. I've been with my boyfriend for three years and most of the time I always had a "should I stay should I go" question in my mind mostly due to the gap between our standard levels. His are much lower then mine. I took the decision twice to break up, but then got back together...Things can be great. He asked me to move in with him but his house is a mess with poor living conditions as he's been renovating it ever since we've met. He makes good money, but the work takes time away from being able to upkeep his house and too tired to continuously work after a 8 to12 hour shift. The money isn't quite enough to hire a crew to finish the house. He is divorced and has a young daughter who has a mental disability. My issue is that I do not want to give up my nice house to move in, and  don't want to give up my dreams of having a house with plenty of space and neighbors somewhere in the distance, not 8 feet away like in the neighborhood he doesn't want to leave. He can't move in with me because there's too much of a distance between  the daughter's school and mother's house. I love him but at times I think this is not at my level. He tries hard to reach my level, and feel like it is still worth it to try, but other times I feel like giving up, and go on on my own. There are a lot more upsides and downsides that play an important role in both positive and negative ways. Lately i have been avoiding to be at his house because of the mess. I help him de-clutter but after a week it's like nothing happened, as he doesn't seem to upkeep the organization.I don't know what to do... 

[Wiseman2]

3 minutes ago, Rosie said:

I took the decision twice to break up, but then got back together.. his house is a mess with poor living conditions  He is divorced and has a young daughter who has a mental disability.  I help him de-clutter but after a week it's like nothing happened, 

Sorry this is happening. On/off relationships are fraught with unresolved chronic conflicts combined with unhealthy attachment.

You're not compatible and he seems to have a tractor-trailer of baggage he won't take care of. Do not clean or help fix his house. There's no future here, sorry to say.

[DarkCh0c0]

I agree. On/off relationships are a sign of major incompatibilities.

Aside of that, none of you wants to find a housing compromise which is telling that you both don't and maybe can't go to the next step. You've had enough ups and downs with him now, and you know that love is not enough and that you need a different person in your life.

You know what to do.

[Rosie]

Unfortunately you are right...it's just hard when he doesn't let me go...

[DarkCh0c0]

Then you have to limit contact, put some boundaries and distance yourself. I'm sure you're up to the task.

You're wasting both of your time the longer you stay. And, you're missing out on better matches!

[Wiseman2]

2 minutes ago, Rosie said:

Unfortunately you are right...it's just hard when he doesn't let me go...

You'll have to cut the cord. People who generate clutter and manufacture chaos are people who'll make your life a living hell. Hoarding in itself is a mental illness but often combined with many other issues. It usually gets worse.

[Rosie]

9 minutes ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

Then you have to limit contact, put some boundaries and distance yourself. I'm sure you're up to the task.

You're wasting both of your time the longer you stay. And, you're missing out on better matches!

Yes, thank you for the encouragement. I know that's what I have to do...

[Rosie]

15 minutes ago, DarkCh0c0 said:

I agree. On/off relationships are a sign of major incompatibilities.

Aside of that, none of you wants to find a housing compromise which is telling that you both don't and maybe can't go to the next step. You've had enough ups and downs with him now, and you know that love is not enough and that you need a different person in your life.

You know what to do.

I offered  solutions to be somewhere half way but no use because the damn kid's mother would need to make the drive

[Rose Mosse]

The "damn kid's mother" will always  be in your life if you're in this relationship so if you have reservations about her you'd best be on your way. He doesn't seem to be at the same point you are in your life so move on. You're building a lot of resentment by staying. 

[DancingFool]

1 hour ago, Rosie said:

I help him de-clutter but after a week it's like nothing happened, as he doesn't seem to upkeep the organization.I don't know what to do... 

You know what to do - leave him. For whatever reason, you keep spinning your wheels wasting more and more of your time and life on this hoping that he will magically change.

You and him are not compatible when it comes to something so fundamental as lifestyle and living conditions and no amount of helping and organizing on your end is going to change who he is. He is comfortable with the chaos and the clutter and you are the opposite and that's that. You have seen him living like this for 3 years. More than enough time to stop with the excuses and realize that this is just who he is and how he prefers to live. This is what a deal breaker looks like. Now stop trying to twist yourself to make it work because it never will. 

If you were to give up your house and move into this mess, it would literally be the worst decision of your life. 

[Batya33]

Please don't stay involved with anyone who you feel superior to and who is not at the same "level" as you -and especially if you would refer to his child as the damn kid.  Perhaps you are not at his level when it comes to making choices to act in the best interests of his child - can you imagine the level his values are at if he's willing to live in a neighborhood that is his second choice for his daughter's comfort and convenience? I know you don't have a child -I mean you can't relate to why he is doing this for his "damn kid" so apparently you're not at his level, generally, when it comes to making choices for the benefit of another human being you are responsible for.  

You and he are incompatible.  You see living with clutter as lower level than you.  You think he needs to elevate himself to your level.  He doesn't seem to be the sort of person who has this mindset about levels, superiority, etc.  I know of many individuals who have neat homes and and who have cluttered homes and it's a choice of how to live - nothing to do with levels. 

Certainly someone living in a situation that is dangerous because it is cluttered may not have the same level of responsibility as someone who lives in a home that is safe to live in but this is a hardworking man, a father, who doesn't value having a neat home. 

You do and you value living in a certain type of home in a certain type of neighborhood and you would prioritize this over the "damn kid" as you put it.  Hmmmmm. 

That's fine but then make sure the next person you date shares your priorities (hint -maybe don't get involved with someone with a child as many parents have geographical restrictions on where they can live).  

[boltnrun]

His child is his priority. That doesn't mean his "level" is below yours. (What is this "level" stuff anyway? Is it a way for you to judge who's worthy of your attention and company?)

For a while I lived in a crappy, tiny, dark studio apartment in a bad area. I wasn't "low level", it just was all I could afford at the time. I lived in a bad area another time for two years because I needed to find a rental in a hurry, and then I needed to buy a car. Again, I had a good job with a good company and kept myself clean. I was not "low level".

Perhaps you need to make a "level" checklist and look for men who you feel are on or above your "level". But please let this guy go because you feel he's on a low "level" and you obviously don't respect him.

[Rosie]

40 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Please don't stay involved with anyone who you feel superior to and who is not at the same "level" as you -and especially if you would refer to his child as the damn kid.  Perhaps you are not at his level when it comes to making choices to act in the best interests of his child - can you imagine the level his values are at if he's willing to live in a neighborhood that is his second choice for his daughter's comfort and convenience? I know you don't have a child -I mean you can't relate to why he is doing this for his "damn kid" so apparently you're not at his level, generally, when it comes to making choices for the benefit of another human being you are responsible for.  

You and he are incompatible.  You see living with clutter as lower level than you.  You think he needs to elevate himself to your level.  He doesn't seem to be the sort of person who has this mindset about levels, superiority, etc.  I know of many individuals who have neat homes and and who have cluttered homes and it's a choice of how to live - nothing to do with levels. 

Certainly someone living in a situation that is dangerous because it is cluttered may not have the same level of responsibility as someone who lives in a home that is safe to live in but this is a hardworking man, a father, who doesn't value having a neat home. 

You do and you value living in a certain type of home in a certain type of neighborhood and you would prioritize this over the "damn kid" as you put it.  Hmmmmm. 

That's fine but then make sure the next person you date shares your priorities (hint -maybe don't get involved with someone with a child as many parents have geographical restrictions on where they can live).  

I was reffering to the damn mother not the kid. A 15 minute difference shouldn't be a problem. If there's a will there's a way

[Wiseman2]

3 hours ago, Rosie said:

He can't move in with me because there's too much of a distance between  the daughter's school and mother's house.

Never let a hoarder move into your house. They tend to trash things.

You're incompatible on many levels. Perhaps you're angry you overinvested and feel let down, but he will never get better.

Your life would be a nightmare of filth, disease, insects, odors and toxicity. Not to mention having to play housekeeper and nanny to someone who just doesn't care about himself or his environment.

Do yourself a favor and end it for good this time..

[Rosie]

1 hour ago, Batya33 said:

Please don't stay involved with anyone who you feel superior to and who is not at the same "level" as you -and especially if you would refer to his child as the damn kid.  Perhaps you are not at his level when it comes to making choices to act in the best interests of his child - can you imagine the level his values are at if he's willing to live in a neighborhood that is his second choice for his daughter's comfort and convenience? I know you don't have a child -I mean you can't relate to why he is doing this for his "damn kid" so apparently you're not at his level, generally, when it comes to making choices for the benefit of another human being you are responsible for.  

You and he are incompatible.  You see living with clutter as lower level than you.  You think he needs to elevate himself to your level.  He doesn't seem to be the sort of person who has this mindset about levels, superiority, etc.  I know of many individuals who have neat homes and and who have cluttered homes and it's a choice of how to live - nothing to do with levels. 

Certainly someone living in a situation that is dangerous because it is cluttered may not have the same level of responsibility as someone who lives in a home that is safe to live in but this is a hardworking man, a father, who doesn't value having a neat home. 

You do and you value living in a certain type of home in a certain type of neighborhood and you would prioritize this over the "damn kid" as you put it.  Hmmmmm. 

That's fine but then make sure the next person you date shares your priorities (hint -maybe don't get involved with someone with a child as many parents have geographical restrictions on where they can live).  

I like the kid, I was referring to the mother. I do know about prioritizing children, I definitely took that in consideration, I just cant write down all the details. Honestly I prioritize the child all the time, and I do see the values that are trully amazing, as that's what kept me in the relationship, however my heart is breaking no matter what direction I take

[DancingFool]

48 minutes ago, Rosie said:

I was reffering to the damn mother not the kid. A 15 minute difference shouldn't be a problem. If there's a will there's a way

And there you go. She is entrenched, he is entrenched, and nobody wants to do or live in any other way....except you. In this situation, you are the odd woman out.

Again, if it was 3 months he is living in fixer upper chaos and general clutter, you could give him the benefit of the doubt. However, it's been 3 years. What you see is what you get. He is not going to change and become a different man. Consider that there is a reason he is divorced and you are seeing why.

I know it's hard, but stop living like he is the last man on earth. Let go and move on. You really can do better.

[Rosie]

6 minutes ago, DancingFool said:

And there you go. She is entrenched, he is entrenched, and nobody wants to do or live in any other way....except you. In this situation, you are the odd woman out.

Again, if it was 3 months he is living in fixer upper chaos and general clutter, you could give him the benefit of the doubt. However, it's been 3 years. What you see is what you get. He is not going to change and become a different man. Consider that there is a reason he is divorced and you are seeing why.

I know it's hard, but stop living like he is the last man on earth. Let go and move on. You really can do better.

Except for she did move away and the transportation is on her terms and his convenience

[Rosie]

Oh and also, he did progress with the house it's just very little in this amount of time

[DancingFool]

9 minutes ago, Rosie said:

Except for she did move away and the transportation is on her terms and his convenience

So again, they are entrenched in their life on their terms and you are the odd woman out.

4 minutes ago, Rosie said:

Oh and also, he did progress with the house it's just very little in this amount of time

Whyyyyy do you keep trying to make excuses? It's been 3 years!!!!! Look, if he was a man who wants a clean home and an ordered life, his house would have been fixed up a long time ago. This includes even daily life things.

You keep grasping at straws....whyyyy..... Again... he is not the last man on this earth. You can soooo do better. Come on.

[Wiseman2]

Unfortunately you may be afraid to let go for what's called a "Sunk Cost Fallacy":

Quote

the phenomenon whereby a person is reluctant to abandon a strategy or course of action because they have invested heavily in it, even when it is clear that abandonment would be more beneficial.

 

[Rosie]

1 minute ago, DancingFool said:

So again, they are entrenched in their life on their terms and you are the odd woman out.

Whyyyyy do you keep trying to make excuses? It's been 3 years!!!!! Look, if he was a man who wants a clean home and an ordered life, his house would have been fixed up a long time ago. This includes even daily life things.

You keep grasping at straws....whyyyy..... Again... he is not the last man on this earth. You can soooo do better. 

Yes, these are true words and good advice. My mind is there, and my heart will be too, it just sucks...

[gamon]

He's a disorganized slob.

Even if you find a way to work out the logistics, you'll be living in his mess or constantly cleaning up after him.

Who knows maybe it's worth it to you.

 

[smackie9]

He is who he is, and you can't do anything to change that...but you can change BFs. You have done all you can, and IMO you should never have to sacrifice your standard of living just because things are sometimes great with this guy. You can do better hun. Plenty of nice men out there that are more suitable. 

[Batya33]

5 hours ago, Rosie said:

I was reffering to the damn mother not the kid. A 15 minute difference shouldn't be a problem. If there's a will there's a way

It is a difference to her. It would be to me.  The days that my son's school bus is late - even 15 minutes -can throw me off with all I need to get done. My husband doesn't want to move where his commute could be lengthened by 15 minutes each way -time is money, driving is stressful, and there's so little time as it is to get everything done and have time to breathe.  He's chosen to accommodate her because he doesn't want to rock the boat with his access to and relationship with his child.  That's totally his call.  

[Rose Mosse]

4 hours ago, Rosie said:

Except for she did move away and the transportation is on her terms and his convenience

It may not feel good now but it's a good wake up call and I mean this in kindness not in a way to make you feel badly because you as the new girlfriend will always come second to the needs of his children or or what he wants for his children. Sometimes that also involves the input of the child(ren)'s mother or other parent coming above your needs or wishes or wants. They may have agreements as coparents between themselves that you aren't aware of or details he doesn't tell you about to burden you. 

In any case that he doesn't involve you too much or that you feel this put out and unhappy does say a lot about your relationship and it's too lopsided. You have a lot to offer someone else so why not set yourself free and find someone who is more on the same page as you.

I'm not sure what you mean by he "doesn't let you go". If someone cares about you deeply they'd be able to sense just how unhappy you are. If he can't do that or let you go, he's a very selfish and singleminded man. It's all the more reason why you might want to go.

Edited April 18 by Rose Mosse