Is it normal for a man to keep expecting money from a woman?

[pinkrose2021]

Hi all

Please be kind:)

I started seeing a guy earlier this year - we met on a dating app, he was really interested in me. I kept pushing him back, but eventually gave in.

We got along really well, and were committed really quickly.

First month, he was super warm, and then started pushing me away - I wondered at the time what had changed.

Having established myself financially, I wanted to make sure he was not left behind, so I encouraged him to purchase a property, and given I work in real estate I started helping him out, and spent countless hours on this. Whilst I work really long hours, there was this expectation that no matter what, I would deliver to him on this, and speak to him as and when required.

At the 1 month mark, he mentioned that his business was struggling. This was not an issue for me as such, going out with someone - I wasn't looking for money or how much they have, I was looking for someone who cares for me.

We went out for 3 months.

In the 2nd month he asked me if I could contribute $200 - $300 toward a course, which I refused, as he has savings.

Then he said that for his birthday he wanted me to pay for a doctor's appointment. When I mentioned to my family and friends, they were horrified. I told him I couldn't do this for him, and I wanted to decide for myself what to get for his birthday. At the time he got so annoyed at me that he cancelled lunch on me.

In the 3 months we went out, I saw him 6 times only. He was always too busy, and his priority was study (as he was doing a university degree). In those 3 months he cancelled me a number of times.

We broke up. He didn't even see my last set of messages to him for weeks - apparently he was 'scared' - not sure scared of what.

I missed him a lot, and we started speaking again after a couple of months apart. He told me he loved me...

I had an appointment near his way, so we decided to catch up. We planned this catch up over a long period of time and I was really looking forward to it.

After the catch up he started acting really weird, it took 2 weeks of asking what was wrong with him and what had happened and how he wasn't being the same. He said that apparently when we caught up he didn't have the 'right vibes' when it came to paying for lunch and that I (ie me) didn't seem to want to pay - which I find rather bizarre. I had assumed I would pay (he had made a point in the past that I must pay for every time we go out). He started acting weird pretty much the day we caught up. I am not sure how he made all this up, and how he felt this way.

He was also annoyed that I offered to pay for a package which got stolen from his mail box the day we caught up - I did this because when we were together my makeup had rubbed off his white shirt and he had made a big deal out of it and had told me he was struggling and couldn't afford to take it to a laundromat (note - he had specially taken a picture of this the night we caught up, and sent it to me the next day) - I had just reacted based off my previous experience with him. There was another thing he raised...but I won't add here, as its complicated.

I wanted us to go on a trip as friends, but he told me he couldn't go halves and expected me to pay for the entire overseas trip as I am doing well financially.

I have worked very hard over the last decade or so, and paid a big price to be where I am financially. I do like nice things, and do spend on nice dresses and shoes. He complained how I didn't have the light-heartedness to spend on him, like I do for myself. I asked if he was my fiancé or husband that I am expected to do these things for him?

Note though in this time I knew him - he never once got me flowers or did anything for me vs what I was doing for him (investing my time and resources helping set him up with a property purchase). My family could see that he was barely doing anything for me, whilst I spent hours on his well being.

THEN, shortly after the last heated chat messages, he came back and asked me to lend him $600 - he was testing me as he wanted to show something was wrong with me - he had lent $600 to his ex girlfriend. I told him that he was saying this after me spending countless hours on him, and wanting his well being. He got really angry and told me he was off the app, and he never saw my last set of messages. This is very typical of him - he did it before when we broke up, and he did it again (even though we were no longer going out, we were speaking every single day, so it has been like a break up).

My research has indicated that he is a narcissist and I am an empath.

I know if I ended up with him for the longer term, he wouldn't care for me or give two hoots about my emotional needs or well being.

I have been blessed with a lot, and I wouldn't mind buying gifts for my partner or doing nice things for them - but in this instance, it seemed forced, whilst he was doing very little for me. I didn't feel emotionally supported.

I am still missing him and care for him. But perhaps we may never speak again. He has locked me out of his life again. Its been 2 weeks. Just like last time, he hasn't seen my last messages.

I can't put a finger on it on how someone could expect financial benefits, when they haven't even committed to you, and continue expecting it after breaking up?

Is it odd for a man to expect this? Btw he is 40yo. I know I should have better self esteem and let him go. I have been pretty inexperienced with relationships as I have been just focussed on career and work for a very long time. All I know is I genuinely cared for him, and wanted to provide emotional support to begin with - but he seems to just measure things I do in dollars - if its not monetary it doesn't count.

Thank you for reading.

[boltnrun]

No, this is not OK. He is apparently a gigolo and expects the woman to pay for his companionship. Also to give him money whenever he asks.

He doesn't "genuinely care" for you. He cares for your money.

You seem nice. You deserve a nice man who isn't trying to just get as much money out of you as possible.

[Tonight.majestic]

He wants you to pay him for his companionship. Is he exceptionally good looking or something? 

[Lambert]

The real question I have is, why are you even dealing with this guy? 

What exactly do you miss about him? 

Don't you think you can find those things in another guy? 

[pinkrose2021]

24 minutes ago, Tonight.majestic said:

He wants you to pay him for his companionship. Is he exceptionally good looking or something? 

No, don't think so 😞

But I liked him just the way he was

[pinkrose2021]

 

48 minutes ago, boltnrun said:

No, this is not OK. He is apparently a gigolo and expects the woman to pay for his companionship. Also to give him money whenever he asks.

He doesn't "genuinely care" for you. He cares for your money.

You seem nice. You deserve a nice man who isn't trying to just get as much money out of you as possible.

Part of me wants to believe he actually cared, but all his actions pointed toward otherwise.

I wanted him to come for a quick medical scan with me after his doctor's appointment, and he said NO, we will have his appointment, then he will drop me at the train station, and I will go to my appointment, as he had to 'study', and that took priority.

[pinkrose2021]

12 minutes ago, Lambert said:

The real question I have is, why are you even dealing with this guy? 

What exactly do you miss about him? 

Don't you think you can find those things in another guy? 

He made an effort initially and really wanted to be with me. I haven't seen another guy make so much effort. I wonder if another guy will make an effort.

I miss the companionship...or may be I wanted to 'rescue' him and feel responsible. I have to say, this really mirrors my childhood on how my biological father was - always 'take take take' but NOT give anything back, or care. Its the familiarity. 

No longer dealing with him as its been 2 weeks now, neither has he viewed my last messages or contacted me. He no longer wants to buy his property, and has given up, so he no longer needs me I guess.

[catfeeder]

57 minutes ago, pinkrose2021 said:

Is it normal for a man to keep expecting money from a woman? 

Yuck. And nope.

The guy sounds like a snot, and I probably wouldn't have tolerated his self-entitled cruelty beyond date 1--if that long.

You will thank yourself sooner rather than later if you'll raise your bar, and drop anyone even remotely like this guy EARLY.

Head high, we all learn by living.

[Lambert]

27 minutes ago, pinkrose2021 said:

He made an effort initially and really wanted to be with me. I haven't seen another guy make so much effort. I wonder if another guy will make an effort.

I miss the companionship...or may be I wanted to 'rescue' him and feel responsible. I have to say, this really mirrors my childhood on how my biological father was - always 'take take take' but NOT give anything back, or care. Its the familiarity. 

No longer dealing with him as its been 2 weeks now, neither has he viewed my last messages or contacted me. He no longer wants to buy his property, and has given up, so he no longer needs me I guess.

I'm sorry your childhood is playing out for you again.  That stinks.

But this is a good learning experience. He manipulated you.  He liked the chase to get you and then to manipulate you into paying and donating your time to him. 

The person you liked did not actually exist.  He is a mess of a person and you are better off.

You should think back to your original feelings.  Why did you ignore your first instinct? that you were not interested in him? 

Focus more on yourself and listening to your gut.  You knew this guy was off. 

[pinkrose2021]

1 hour ago, Lambert said:

I'm sorry your childhood is playing out for you again.  That stinks.

But this is a good learning experience. He manipulated you.  He liked the chase to get you and then to manipulate you into paying and donating your time to him. 

The person you liked did not actually exist.  He is a mess of a person and you are better off.

You should think back to your original feelings.  Why did you ignore your first instinct? that you were not interested in him? 

Focus more on yourself and listening to your gut.  You knew this guy was off. 

It's interesting you say that I knew this guy was off. He was committed to me really quickly, where as I was of two minds for a while. But then I thought he so wants to be with me - so I should be with a man who wants me so much as they will value me all along.

Narcissists have this trait of chasing you, love bombing you, and then back off - this was a classic case 😞 some things I have read, went word for word. They love the initial stages of a relationship, then push you away.

[pinkrose2021]

2 hours ago, catfeeder said:

Yuck. And nope.

The guy sounds like a snot, and I probably wouldn't have tolerated his self-entitled cruelty beyond date 1--if that long.

You will thank yourself sooner rather than later if you'll raise your bar, and drop anyone even remotely like this guy EARLY.

Head high, we all learn by living.

Hope so too - just want to process my feelings, and stop missing him 😞 

[greendots]

I would honestly reflect on why you'd miss someone who treated you like rubbish.

3 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

I haven't seen another guy make so much effort. I wonder if another guy will make an effort.

Trust that you're worth it and that there are other guys in this world who will be willing to go the extra mile for you. 🙂

[MissCanuck]

I'm sorry, OP. 

This guy is a user, plain and simple. And you badly need better boundaries and to work on your self-esteem. As you've seen, you can't buy someone's love. But until you believe you are worth it, you will continue to continue to attract men who can smell your vulnerability a mile away and are all too happy to take advantage of it. 

[Wiseman2]

8 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

Having established myself financially, I wanted to make sure he was not left behind, so I encouraged him to purchase a property, and given I work in real estate

My research has indicated that he is a narcissist and I am an empath.

I know if I ended up with him for the longer term, he wouldn't care for me or give two hoots about my emotional needs or well being.

I have been blessed with a lot, and I wouldn't mind buying gifts for my partner or doing nice things for them - but in this instance, it seemed forced, whilst he was doing very little for me. I didn't feel emotionally supported.

I am still missing him and care for him. But perhaps we may never speak again. He has locked me out of his life again. Its been 2 weeks. Just like last time, he hasn't seen my last messages.

I can't put a finger on it on how someone could expect financial benefits, when they haven't even committed to you, and continue expecting it after breaking up?

Is it odd for a man to expect this? Btw he is 40yo. I know I should have better self esteem and let him go. I have been pretty inexperienced with relationships as I have been just focussed on career and work for a very long time. All I know is I genuinely cared for him, and wanted to provide emotional support to begin with - but he seems to just measure things I do in dollars - if its not monetary it doesn't count.

Thank you for reading.

This was a very bad start. Don't try to turn dates into clients or clients into dates.

Separate your business and financial life from your dating life.

As far as this guy, he's a parasite.

Delete and block him and all his people from ALL your social media and messaging apps.

Next time don't try to buy love.

6 dates in three months is a red flag as well. Dating is to get to know someone as a potential romantic partner, not to get this involved in seedy financial transactions.

[Batya33]

9 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

No, don't think so 😞

But I liked him just the way he was

The way he was is asking someone he barely knows for large amounts of money.  Is this consistent with your values and standards?

[pinkrose2021]

1 hour ago, Wiseman2 said:

This was a very bad start. Don't try to turn dates into clients or clients into dates.

Separate your business and financial life from your dating life.

As far as this guy, he's a parasite.

Delete and block him and all his people from ALL your social media and messaging apps.

Next time don't try to buy love.

6 dates in three months is a red flag as well. Dating is to get to know someone as a potential romantic partner, not to get this involved in seedy financial transactions.

 

I actually didn't want to get involved in his finances - but he started with introducing to his banker on a 3 way phone call to understand his borrowing capacity to begin with. I told him I could not find him a property due to the nature of the relationship and direct conflict with my business, and introduced him to an agent to assist him, whilst I gave feedback on the properties. So he was never directly my client, but he had me engaged in the conversations. His expectation was that every week we would spend hours going through every single deal, and one evening when he told me that he didn't want to review the deals - and that night he sent me really harsh messages all night on how I didn't put aside time (I had offered to help out, but he had said he was tired, then he put it on me that I didn't want to help him).

I was actually a bit concerned when he shared his annual tax return with me, and I told him it was too much information for him, and I didn't feel comfortable with him doing this so early, along with telling me his savings.

I am not sure when you say - don't try to buy love? I don't think I tried to buy love. I just wanted him to have a good financial foundation as things progressed, I wanted him to have a financial grounding, and even after breakup I genuinely felt that he should do something to secure his future (which he had been putting off for a decade at least). It was him putting me in these situations where he wanted me engaged in his finances. Perhaps it was a way to know more about mine - but he knew about me from the outset anyway before he approached me, as I do have a public profile as I run a business, where people know who I am, and how I have gotten to where I am at.

Yes agreed, 6 days is nothing. I did say to him at one stage that I felt that he had no longing to see me and that really upset him. I know for next time though, I wouldn't be OK with someone who can't find time for me, but expects me to drop everything for them, like he expected me to.

I know anything I would say or express, it would rub him off the wrong way.

 

 

 

[pinkrose2021]

3 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

The way he was is asking someone he barely knows for large amounts of money.  Is this consistent with your values and standards?

I am not sure Batya?! I am actually lost as I have never had someone so persistent. But when I told my mum she was horrified.

But the fact I found it so weird and pushed into it, obviously it did not sit well with me from the very first time when he asked for first $300 for his course - which I said NO to, then he downgraded it to $200 - I said No to that. Weirdly he never repeated this instance, whilst he repeated about all other things I didn't do - not pay for his doctor, not pay for a holiday (as he is struggling) etc.

[pinkrose2021]

4 hours ago, MissCanuck said:

I'm sorry, OP. 

This guy is a user, plain and simple. And you badly need better boundaries and to work on your self-esteem. As you've seen, you can't buy someone's love. But until you believe you are worth it, you will continue to continue to attract men who can smell your vulnerability a mile away and are all too happy to take advantage of it. 

😞 May be I was just pleasing him - in hope that if I do a lot for him, he will actually love me. He said he loved me the 2nd time round we started speaking. 

Yes, I really need to work on this self esteem and 'worth' bit so I don't attract the same again.

[Wiseman2]

4 minutes ago, pinkrose2021 said:

 

I actually didn't want to get involved in his finances - but he started with introducing to his banker on a 3 way phone call to understand his borrowing capacity to begin with. 

Not really. A simple "it's not working out" then delete and block him and all his people from ALL your social media and messaging apps.

Next time stop engaging people in finances. You started it with your real estate nonsense.

Keep business and dating separate. It's that simple.

[pinkrose2021]

6 hours ago, greendots said:

I would honestly reflect on why you'd miss someone who treated you like rubbish.

Trust that you're worth it and that there are other guys in this world who will be willing to go the extra mile for you. 🙂

thank you - yes, it is past trauma from abusive childhood. My biological father treated me like crap - its the familiarity. Perhaps sense of unworthiness that comes up.

[pinkrose2021]

2 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Next time stop engaging people in finances. You started it with your real estate nonsense.

Perhaps he approached me with the intent to use me? I was only acting out of good faith and well being.

Point taken, next time round I will just plainly state to a prospect partner that I don't engage in these conversations.

[DancingFool]

1 hour ago, pinkrose2021 said:

😞 May be I was just pleasing him - in hope that if I do a lot for him, he will actually love me. He said he loved me the 2nd time round we started speaking. 

The first sentence is the definition of trying to buy love and affection from someone.

The second sentence......how did that not give you the creeps and send you running for your life??? Serious question.

Think about it - how can a complete stranger who doesn't know you just love you out of the blue - you, the person, the individual, who is complex, who has her dreams and life experiences he knows nothing about, quirks and habits he knows nothing about? True love takes time, takes getting to know each other for real. It's not a word tossed at a stranger you've barely met.

Sane men are not going to pursue you against your will and force themselves into your life because they have this thing called respect for other people. Only predators are pushy, forceful, in a sweep you off your feet kind of way whether you like it or not. This man is a predator and he pursued you purely because he saw that you are vulnerable and an easy target.

Thankfully, you do at least have some boundaries and managed to draw some lines and say no to his demands. Unfortunately, you are still a bit confused and over invested and treating this thing like a relationship when in reality you've only seen him 6 times in your life. A few dates does not a relationship make, OP.

Block this man from ever contacting you again. Going forward, when you notice that a man is trampling your boundaries, end things immediately. Also, being giving is all good, buuuuut healthy relationships are all about reciprocation. Goes back to don't keep giving and giving when he is not giving back equally in whatever form. If you keep giving and giving just hoping to get something eventually....you are trying to buy a relationship and it will never work.

You said that you want a man who simply cares for you, so why are you chasing a man who clearly doesn't? Maybe think long and hard what genuine care looks like? You don't have to look far - look in the mirror and find someone who is like you, kind, giving, has his life together, etc.

[SooSad33]

15 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

I am still missing him and care for him. But perhaps we may never speak again. He has locked me out of his life again. Its been 2 weeks. Just like last time, he hasn't seen my last messages.

This sounds like trauma bonding.. They 'love you', then hate you. Push & pull.  Making you want to try again.. making you miss them.  Is all crap!

I am sure you are well aware of the effects now, as you stated, a narcissist.  They are nasty 😕 .

So, be strong and do NOT reach out again.  You owe him Nothing!

Wonder why he's single at 40? 😉 .  I'm sure many other's have been messed up by his behaviour as well.

No loss.. just stay far away.  I encountered a few in my time.  One set me off badly a few yrs ago.

 

[Batya33]

5 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

am not sure when you say - don't try to buy love? I don't think I tried to buy love. I just wanted him to have a good financial foundation as things progressed, I wanted him to have a financial grounding, and even after breakup I genuinely felt that he should do something to secure his future (which he had been putting off for a decade at least). It was him putting me in these situations where he wanted me engaged in his finances. Perhaps it was a way to know more about mine - but he knew about me from the outset anyway before he approached me, as I do have a public profile as I run a business, where people know who I am, and how I have gotten to where I am at.

To me this approach is completely inappropriate - taking this role- with someone you're newly dating.  I was dating someone a short time and he had an interview.  Similar fields and I am skilled at interviewing.  So I did a mock interview to help him prepare.  Spent about 30 minutes.  He was really appreciative.  And he thought it was a good idea and it was kind of fun too!  That's ok as opposed to the tasks and role you took on with this person - did you actually want him as a client/want him to refer business to you??

He didn't put you in this situation.  You can say no, you can say partially no, whatever.  You chose to be in this situation.  Why?

[Lambert]

16 hours ago, pinkrose2021 said:

It's interesting you say that I knew this guy was off. He was committed to me really quickly, where as I was of two minds for a while. But then I thought he so wants to be with me - so I should be with a man who wants me so much as they will value me all along.

You're right. You want someone that wants you so much they will value you all along. 

But you have to watch and learn what a person is about.  

You said after month 1 he started pushing you away....

when this happens you have to check your ego and stop yourself from chasing him, trying to get him back to being nice. Your ego will tell you, you have to try harder and do more.  

But you don't! You pull back! You protect yourself and your heart.

you value yourself so much you only give your attention to guys that treat you with kindness and respect all the time.