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I just keep saying what I was saying.  

Holly,   If I may interrupt you for a moment 😀     You mentioned that it wasn't always this way and had gotten worse in the last months.  Perhaps that is a good starting point for your discu

Thank you everyone for you amazing support.  I really appreciate it!

1 hour ago, boltnrun said:

I can see coming back from a friendship rift, but there needs to be apologies and a sincere desire to mend the rift.

I've never received that in my life.  It's always been swept under the rug, let bygones be bygones and expectations for me to move on.  If I broach the subject to hope for a sincere apology, I end up looking like a fool.  An apology?  It's out of the question.  I get gaslighted to death and feel disgusted.  For me, this is why I drift apart and fade away.  If it's unavoidable to cross paths with the perpetrator, I'm civil yet permanently frostily distant.  Trust is dead.  It works.  

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17 hours ago, Seraphim said:

If you have lost emotion for her I am wondering why you would bother going? I mean it makes no sense. I am not sure I understand the “ casual “ friendship thing. 

I believe I said I was getting to that point that is why I said I would talk to her.   I would not have a casual friendship with someone after being close, unless they were in my friend group.  

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17 hours ago, boltnrun said:

They're probably out to dinner as we speak.  IIRC, Holly is on the East coast of the US, so it's about 6:50 PM there.

Curious, Holly, do you have to dine outdoors?  Brrrrr!

It's a bit cold, here.  I try to dine out about once, some restaurants are better than others regarding seating and heat.   

 

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17 hours ago, Cherylyn said:

Did you have a talk with her yet?  How did it go?  What's the outcome? 

When we met last night, the first question she asked was about my mom.  I told her I preferred not to speak about my mother, and I could tell that she was confused but accepted it- I kept hearing Seraphim telling me not to bring it up on the b-day .  We continued with the convo with no interruptions.   About midway through the meal she asked about my mom again, saying she was concerned.   I let everything rip.   She was mortified about her behavior.  She apologized profusely and said her intention was to be helpful, but sees that it was the opposite.  She even questioned who else she may be doing this to.   She recognized that she needs to listen and be supportive and not project her own ideas.   I then added the bit about bringing up a topic I do not want to discuss.  I asked her if she did not respect how I was running my life, and how disrespectful and controlling  her behavior  was.  I let her have it on everything.   In the end, she said how much she values my views  and friendship, and thanked me for telling her, as she believes it will make our relationship stronger.

 I asked if there was anything that I had done.  It was how I had reacted to something, and this was a result of my anger towards her.  I apologized.   She sent a thank you, and again apologized for her behavior.  

Edited by Hollyj
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3 minutes ago, Seraphim said:

It turned out better than I would have thought but I would not have left that for someone’s birthday as that is also disrespectful. 

I don't agree.   And, she asked me what was wrong.  

Personally, if the situation were reversed, I would want to know.  Birthday, or no birthday.

Edited by Hollyj
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1 minute ago, Seraphim said:

Just my opinion is all because I would not most likely appreciated it and would have made my apologies and left no matter how close the friend . 

That's too bad.   I would have welcomed it if I valued the friendship.   That is what true friendship is about.  

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I can’t say true friendship or not I would enjoy my butt being ripped in public on my birthday. I don’t think that’s what true friendship is about. To me the person would’ve contacted me long before a celebration and it wouldn’t have been in public. 

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2 minutes ago, Seraphim said:

I can’t say true friendship or not I would enjoy my butt being ripped in public on my birthday. I don’t think that’s what true friendship is about. To me the person would’ve contacted me long before a celebration and it wouldn’t have been in public. 

Then I guess I am not a good friend.  I prefer convos like this to be in person.  I am not so thin-skinned. 

Edited by Hollyj
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It is just a difference of opinion is all .I don’t want anybody ripping my butt in public because I don’t think it’s respectful. I think things like that should be done in private. 

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1 minute ago, Seraphim said:

It is not about being thin skinned it if you want respect from someone embarrassing them in public isn’t a good method. 

I spoke to her in a respectful way.  She was not offended, and appreciated the convo.  She asked what was up.  You were not there and are making false assumptions.   This was supposed to be positive and you have made it into a negative.  

Thank you for your input.

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Wait, so in front of everyone, you said all that to her? All the bottled up for months, maybe years of frustration at her birthday dinner?  Eek. She thanked you to be gracious, but no matter what, you and her will never be the same.  Reason being - you never found out why she's been like this for months.  There is something going on with her, and since you wait this long to bring it up, there is no safe space for her to talk about it.

The reason why she asks about your mom is because there is something up with her mom.  Friendship isn't grin and bear it or exploding on them.  It's okay to not stay friends too - this fight has not made you closer, just because you say thanks at the end - It only makes her look and feel like a giant A-hole.  Essentially, you told her she's a big A-hole.

Sometimes it's good to take some space, a bit of distance.  You've outgrown each other.

Edited by tattoobunnie
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Let me make this clear.  We were the only table occupied.  There was no else around.  I spoke in a low voice, but told her everything i have mentioned here.  There were no raised voices or emotion.   It is done and we are in a good place.  

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9 minutes ago, tattoobunnie said:

Wait, so in front of everyone, you said all that to her? All the bottled up for months, maybe years of frustration at her birthday dinner?  Eek. She thanked you to be gracious, but no matter what, you and her will never be the same.  Reason being - you never found out why she's been like this for months.  There is something going on with her, and since you wait this long to bring it up, there is no safe space for her to talk about it.

The reason why she asks about your mom is because there is something up with her mom.  Friendship isn't grin and bear it or exploding on them.  It's okay to not stay friends too - this fight has not made you closer, just because you say thanks at the end - It only makes her look and feel like a giant A-hole.  Essentially, you told her she's a big A-hole.

Sometimes it's good to take some space, a bit of distance.  You've outgrown each other.

I don't agree with you.   Her parents are dead, so there is nothing going on with her mother.  My mother has serious health issues-she knows my mother- this is why she was asking.  

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9 minutes ago, tattoobunnie said:

The reason why she asks about your mom is because there is something up with her mom.

Did you mean to type it this way -so to you, you think that she's also experiencing some struggle with her own mom and wants to have a back and forth? I quote this not to argue -I find this a really interesting perspective.  

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I will not continue to defend myself as to how this was handled.  We are in a good place-as good friends can talk things out, even on their b days-and move to a better place.  I have been in the reverse, and have gotten closer to someone after they have pointed out my faults.   I have a large friend group and have known many for years.   Sometimes stuff happens, and if you cannot have open communication, without getting your feelings hurt, then there's no growth or continuity.   I value and trust the people in my life and look forward to many more years with them.  

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6 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Did you mean to type it this way -so to you, you think that she's also experiencing some struggle with her own mom and wants to have a back and forth? I quote this not to argue -I find this a really interesting perspective.  

Her mother is dead. 

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3 minutes ago, Batya33 said:

Yes I saw that after I posted.  I guess it's possible she still wanted to share about the relationship.

I don't understand?   She knows my mother is having serious health struggles, this is the only reason she was asking.  Her mother has been gone for 30 years

 

Edited by Hollyj
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5 minutes ago, Hollyj said:

I don't understand?   She knows my mother is having serious health struggles, this is the only reason she was asking.  Her mother has been gone for 30 years

 

Sorry I was just musing off of what Tattobunnie wrote.  I understand what she wanted to talk with you about and that you did not feel like talking about your mother.  Tattobunnie's overarching point, I think, was that she asked about your mother also because she wanted to share something going on with her that was analogous.

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Holly...I think you handled it well.

I also think this was a learning moment...instead of allowing the issue to build until you feel ready to "rip", maybe bring it up the second time it happens.  A true friend will appreciate your honesty and will want to work with you to preserve the friendship, as your friend did.

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