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Who is co-dependant? Who is being controling? Me , him or both of us?


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I have recently had a discussion with a man I have been having a relationship now for a year.

It was a heavy duty conversation that did nothing but confuse me in the end. I have a real issue with him that I have yet to sort out. He has told me that he wants to stay in this relationship with me but also to sleep with other women every now and then. He claims he's in the free way sone but with in the last year he has only been with me. I am really confused with this person because he seems to contradict himself all the time.


This other women thing "is" an issue for me. It isnt that I hadnt been fore warned because he did tell me about this early on. Not to say that I have resolved it with in my self yet. No I havent. Im very upset about this. Recently an ex girlfriend has shown up who he says he isnt sleeping with and I believe him, but still it is SO uncomfortable being around her since we share the same kitchen space and also there is something very wrong with her.


But to he main point: I was unhappy with this women being here and wanted to know how long she would be staying. Now, do I have a right to want to know this? Am I wrong for wanting to know this? I came in and asked him this as calmly and nicely as I could and he more or less blew up on me like I was the bad person for wanting to know. Then he acused me of drama which he started, I got upset and told him that I was confused and wasnt sure anymore if I wanted to continue living here anymore under the obvious reasons of not wanting to be subjected to watching him with other women. I thought it was pretty obvious that this issue has been hurting me terribly. He doesnt seem to care. He makes this my problem.


Ive tried to be ok with this, but what happens is that I get accused of being insecure as a person, not loving enough to myself, some how this is all ways my character down fall where I am the weak one with issues never him. And its true I did get very insecure and doubted that he even has ever really loved me at all. I told him I felt used.


Well, he got really upset and felt hurt that I even said that which confused me more. Then I felt really really awful like I ad just ruined our relationship. Amoungst all this stuff going on between us I had to tell him that I was not sure if I wanted to live here anymore, seriously feeling this way. Well with this he accused me of being controling and trying to manipulate him like ALL women do. For myself personally I was only trying to express to him what might be best for ME. Isnt it kind of controling and co-dependant of him to take what I had to say as a ploy to only get my way? I only want to protect myself and do whats best for me. I need some help with this. I need straightened out. Thanks for listening. Tracy2

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He's manipulating you and blaming you.


He moved his ex into your shared house? He's anger at you for wanting to know when she is leaving? He blames you like "all women" for not being okay with his desire to cheat.


What are you getting out of this?

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The reason she is staying here is because I live in Tiny House community. She was involved with him before me but started developing serious psychological problems so he had to stop sleeping with her. Now they are just friends, so he says. I think I do believe him though she plays games and wont let go of hoping to get him back the way it was. I stay friendly to her but do not engage much because the last time she was here she became very passive aggressive to me and wouldnt leave me alone. There is a separate place where she stays but she ends up dominating the the kitchen and acts as the main cook here, of course catoring to him. Quite personally, I think she needs to go and accept that he has moved on and is now with me.


As far as a Polyamerous thing is concerned. Its confusing to me because Ive been here a longer then a year , very involved with him and have yet to see him actually live this out while Im here. I think, I dont know for sure, but it looks to me he pronounces this reality about himself as a defense mechanism.


Im having trouble sorting this out in my mind. On one level I know he loves me an awful lot so how could he do this? How could he not care how hurtful this could be to me? He as a very rough sad back ground with a women he was to marry who left him. He talks about her all the time. Claims he is no longer clinging to the past with her, yet all ways talks about it. This was about 5 years ago. Also about this time , his son died which absolutely destroyed him. He's not too happy about the women who have previously been in his life. Sometimes he sounds like a mgtow advocate. And you know. some of the things he says about female behavior is right on the money. Ive learned a lot about this and am trying very hard to not be manipulative or anything bad.


His story basically is, that he doesnt see why just because he has a new girlfriend, Why??? should he have to give up all the other female relationships he as in his life? It seems to me he has had it with commiting and doesnt plan on ever doing this with another women ever again. So hes been hurt. I find his relationship with this other women here as a sign that he would never just tell me good bye and drop me cold like some men do. Which is admirable. He thinks he can help her get over him. I dont see this happening in a million years. The women is obsessed with him.


So this is the basics of my story, He claims he will all ways love me and this will never change, but for me all Im seeing is pain. I think its been projected on me, so in a sense Im feeling his pain, the pain he wants to for ever avoid and put on who ever loves him the most. I dont want to feel this anymore. I want to love the man but also understand that this other women thing of his he talks about may be a bunch of sheete, but then again he may be serious. Its hurtful to me and I dont know how else I can think about this and see it so I can be strong and not be hurt at all if or when it happens.

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Going back to what you said in your first post "He has told me that he wants to stay in this relationship with me but also to sleep with other women every now and then."


From what you're saying you're not into this, and you don't have to be. It does sound very much like he is manipulating you and making you doubt your own mind. That is cruelty in my book, and so this man should be avoided like the plague.


Do you have to live with him?

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He lives with his ex as 'roommates' and she cooks for him, you are a third wheel and he wants and open relationship? Even if he talks a good mgtow talk, isn't he just a player dressed up as "enlightened"?


It sounds like he's gaslighting you under the guise of social activism and recycled hippie philosophy.


Decide what's right for You mentally, socially and emotionally. You are better off saving whales than this relationship.

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He has told me that he wants to stay in this relationship with me but also to sleep with other women every now and then.


This wouldn't be 'confusing' to me in the least: I'd leave him to go have this kind of relationship with other people who want that for themselves. I'm already clear that I'm monogamy material, and that's not negotiable. Period.

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What's to be confused about? He wants a harem of women and has told you he wants one. Either be cool with being a part of his harem or dump him and move on and find someone who wants a monogamous relationship who won't gaslight you. (Look that up, it's a psychology term and an important one to know.)


You're only confused, because you would rather believe his lying than accept the truth in front of you. If an open relationship with you able to sleep with other men if he can sleep with other women isn't to your liking (because that's the only way this would be an equal relationship and not a return to the dark ages of man calls all the shots, woman follows blindly and has no voice or say in the matter) then you should know you can leave him. Tell him it doesn't work for you, it's not what you want, and you're done. Then just leave or kick him out, depending on who's house it is.


Also maybe I'm wrong, but let me guess, you're paying all the bills and doing the cooking and cleaning too or providing him some material creature comforts that otherwise he'd have to go without? If any part of that is true then this is why he doesn't want you to leave, but wants other women for sex. You get to be the "mom" figure and the other women are there for fun and romance. Sorry to be brutal, but I do not get what you even see in this a$$hat to begin with.


P.S. He's controlling to the degree you let him be in that he seems to have all the power about what he is to do and you are to do. You do seem codependent to the degree you stay in an unhealthy toxic relationship that isn't what you want while he pulls out the hippie-dippy not so smooth talk about why his sleeping with other women should be okay with you. And you didn't give him the boot the first time that happened and some other woman showed up in your kitchen.


In short this just sounds like a toxic mess no matter who is what.

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Hippie dippy recycled philosophy is right. I call it la la land dream on thinking only that I dont think this man realises the kind of drama this way of behaving can cause. Quite frankly, I dont know what he's thinkng. This is why I have suspected this is more of a fantasy with him then a reality. I dont know if he likes this drama around himself but Im beginning to suspect that he is so insecure that he does. He claims he hates drama, yet with this way of functioning around women this is doing nothing but creating drama that he is very much apart of.


I do know that he does sincerely love me more then anyone else hes been with for a long while. This doesnt mean its ok to go ahead and parade some passing thrill right in front of me. It "is" cruel. Some one mentioned gas lighting. How am I being gas lit?


The deal here is that I have known him very closely for a year so if anyone knows this man very well in reference to this post, its me. He told me about this early on so I have no case to get all enraged at him over this.

Its ok if I have second thoughts about this because there is a difference about just talking about things and actually doing it. He has mentioned being a swinger with his first wife, she wasnt happy with it. You think hed learn there, guess not. He appears to me to be a man with a chip on his shoulder who has had it with bad relationships and just wants to do what he wants now. Im not defending him, just observing. I dont think he wants to get hurt any more so he goes on fooling himself with this new age free love doctrine of his. It causes me to wonder if he doesnt have hidden hostilities towards women under the guise of loving them all. Ha! sick isnt it.


What is disturbing to me is that in the last year we have gotten rather serious with each other if my reality is what I think and I think it is. But with that youd think he wouldnt want to do this to me. Im in too deep now, this is what Im trying to say. I dont want to leave him and I couldnt now even if I wanted to. Im not writing here to bash him. Im trying to understand what he thinks he's doing and the real reasons why which I know has nothing really to do with me. I need help understanding this, not receiving write backs telling me to leave the bastard. Not helpful at all,

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Most people who manufacture chaos are aware of it and do so to confuse and throw everyone off in order to maintain the upper hand: Read up on that and gaslighting: Out of the FOG: Chaos-manufacture

I dont think this man realises the kind of drama this way of behaving can cause.He has mentioned being a swinger with his first wife, she wasnt happy with it.



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Oh my God Wiseman2, That gif is so funny. Ya. thats him in his holier then thou moments of justifying his supposive poly amorous intentions for the future. The future that still has yet to occur. Which I do suspect is a defense mechanism so he can all ways keep up his illusion that he will never be hurt or abandoned ever again by any women. Im surprised that no one else here has mentioned this. I think I hit it on the nail that this is really his problem of protecting himself. Why? Because he gave all of his self to this one women for 5 years who was to marry him, it turned she was a fraud and took him for everything he had. It almost destroyed him.


I find it interesting in these forums how many people are so fast to jump on the "hate train" or serious judgement train before they hear the whole story or even after that. Is he wrong? Am I wrong? This man has saved my life,

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Which I do suspect is a defense mechanism so he can all ways keep up his illusion that he will never be hurt or abandoned ever again by any women. Im surprised that no one else here has mentioned this.


Why would that surprise you? We're not the ones invested in dissecting the guy.


I find it interesting in these forums how many people are so fast to jump on the "hate train" or serious judgement train before they hear the whole story or even after that.


It's not about hate, it's about what each of us are willing to put up with. You can play therapist to a guy who wants to sleep with other women if you want to--it's not against the law. If that will make you happy, great. But if you ask a public forum to express our own opinions, it's not a real shocker to learn that some of us would have no trouble walking away from that--and without any need to delve into any complexities about it.

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Wow, He has another women living with the two of you? Oh..my!!! Ok first of all, you have to do what is best for you. NO your not wrong! This is NOT about control, it's about how you want to live your life, and if you don't want too... put up with the women in your own house!!! MOVE OUT! Don't even talk to him about it. He has already made the decision to bring these lady's in the house. why should you have to give up your personal space to someone else. (and I'm not sure who pays the bills but that will be an issue too!!) bottom line if I was paying the bills in the house and my roommate brought someone else in for a period of time and didn't ask me first. I'm out of there!!! And so is the Women that don't belong there!!! I would be taking her with me. Drop her off at the corner where she belong!!!! O-NO!!! you don't do that!!

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I'm going to address the original question and my insight would be that you're the co-dependent here, and he has more narcissistic tendencies. It's not an uncommon dynamic and one that you're trapped in the cycle of.


I won't villify him or you, as both have manipulation strategies that one or both parties are unaware of and all manipulation is, is a way of meeting your needs.


In this particular dynamic the co-dependent usually starts to suffer first - mostly because having boundaries (as in, a clear sense of self, your likes and dislikes and the ability to express and live those choices) are either severely compromised or absent, and they're also deprived of self love and are reliant on external influences to provide them with a sense of worth. These aspects used as a bartering tool for the partner's love, attention and approval regardless of whether it's true to who you are likely because you've never been able to be true to who you are without punishment (shame, disconnection from your loved one/family etc).


Look back in your childhood - if you went through the experience of not being heard, feeling invisible, that your feelings and needs were insignificant and if you were trapped in no win situations where you couldn't do right for doing wrong, this is a wound which will keep coming up until you go and heal it.


From a narcissist's perspective, they suffer from the same wound - the sense of lack, worthlessness, and invisibility their methods of obtaining that sense of value is however different - they tend to make themselves bigger, more grandiose and more of a 'takers' mentality in order to acheive it. It's generally harder to get the narcissist to see their own patterns unfortunately, but it does happen.


You're in a cycle of self neglect in exchange for his love and attention, and he is in the habit of demanding capitulation from you so that he feels seen and loved, at any cost.


The first thing to deal with is always yourself, not the relationship so personally I'd recommend that you start there.

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