Listen to his words or his actions?

[rlsayers]

I have been seeing a man I met online for about 4 1/2 months. We went to high school together, but didn't really know each other as he was 3 grades ahead of me. When we met, he was in the middle of his second divorce. I have been divorced for 3 years, married once. Both of us had bad marriages with spouses who cheated and were mentally unstable. Neither of us were looking for anything serious and I thought our first date was going to be a one night stand (on my part.) Unexpectedly, we really hit it off. Fast forward over 4 months. We see each other every day, with him spending 2-3 nights a week at my place. He has met my kids, and when he is around he interacts with them as much as he can. He has introduced me to his kids, invited me over during his time with them a few weekends in a row and brought them to my house to make Christmas cookies (leaving them with me for 2 hours while he returned his youngest to his mom.) He is consistent and reliable, calling when he says he will and never breaking his word. I feel that I am falling for him and see the relationship going somewhere with time. He however, verbalizes that he isn't sure what we are, doesn't know if he ever wants more than a FWB, and that while he is faithful to me he does not want commitment. I have no worries that he is seeing anyone else or has the desire to. Part of me thinks that what he is saying is out of fear due to his past marriages and being so soon after his divorce. I have always been a 'listen to his actions' person because someone can say anything to you, but with him his actions are beautiful and his words are confusing. He is loving, attentive, honest, consistent, genuine, and protective. His actions are not at all like a FWB. About a month ago I pulled away because I knew that I would want more eventually and he told me he would not. When I did, he pulled me closer and told me he did not want to lose me. I know it isn't just about sex, because a huge part of our dynamic is companionship, going to dinner and spending time together outside of sex. I realize that we have not been together that long and don't expect anything serious at this point. I am so confused though! His actions seem to be those of a man who is progressing in a serious relationship, but those words...? He brings up feelings a lot, not me. He brings up the relationship dynamics and the future, not me. In one breathe he says he is looking into putting an addition on his house so that we could live together and all of our kids would have room, and in his next breathe he says he never wants to live with a woman again. Help!

[limichelle]

True actions speak louder then words. Also listen to his words carefully though because he could be very well conveying how he really feels. He shouldn't be messing with your emotions with his words though, the I want you come here one moment to go away the next. I would talk to him and ask him how he really feels. You have to communicate or you won't get anywhere.

 

Best of luck

 

Lisa

[gebaird]

When we met, he was in the middle of his second divorce.

 

This is why you are so confused. Marriage was hell for him, and he doesn't know if he wants to do it again. He isn't even close to healing -- it can take YEARS to get a toxic person out of your system, and he's dealt with two of them.

 

If you proceed with this relationship, you're going to have to embrace a lot of uncertainty. It may or may not work out, and he will resist labels and long-term commitments. You don't have to take it personally.

[rosecolored108]

Gebaird is right on; this man is probably emotionally scarred and conflicted. He probably really likes and cares for you, but is hesitant because bad divorces can be extremely messy.

 

I would take it slowly with him, if you proceed in the relationship. You probably will resist long-term commitment, at least for awhile, and if you are willing to accept that, then continue to see him.

 

However, if the commitment and labeling is important to you; it is a discussion you are going to have to have with him. Be open with him, and see what he says.

[Wiseman2]

Unfortunately, he's still very freshly divorced so that's all he can offer for now. Sadly he's rushing in way too much, too soon, too fast. You must slow this down.

 

He's seeking an insta-pseudo-relationship to replace sex, recover from his divorce and distract himself. His hot/cold remarks are quite typical of a recent post divorce haze.

 

Tread carefully...and believe him even if you don't want to. Most of all slow this way way down. He shouldn't be at your place everyday you shouldn't be babysitting his kids, etc or trying to create an insta-family with him.

he was in the middle of his second divorce. he isn't sure what we are, doesn't know if he ever wants more than a FWB he does not want commitment. and in his next breathe he says he never wants to live with a woman again.

[rlsayers]

Thank you! When he brings the relationship up I have voiced to him that his words and actions are confusing and conflicting. He consistently answers by telling me that he doesn't know what he wants. I knew from the beginning that a relationship with him would take patience given his divorce. I remember where I was after my divorce and would never try to rush him or push for something that he isn't ready for. Labels are not important to me and I am not in a hurry. My main fear is our kids getting attached. If there is no future or no chance of the relationship growing, I don't want kids getting attached. He is one of only 2 men I have let meet my kids over the past 3 years.

[reinventmyself]

Thank you! When he brings the relationship up I have voiced to him that his words and actions are confusing and conflicting. He consistently answers by telling me that he doesn't know what he wants. I knew from the beginning that a relationship with him would take patience given his divorce. I remember where I was after my divorce and would never try to rush him or push for something that he isn't ready for. Labels are not important to me and I am not in a hurry. My main fear is our kids getting attached. If there is no future or no chance of the relationship growing, I don't want kids getting attached. He is one of only 2 men I have let meet my kids over the past 3 years.

 

Having said that I would put a stop or at least slow down the interaction with the children. As parents, you two have a responsibility to protect them and if that means dialing things back, then you do so.

 

You just tell him you've been giving it some thought and you respect where he's at but in the meantime you'll be limiting the pseudo family time until things are bit clearer one way or another with the two of you.

 

I would never involve my children unless there was an understanding of monogamy and commitment and we had been together long enough that I have faith in the likelihood that we would stay together. Only then would I involve my children. But that's me.

 

I had an experience in my first relationship, post divorce where the man I dated had a daughter who I had a strong relationship with.

It ended badly and it's a very long story but I've been really protective of my sons since. It was a valuable lesson.

[Wiseman2]

That's why you need to put the brakes on this to protect yourself and your kids from rushing in and this insta-family behavior and having him over there almost constantly.

 

He really shouldn't be that involved with them at 4 mos in and when he repeatedly tells you he wants fwb, no commitment and 'feels confused'.

 

It's your job to protect your kids and your heart, not his. Stop having him at your place this much as if you are already a family. What's the rush? if it works out in time that's ok, no?

My main fear is our kids getting attached. I don't want kids getting attached.

[katrina1980]

I am going to say what I always say, and that I am sure many posters are sick of me saying.

 

When something confuses you, when his words don't jibe with his actions, you talk to him about it. You communicate!

 

If it were me, I would have NO problem and would not hesitate for one second in saying something like "sweetie, I'm confused. On one hand you act like a guy who is moving toward a committed RL (remind him of the all the things he does, including the time when you pulled away and he pulled you back), but on the other you say you don't want a commitment, that you're happy with being FWBs. So what's up? I'm not mad, just confused, can you explain the contraction? I'm open to listening."

 

Be gracious, non-accusatory, non-confrontational, you are simply asking the question because his actions contradict his words and you're confused.

 

To me that just seems so simple and would be much better than asking us, a bunch of strangers on a message board who have never even met him.

 

I just don't understand why so many people are afraid to communicate. It boggles my mind quite frankly.

[Wiseman2]

They have communicated openly and he keeps reiterating that he's confused.

When he brings the relationship up I have voiced to him that his words and actions are confusing and conflicting. He consistently answers by telling me that he doesn't know what he wants.

[katrina1980]

They have communicated openly and he keeps reiterating that he's confused.

 

I see, missed that.

 

Anyway, my response to that would be to walk away and when he figures it out, to give me a call.

 

If I am still available at that time, I will consider dating him again.

 

Just me but I try to not mess with guys who are "confused" about what they won't.

 

Nine times outta ten they're not confused, they just don't want to admit they don't want a "relationship" (with her) and are happy with the status quo (FWB).

 

Not suggesting he doesn't like you or not attracted to you, obviously he is. He may even care to some degree.

 

But he doesn't want commitment, otherwise he wouldn't be "confused" about it.

 

I think it's important to listen to both words and actions, combined. They need to jibe otherwise you're wasting your time.

 

Frankly, I would be utterly insulted if a man told me he only wanted FWB with me (and wasn't sure if he would ever want more), no matter what his actions were.

 

That would be an immediate dealbreaker for me actually.

[JaggerJim]

Why don't you reassure him that you probably don't want to get married ever again and your happy to enjoy this romance and just enjoy what you have. Tell him you don't want to put any labels on it. Also tell him that you won't be dating others and hope he won't do the same. Once you get all that out there, you can have a better time in the romance department.

 

But if you are looking for serious, then your probably barking up the wrong tree here.

[boltnrun]

Of course he doesn't want to "lose" you!

 

He has a sweet deal and he knows it. Despite your talks with him you continue to spend time with him. So him telling you he's "confused" changes nothing for him.

 

I always say, no consequences, no change.

[rlsayers]

The kids are my main fear. The one other man who met my kids was a relationship where the friendship was stronger than anything. The relationship ended, but the friendship continued and so he continues to be present in my sons lives as my friend. It was a great scenario. I feel the same way with this one, which is why I hesitantly let him meet my kids and spend time around them. I don't feel that if things end romantically it will be the end of everything. There is a strong friendship behind the relationship that has developed. It is such a difficult path to navigate when kids are involved. I have 2 special needs kids, 8 year old son with Asperger's and 4 year old son with Norrie Disease who is blind. I was in one serious relationship after my divorce with someone who I wouldn't let meet my kids. A year into things it ended because he ran into us at a store and he was terrified of my kiddo with Norrie. He ended it because he said it was not something he was strong enough to deal with after seeing him. Ouch! I wasted a lot of time and emotions on someone who was a terrible fit. Everything else was great and communication about my kids didn't cause any issues. When I felt that this one had a good potential for something long term and serious, part of me wanted to make sure there was no repeat. If a man can't accept my boys, I don't want to waste my time on him. This one was the polar opposite. After he met them he started researching Norrie and asked lots of questions about the best ways to interact with my son with ASD. He has been amazing with them.

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear that. Glad this jerk is out of your life. If this man is compassionate then that's huge plus, but still take it slow only because if his recent divorce.

I was in one serious relationship after my divorce with someone who I wouldn't let meet my kids. A year into things it ended because he ran into us at a store and he was terrified of my kiddo with Norrie. He ended it because he said it was not something he was strong enough to deal with after seeing him. Ouch! I wasted a lot of time and emotions on someone who was a terrible fit.

[rlsayers]

I see, missed that.

 

Anyway, my response to that would be to walk away and when he figures it out, to give me a call.

 

If I am still available at that time, I will consider dating him again.

 

Just me but I try to not mess with guys who are "confused" about what they won't.

 

Nine times outta ten they're not confused, they just don't want to admit they don't want a "relationship" (with her) and are happy with the status quo (FWB).

 

Not suggesting he doesn't like you or not attracted to you, obviously he is. He may even care to some degree.

 

But he doesn't want commitment, otherwise he wouldn't be "confused" about it.

 

I think it's important to listen to both words and actions, combined. They need to jibe otherwise you're wasting your time.

 

Frankly, I would be utterly insulted if a man told me he only wanted FWB with me (and wasn't sure if he would ever want more), no matter what his actions were.

 

That would be an immediate dealbreaker for me actually.

 

 

Hard to hear, but necessary I think. He is coming over tonight to talk. I think I need to make some decisions about what I want and see if he will communicate anything other than " I don't know what I want." I don't know yet whether to continue or end things, but I am putting the non-negotiable out there tonight that there can be no more sleepovers and him being around my kids needs to wait for now.

[limichelle]

Best of luck! I know those talks aren't easy just remember whichever way works out is in your best interest.

 

Lisa

[Wiseman2]

He's fresh out of a divorce and you are only dating 4 mos. He isn't lying when he says "he doesn't know what he wants". Just slow things down without pressing him for relationship talks when is divorce papers aren't even dry yet and you are just dating briefly. When you stop treating this like a mini-marriage and insta-family things will get much better.You are dating exclusively that is fine at 4 mos.

 

You need to simply set the pace by slowing down how often he's over your place and all these intense relationship talks. Another talk won't yield much. And ultimatums at 4 mos in with a freshly divorced guy will shut him down and soon you'll see the slow fade and a lot more "confused" talk.

I want and see if he will communicate anything other than " I don't know what I want." I am putting the non-negotiable out there tonight that there can be no more sleepovers and him being around my kids needs to wait for now.

[HeartGoesOn]

I can't speak for others, but I would want to know where I stand with the person whom I'm dating, before even considering introducing them to my children. It also appears you're in over your head by having sleep overs at 4 1/2 months in.

 

Either way, I agree with other as to slowing down, and setting your expectations down a few notches.

[katrina1980]

JMO as always but if he's fresh out of a divorce (he was in middle of it when he met the OP), then he really shouldn't be dating yet at all...let alone getting this emotionally involved.

 

I mean seeing each other every day, sleepovers 3 times per week, getting involved with her kids (both of which are disabled) telling her he doesn't want to lose her etc etc, he really has NO business behaving that way fresh out of a divorce especially if he only wants casual (FWB).

 

That's the problem, he's latching on to OP emotionally like many people do after a divorce, because they're lonely and to fill a void. They're in rebound mode.

 

While he keeps telling her he's "confused" and "doesn't know what he wants."

 

Dude, if you're confused or don't know what you want, then don't date or if you do, date casually for heaven's sake.

 

Wiseman's advice is good but somehow I think it's a little late for that. OP is falling in love with him, it's hard to slow things down when at that point.

 

I don't think giving him an ultimatum is smart, and probably won't work anyway as most people view that as manipulation.

 

I would suggest walking away and telling him when he figures it out, to contact you.

 

I think that would be best for your kids too, you really can't risk them becoming emotionally attached when he's so wishy washy.

 

I dunno lesson learned I guess. Not smart to get involved with men fresh out of a divorce or worse, going through one when you meet.

 

That is a recipe for disaster.

 

I'm sorry OP, I know that's not what you want to hear.

 

And of course I don't claim to have all the answers either, but I've learned a lot over the years and recently separated or divorced men = heartbreak waiting to happen.

 

But it's your call of course, you could try slowing things down, lowering expectations, see how that works for you.

 

Good luck whatever you decide!

[rlsayers]

Thank you all for the words of wisdom. We talked until 4 this morning. He was finally very open and he admitted that for the first 3 months it was just sex and filling a void for him. He also admitted that during that time he was still trying to get his exwife back. He says that he did not expect to get attached to me, but has realized over the past month that he is falling too and that he wants more. I didn't say very much last night, just listened and took it all in. He left this morning asking if he could come tonight to spend time with me. I have made my mind up and the more I think about what was said last night the more I feel it is the best decision. I am just going to avoid him tonight and after Christmas end things.

[Belle2017]

Can I make a suggestion - for your own wellbeing, look into the No Contact rule and start implementing it. I've started and it works amazingly well within days. It is the best way to preserve your own mental health, dignity and to help you move on. This link may not be as relevant to you as you haven't been "dumped" as such, but the fact that he was sleeping with you while trying to get his ex wife back is pretty poor form. I would look at the 13th and 14th paragraphs of this and remind yourself of your own worth. Don't let him have the best parts of you if he doesn't want all of you. Best of luck - you sound like a beautiful person who deserves lasting love and happiness. /

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear this. Perhaps you were wise to force his hand on this given the recent divorce and comments about fwb.

He was finally very open and he admitted that for the first 3 months it was just sex and filling a void for him. He also admitted that during that time he was still trying to get his exwife back.

[katrina1980]

 

We talked until 4 this morning. He was finally very open and he admitted that for the first 3 months it was just sex and filling a void for him. He also admitted that during that time he was still trying to get his exwife back.

 

OUCH! I am curious though, how were his actions with you during this time?

 

Did you have any inkling that he was just in it for the sex and to fill a void? And trying to get his ex back? Three months? Wow.

 

What changed for him suddenly? Did he realize he would never get his ex back so decided to latch on to you out of fear of, god forbid, being alone?

 

Of course he would never admit it, but that is what makes the most sense.

 

Something is NOT jiving here, and discovering this would NOT have sat well with me at all.

 

I would have ended it right then and there.

 

You are definitely doing the right thing.

[Ms Darcy]

1. Yes, he's sending mixed signals. He says he doesn't want a commitment but he seems to act very focused on you.

 

2. Believe his words. When words and actions don't match, trust worst. In other words, when someone tells you what you are to them, believe them.

 

3. I think it's pretty irresponsible for both of you to be involving your children in this non-relationship.

 

4. A man who's still married ("going through a divorce") is one of the worst to try for dating/one night stand/whatever.

 

5. I think you'll stick around until he basically tells you he cannot go on.